67 réponses à ce sujet

[Xzeto]

Am I the only one who finished this game and went ... pooh (figuratively not literraly)?

125 hours I played. Level 22 or 23. Major armor. Major spells. Major everything. I was still a punk by the end. Insta-killed often! Unable to kill ... just about everything. Bored! Ticked! Irate! And that ending. What a choice. You play the good guy all the way through and the night before the big fight, you have to do something evil or die? Or kill the king (which in itself sent me almost into apoplexia since a major focus was revenge for the death of the king - just an assinine choice). But hey, it's "dark fantasy." And worst of all, why is having the bad guys level with you a good idea? It just prolongs the already monotonously repetetively elongatedly stupid fights against the proverbial level 20 rats! IT'S NOT FUN!!!!

One of the fun things of the good old days in RPGs was becoming the ubber-character. You work and work and work and eventually, you walk into a room and by sheer presence alone, owned everything. You didn't have to reload every (!) single (!) battle 20 or 30 times until you lucked up on some scenario that allowed you to move to the next nightmare fight and reload sequence. There was a sense of accomplishment. And God-forbid a sense of fun. Not with this new generation of game makers. It's almost a point of victory for them to spew their sadism at you, sit back and rub their grubby little hands saying "take that." This they call a game. Er, sorry, dark fantasy.

There were some good parts to this ....thing...- no denying. I'll never forget the surprise that was Leliana's song. I finished it yesterday and I've been reflecting on the whole experience. In the end, I can't say that I had fun. And I feel bad for having done it. I feel like I just wasted the time. What a stupid thing.-

I am so scared that this group will do the same thing to Mass Effect 2. I think that would break my heart.

[jmp0505]

Hmmm, are you sure you are on the right forums?  Doesn't sound like we played the same game.  [smilie]../../../images/forum/emoticons/tongue.png[/smilie] 

And sorry... I sort of have to laugh - you played 125 Hours.  Played. 125. Hours.  If it was such a bad experience, why did you play it that long?     (My shelf has lots of games I did not finish because they didn't grab me, or the gameplay was unsatisfactory, or I simply got bored half way through.)  If a game is not satisfying me in some
manner, I generally don't invest days worth of gameplay in it.  The story unfolds how it unfolds, based on decisions you made, or didin't make.  *shrug*  That's telling a good story.

But if you were still getting insta-killed at the levels you were at, then you need to examine your game strategy and manage your party more effectively.  By the time I get to the final battle in any of my playthroughs, calling in allies and letting my team go through their well-practiced paces, we don't really have major problems.

I am not trying to bust on you , but your post was just puzzling.  I am sure there are others who will agree with you or have the same issues, but I have been playing this game steadily since it was released and am still enjoying it. ymmv, as always.

Modifié par jmp0505, 02 janvier 2010 - 10:56 .

[Solistus1]

What you are describing sounds a lot more like an action RPG. BioWare made it pretty clear that this is an oldschool RPG in the sense that you have to not only 'grind' to a high level but actually build your party well to be powerful. If you are getting owned lategame as you say, it probably means you built your party poorly and/or play poorly. No offense, but you are asking for a game that is impossible not to beat easily if you just play it for a while. To most of us, that hardly sounds like a game at all.



If you are reloading 20 or 30 times on non-boss encounters, you are doing several somethings very wrong. By that level, I could sit still with my main character and let my partners easily mop up white mobs with their tactics. What party are you using and why are you dying? Are you healing effectively? Are you AoEing your own party? Describe what's happening and maybe we can help you. The game is far from sadistic; it's actually extremely easy if you learn how to exploit a few simple tricks in combat. People looking for a challenge have taken to playing through the entire game with only the main character in the party, on nightmare.



It sounds like you don't actually find the gameplay in this game enjoyable, and/or you just don't have a solid grasp on it despite apparently having played longer than all my playthroughs combined. If you find yourself questioning why the game continues to scale the difficulty to present a challenge rather than allowing you to instantly win just for being high level, maybe you just don't enjoy the game. The end of a game is supposed to be difficult and require you to have mastered the game to beat it.

[wrathofnature]

Xzeto wrote...

Am I the only one who finished this game and went ... pooh (figuratively not literraly)?

125 hours I played. Level 22 or 23. Major armor. Major spells. Major everything. I was still a punk by the end. Insta-killed often! Unable to kill ... just about everything. Bored! Ticked! Irate! And that ending. What a choice. You play the good guy all the way through and the night before the big fight, you have to do something evil or die? Or kill the king (which in itself sent me almost into apoplexia since a major focus was revenge for the death of the king - just an assinine choice). But hey, it's "dark fantasy." And worst of all, why is having the bad guys level with you a good idea? It just prolongs the already monotonously repetetively elongatedly stupid fights against the proverbial level 20 rats! IT'S NOT FUN!!!!

Personally I thought the level-scaling was well done. It kept all the fights at challenging levels and you didn't periods of boredom from killing lots of weak enemies while looking for something challenging to fight. Also allowed for a little less linear play.

One of the fun things of the good old days in RPGs was becoming the ubber-character. You work and work and work and eventually, you walk into a room and by sheer presence alone, owned everything. You didn't have to reload every (!) single (!) battle 20 or 30 times until you lucked up on some scenario that allowed you to move to the next nightmare fight and reload sequence. There was a sense of accomplishment. And God-forbid a sense of fun. Not with this new generation of game makers. It's almost a point of victory for them to spew their sadism at you, sit back and rub their grubby little hands saying "take that." This they call a game. Er, sorry, dark fantasy.

The final part of the game consisted heavily of you 1 shotting tons of darkspawn.

Fights in dragon age are really good, lots of tatics involved imo. You shouldn't be dying every (!) single (!) battle multiple times. You shouldn't be relying on luck. You should be relying on skill and tatics. Personally I found the fights fun because I enjoyed the difficulty.

[Cybercat999]

Dunno, I felt pretty uber at the end of each of my games. Even in my first playthrough I never died in that last fight. And oneshotting stuff at Denerim gate is lame and stupid imo, not one iota of challenge.

Actually, the end was sort of anti-climax for me. After some fights (like Jarvia, 5 reloads ugh) I expected a really grand battle in the end, I armed myself with 300ish potions and best armor/weapons I could find. Archdemon went down in 3 minutes..... bleh.

[DragonRageGT]

Cybercat999 wrote...

Dunno, I felt pretty uber at the end of each of my games. Even in my first playthrough I never died in that last fight. And oneshotting stuff at Denerim gate is lame and stupid imo, not one iota of challenge.
Actually, the end was sort of anti-climax for me. After some fights (like Jarvia, 5 reloads ugh) I expected a really grand battle in the end, I armed myself with 300ish potions and best armor/weapons I could find. Archdemon went down in 3 minutes..... bleh.

Same here... after my first full playthrough, where I did die 20 times though in Hard diff, all subsequent runs in NM, with zero death and feeling extremely powerful at the end led me to believe that char development plays an important part as well as experience with the game, party abilities and properly control off their actions either thru script or manually.

Some people like to RP weaker chars, flawed skills, stuff like that. I'm ok with that but in this game it comes with a price. Things tends to get too hard sometimes. Even a regular player like me can get some useful tips from the forums and built an efficient character and tweak the party skills to be as efficient as possible too.

OP, don't blame the game for your personal failure! As Sir Ulrich once heard himself:

"You have been weighed, you have been measured, and you have been found wanting. Come back when you're worthy."

[knownastherat]

You are not the only one I am sure, but I tend to end up owning everything even if after several reloads. Actually, if I do not have to reload or be close to reload I feel .. is this all you got?

[Gcxtian]

It's all about the party setup and tactics not levels. I've reloaded only about twice so far and i'm 11 levels into nightmare mode. In all seriousness I wish the game was more challenging, not trying to sound like a dick or anything.

[Selej]

Not sure what you did wrong but with my assassin/duelist rogue, I was moping things up. Fighting darkspawn was more of an annoyance than any challenge. The only thing that even remotely hurt me was the Archdemon/High Dragon and even then, not much.

[RangerSG]

First of all, the "everything levels with you" line is waaaay overdone. There's a floor and a ceiling to everything in the game. The fights are scaled to your level, yes. But the genloks are still genloks. There's more of them, but if you know how to crowd control, you can lock them down easy.



I've reloaded a few times on my first play through. Most of the time from battles where my mage gets dropped from a cutscene 2 feet from a guy with a 2 handed sword. (Kogrim and Marjoleine, but then, one of those was entirely optional) Tactics don't save you when three people get a free whack at you from point-blank coming out of a cutscene. You just pray there that the damage roll isn't fatal so Wynne can save me. hehe



Otherwise, the only time I'm in trouble is when a wave comes I didn't expect after I've burned all my spells...or pops in behind me unannounced.

[SusanStoHelit]

I have to agree. I am most definitely not a min/maxer, and I don't play on Nightmare or even on Hard because I absolutely hate micromanaging all my companions and playing all combat stop/start. My first playthrough I died quite a lot (not as much as you, I think, but a lot). I made dumb mistakes with my build, I didn't know how to make best use of tactics, or how half the skills worked. So I deleted that character about halfway through, did some research on the forums, and started again.



I'd advise you either give up and go play something else - or you look for/ask for some advice about builds and tactics and teams, set the game to 'easy' and play until you learn how it all works in practice. Then have fun.

[twintalons]

Well if you played 125 hours in a row, it could have been literally !



Re the game, you have a point.

[WoodsDweller]

I can sort of understand the OP's point. Your reward for progressing through the game is, or should be, that combat becomes easier.

In a game in which opponents do not level (though encounters might, with more bad guys in a scaled-up encounter), you get that feeling that you are a stronger character. Fighting four goblins as a level 1 character is a challenge. When you are a level 10 character, four goblins are trivial. Generally, however, there aren't four-goblin encounters any more at that level. You will probably see an encounter with higher-level opponents (which is why such a game may have hundreds of possible opponents), though it can be fun to have the game designers throw you a cave full of goblin hordes so that you can wade through them without breaking a sweat.

In a game which levels up creatures to be a challenge to your abilities, the four goblin encounter that was a challenge at level 1 becomes a four uber-goblin encounter that is still a challenge at level 10, but the player doesn't get a feeling of accomplishment. It feels like you are fighting the same battle against the same opponents and you aren't getting any better (you really are, because each hit does more damage, etc., but it doesn't seem that way).

As to the reload 20 times issue, the game just isn't that hard, certainly not after 125 hours (!) of practice. You must be doing something wrong.

[WoodsDweller]

In an old 2D RPG, adding a new creature was just a matter of designing a new sprite and adding a new line to a table. In a modern 3D game you have a significant investment in designing, modeling, texturing, animating, and doing sound for an Ogre. So instead of making a Frost Giant, they give us an Alpha Ogre.

I fight an Ogre in Ostagar at the beginning of the game (and it was challenging), and I'm still fighting Ogres in Fort Drakon just before the final battle (where they are still fairly challenging). I guess my character never got any better ...

[Ronin 3000]

as long as you have a well built tank and healer, the game becomes quite easy. i got absolutely raped in my first playthrough on normal and had to switch it to easy on some of the harder fights.



now im playing on hard and never die. i probably should switch it to nightmare, but im scared i will get pwnd again...

[Astranagant]

So, basically, you're whining because the game is actually challenging, and you're expecting to somehow achieve godhood by poking genlocks with a sharp piece of metal for 100 hours?

And how on earth could you possibly classify boinking Morrigan as "evil"? That makes absolutely no sense.

Modifié par Astranagant, 03 janvier 2010 - 04:14 .

[castaftw]

Well I do not agree with this game being too hard, actually I think it could be several times harder with no problem. I like my games very hard though and want a challenge when I play, not just a story being told, I want the feeling that I beat the game. These days games like that are hard to find as they are often dumbed down to feed the masses of ordinary players just looking for an experience like watching a movie..



I will agree though that I didn't feel very "epic" in the end of DA, the archdemon was really just another dragon waiting to get spanked and the abilities of especially the rogue and the warrior just got incredibly boring in the endgame compared to a mage playstyle. As a mage you literally get to rain fire down from the skies and blow enemies to bits and pieces while a warrior just gets +x to damage and attack and a lot of boring and limited abilities that in the end isn't better than auto attacking unless they can aoe stun or knockdown stuff. I have played all possible characters I could think of through the game on nightmare and without a doubt it is the mage who gets all the fun in combat. The other classes are useful yes, but with very few choices in combat they become boring to play.

[termokanden]

I agree completely with castaftw on that. Mages are by far the most fun to play. Everything else can work just as well, and I personally had a very effective DW warrior, but in the end you're mainly autoattacking with a few not very flashy special moves. It works, but it's not fun in the long run.

About Dragon Age. I don't agree that it's as boring as the OP says. In fact I really liked the game. I liked the graphics, I liked the story (well for the most part), and I liked the characters.

The mechanics is where I am not so impressed. I liked the mage TALENTS, but other than that, I pretty much dislike the mechanics of the game. They do not seem to have been tested well enough or balanced properly. However, I still think they did a good job of allowing mages to be so diverse. It's usually a very narrow class in other games. They deserve some credit for that part.

Modifié par termokanden, 03 janvier 2010 - 04:48 .

[andyx1205]

So far, this game's been a walk-in the park for me. I play on Hard, with Wynne, Morrigan, Leliana and my Warrior Tank.



I'll play once more after with a new group on nightmare (and one mage, with 2 mages it's just too easy...and 3 mages is gg).

[Haplose]

I kinda disagree with the sentiment that mages are most interesting as main chars. Actually I've found that when I feel like casting a few spells NPC casters feel almost the same as main chars. Even if there were 30 point difference in attainable spellpower (in reality the gap should be much less), the difference in actual spell effects is just not very big. So I don't need to play a mage when I can have Morrigan and Wynne in my groups. Basically no difference.



I played a Mage till level 12 and then I dropped him in favour of a dual-wielding Dex rogue. Much more interesting for me. Actually more micro-managing and more fun. Sneak up to an enemy mage, stun, backstab... restealth, choose another target.... or just have your tank Taunt and go for enemy backs.

I beat the game on Nightmare with this char. Now I'm playing a Two-Handed warrior. Been much tougher so far, but he is getting into his own. It slowly becomes a satisfying experience as well.

[termokanden]

I think there are two reasons why people have so different views on the difficulty:



1. For very casual players, some of the challenges in Dragon Age can be much too difficult. Not everyone is used to a game with this amount of depth, and not everyone is even interested in learning the details of the mechanics.

2. For powergamers, people who have maybe tried MMOs and raiding, the challenges in Dragon Age are quite trivial. Furthermore, we optimize our character builds to a degree that makes it all too easy. I think we were meant to play suboptimally to have a challenge.

[Spazure]

I just had to pop in to say the OP should never, ever, ever, EVER play Demon's Souls if he thought Dragon Age was too difficult. Wow. DAO is what I play to have fun when I get tired of dying every other fight. I can't imagine living in a world where DAO was a pain in the ass.

[Stuffy38]

I really enjoyed the game. Its' a shame you didn't, but it must have had some appeal to get 125 hours out of you.

At least you stuck at it though, a friend of mine just did the six different origins and Ostagar then called it quits. 

Modifié par Stuffy38, 04 janvier 2010 - 01:32 .

[RobotXYZ]

With regards to still fighting ogres throughout the game...

I think this is more realistic than ARPGs.  In those you fight something at level 1 that has 20 HPs.  Then at level 30 they have 2000 HPs.  I don't think any amount of training allows you to hit 100 times harder.  I mean even a kung fu master could be taken down by 100 level 1 dudes (with knives).  But if the ARPG kungfu master 1 shots all those level 1 dudes and has 1000 times more HP than them he can take down an infinite number of level 1 dudes.