220 réponses à ce sujet

[KingZayd]

HYR 2.0 wrote...

KingZayd wrote...

No. Why would it be? Shepard never decided that it was inevitable that synthetics would want to shoot him.

The Leviathans apparently decided it was inevitable, that were they to create a synthetic (and it would happen at some point, inevitably) that it would try to kill them at some point, and succeed. I'd say it'd be ridiculous for them to decide that the best move to prevent this, would be to create a synthetic.

The Leviathans never decided anything, they were simply investigating the problem.

Only the catalyst draws that conclusion about inevitability.

StarChild:"An intelligence designed eons ago to solve a problem."
...
Shepard: "But you were created?"
SC: "Correct."
Shep: "By who?"
SC: "By ones who recognised that conflict would always arise between synthetics and organics."

Sounds to me like the Leviathan had already decided stuff.

[Sable Rhapsody]

Eterna5 wrote...

It means something too me. I don't particularily care if it means anything to your or if you think it' stupid. 

Then the flip side should apply.  Those of us who like the modded ending don't particularly care if it means anything to you 

[Hackulator]

So I took a few months off from this forum to see if people would stop complaining about the ending.

They didn't.

[Dr_Extrem]

Hackulator wrote...

So I took a few months off from this forum to see if people would stop complaining about the ending.

They didn't.

what did you expect - the endings did not change as well.

[Maxster_]

Chief Commander wrote...

Some of you may know of the mod that completely changes the ending (no starchild, no deaths, shep survives, reunion) Link here: social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/368/index/14795358

And as I watched the new modded ending I asked myself "Bioware, was it really that hard to do this yourself?" It´s pretty much what the majority of community wants, the polls prove this. And with some professional work it would have looked and sounded even better. Why not just retcon the endings and make what the mod shows canon? Shep can retire with his/her LI and the galaxy is a happy place without some organic-robot freaks running around.

Would you support this? I for once would even pay for it, just to finally come to peace with the series.

So Bioware throw away the "artistic integrity" and for once make your community happy and make amends after lying to us and treating us to this horrible conclusion of our beloved series.

Removal of starchild fixes(partly) overarching plot, but does not fix ME3 being a nonsensical plothole-ridden mess.
And it is obviously better than EAWare endings, because does not retcons ME1 and ME2 to nothing.
Still doesn't fix stupidity of reapers waiting for thousands of years of Sovereign's machinations instead of just flying into a galaxy losing completely nothing in the process, though.

[His Name was HYR!!]

KingZayd wrote...

StarChild:"An intelligence designed eons ago to solve a problem."
...
Shepard: "But you were created?"
SC: "Correct."
Shep: "By who?"
SC: "By ones who recognised that conflict would always arise between synthetics and organics."

Yes, they recognized a trend they were seeing. They did not, however, understand why it was happening.

Sounds to me like the Leviathan had already decided stuff.

Not so fast John Kerry.

The Leviathans created The Intelligence in hopes of solving this problem. That alone tells us that they did believe that brokering peace between organics and synthetics was possible. But, again, they first needed to figure out why.

If they had already decided that it was merely an inevitability, they would not have seeked to solve the problem period, what to say of create The Intelligence.

[Maxster_]

HYR 2.0 wrote...

Greylycantrope wrote...

@ LilLino
They're motivations are supposed to be beyond our comprehension as in beyond our grasp, we can grasp their motivation, it's just completely stupid.

False.

The Reapers motives are not within our comprehension, the problem they deal with is typically never seen in our civlization. Why? Because they deal with it before our galaxy advances to that point. You don't even need Leviathan DLC to know that: the patterns are in the data. ME1 is when the harvest was supposed to begin, synthetics were primitive. After the delay, "true" AI (like EDI/geth) were created. They're still new, and too small a population to be threats to anyone.

So, no. If this fanbase is an indication, Sovereign was right. The majority of us do not comprehend it. The fact that people see Rannoch as "proof" that they're wrong goes to show that.

Assertion about synthetics destroying all organics is appeal to probability and obviously never happened.
There is nothing to comprehend. Reapers are the problem they are pretending they fix.

[KingZayd]

HYR 2.0 wrote...

KingZayd wrote...

StarChild:"An intelligence designed eons ago to solve a problem."
...
Shepard: "But you were created?"
SC: "Correct."
Shep: "By who?"
SC: "By ones who recognised that conflict would always arise between synthetics and organics."

Yes, they recognized a trend they were seeing. They did not, however, understand why it was happening.

Sounds to me like the Leviathan had already decided stuff.

Not so fast John Kerry.

The Leviathans created The Intelligence in hopes of solving this problem. That alone tells us that they did believe that brokering peace between organics and synthetics was possible. But, again, they first needed to figure out why.

If they had already decided that it was merely an inevitability, they would not have seeked to solve the problem period, what to say of create The Intelligence.

Conflict would ALWAYS arise.

And since they didn't know how to bring about the peace, conflict was always going to arise between them and their AI.

Out of curiousity, why did the Leviathans care about peace between organics and synthetics? As long as there are species to exist as thralls to the Leviathans, isn't it okay?

[sH0tgUn jUliA]

MrFob is not a pro. He made this mod out of the goodness of his heart for the community to use. It satisfies me. I worked my arse off and gathered all the resources available 100% completion, played multi player 100% readiness, promoted 10 characters, so I should have the maximum benefit, right? Still I get no better ending with Destroy than someone with 3200 EMS. Shepard is still left in a pile of rubble. I just get that stupid gasp. Oh well. That really sucks.

We know that in about 6 months multiplayer is going to be dead, so 3150 or what ever it is will be the target anyway. Then if you have Leviathan, Omega, and other DLC, you should be able to get out of that pile of rubble and have your reunion like in MEHEM, don't you think? You worked hard enough for it. It's not really a happy ending either. You lost your friend and mentor and you just put his name on the memorial board. It's a bittersweet ending. Your LI doesn't look all happy either, so like I said it's bittersweet. Happy would be "Party!" No one is partying. They're remembering the lost and glad to be alive.

So I think the player earned this as a possibility, but we never got it, and they're not going to give it to us. Hence those of us who pick destroy all the time will download this mod, and use it because it makes the game playable.

I don't need to have Casper explain what the reapers do and why they do it. It's not going to change what I do to them, ever. All three choices he gives me are morally reprehensible. Refuse isn't an option because BW said conventional victory isn't possible. So that leaves us with this mod.

A conventional victory mod would be interesting as well, and have Shepard give the monologue at the end. It could be done. It would be a lot of work. Triggers around 7000 TMS. Someone could "do" Shepard with a lot of practice, and with some tweaking it could sound pretty convincing, but not exact.

[Maxster_]

HYR 2.0 wrote...

Greylycantrope wrote...

HYR 2.0 wrote...

Greylycantrope wrote...

@ LilLino
They're motivations are supposed to be beyond our comprehension as in beyond our grasp, we can grasp their motivation, it's just completely stupid.

False.

The Reapers motives are not within our comprehension, the problem they deal with is typically never seen in our civlization. Why? Because they deal with it before our galaxy advances to that point. You don't even need Leviathan DLC to know that: the patterns are in the data. ME1 is when the harvest was supposed to begin, synthetics were primitive. After the delay, "true" AI (like EDI/geth) were created. They're still new, and too small a population to be threats to anyone.

So, no. If this fanbase is an indication, Sovereign was right. The majority of us do not comprehend it. The fact that people see Rannoch as "proof" that they're wrong goes to show that.

Ah no they are wrong, they argue certain and absolute inevitability of something that is merely a possiblity. "Proof" from the outcome of their cycle of origin is no more absolute than the "proof" from the outcome of ours.

Changing the subject, right or wrong has got nothing to do with it.

You asserted that their motives were supposed to be beyond our comprehension, and that we comprehend them fine.

We do not.


*edit* OP got lost along the way as well.

Yes we do.

They are the problem they pretend they trying to fix.

1. Because assertion about synthetics will destroy all organics is false. It never happened.
2. And assertion about synthetics will destroy their organic creators and reapers prevent that from happening -
- meaning that instead of synthetics destroying their organic creators,  reapers are destroying their organic creators.
So, before reaper's "solution" to non-existent "problem", by their assertion - synthetics always destroy their organics creators.
And after applying reapers "solution", - reapers always destroy organics creators of synthetics.

So, organics are destroyed in both situations. So much for "preserving". Big difference.


Also, reapers destroying even more, than just creators of the synthetics. They destroy every organic civilization, who never created synthetics. And every organic civilization which can not be preserved, like protheans.
Meaning that reapers are more effective at destroying organics, than any synthetics

Modifié par Maxster_, 08 novembre 2012 - 10:04 .

[CommanderVyse]

LilLino wrote...

...and doesn't explain the Reapers origins nor goals....

This was never required of the ending. The Reapers were suppose to be unknowable. It made them more threatening that way.

[His Name was HYR!!]

KingZayd wrote...

Conflict would ALWAYS arise.

And since they didn't know how to bring about the peace, conflict was always going to arise between them and their AI.

That reasoning would be akin to Shepard saying no-go on having EDI and Legion on the Normandy, because Shepard's experiences with synthetics in ME1 are always bad ones.

But it would be wrong. In Leviathan's case, you and I have the convenience of hidsight to say "It was foolish of him to ever trust those trecherous synthetics! Why couldn't he see that?" But it's no less a risk when the player does it in ME2.

Out of curiousity, why did the Leviathans care about peace between organics and synthetics? As long as there are species to exist as thralls to the Leviathans, isn't it okay?

How long does it take for civilization to develop after being wiped out... 50,000 years, going off the Reapers' cycles?

Suffice it to say, I think it would get pretty annoying to take slave races, lose them, and then wait milennia for replacements.

Modifié par HYR 2.0, 08 novembre 2012 - 10:18 .

[His Name was HYR!!]

Maxster_ wrote...


Also, reapers destroying even more, than just creators of the synthetics. They destroy every organic civilization, who never created synthetics. And every organic civilization which can not be preserved, like protheans.
Meaning that reapers are more effective at destroying organics, than any synthetics

Haha bro, that's almost as funny as Demogoggy!

[Maxster_]

HYR 2.0 wrote...

Maxster_ wrote...


Also, reapers destroying even more, than just creators of the synthetics. They destroy every organic civilization, who never created synthetics. And every organic civilization which can not be preserved, like protheans.
Meaning that reapers are more effective at destroying organics, than any synthetics

Haha bro, that's almost as funny as Demogoggy!

I know that you have nothing to say in defence of ME3 crappy plot. You already showed that behavior in this thread.
Now you can run for moderators again Too bad they never listened to your whines.

[KingZayd]

HYR 2.0 wrote...

KingZayd wrote...

Conflict would ALWAYS arise.

And since they didn't know how to bring about the peace, conflict was always going to arise between them and their AI.

That reasoning would be akin to Shepard saying no-go on having EDI and Legion on the Normandy, because Shepard's experiences with synthetics in ME1 are always bad ones.

But it would be wrong. In Leviathan's case, you and I have the convenience of hidsight to say "It was foolish of him to ever trust those trecherous synthetics! Why couldn't he see that?" But it's no less a risk when the player does it in ME2.

Out of curiousity, why did the Leviathans care about peace between organics and synthetics? As long as there are species to exist as thralls to the Leviathans, isn't it okay?

How long does it take for civilization to develop after being wiped out... 50,000 years, going off the Reapers' cycles?

Suffice it to say, I think it would get pretty annoying to take slave races, lose them, and then wait milennia for replacements.

It wouldn't because the Leviathans had created the Starchild because they decided that : "Conflict would ALWAYS arise between Synthetics and Organics". Shepard (at least my Shepard) didn't come to the conclusion that synthetics would always want to shoot him. If he had, he would not have trusted EDI nor would he have trusted the Geth.

I'm saying its foolish for the Leviathans to create a synthetic, when they believed synthetics would always end up trying to kill them.

The Leviathans werre pretty strong right? Surely they could have killed the synthetics their thralls created? Or even just enslaved the synthetics (if indeed they were arrogant to believe they alone would never be killed by synthetics)

[Maxster_]

KingZayd wrote...

HYR 2.0 wrote...

KingZayd wrote...

Conflict would ALWAYS arise.

And since they didn't know how to bring about the peace, conflict was always going to arise between them and their AI.

That reasoning would be akin to Shepard saying no-go on having EDI and Legion on the Normandy, because Shepard's experiences with synthetics in ME1 are always bad ones.

But it would be wrong. In Leviathan's case, you and I have the convenience of hidsight to say "It was foolish of him to ever trust those trecherous synthetics! Why couldn't he see that?" But it's no less a risk when the player does it in ME2.

Out of curiousity, why did the Leviathans care about peace between organics and synthetics? As long as there are species to exist as thralls to the Leviathans, isn't it okay?

How long does it take for civilization to develop after being wiped out... 50,000 years, going off the Reapers' cycles?

Suffice it to say, I think it would get pretty annoying to take slave races, lose them, and then wait milennia for replacements.

It wouldn't because the Leviathans had created the Starchild because they decided that : "Conflict would ALWAYS arise between Synthetics and Organics". Shepard (at least my Shepard) didn't come to the conclusion that synthetics would always want to shoot him. If he had, he would not have trusted EDI nor would he have trusted the Geth.

I'm saying its foolish for the Leviathans to create a synthetic, when they believed synthetics would always end up trying to kill them.

The Leviathans werre pretty strong right? Surely they could have killed the synthetics their thralls created? Or even just enslaved the synthetics (if indeed they were arrogant to believe they alone would never be killed by synthetics)

Of course it is foolish. It is nowadays EAWare storytelling. Like Udina betraying himself and other ME3 nonsense.
Assertion about synthetics that will destroy all organics is obviously false, and someone operating on base of such false premise is obviously crazy(or retarded).

[His Name was HYR!!]

Maxster_ wrote...

I know that you have nothing to say.

As always, you're wrong. I have plenty to say. But I decided, hey, why say anything when I can just adopt the Maxster_ method of argument and just throw out stupid insults/name-calling that I can't even spell?!

Surely you won't hold it over me for speaking your language, right? 

[SmellyMetal]

This mod actually offers less choice than the original and doesn't explain the Reapers origins nor goals.

Because the original game did?

You have to pay for the Leviathan DLC to understand EVERYTHING that should have been included in ME3 already...

Modifié par SmellyMetal, 08 novembre 2012 - 10:48 .

[Maxster_]

HYR 2.0 wrote...

Maxster_ wrote...

I know that you have nothing to say.

As always, you're wrong. I have plenty to say. But I decided, hey, why say anything when I can just adopt the Maxster_ method of argument and just throw out stupid insults/name-calling that I can't even spell?!

Surely you won't hold it over me for speaking your language, right? 

You are pathetic. Taking part of phrase out of context just to make personal attack. After previous personal attack based on typing error(is it even existed, such typing error in my posts? knowing you, you could have just made that up).


Also, previous thread already showed how exactly pathetic you are.
Now you should start your second run for the moderators

Modifié par Maxster_, 08 novembre 2012 - 10:54 .

[Maxster_]

SmellyMetal wrote...

This mod actually offers less choice than the original and doesn't explain the Reapers origins nor goals.

Because the original game did?

You have to pay for the Leviathan DLC to understand EVERYTHING that should have been included in ME3 already...

Really?
You are saying this, as if Leviathan DLC added some explanations.

[Mathias]

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

MrFob is not a pro. He made this mod out of the goodness of his heart for the community to use. It satisfies me. I worked my arse off and gathered all the resources available 100% completion, played multi player 100% readiness, promoted 10 characters, so I should have the maximum benefit, right? Still I get no better ending with Destroy than someone with 3200 EMS. Shepard is still left in a pile of rubble. I just get that stupid gasp. Oh well. That really sucks.

We know that in about 6 months multiplayer is going to be dead, so 3150 or what ever it is will be the target anyway. Then if you have Leviathan, Omega, and other DLC, you should be able to get out of that pile of rubble and have your reunion like in MEHEM, don't you think? You worked hard enough for it. It's not really a happy ending either. You lost your friend and mentor and you just put his name on the memorial board. It's a bittersweet ending. Your LI doesn't look all happy either, so like I said it's bittersweet. Happy would be "Party!" No one is partying. They're remembering the lost and glad to be alive.

So I think the player earned this as a possibility, but we never got it, and they're not going to give it to us. Hence those of us who pick destroy all the time will download this mod, and use it because it makes the game playable.

I don't need to have Casper explain what the reapers do and why they do it. It's not going to change what I do to them, ever. All three choices he gives me are morally reprehensible. Refuse isn't an option because BW said conventional victory isn't possible. So that leaves us with this mod.

A conventional victory mod would be interesting as well, and have Shepard give the monologue at the end. It could be done. It would be a lot of work. Triggers around 7000 TMS. Someone could "do" Shepard with a lot of practice, and with some tweaking it could sound pretty convincing, but not exact.

Respect.

Modifié par Mdoggy1214, 08 novembre 2012 - 11:00 .

[Dretlin]

I prefer this stab at the ending. I found the original ending monumentally unsatisfying, not in keeping with the ethos of the series - and just plain bizarre.

I have bought none of the DLC for ME3, as I do not see much enjoyment in revisiting something I know ends in such lackluster way.

So I praise these people for trying and I prefer there ending. Not because it is happy or sad but because it puts your choices at the center, whether for good or bad. I feel this is what Bioware should have done.

Bioware did however create an incredible journey. Its is just a shame they lost there nerve at the very last hurdle.

[His Name was HYR!!]

Maxster_ wrote...

You are pathetic. Taking part of phrase out of context just to make personal attack.

rofl, personal attack? In that thread you linked (thanks for that, by the way), you clearly state your intent to mock me.

Ergo, saying that you mock people is merely stating facts. Sorry if the truth hurts. Maybe you should.... NOT do it?

After previous personal attack based on typing error(is it even existed, such typing error in my posts? knowing you, you could have just made that up).

Who said anything about typing errors? Only way you could have known that is if you knew what I meant.

Besides, the link you provided proves I didn't make that up. Stones in glass houses, friendy.

Now you should start your second run for the moderators

Good idea. I'll just keep trying 'til they listen, which shouldn't be long at the rate you're going! 

I'm probably doing them no favor by continuing this, however, so this will have to be it for me. Too bad, would've been fun.

[SmellyMetal]

You're my hero! Thanks for this mod! At last we got rid of ALL the nonsense that was thrown at us...EA must be really stupid then, because I would have paid for such a DLC! That's how desperate I was...and just like the face import glitch, a fan had to do the fix himself. Unbelievable.