208 réponses à ce sujet

[kyban]

Mumba1511 wrote...

They should keep the combat as it is (Or go back to ME2 combat, which I prefer)
And definitely, definitely have a more RPG element in ME4, ME3 didn't feel like an RPG in-comparison to ME and ME2.

Yes, I like this idea. I think the combat is pretty much right where it should be. Now that the frameworks is set for combat, Bioware should start bringing back the RPG side, you know the thing they made their name on.

[Peranor]

David7204 wrote...

Because it would be annoying to have the character's personality based on his class.

Here's what would happen if BioWare did that. Soldier Shepard would be a dumb thug who likes to shoot stuff. Engineer Shepard would be a nerd who mumbles equations. Infiltrator Shepard would be sneaky and mysterious.

That's not fun. That's frustrating. What if I just want to play as a class because I think that class is enjoyable?

No, characterzation and combat class need to be seperate.

(Not only that, it would be very difficult to come up with lines for Vanguards, Adepts, and Sentinals. And content needs to be roughly equal across the classes.)

I know that people think that the quality of Biowares writing has degraded over the past years. But I don't think they would write the characterzation that stereotypical and stupid?

Modifié par anorling, 11 novembre 2012 - 11:58 .

[David7204]

It doesn't matter how good the writing is. I don't want my character's personality, no matter how well written, decided by what class I pick.

Mass Effect is first and foremost a game. When it gets to the point where players stop picking their favorite class because they don't like the consequences, that's no longer fun.

[kyban]

JaceBelerin wrote...

Bring back inventory and loot. I like classic RPG style weapons with stats.

Me too! =D

[LucasShark]

David7204 wrote...

It doesn't matter how good the writing is. I don't want my character's personality, no matter how well written, decided by what class I pick.

Mass Effect is first and foremost a game. When it gets to the point where players stop picking their favorite class because they don't like the consequences, that's no longer fun.

And yet do you have a problem with SHepard's backstory effecting elements?

[kyban]

FemaleMageFan wrote...

I would like some class specific interactions. As an engineer i should be able to perform extra tasks rather than just combat drones and turrets. I should be able to apply my engineering knowledge to stuff

Not a bad idea. I sorta felt that way in ME1 with tali in my group. I maxed out her hacking skills, and if I wanted something hacked i used her. Some thing with Garrus, I used his repair skill ( I think it was dampening) for the Mako. When i did drop missions I always used him because he could fix the vehicle.

[Gruntburner]

I would welcome it very much, as long as they are implemented in such a way as to not make them obtuse, annoying, or tedious.

[David7204]

Shepard's backstory affects a few things in the story and nothing else. There's no side effects. If the player doesn't like it and prefers another backstory, he or she can change it with no other consequences.

But what if a player doesn't like their 'class personality.' If they want to change it, they'll have to play as a class they may not enjoy. So there are side effects. There are other consequences.

Modifié par David7204, 12 novembre 2012 - 12:04 .

[garrusfan1]

Yeah I prefer more RPG elements

[David7204]

FemaleMageFan wrote...

David7204 wrote...

It doesn't matter how good the writing is. I don't want my character's personality, no matter how well written, decided by what class I pick.

Mass Effect is first and foremost a game. When it gets to the point where players stop picking their favorite class because they don't like the consequences, that's no longer fun.

This is where you are missing the point. It won't dictate your character's personality.
Imagine i am an engineer and instead of blasting through a mission i have an option to hack a nearby terminal?
Someone wants an insight on biotics and they ask me some questions?
Just like how dragon age talks about mages. Choosing a mage will not dictate your personality

That's (mostly) gameplay, not story. It's important to differentiate between the two.

[kyban]

FemaleMageFan wrote...

David7204 wrote...

Because it would be annoying to have the character's personality based on his class.

Here's what would happen if BioWare did that. Soldier Shepard would be a dumb thug who likes to shoot stuff. Engineer Shepard would be a nerd who mumbles equations. Infiltrator Shepard would be sneaky and mysterious.

That's not fun. That's frustrating. What if I just want to play as a class because I think that class is enjoyable?

No, characterzation and combat class need to be seperate.

But it's not the personality i am refering to. I am refering to skills and qualities they are able to have based on their class. It has nothing to do with personality

Pretty much this. You're character should not change at all, save for special dialogues and missions that ME1 had. Like if you were form Mindior you had to save Talitha, if you were from earth you had to face your own gang, etc..

[LucasShark]

Gruntburner wrote...

I would welcome it very much, as long as they are implemented in such a way as to not make them obtuse, annoying, or tedious.

Those are somewhat hard things to gauge: I don't find Galactic Civilizations 2 tedius, but it is a turn-based strategy game with over multiple menus with multiple tabs to each, but I think it works, yet plonk an action game player into it and they'd be bored to tears.  I found ES4 Oblivion's inventory and gameplay less annoying than SKyrim, but lots of people find the opposite.

[LucasShark]

David7204 wrote...

Shepard's backstory affects a few things in the story and nothing else. There's no side effects. If the player doesn't like it and prefers another backstory, he or she can change it with no other consequences.

But what if a player doesn't like their 'class personality.' If they want to change it, they'll have to play as a class they may not enjoy. So there are side effects. There are other consequences.

There are backstory-exclusive sidequests in ME1, case closed.

[kyban]

David7204 wrote...

The first, second, and forth points are opinions. But the third isn't. It's fact. Having guns get 10x stronger is not realistic.

I understand your want to make the game more realistic, sure. Depending on the game that's important.

The thing is, RPG games, and Sci-fi's aren't very realistic... Lots of older RPG's you carried tons of items, you kind of have to suspend your disbelief. Every play a final fantasy game? you can stock up on 99 potions, 99 ethers, 99 grenades, and carry other weapons and armor... How does that all fit on you? It's just something you don't think too much about or worry on.

Another reason why i Love RPG's so much is because you get out of it what you put into the game. If you spend 2 hours grinding mobs to level up, I better damn well be able to kill things in 1 -2 hits. That's an RPG, you become stronger than you should.

[danby]

Player mods.   Thats why i love bethesda games.  The players will improve the game over time, making its life FAR longer.   If it wasn't for skyrim i'd still play oblivion.   I've had that game for over 6 years now and 5 of those i played it many many times over. 

The whole ending wouldn't have been as much as an issue because people would make alternative endings.  They would make thier own levels and missions.   Perhaps add dinosaur mods

I hope they add player mods for the next one.   Player multiplayer maps and multiplayer games like starcraft did.  The whole defense game came from starcraft 1.  Theres about a million flash versions now, but originally it was from starcraft.

I know they wanna make money off the company mods, and they still will.  Make it happen next game.

[DrGunjah]

kyban wrote...
I disagree with all of your points.

It sounds like you're more of a fast gameplay, and combat enthusiast. I'm more old school RPG. The old skills were not all that useless, they did help.
The strong points in ME1 were not so much its combat but its compelling story, characters and settings. I would like to see the RPG come back, and not be so much of a mainstream shooter. Don't we have Gears of War and other games for that?

The issue with the looting system and the skill trees in ME1 was mainly balance imho.
In the beginning the game is quite hard but it gets ridiculously easy in the endgame due to skills like immunity or gear like colossus armor or the spectre weapons.
Also, ME1 lacks in skill variety.

[Zakuspec089]

It's nice having a mixture of both, I care about characters and story interactions and explorations. I just don't want Mass Effect to be a Call of Duty in space.

They should have more Aliens and human in Mass Effect. Mass Effect 1 I loved the most and Mass Effect 3 with the many new weapons and contents, armor. I think we need more armor, RPG/shooter and other things but its great.

[David7204]

Maybe. It might not be as fun as you think.

I think there's a good chance that players might see such situations as depriving them of gameplay and story, not enriching them. Players will see them as the absence of an opportunity, rather than the presence of a bonus.

Instead of thinking "Yay, I got to help half of these people since I'm an engineer," players might feel "God dammit, I missed half of these opportunities because I'm not a biotic." As a completionist player, I think there's a very good chance I would.

[danby]

LucasShark wrote...

Gruntburner wrote...

I would welcome it very much, as long as they are implemented in such a way as to not make them obtuse, annoying, or tedious.

Those are somewhat hard things to gauge: I don't find Galactic Civilizations 2 tedius, but it is a turn-based strategy game with over multiple menus with multiple tabs to each, but I think it works, yet plonk an action game player into it and they'd be bored to tears.  I found ES4 Oblivion's inventory and gameplay less annoying than SKyrim, but lots of people find the opposite.

If you get the skyrim inventory mod its MUCH better.  Of course you need the pc version for that.  

[kyban]

Gruntburner wrote...

I would welcome it very much, as long as they are implemented in such a way as to not make them obtuse, annoying, or tedious.

That's the trick now isn't it. That's the name of the game when it comes to design. It's called flow, how do you make it fun without becoming too easy, boring, and/or hard?

I still have some faith left in Bioware. I think if they remember their roots that they could make great strides in bringing back the RPG.

[Sajuro]

kyban wrote...

For example, I liked managing my equipment in ME1 but you got so much junk that it was hard to keep track of it all. I liked what they did for ME3 with weapon mods, but i wanted it to be more fleshed out (2 mods and an ammo type is what I liked.).

I also wanted mods for equipment. In ME2 & 3, I like that certain armor has particular stats, but they were fixed. This is a major story and character driven game, people are going to care about the way they look. If we want to wear certain armor, we shouldn't be punished for wanting to wear + Biotic skill armor when we're a soldier, or engineer. We should be able to mod armor like we can our weapons.

I also Missed the expansive skill trees from ME1. I actually don't mind how big they were, but i can see why they watered it down. I would like to see something more in the middle. I liked how i could put points for my crew to make my squad more versatile, like giving Tali sabatage, and Garrus dampening, etc. (What ever happened to hacking and slicing? )

Baisically I want the game to go back to being more of an RPG.

First of all, you do have two weapon mods and an ammo type in ME3, it's just that the ammo types you get aren't useless or highly situational (also you don't have to pause to change out ammo type in the inventory screen)

Second, I would like more cosmetic armor, but I can see why certain armors would be more restrictive depending on your class, a adept wouldn't want to wear heavy armor because of the motions they have to make and an infiltrator wouldn't do well in heavy armor either. Also a soldier could probably wear adept armor, but when you have heavier armor that you are trained to use, why?

Third, I did not like the skill trees in ME1, first a professional soldier/marine can't aim with certain guns depending on the class and they choose to do more damage as you go up in level, what is Shepard doing, pulling the trigger harder. I disliked heavily the electronics and tech skills because it limited who I could take if I actually wanted to open any of the boxes in later levels and it just felt silly that shepard was able to disarm Saren's bombs in the first level but he needs Tali's help to play Simon Says later on when he wants to get into a storage locker.

[Mr.Pink]

I think that it should be a heavy RPG element type game, but with the same type of combat as ME3. Take Skyrim, re-skin everything to be ME, and give it the same type of combat as ME.

[kyban]

danby wrote...

Player mods.   Thats why i love bethesda games.  The players will improve the game over time, making its life FAR longer.   If it wasn't for skyrim i'd still play oblivion.   I've had that game for over 6 years now and 5 of those i played it many many times over. 

The whole ending wouldn't have been as much as an issue because people would make alternative endings.  They would make thier own levels and missions.   Perhaps add dinosaur mods

I hope they add player mods for the next one.   Player multiplayer maps and multiplayer games like starcraft did.  The whole defense game came from starcraft 1.  Theres about a million flash versions now, but originally it was from starcraft.

I know they wanna make money off the company mods, and they still will.  Make it happen next game.

i'm not opposed to player mods at all. Not sure what EA thinks of that.

Even though they sell more to console owners, they shouldn't disregard the PC gamers or the mod community.