199 réponses à ce sujet

[FlashAK]

Hmm, I've never seen this mentioned before. Is it a recent bug or has this been around for a while now?

I love getting the phantom into her hand of denial position. It just makes it easier to line up headshots.

[Bayonet Hipshot]

Air Quotes wrote...

Why power classes need to adjust to boss tactics, while gun classes can just keep firing? And gun classes already do the most DPS. That is the point. Everything else is secondary.

This. I am not a big fan of biotics, I prefer tech powers but yeah there are so many different ways an enemy can gimp your powers. Bubble of Denial, Guardian Shields, Seeker Swarms, Roll, Sidestep, Blade Armor (Shadow Strike on Brutes), Acid Pools.

& how many ways are there for the enemy to gimp your weapons: Stagger & Stunlock. & some classes are immune to both of those. & these 2 mechanics don't really gimp weapons like Seeker Swarms or Bubble of Denial gimps powers

Why can't we have enemies like Nemesis, Geth Hopper (yes bring that back) that can use  Sabotage power against players. & when a player is sabotaged, they have to either switch weapons or reload them because they are overheated & if they player keeps firing that particular weapon, they take 30% of the weapon damage on themselves (backfire). This power should not affect powers, it is exclusively for weapons. We could have a Salarian+Quarian mesh of husk that just sabotages players' weapons, players' drones and players' turrets. 

Imagine the hilarity & the new complexity this would bring. N7 Destroyer with Harrier X + AP rounds get sabotaged. Does not reload or switch weapons ..but keeps firing the Harrier & commits suicide... 

That way, weapon classes would bring more than one weapon. Main weapon + sidearm. & if Infiltrator gets sabotaged, they can cloak and hide to wait for the sabotaged weapons to cool off..

Modifié par The Sin, 13 novembre 2012 - 02:22 .

[Tybo]

Ashen Earth wrote...

I've never hosted a Cerberus game where I didn't get that bug, and I've never played Cerberus off host where a Javelin with AP wouldn't OSK a Phantom through her hand of denial with a headshot. It can actually be exploited with a GI and Proximity Mine.

I definitely agree with your off host position.  I'm going to start looking to see if I can get this behavior on host.

[Black Phantom]

Herbn wrote...

Hmm, I've never seen this mentioned before. Is it a recent bug or has this been around for a while now?

I love getting the phantom into her hand of denial position. It just makes it easier to line up headshots.

The bug has been around since long before shield gate on Gold was lowered for the first time. (the direct health damage aspect)

Modifié par Ashen Earth, 13 novembre 2012 - 02:27 .

[Bleachrude]

I agree with THE SIN

I hope we get an enemy type that can use some sort of anti-weapon type power...Say the heavier your current weapon that's equipped, the more damage you take..

Make it so that it is a grenade type power (thus allowing players to avoid it - the anti-powers also allow you to do this) and I think it would be a nice enemy addition to MP. A salarian-quarian husk as the sin said....

That said, it should be noted that seeker swarms screw over everyone not named destroyer or demolisher...

Turian soldier loses access to markman and proximity mine, geth infiltrator can't cloak or use proximity mine blast and human soldier can't use adrenaline rush either....These hgih DPS classes take a major hit when ganked by seeker swarms...

[Blissey1]

Deathshroud09 wrote...

This, so much...i have no idea why they have to be so stacked in their abilities.....phantoms can become 100% immune to powers, and 95% immune to weapons...banshee's/praetorians just troll the power users.

you mean 95% more vulnerable to weapons, right? Since they're standing still instead of flipping around?

[Bleachrude]

Air Quotes wrote...

Our_Last_Scene wrote...

Why don't you just shoot them?

Because I want to be a biotic. You don't see Liara running around with a Saber now do you? 

You do see her in cutscenes using both biotic power AND a weapon though...remember the chase scene through the air vent system...she used singularity and finished them off with  a pistol...

[Star fury]

It's even more hilarious when soloing. You only prepare to use power and these three mobs already in their bubble.

Even more bull**** that said bubble blocks grenades. I can understand blocking biotics, but old good grenade? Give me a break.

[FlashAK]

Good to know, Ashen. Thanks.

Has anyone tried using the Acolyte on host while she's in that stance? Maybe even with phasic rounds? Would be interesting to see how much damage her barriers take then. Might have to try this next time I'm hosting...

[Clayless]

Air Quotes wrote...

Our_Last_Scene wrote...

Air Quotes wrote...

Why power classes need to adjust to boss tactics, while gun classes can just keep firing? And gun classes already do the most DPS. That is the point. Everything else is secondary.

Pretty sure power classes can also just keep firing.

But they are LIMITED to what they can carry and gun classes aren't. And all good weapons for casters that are light are ultra rares. And if you spec for power damage, you skip weapon damage, while gun classes go full on guns and have MANY boosts for guns trough various evos. They don't care about CD, they don't care about bubbles. 

Pretty sure it makes no difference as everyone with a bubble can't attack you when they're in it, except the Banshee, which can be avoided with a basic knowledge of distance and cover.

You shoot them for free damage and then spam them with powers when they come out of it.

You're literally complaining that you have to shoot a gun for a few moments at something that can't attack you.

[Blissey1]

Our_Last_Scene wrote...
You're literally complaining that you have to shoot a gun for a few moments at something that can't attack you.

banshees can totally still throw warp balls while barriered. and preatorian close distance while barriered, which is almost as bad as them lasering you.

only Phantoms can't do anything in their bubble.

[darkblade]

Our_Last_Scene wrote...

Air Quotes wrote...

Our_Last_Scene wrote...

Air Quotes wrote...

Why power classes need to adjust to boss tactics, while gun classes can just keep firing? And gun classes already do the most DPS. That is the point. Everything else is secondary.

Pretty sure power classes can also just keep firing.

But they are LIMITED to what they can carry and gun classes aren't. And all good weapons for casters that are light are ultra rares. And if you spec for power damage, you skip weapon damage, while gun classes go full on guns and have MANY boosts for guns trough various evos. They don't care about CD, they don't care about bubbles. 

Pretty sure it makes no difference as everyone with a bubble can't attack you when they're in it, except the Banshee, which can be avoided with a basic knowledge of distance and cover.

You shoot them for free damage and then spam them with powers when they come out of it.

You're literally complaining that you have to shoot a gun for a few moments at something that can't attack you.

It sounds like you don't play the game.

Preatorians laser from inside their bubbles pretty regularly, dont know if it was intended or not but they do it.

[Kaitus]

Just an observation (haven't hard tested it really) but it seems like praets take more weapon damage while bubbled. I guess I could go into a solo match and do some tests but just from all the matches I've played in, it seems to be that way. Not sure if the same applies to banshees but they were frustrating the hell out of me earlier with my demolisher homing grenade... I'd wait for the immunity to go away, launch a grenade and she'd have her immunity back up before the grenade hit. Settled for shooting her in the face.

Phantoms? I hate phantoms. Despise them. !@)#(! handcannons are the most evil thing ever. I trigger their shields on purpose just so they'll stand still and let me shoot them.

I'd be ok if power effects were still applied (cryo, prox mine, etc) but power damage was reduced. Allowing combos though? That would defeat the entire purpose of the barrier, no? Next time you destroy an entire spawn of mooks with those BEs or grenades should make you feel better though.

[wk38]

Air Quotes wrote...

Why power classes need to adjust to boss tactics, while gun classes can just keep firing? And gun classes already do the most DPS. That is the point. Everything else is secondary.

I agree that basically the bubbles amount to an inadvertant nerf to power based classes (specifically adepts).  Basically it's getting harder and harder to justify using an adept over any weapons based class.  They need to make the game more balanced...

Remember when overload, acolyte pistol, and energy drain were used to take out shields and barriers... Why do these have no affect on all types shields/barriers...

Definitely agree that it should be a general damage reduction sort of thing not 100% damage reduction, and not specifically nullifying powers.  Or else (like you said earlier) they should not be allowed to move or attack when using the bubble and there should be a cooldown...

[wk38]

Ashen Earth wrote...

His Guardness wrote...

Ashen Earth wrote...


By refusing to use your best weapons when you literally lose nothing from doing so, you are imposing a handicap on yourself. Every time you're forced to kite a Praetorian around the map for 2 minutes while trying to strip it's barrier with powers alone, it is your own fault due only to your own refusal to use all of the tools given to you and putting all of your eggs in one basket.... so to speak. Versatility should be rewarded, and lame 1 trick pony playstyles should be punished. If you don't like having to be forced to rely on teammates to cover the weaknesses you willingly imposed on yourself, then do something about it.

If you didn't have any of those weapons unlocked, you might actually have a respectable argument.

Now let's turn around that argument...

Versatility like : the Destroyer (or any soldier for that matter) or the Demolisher or the Kroguard or the Novaguard ?

These all are classes that by their very nature push you into a certain playstyle. In some cases even don't allow any deviation from it.  Or as you put it  " 1trick pony playstyles ".
Now I ask you..where is the punishment there ?

No.

"Versatility" as in My AJA can equip an Indra and a ULM Scorpion to deal good single target weapon damage, CC everything on the map, and still spam powers because those two weapons combined have the same weight as a level X Mantis. There is no enemy in the game that would give me any real trouble, and when cetain enemies deny my powers (or weapons) I'd have an answer for it.

There is no class in the game that is forced into one very specific role when weapons are no longer restricted by class as in previous ME games and we have so many specialized weapons that allow a class to be played in many different ways.

Yes and while that's great for us who have put the time in already and have a bunch of stuff unlocked, but what about the people who don't have as much unlocked... I'm sure they'll be consoled by the general "sucks to be you" mentality.  That is not balance... Basically they've made the mistake that a lot of companies newer to multiplayer games make in that the people who've put the time in have all the best stuff while the newer players have to struggle until they finally start levelling up enough.  That is not fun for people and makes it harder for some to get into the game thus keeping the player base from growing... in short, it's not a wise/balanced formula for multplayer...

I know it's not competitive but still you should be able to pick up and play, you shouldn't be dead weight till you have the Indra and Scorpion with ULM to equip on your AJ.  And you can make your argument about them needing to pay their dues in bronze and what not, but in order to get the weapons needed to handles these bosses at higher levels they need credits which are obviously easier to come by at higher levels...  

I know it's simple enough to equip a decent weapon, but the main point is still valid... Weapons based classes have surpassed Adepts in damage output, now Adepts also have to deal with bosses nullifying their attacks... You have to admit that some balance there would be better... And maybe your AJ would be better off for it so I'm kinda baffled as to why you seem to argue against it...

[Takeyama]

Based on my limited experience, I'd say that since powers are easier to use generally and grant you a rather large advantage, that's why there are more anti-power measures used against you.
I'm not saying there shouldn't be a change. I'm all for there being at least something to get through, like the bubble does 80% reduction or something. I don't know about a lot of the suggestions here though. Not being able to move at all AND they take more damage? That seems a bit much.

Also, you DO still have a gun to fall back on if your powers are unavailable. I saw one suggestion saying that basically it would render a firearm useless...well, the problem here is that say for the human soldier (if we consider that concussive shot utilizes a gun) that would leave him with only grenades as a weapon for X amount of time. What if he were out of nades? A single character potentially rendered entirely worthless on anything not a foot in front of him...and he's not a Krogan who could make up for it lol.

I dunno. I tend to rely more on powers than weapons, but even so, I don't think it's unfair as it is. It just means adapting (in part, as a team).

[Clayless]

darkblade wrote...

It sounds like you don't play the game.

Preatorians laser from inside their bubbles pretty regularly, dont know if it was intended or not but they do it.

Never seen this before, or heard of this before, so I'm assuming you just made it up.

They have to ground themselves and then enter the laser animation, they can't activate their bubble in between that time as they can't use it whilst grounded.

[Sihmm]

Herbn wrote...

Good to know, Ashen. Thanks.

Has anyone tried using the Acolyte on host while she's in that stance? Maybe even with phasic rounds? Would be interesting to see how much damage her barriers take then. Might have to try this next time I'm hosting...

The Acolyte will work as normal, it's a projectile weapon which means it won't have any armor/cover penetration properties even if you put AP ammo or mod on it.  It's the penetration property specifically which seems to trigger the bug.

[vivanto]

wk38 wrote...
I agree that basically the bubbles amount to an inadvertant nerf to power based classes (specifically adepts).  Basically it's getting harder and harder to justify using an adept over any weapons based class.  They need to make the game more balanced...

I have a pretty solid reason. For fun?  Weapons classes are still boring as fuck just sleeping on the LMB like the mad kid they are while power classes have to deal with the cheesy shit Bioware decided to screw them over with.

Modifié par vivanto, 13 novembre 2012 - 06:10 .

[Eckswhyzed]

wk38 wrote...


Yes and while that's great for us who have put the time in already and have a bunch of stuff unlocked, but what about the people who don't have as much unlocked... I'm sure they'll be consoled by the general "sucks to be you" mentality.  That is not balance... Basically they've made the mistake that a lot of companies newer to multiplayer games make in that the people who've put the time in have all the best stuff while the newer players have to struggle until they finally start levelling up enough.  That is not fun for people and makes it harder for some to get into the game thus keeping the player base from growing... in short, it's not a wise/balanced formula for multplayer...

I know it's not competitive but still you should be able to pick up and play, you shouldn't be dead weight till you have the Indra and Scorpion with ULM to equip on your AJ.  And you can make your argument about them needing to pay their dues in bronze and what not, but in order to get the weapons needed to handles these bosses at higher levels they need credits which are obviously easier to come by at higher levels...  

I know it's simple enough to equip a decent weapon, but the main point is still valid... Weapons based classes have surpassed Adepts in damage output, now Adepts also have to deal with bosses nullifying their attacks... You have to admit that some balance there would be better... And maybe your AJ would be better off for it so I'm kinda baffled as to why you seem to argue against it...

But if you don't have good weapons, then your weapons classes are worse in comparison to power classes. That's why weapons get lighter and more damaging when levelled.

[WarmechaM2]

Apl_J wrote...

Air Quotes wrote...

Apl_J wrote...

The Bubble is why you bring a real weapon with you.

Honestly, +200% cooldown is overrated. If you're fighting anything but Geth, you need something to damage these types of enemies

And that's why we have Furies with freaking Javelins. 

Well that's a blanket statement if I ever heard one.

The game has been this way since the DEMO. Learn to balance weapon effectiveness and cooldown.

But why should i need to do that? 
If am playing as an adept my main focus is on the biotic explosions and what not. i shouldn't NEED to bring along a harrier X just to deal with 1 opponent that has gone and used bubble shield. 
I'll have a decent gun that'll inflict damage (usauly the hurricane) But the point stands, the gun shouldn't be getting used that much, 95% of all kills from a adept should be power realted, the other 5% should bee either gun or melee.

[Mozts]

Agree with Praetorians and Banshees.

Praetorian's HUGE stamina and damage is the most ridiculous,

[Black Phantom]

Herbn wrote...

Good to know, Ashen. Thanks.

Has anyone tried using the Acolyte on host while she's in that stance? Maybe even with phasic rounds? Would be interesting to see how much damage her barriers take then. Might have to try this next time I'm hosting...

Projectile weapons already ignore Phantom damage reduction...

The bug only occurs with hitscan weapons running AP.

[Black Phantom]

Blissey1 wrote...

Our_Last_Scene wrote...
You're literally complaining that you have to shoot a gun for a few moments at something that can't attack you.

banshees can totally still throw warp balls while barriered. and preatorian close distance while barriered, which is almost as bad as them lasering you.

only Phantoms can't do anything in their bubble.

A Banshee will not attack you while blocking powers.

It will actually cancel it's Warp attack just to block your powers, which means if you're intelligent about when you use projectile abilities it can be exploited.

[CitizenThom]

With phantoms...if I'm playing as a caster... I spam an ability and fire lots of bullets, so that if she's going to attack, she's going to die when she leaves her bubble. Proxy Mine is great for that to... place one half way between you and the phantom...and she'll have to stagger herself to get to you.