348 réponses à ce sujet

[Obrusnine]

Unless you all kind of didn't notice, this conversation ended like 40 minutes ago. In the end, it's a circular argument. Neither can prove the other side correct or incorrect in an objective sense because neither actually make sense.

[maia0407]

Wow! Good for you; seriously, if you're sincere, I'm impressed that you've actually come around.

[Omega Torsk]

Edit: Screw it, I don't want to get banned for OT image posting. Besides, this obvious troll-bait thread isn't worth it...

Modifié par Omega Torsk, 13 novembre 2012 - 01:52 .

[Steelcan]

Obrusnine wrote...

Unless you all kind of didn't notice, this conversation ended like 40 minutes ago. In the end, it's a circular argument. Neither can prove the other side correct or incorrect in an objective sense because neither actually make sense.

There's a deadlock because one side can look all evidence and proof in the face and then say "Nah, I like it my way better, screw proof"


It's like arguing with creationists.....

[maia0407]

Steelcan wrote...

Obrusnine wrote...

Unless you all kind of didn't notice, this conversation ended like 40 minutes ago. In the end, it's a circular argument. Neither can prove the other side correct or incorrect in an objective sense because neither actually make sense.

There's a deadlock because one side can look all evidence and proof in the face and then say "Nah, I like it my way better, screw proof"


It's like arguing with creationists.....

I've argued with enough creationists to know what you mean but this argument is qualitatively different than debating creationism. Evolution has mountains of evidence and actual facts on its side that easily knock down any creationist nonsense. The question of whether Shep is alive or dead doesn't really have any definitive proof one way or another; it really is speculative. I, however, head cannon that she is alive while being fully aware that this may not be the case.

Modifié par maia0407, 13 novembre 2012 - 02:40 .

[Steelcan]

maia0407 wrote...

Steelcan wrote...

Obrusnine wrote...

Unless you all kind of didn't notice, this conversation ended like 40 minutes ago. In the end, it's a circular argument. Neither can prove the other side correct or incorrect in an objective sense because neither actually make sense.

There's a deadlock because one side can look all evidence and proof in the face and then say "Nah, I like it my way better, screw proof"


It's like arguing with creationists.....

I've argued with enough creationists to know what you mean but this is argument is qualitatively different than debating creationism. Evolution has mountains of evidence and actual facts on its side that easily knock down any creationist nonsense. The question of whether Shep is alive or dead doesn't really have any definitive proof one way or another; it really is speculative. I, however, head cannon that she is alive while being fully aware that this may not be the case.

  Call me naive, but I'd like to belive that BioWare wouldn't lie, in the game files

[maia0407]

Steelcan wrote...

maia0407 wrote...

Steelcan wrote...

Obrusnine wrote...

Unless you all kind of didn't notice, this conversation ended like 40 minutes ago. In the end, it's a circular argument. Neither can prove the other side correct or incorrect in an objective sense because neither actually make sense.

There's a deadlock because one side can look all evidence and proof in the face and then say "Nah, I like it my way better, screw proof"


It's like arguing with creationists.....

I've argued with enough creationists to know what you mean but this is argument is qualitatively different than debating creationism. Evolution has mountains of evidence and actual facts on its side that easily knock down any creationist nonsense. The question of whether Shep is alive or dead doesn't really have any definitive proof one way or another; it really is speculative. I, however, head cannon that she is alive while being fully aware that this may not be the case.

  Call me naive, but I'd like to belive that BioWare wouldn't lie, in the game files

I'm really just going on what is presented in the game. Certainly, BW could have intended for Shep to live when the game file was named but, as it stands now, they have left it ambigous.

[Major Crackhead]

Pretty sure this whole "breathing scene" was deliberately designed for speculation like this, even if it is somewhat clear that Shep survives.

Personally, though, screw speculation. Why not just have high EMS Destroy end with Shepard waking up on a hospital bed, all wrecked and hurt but still alive. His LI and squadmates walk into the room, Shepard wakes up, telling them "We did it...", cut to credits.

Now THAT would have been awesome!

Modifié par Major Crackhead, 13 novembre 2012 - 02:41 .

[Arxduke]

Umm, my Shepard lived:

Proof

What now.

Modifié par Arxduke, 13 novembre 2012 - 03:06 .

[Zazzerka]

Conniving_Eagle wrote...

Leave people's headcanon alone, jerk.

+1

@OP
You're essentially telling people what to think. That comes off pretty jerk-ish.

Modifié par GT Zazzerka, 13 novembre 2012 - 03:25 .

[Gruntburner]

1. It doesn't wipe out technology, it wipes out AI at the expense of the Mass Relays. Ships still work. Guns still work. Implants still work. There is nothing to suggest his cybernetics are fired.

2. That isn't rebar per se. We never get a good look at the rubble, so really it could be anything, but chances are it is debris from the Citadel. (sidenote: since when does the presence of rebar indicate that he is in London, as tons of other places have it)

3. The person wearing the N7 tags is a man or a woman, depending on what gender your Shepard is.

[MegaSovereign]

Wow 14 pages.

[MegaSovereign]

GT Zazzerka wrote...

Conniving_Eagle wrote...

Leave people's headcanon alone, jerk.

+1

You're essentially telling people what to think. That comes off pretty jerk-ish.

I'm pretty sure Conniving Eagle is being sarcastic.

[Zazzerka]

MegaSovereign wrote...

GT Zazzerka wrote...

Conniving_Eagle wrote...

Leave people's headcanon alone, jerk.

+1

You're essentially telling people what to think. That comes off pretty jerk-ish.

I'm pretty sure Conniving Eagle is being sarcastic.

I was agreeing with Conniving Eagle. Did I miss something earlier on? I only read the last few pages.

Fixed previous post.

Modifié par GT Zazzerka, 13 novembre 2012 - 03:25 .

[noobcannon]

Argolas wrote...

iPoohCupCakes wrote...

Deitar wrote...

Proof. Your argument is invalid OP.

Yes, these are the breath scenes. And for the record, more proof directly from Bioware.

You may notice that in the “Shepard lives” ending, the love interest hesitates to place Shepard’s name on the wall, and instead looks up as though deep in thought. This is meant to suggest that the love interest
is not ready to believe Shepard is dead, and the final scene reveals they are correct. As the Normandy lifts off, there is hope that the loveinterest and Shepard will again be together.

Link

OP you lose. get over yourself.

[jpraelster93]

noobcannon wrote...

Argolas wrote...

iPoohCupCakes wrote...

Deitar wrote...

Proof. Your argument is invalid OP.

Yes, these are the breath scenes. And for the record, more proof directly from Bioware.

You may notice that in the “Shepard lives” ending, the love interest hesitates to place Shepard’s name on the wall, and instead looks up as though deep in thought. This is meant to suggest that the love interest
is not ready to believe Shepard is dead, and the final scene reveals they are correct. As the Normandy lifts off, there is hope that the loveinterest and Shepard will again be together.

Link

OP you lose. get over yourself.

[ZeCollectorDestroya]

OP is a console **** (Did he?! Yes, he just said it...)

If you play on PC, go to the ME3 install location, \\BIOgame\\movies\\End03_Shepard_Alive_Male.bik
Play the file if you have the Bik format player. I did, and it gives you the breathe scene without any sound due to the way a Bik file is created (Me thinks)

This disproves EVERYTHING. Suck it, and shove a potato up le anus.

[Steelcan]

Checkmate

[TSA_383]

Obrusnine wrote...

Okay, I've been seeing this pop up wayyyyyy too frequently where people still actually believe Shepard is alive in the destroy ending. So I really want to ruin your day, he did not survive. The person taking a breath cannot have been him, period.

The first piece of evidence is the obvious one. The Destroy ending obliterates all technology, this is immediatley established about it. It doesn't just kill the Reapers, it kills all tech, everywhere in the galaxy. Shepard has cybernetic implants, and it has been repeatedly established throughout the series that he cannot live without them. In the beginning of the game, Chakwas checks to make sure your cybernetic implants were okay because she was worried. The blast would've fried Shepard's implants and instantaneously killed him.

The second piece is a little less obvious, but one of the developers stated that the person taking a breath in the scene is surrounded by Rebar. London has tons of Rebar. Even if you could convince me that Shepard could survive the citadel exploding into pieces, or that Shepard could survive re-entry (which he could not), the chances are even more astronomical that he would land right back in London where he started. Earth is a pretty big planet, you dig? Hell, chances are astronomically low that he would land on land. 70 percent of the Earth is covered in water. Besides, Shepard would die on impact because he is travelling at terminal velocity.

Now I know your going to argue now that Shepard's armor could've protected him. I ask you how? Shepard's armor was torn to bits by Harbinger's beam. He had no kinetic barriers to stop him from being killed by the citadel explosion, re-entry, and hitting the ground.

The third one is just a question of resilience. I urge you not to put Shepard on too high a pedestal here. Sure, Shepard's a bad-ass, but he's still a HUMAN BEING. It's already amazing that he survived the intense heat from Harbinger's beam, getting shot in the shoulder, and losing a ton of blood. There is no way you an convince me that he also survived everything above.

So just get it into your thick skulls. Just because some dude wearing N7 armor took a breath in the end, just because the people didn't put his name on the wall (How would they even know not to? They are on a jungle planet light-years away from Earth.), just because Shepard's a bad-ass... that does not mean he survived.

Shepard dies in the Destroy ending, end of story.

Seems Legit...

OP came across the thing that started the indoctrination theory, but managed to make himself look like a drooling retard in the process 

Modifié par TSA_383, 13 novembre 2012 - 04:38 .

[MasterKiller64]

Well good thing Bioware confirmed he lives in Destroy and I don't have to listen to a thing you say. Look here and read this Bioware post.
social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/355/index/12798992&lf=8

Modifié par MasterKiller64, 13 novembre 2012 - 05:00 .

[Seifer006]

i hate liara...

[Battlepope190]

Shepard lived and there's nothing you or anyone else can say to change my mind.

[RaenImrahl]

Well... we laughed, we cried... it was better than "Cats". This thread has certainly run the gambit.

All of the evidence for and against Shep's survival is presentational rather than discursive... meaning it is presented through imagery and visual metaphor rather than confirmed or denied explicitly. There is no explicit answer, one way or another, within the game itself.

The actual answer lies within each gamers' interpretation of the their gameplay experience.  We all wanted to be involved in the story, and for better or worse, that's exactly what we got-- each one of us is the arbiter of our own interpretation.

So there's no way to settle this argument... certainly not by calling one another names. So I think it's time to draw the curtain on this particular drama.

Modifié par RaenImrahl, 13 novembre 2012 - 05:35 .