232 réponses à ce sujet

[Stenun]

BjornDaDwarf wrote...
You started off with a whiny, antagonistic thread that insulted the BSN at large, a significant number of regular posters and Bioware.  And you wonder why your thread degenerated and why you can't have a proper discussion.

I don't think I insulted "BSN at large".  I certianly questioned BioWare's wisdom, though.  :-)

[palmof40sorrows]

Saans Shadow wrote...

Ugh...

You're right, "Family Guy" IS terrible. Ugh indeed.

[Dunvi]

Stenun wrote...
... because the person responding is SuperGamer and wants it to be a challenge akin to ice skating uphill.

That's a common part of high intensity ice hockey training.

[Avl521]

Dear God... I just can't believe this...

[Feneckus]

Gold/Platinum is easier than it was a few months ago.

- We've got better weapons, both because of our money spent in the store and because of powerful guns being released with each DLC (Harrier, PPR, Typhoon, Piranha, Reegar, Acolyte ...)
- Those same DLCs brought arguably the best classes in the game
- We now have a gear slot, so that's 15% weapon damage bonus/30% more shields or whatever for every single class, which definitely makes things easier
- Level 4 consumables
- Every boss unit has a weakpoint

I'm sorry but are you serious ?

[Stenun]

Kushiel42 wrote...

Stenun wrote...
And therefore fewer and fewer peopole are playing Gold and Platinum...

As I have said elsewhere in my replies, while there might be a more obvious dip right now because of the recent challenges the trend is definitely a gradual decrease even without that. 

No offense, but I'm quite confident that Bioware's sample sizes on the truth of this are exponentially larger than yours, particularly given that you've said yourself you're mostly hearing the complaints about difficulty from people who are playing silver because they don't want to bother with gold. A dispute between one person's self-selecting sample and the entire database of global player activity isn't much of a dispute.

To offer my own anecdotal experience, which again due to sample size is as irrelevant as your own, I've had no more issue finding PUGs on gold recently than I ever have.

I absolutely accept that I can only ever talk from my frame of reference. 
And yes, BioWare's frame of reference in regards to this particular topic is obviously much bigger.
I don't deny either of those facts for one moment.

But I can't argue from a frame of reference I don't have, can I?  And if, from my frame of reference, I see something that I feel needs commenting on ... shouldn't I do just that?

I completely accept that everything I have said here is just my blinkered opinion and nothing more - just like everyone's responses are, too.
Here's one:  I've said that I hear a lot over mic on Silver games that Gold games are now too hard.  Well, I'm not going to hear in Silver that Gold is easy, am I?    See?  I know there are flaws in my very own evidence and experience but I can't argue from a position I've never seen.

And the position I *have* seen is that more and more players are finding Gold too hard and BioWare, instead of addressing the difficulty, are just going to increase the XP rewards for Gold and Platinum.

Here's a thought for you all ... WHY are you finding it easier to grind on Silver for Challenges?  Because Gold is too hard for the Challenges because it spawns too many of the harder enemies, yes?
Surely the logical solution for BioWare would be to increase the frequenct of those enemies in Gold?  Or would that make it too easy?

[Stenun]

For those of you who might miss this point in another reply I've posted ...

WHY are you finding it easier to grind on Silver for Challenges? Because Gold is too hard for the Challenges because it spawns too many of the harder enemies, yes? You need to fight the easier enemies because that's what the Challenges require.

So you're dropping to Silver to make the game easier for yourself.

And I would argue that most of you here arguing that are - at the very least - the Better Than Average players. How do you think the average players feel?

[BjornDaDwarf]

Stenun wrote...

BjornDaDwarf wrote...
You started off with a whiny, antagonistic thread that insulted the BSN at large, a significant number of regular posters and Bioware.  And you wonder why your thread degenerated and why you can't have a proper discussion.

I don't think I insulted "BSN at large".  I certianly questioned BioWare's wisdom, though.  :-)

So being a troll is what, doing the boards a favor?  We have enough, we don't need more.

[Stenun]

BjornDaDwarf wrote...

So being a troll is what, doing the boards a favor?

Er ... no.  I don't think that was my implication at any point.

[Clayless]

Stenun wrote...

For those of you who might miss this point in another reply I've posted ...

WHY are you finding it easier to grind on Silver for Challenges? Because Gold is too hard for the Challenges because it spawns too many of the harder enemies, yes? You need to fight the easier enemies because that's what the Challenges require.

So you're dropping to Silver to make the game easier for yourself.

And I would argue that most of you here arguing that are - at the very least - the Better Than Average players. How do you think the average players feel?

No.

More Guardians spawn on Silver for example, while it's incredibly easy to score Dragoon, Phantom and Atlas points on Gold, it's night impossible to get Guardian points fast because less of them spawn.

The last thing many people will level up is Guardians, which is why they drop to Silver, not because of difficulty, but because of spawns. You need the harder enemies too, it's just that everyone gets them first.

You've grossly misinterpreted the situation.

Modifié par Our_Last_Scene, 14 novembre 2012 - 06:16 .

[BjornDaDwarf]

Stenun wrote...

BjornDaDwarf wrote...

So being a troll is what, doing the boards a favor?

Er ... no.  I don't think that was my implication at any point.

That's what this is, and it's what all of your replies are.  Troll-bait.  You started with an inflammatory, antaganistic rant that you knew would get people's dander worked up.  Then you egged them on, complained about how they just don't "understand" you, called them names, replied with sarcastic comments to legitimate critiques.  T-R-O-L-L.

Hence the insult to the entire BSN.  This place is plagued with enough trolls and negativity.  Quite frankly it's tiring and boring.

[SlimJim0725]

Stenun wrote...

Dharvy wrote...

Bioware says they are going to increase the xp/score for Gold/Plat, how is that in any way affecting the difficulty of the game?

No offence but I don't  think you've quite grasped the point of this thread.

I've not mentioned BioWare changing the difficulty by adjusting the xp/score ...

You did indeed mention the xp/score for Gold and Platinum when you took part of the quote that we all know it came from in the OP. They said the noticed more players dropping from higher difficulties to do the challenges, not about it being because the game is more difficult.

My two cents: I think most of the people that feel the game became "too difficult" got too comfortable behind the counters of FBW and forgot how to play. Most of the basics of the combat system get lost when you get taught that you don't need to gel, don't need to missile, only move for an objective, and your aim likely gets worse since you aren't in many situations where enemies are attacking you from multiple directions.

I personally think the game has become easier with all the gears that have been added, higher level consumables, a weapon that is meant for shields and barriers (Acolyte), and the frequent buffs to both weapons and powers (there are far more of these than there are nerfs and none of the nerfs except the Krysae and Falcon were that severe).

They are actually about to buff the players again by reducing the cooldown period of shields, so I really can't take a post such as your original post all that seriously. I have friends that recently came back to playing that hadn't played for at least a month and none of them are complaining about difficulty. There are more complaints from them about bad randoms that are expecting a free ride by equipping nothing except maybe a gear slot and not using missiles or gels.

As for why there are more players dropping to Bronze and Silver, I personally don't enjoy playing Gold pick-ups anymore. Before Retaliation came out I rarely if ever saw a player that would never use a medi-gel or a missile, now I am lucky if there is even one in a game besides myself. Due to that and the fact that certain enemies like Guardians don't really show up in Gold I drop down to Silver if I am alone since I am looking to do either waves completed or kill Guardians which both are much easier to accomplish on an easier difficulty. I can't speak for everyone, but there are quite a few players posting similar reasons as to why they dropped to those difficulties and most of them as well as myself are saying that it isn't because the game is "too hard".

[soulstriker09]

Stenun wrote...

For those of you who might miss this point in another reply I've posted ...

WHY are you finding it easier to grind on Silver for Challenges? Because Gold is too hard for the Challenges because it spawns too many of the harder enemies, yes? You need to fight the easier enemies because that's what the Challenges require.

So you're dropping to Silver to make the game easier for yourself.

And I would argue that most of you here arguing that are - at the very least - the Better Than Average players. How do you think the average players feel?

I drop to silver because of faster completion times... and it spawns the most guardians.

What do the average players feel? .___. Gold is harder now that we're all in silver...?

There was a difficulty spike after Retaliation dropped because of the new units in each faction but bioware has since adjusted the wave spawns. I took it down a notch to pugging silver then to get used to the new units. But now, Gold and Platinum feel the same as it always did. o.o

[Stenun]

Our_Last_Scene wrote...
No.

More Guardians spawn on Silver for example, while it's incredibly easy to score Dragoon, Phantom and Atlas points on Gold, it's night impossible to get Guardian points fast because less of them spawn.

The last thing many people will level up is Guardians, which is why they drop to Silver, not because of difficulty but because of spawns.

You've grossly misinterpreted the situation.

Or maybe I just haven't explained this particular point well enough.  I did think it read as rather clumsy as I was typing it so my bad.  Let me try again.

Guardians are easier enemies than Dragoons, yes?  Would most people accept this?

On the easier difficulty settings, more Guardians spawn in comparison to the spawns on higher settings.  The percentage of Guardians in a particular group will be higher on Silver than on Platinum, yes?

This is because Guardians are easier enemies.

So for the elite players to get access to the easier enemies, they play Silver.  Because in Gold, you not only get tougher stats on the enemies but also more of the harder enemies and less of the Guardians.

Gold doesn't just have tougher enemies, it also has greater propotions of the harder enemies than the lower difficulties do.

Apparently the Above Average players are dropping to Silver so they can find the easier enemies because it's too hard to just stick to Gold and do it there.

[Stenun]

BjornDaDwarf wrote... called them names, replied with sarcastic comments to legitimate critiques.

Examples, please.

[Zaidra]

Multiplayer is NOT hard. Campaign was freaking easy. There were maybe three hard parts in the entire campaign, and that's just because of the battlefield.

Seriously, play better, you'll do better. Having trouble staying alive on bronze? Try taking cover now and then.

[Zaidra]

Avl521 wrote...

Dear God... I just can't believe this...

If this isn't a troll, then I don't want to live on this planet anymore.

[Cyonan]

Stenun wrote...
Apparently the Above Average players are dropping to Silver so they can find the easier enemies because it's too hard to just stick to Gold and do it there.

We drop down because Gold takes too long for those units.

There is a difference between something being time consuming and something being actually hard =P

Modifié par Cyonan, 14 novembre 2012 - 06:28 .

[SlimJim0725]

Stenun wrote...

Our_Last_Scene wrote...
No.

More Guardians spawn on Silver for example, while it's incredibly easy to score Dragoon, Phantom and Atlas points on Gold, it's night impossible to get Guardian points fast because less of them spawn.

The last thing many people will level up is Guardians, which is why they drop to Silver, not because of difficulty but because of spawns.

You've grossly misinterpreted the situation.

Or maybe I just haven't explained this particular point well enough.  I did think it read as rather clumsy as I was typing it so my bad.  Let me try again.

Guardians are easier enemies than Dragoons, yes?  Would most people accept this?

On the easier difficulty settings, more Guardians spawn in comparison to the spawns on higher settings.  The percentage of Guardians in a particular group will be higher on Silver than on Platinum, yes?

This is because Guardians are easier enemies.

So for the elite players to get access to the easier enemies, they play Silver.  Because in Gold, you not only get tougher stats on the enemies but also more of the harder enemies and less of the Guardians.

Gold doesn't just have tougher enemies, it also has greater propotions of the harder enemies than the lower difficulties do.

Apparently the Above Average players are dropping to Silver so they can find the easier enemies because it's too hard to just stick to Gold and do it there.

It isn't too hard to stick to Gold and do the challenges there. It is too time consuming because they don't spawn often enough. At this point I am just going to assume you are trying to troll.

[Stenun]

Slimjim0725 wrote...

Stenun wrote...

Dharvy wrote...

Bioware says they are going to increase the xp/score for Gold/Plat, how is that in any way affecting the difficulty of the game?

No offence but I don't  think you've quite grasped the point of this thread.

I've not mentioned BioWare changing the difficulty by adjusting the xp/score ...

You did indeed mention the xp/score for Gold and Platinum when you took part of the quote that we all know it came from in the OP. They said the noticed more players dropping from higher difficulties to do the challenges, not about it being because the game is more difficult.

I did mention the xp/score but I did not, as Dharvy suggested, say it was affecting the difficulty of the game.  That's the issue I was taking with what he said.  He was - quite possibly not intentionally - creating a Straw Man from the comments I was trying to make.

[Stenun]

Zaidra wrote...

Avl521 wrote...

Dear God... I just can't believe this...

If this isn't a troll, then I don't want to live on this planet anymore.

I'm very sorry that an opnion that's different from yours can only possibly come from a troll.

[Clayless]

Stenun wrote...

Our_Last_Scene wrote...
No.

More Guardians spawn on Silver for example, while it's incredibly easy to score Dragoon, Phantom and Atlas points on Gold, it's night impossible to get Guardian points fast because less of them spawn.

The last thing many people will level up is Guardians, which is why they drop to Silver, not because of difficulty but because of spawns.

You've grossly misinterpreted the situation.

Or maybe I just haven't explained this particular point well enough.  I did think it read as rather clumsy as I was typing it so my bad.  Let me try again.

Guardians are easier enemies than Dragoons, yes?  Would most people accept this?

On the easier difficulty settings, more Guardians spawn in comparison to the spawns on higher settings.  The percentage of Guardians in a particular group will be higher on Silver than on Platinum, yes?

This is because Guardians are easier enemies.

So for the elite players to get access to the easier enemies, they play Silver.  Because in Gold, you not only get tougher stats on the enemies but also more of the harder enemies and less of the Guardians.

Gold doesn't just have tougher enemies, it also has greater propotions of the harder enemies than the lower difficulties do.

Apparently the Above Average players are dropping to Silver so they can find the easier enemies because it's too hard to just stick to Gold and do it there.

It seems like you don't understand the challenge system.

All of Cerberus, bar Engineers and their Turrets, are included in the system. By sticking to Silver you will not complete it faster, in fact you will complete it slower as, like you said, you are missing out on 9 challenges that will take you forever to get on Silver and Bronze.

"Elite" players don't drop down to Silver because of difficulty, they drop down to complete 3 challenges faster. It's because of efficiency, not difficulty.

[NexionSE]

someone got stuck in the ground today i see

[lightswitch]

Stenun wrote...

For those of you who might miss this point in another reply I've posted ...

WHY are you finding it easier to grind on Silver for Challenges? Because Gold is too hard for the Challenges because it spawns too many of the harder enemies, yes? You need to fight the easier enemies because that's what the Challenges require.

So you're dropping to Silver to make the game easier for yourself.

And I would argue that most of you here arguing that are - at the very least - the Better Than Average players. How do you think the average players feel?

If this is true, it's more likely because gold PUGs are so risky, and grinding for challenges requires a lot of time - and it's hard to coordinate playing with friends for that length of time. So players are going solo more (playing PUGs) more often then before.

I'm actually really impressed with the balance at gold - I think it's absolutely perfect. It's really not that hard, as long as the team sticks together and has good fundamentals (i.e., use cover, equips gear, understand how to effectively play their chosen class, uses decent weapons). Even if a player goes down, just three players can still pull through just by following these simple rules: I just got out of a gold PUG where one guy (the host) got downed every wave, pretty early in most of them. The remaining three of us just stuck close and kept grinding, and we extracted in around twenty five minutes. I don't think any of us were crazy good, I know I'm not that great and IIRC no one scored over 85,000, but just not being stupid will take you a long way.

Of course, if a couple players start acting a little bit stupid, everything goes bonkers real quick. And I like that. Gold puts the exact perfect amount of pressure on the team; any serious flaw in their play, and everything collapses, but it rewards players with good fundamentals.