19 réponses à ce sujet

[Ambaryerno]

Yeah, still early to really go crazy with MOD ideas, but I figured I'd jump in with a thought I had...

As a student of historical Western martial arts, the generally poor and random use of terminology and status in RPGs REALLY bugs the heck out of me (it's not Bioware's fault. I blame it on D&D. They're part of the reason people immediately assume Western swords were 10lb monsters and were automatically inferior to anything in the East).

My desire is this: To reorganize, design, and/or label weaponry--particularly swords--to something MUCH more accurate. This would involve the following:

1) The in-game longswords we have are NOT actually longswords, but are more accurately arming swords. Therefore, longswords will thus be renamed to "Arming Swords". I'd REALLY love to modify the models themselves, because they're really rather oversized for single-handed swords. This might be an exceedingly large amount of work, though, depending on how many "stock" swords are in the game and how many unique models they use. Otherwise, aside from name these swords will remain the same as those in the game.

2) The addition of a new "class" of swords, identified as "Longswords." These would be two-handed swords like those already in the game but with several differences:

* The longsword will be somewhat more powerful than the arming sword, though not to the same extent as the large two-handed greatswords.

* Longswords will see a slight decrease in speed over the arming sword, but not significantly so, as a properly weighted and balanced longsword is a very swift and agile weapon.

* Armor penetration will not be too much greater than that of the arming sword. However to reflect the utility
of the longsword in harnissfechten, longswords may be given a "piercing" capability like daggers and arrows if possible. They will also have a strength modifier along the same lines as the two-handed swords, though not as significant.

* Strength requirements will not be too much greater than the arming sword, as a longsword was not significantly heavier. If possible, a Dex requirement will be added as well.

3) The default two-handed swords will remain as they are.

I have some experience with modeling, and could probably create a number of weapon models for the longsword. Most of the modeling work I've done is for older games, however, so I don't have much experience with many of the effects contemporary games can take advantage of.

This would also be my first foray into this sort of editing. I'm willing to make the effort and learn, however. But before I dove into a project like this, I first wanted to see if anyone would even be interested in such a mod, or would this just be something I'd be ending up doing for myself?

Modifié par Ambaryerno, 04 novembre 2009 - 06:30 .

[Mjelnir]

Oh god yes I am intrested in this very much. It bugs the hell outa me when is see those huge sword hilts and all the other little errors. If you will release this I will be the first to download it.

[Eleride]

Good idea. I'm playing a rogue, saw that it was one handed and placed it in my main hand. Once the character actually used it I thought he had a kung-fu grip or something; it was huge and watching him swing it made my arms hurt.

[Ragura]

More so than the 1H swords, the "daggers" are absolutely huge. One might say the daggers look more like one handed swords than the swords themselves do. However, I'm not sure the gain of such a mod would be worth the trouble, seeing how there are a lot of weapons in the game and aside from changing some of the models, you'd also have to look into the descriptions, talents, ... and all that for the few people who would replay the game with that mod enabled, or would use it for their own mods.



If it's your major interest however, go for it, I'm sure some people will definitely enjoy the outcome and it will probably be fun for you to create^^

[musicfans]

Great!

[Kempeorlaxan]

*doesn't get it.*

[Ambaryerno]

Ragura,



As far as the longsword goes, I'm sort of divided on how to handle the talents. Some of those already in the game for the two-handers would already work for longsword as well (particularly the pommel strike). I guess part of it would depend on just wha will be possible WITH the editor.



I'd LOVE to be able to have a "half-sword" talent. That way if you wield it at full-length longswords largely function like a lighter, much faster two-hander, (without piercing damage) while if you close to half-sword you lose some power but gain speed, precision and piercing damage (some talents like the pommel strike would be usable at both full range and half-sword). This would, however, require additional animations to reflect the change in the sword grip.

[ixobelle]

In response to Ragura, I doubt people would play through the OC again with just the mod, but if significant work were put into the mod, then I could see people incorporating it into their own works.



Battlefield (the FPS) had such a mod that accurately modeled recoil and weapon accuracy, and was widely regarded as one of the best mods for the series.

[Eidolonn]

fantasy =/= reality, so it really should not "bug" you all that much.



It would be a nice mod though.

[Ambaryerno]

ixo,



That would be the greatest thing, to see it incorporated in other add-ons. It could also easily be expanded to add other weapons, such as polearms, and more detailed armor protection (IE, the differences between the protection provided by plate vs. mail) as a general "reality" mod.



Eidolonn,



Yes, it DOES bug me, because too many people take their concept of how these weapons work FROM games like D&D.

[CJohnJones]

While you are at it, how about a dex-based epee (too lazy to do accent mark) or rapier?



Speaking from experience in other games, I can tell you that if you make a fairly extensive mod with 10 or so different types of swords and a few good looking swords in each type, you will have a mod that the whole community will adore and become a legend, possibly having a constellation named after you. If you just fix one thing that is bugging you, people will gravitate towards the larger mods. I am wholeheartedly on your side, so understand that I am not being critical so much as suggesting what I iknow would go over well with the community.

[Ambaryerno]

The problem with the rapier (epee is strictly a sporting weapon and was never used for actual combat) is that it was purely a civilian sidearm that was never used on the battlefield, particularly in the period a game like this takes its inspiration from (looking at the equipment and culture it's c.14-15th Century, maybe as late as the mid-16th). In keeping with the theme of the game, I'd imagine a lineup more like this:



Single Handed



Dagger

Arming Sword

Falchion/Grosse Messer (slower but slightly heavier cutting power than the arming sword)

Mace

Hammer

Axe



Two Handed



Longsword

Greatsword

Axes

Hammers

Maces



Poles



Quarter Staff

Spears

Pikes

Halberds

Bills



The main issues with polearms are the large variety and size. You wouldn't be able to even CARRY a 12-13ft pike indoors, much less wield it effectively. Even shorter poles would be very difficult to use and carry in cramped quarters like a narrow hallway (though this COULD be worked into the weapon's mechanics, forcing characters who utilize polearms to use their secondary weapon set when entering an indoor environment).



Armor



Leather - Limited resistance to cutting or piercing damage, no resistance to crushing



Mail - Good resistance to cutting weapons, some protection from crushing, limited resistance to piercing (the gaps between those rings are very vulnerable)



Plate - Excellent resistance to cutting weapons, good protection from crushing, good protection from piercing



Armors such as splint would occupy something in the middle of mail and plate.

[CJohnJones]

Good reply. I would, then, make sure that there are some very good daggers for the rogues in your set. Or maybe instead of a rapier, dexies could get a hunting sword? That would be very in character for Dalish types, at least. There are some lovely hunting swords from the 13th century onwards at my local art museum. I know it is not a hundred percent accurate, but let's face it: historical rogues were thugs who would get beaten to a pulp by an armored warrior in all situations.

[Ambaryerno]

I'm sure there's some options out there that might work. One may be to adjust daggers to have a VERY high piercing rating to reflect that it's easier to get a dagger between the joints of plate armor than it would be for a sword or arrow.



Wow, this is quickly evolving into a lot more than I originally planned. I may need to put together a team for this.... ;-)

[Ambaryerno]

Ok, I'm going to put together a definitive "To Do" list for this. As it's evolved beyond a simple "Sword Mod" and now encompassing other weaponry and armor I'll start a new thread.

[LokiHades]

So we will be seeing Western inspired swords. Delightful!



I loved how in The Witcher, Geralt had a steel longsword as a main, it didn't look ridiculous or too fancy, and reminded me of all my trips to British castles in the past. Seeing them in DAO will be nice.



While you're at it, do you think you could make daggers more like daggers, or remodel/name them into something more historically accurate for their build?



Also I agree on the whole Eastern weapons thing. While they are lovely swords, several people who've tried matching the two have confirmed them for near equals, the European swords having the advantage of a double edge.

[AnTeevY]

The swords are slightly oversized so that you can still see them when playing in the isometric view.

[Tianth]

Ooh! I absolutely love this idea! I'd gladly offer any assistance I could give.

[stevej713]

I agree. The swords are so big it's ridiculous. I would be interested in this mod if you make it.

[Pract1t10ner]

Not to get all technical here but... and i might be wrong here, but Armored English Knights used longswords a lot (whenever they finally came) and these Knights did use them with two hands but they also used them with one hand with a shield in the other. if your going to do this mod at least keep this in mind please.