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[Cancermeat]

I thought we were past this.......

[RethenX]

Cancermeat wrote...

I thought we were past this.......

I know, 8 months is a little long to be still pissed this much at the ending. 

Modifié par RethenX, 21 novembre 2012 - 05:24 .

[Iakus]

chemiclord wrote...

At this point, I'm of the mind that whatever helps people come to terms with the end of the trilogy and lets them move on, go for it. More power to ya.

IT? Cool. Completely retconning everything with a mod or headcanon? Go wild, pal. Burning your CDs in a cathartic rage? Sure!

Anything that lets them move on and not let the endings tear at them and inflict emotional harm eight months later is something to be embraced.

And this is what makes me curious about any sequel that might be produced.  Will an ending be canonized?  Will it be compatible with IT?  MEHEM?  Puzzle Theory? 

[SomeKindaEnigma]

8 months dude. Get over it. Either move on and find a new game series to enjoy, whine on a different forum, or be partially constructive by offering your feedback to Casey Hudson who has returned to posting on twitter and is actively listening to the fans. Continuous whining on here does nothing at all other than be a nuisance.

P.S. This is coming from me, someone who was extra critical of the endings the first 2 months after release and even contributed to the cupcake protest.

[BearlyHere]

SomeKindaEnigma wrote...

8 months dude. Get over it. Either move on and find a new game series to enjoy, whine on a different forum, or be partially constructive by offering your feedback to Casey Hudson who has returned to posting on twitter and is actively listening to the fans. Continuous whining on here does nothing at all other than be a nuisance.

P.S. This is coming from me, someone who was extra critical of the endings the first 2 months after release and even contributed to the cupcake protest.

Casey Hudson is listening to his "followers" who are going to tell him how awesome he is. He and the rest of the team don't care about the rest of us. Sorry you're bothered, but we paid for the games too, and put countless hours into playing different character builds, only to get red, green, blue, but it doesn't matter since they like the worst one of all, green. You may recall someone made a worst case scenario post before the release, and almost everything on it came to pass. Even with the EC, they only addressed the most general complaints and ignored the larger question of Shepard's fate. 

Belive it or not, most of us are playing other games, though thanks to Bioware, I will never pre-order another game. We're still here because we are consumers who feel ripped off, and we want to get what we paid for. And if you don't like it, stay away from threads like this one.

[SomeKindaEnigma]

BearlyHere wrote...

SomeKindaEnigma wrote...

8 months dude. Get over it. Either move on and find a new game series to enjoy, whine on a different forum, or be partially constructive by offering your feedback to Casey Hudson who has returned to posting on twitter and is actively listening to the fans. Continuous whining on here does nothing at all other than be a nuisance.

P.S. This is coming from me, someone who was extra critical of the endings the first 2 months after release and even contributed to the cupcake protest.

Casey Hudson is listening to his "followers" who are going to tell him how awesome he is. He and the rest of the team don't care about the rest of us. Sorry you're bothered, but we paid for the games too, and put countless hours into playing different character builds, only to get red, green, blue, but it doesn't matter since they like the worst one of all, green. You may recall someone made a worst case scenario post before the release, and almost everything on it came to pass. Even with the EC, they only addressed the most general complaints and ignored the larger question of Shepard's fate. 

Belive it or not, most of us are playing other games, though thanks to Bioware, I will never pre-order another game. We're still here because we are consumers who feel ripped off, and we want to get what we paid for. And if you don't like it, stay away from threads like this one.

Firstly, I can assure you right away that the people "telling him he's awesome" represents a rather minor portion of those tweeting him.  Have you actually read what others are tweeting to him?  And I'm also rather certain you have no evidence that the team specifically doesn't care about you or everyone else.  I highly doubt that is true in any regard, considering that their money comes from us.  Yes, we all paid for the game.  I was disappointed with the endings, so trust me when I tell you I was voicing my opinion until the EC and a little after.... however, whether I liked it or not, that was all that going to be done to rectify the problem.  Whether the problem was truly rectified or not, however, is an opinion that is different from person to person.  I was halfway satisfied with the EC, but I made my comments on it and let it be.  

If it's true you are playing other games, why continue to persist with something that is DONE in a different game and is no longer being addressed, nor will be addressed any time in the relatively NEAR future?  If there truly is absolutely nothing else for you to redirect your focus on but this game, then I apologize.  If you feel like you were ripped off, I'm sorry you feel that way.  In retrospect, 99% of this game is outstanding, and you have to admit it was a great game until the end.  

You're right, I don't like it.  But to be fair, I've been sifting through these threads for the past few months.  I felt it was necessary to make a remark, finally, as I have ignored all the others.  So I will post in this thread if I feel like it.

[AlanC9]

iakus wrote...

chemiclord wrote...
Anything that lets them move on and not let the endings tear at them and inflict emotional harm eight months later is something to be embraced.

And this is what makes me curious about any sequel that might be produced.  Will an ending be canonized?  Will it be compatible with IT?  MEHEM?  Puzzle Theory? 

Well, if you're worried about getting headcanon contradicted in the future, your best bet is to sign on with IT-Con/ Deception Theory. That's pretty much compatible with a canonized literal Destroy, as long as you don't attach the optional geth-survive component. Maybe MEHEM would work too? I honestly haven't paid too much attention.

[Iakus]

Worried isn't the term I'd use. Curious is closer, as I have zero vested interest in the next game. Frankly I am shocked a new one is already being planned given how thoroughly the franchise got burned by the endings. I ecpected to see the franchise shelved for several years followed by a reboot.

[CSunkyst]

ElSuperGecko wrote...

This one humbly disagrees with the topic creator's expressed opinion. This one finds the ending to Mass Effect 3 a fitting and effective finale to an outstanding series.

this one thinks that one is stupid.

[HTTP 404]

dasGleamer wrote...

HTTP 404 wrote...

dasGleamer wrote...

8 months later and i still can't look at any of the games without a feeling of being let down.  destroyed a masterpiece with these shenanigans.

hope it feels good to sell out bioware...i can only hope future sales reflect the disrespect towards fans

try and read a book, or find a new television show to watch.  To still contemplate 8 months later about a video game ending is well, wasted energy.

i have plenty of things to do.

i'm just very frustrated that they essentially killed Mass Effect.  i used to spend hours replaying the games because i enjoyed it so much.  i can't even load the discs anymore because of how depressing the endings are.

i'm not even mad about the wasted time/money.  i'm mad that they won't fix the mistakes and restore Mass Effect to the throne of the greatest game ever.

yup I am with you on this but you gotta move on.  My actual last me3 playthrough I plan on not going to the ending until all DLC is done.  Even then I may not "finish" it.

Truly, the journey is much better than the destination. 

[dorktainian]

i stated my headcanon yesterday. i hope to god someone explains to them synthesis is a bad idea. for those that are still annoyed i completely understand. to those who are satisfied well it cant take much can it?

just play to chronos station and wait.....

[Xerxes52]

DirtyMouthSally wrote...

Realistically, I doubt that there ever will be a "past this..."; not if you consider everyone who has played through the series.  The ending discussion may quell at times, but whenever the ME trilogy is discussed, especially ME3, I imagine that the ending topic will undoubtedly rear it's head eventually, for better or for worse.

The ME trilogy and the ending(s) are married now.  If someone thinks that the ending is bad today, as they may have 8 months ago, then they'll probably still consider the ending as bad 8 months from now, and so oon, and some will voice it from time to time.

This. It's up there with the Star Wars prequel trilogy, and the Matrix sequels as examples of Fanon Discontinuity.

[d1ta]

OP, I really feel for you. And I remember feeling very envy to those who liked the endings and the ones who found satisfactory from the EC. Btw do you play your game on PC? Because if you do, maybe you'd consider getting a modded ending? There's two of them out there at the moment, both created by MrFob: the MEEM (mass effect ending mod: which changes the starkid with something else) and the MEHEM (ME happy ending mod: I pprefer this one and it's more of bittersweet for me than just plain bitter)
Not so sure if it'll help you, but it does help me love the series again (though not with the same intensity) and made me want to re-play the game. I'm even contemplating on getting Leviathan, something that I thought would never happen, LoL..

[Liamv2]

God this thread is still alive

Modifié par Liamv2, 21 novembre 2012 - 09:12 .

[sirjimmus86]

I dunno, I thought about it again recently and a few things came to mind that have shifted me slightly.

The Leviathan DLC at least provides some explanation for the ass-backward logic the Reapers use. Their goal is to prevent synthetic life taking over the galaxy and wiping out all organic life.

They have been doing it for billions of years, and lo and behold - its actually worked. The current cycle where humans, asari, turians, salarians, quarians, krogan, drell, elcor, hanar, batarians etc are able to exist and spread through the galaxy is only possible thanks to the Reapers. Javik hints at this when he says the Protheans lost because they subdued the whole Galaxy and then only fought with one strategy.

Obviously the counterargument to this is 'yes but the Reapers are about to destroy all these races', except that they don't, because now that the Galaxy has evolved such that there are so many sentient spacefaring races abound, they are actually able to defeat the Reapers - through the catalyst which is still a bit lame but its means the races cooperated on building something, not just creating massive armies and fleets which would then obviously turn on each other.

The EC epilogue sort of gives the impression that a new era of peace will abound, especially if you chose control or synthesis as the Reapers will still be there to 'enforce' the peace.

I haven't played through a new runthrough myself, just downloaded the DLCs and played them in one go, so I've now started a whole serious playthrough with the EC/Leviathan dlc installed, and by the time I get to it, Omega will be as well - and keeping this interpretation in mind.

[Leem_0001]

sirjimmus86 wrote...

They have been doing it for billions of years, and lo and behold - its actually worked. The current cycle where humans, asari, turians, salarians, quarians, krogan, drell, elcor, hanar, batarians etc are able to exist and spread through the galaxy is only possible thanks to the Reapers. Javik hints at this when he says the Protheans lost because they subdued the whole Galaxy and then only fought with one strategy.

How do we know that other cycles didn't have species working together? We have no way of knowing and I'd argue law of averages alone say they would. Sure they would have confilct, conflict is an unavoidable part of life (organic or synthetic it seems), but I'm sure there would be peace betweem races as well. In no way do I see that as being down to the Reapers.

Each to their own interpritation though.

Peace.

[daecath]

AlanC9 wrote...

daecath wrote...
However, there are some things about the ending issue that aren't "completely" subjective. 
Introduce brand new character at the very end
Gave new character god-like powers to magically end the conflict with a push of a button
Introduced new theme at the very end
Introduce new unprecedented technology at the very end

All of those things are factual, provable statements.

I don't think the italed ones are factual , at least not as phrased here. Assuming the "new" theme is synthetic/organic conflict, that appears all through ME1. And the new character doesn't have any power to do anything; the only person who can push any buttons is Shepard himself. Reading the Catalyst as powerful in the endings is simply a mistake -- he didn't design the Crucible, and the Reapers did their best to prevent Shepard from using it.

Edit: if you want to say that the series had moved past synthetic/organic conflict and shouldn't have revived the concept in the last five minutes, that's a defensible position, though I still wouldn't call it factual.

I'm also not clear why you think rushing is the big issue here. Your reading of the ending is that it's conceptually bad, not that it didn't have enough time put into it. Unless you think more time would have led them to write a completely different ending, and I don't see any particular reason to think that.

Actually the catalyst is the one with the power. "The Crucible changed me. Created new... possibilities." Shepard is the one that makes the decision, but it is the catalyst's power that makes that decision possible. And as for synthetics vs organics, that theme was there, but not the inevitability of the conflict between them, or that being the motivating factor in the Reapers' actions.

My reading is that it is conceptually bad because it didn't have enough time put into it. I do think that they had something else planned. All you have to do is listen to what they said in their interviews prior to the release. The only possible way they could have been describing the ending we received is severe mental disability. When you make a statement like "There are many different endings. We wouldn’t do it any other way. How
could you go through all three campaigns playing as your Shepard and
then be forced into a bespoke ending that everyone gets?" or "You won't be able to say that you got ending A, B or C," then it's clear that they obviously had something else in mind. What that something else was, no one knows. Personally, I think that they were going to go down the path of IT, but ran out of time and had to make it literal, but that's just a theory. In any case, something changed that caused them to switch from what was planned to what we got, and I would bet EA's marketting budget that it was because they were rushed.

Even the game itself spells it out. You have minor details like what is the military leadership doing having a strategy meeting in a courtroom? And major details like where are all the side quests and dialog options?

And most damning - why is it called a "crucible"? What was the secret of ME1? The conduit. What did the conduit eventually turn out to be? A conduit - a means of conveyance. What was the big secret of ME3? The the catalyst and the crucible. What did they eventually turn out to be? A genocidal AI and a computer virus. Crucible implies a trial, a test of some kind. I think the crucible was supposed to be an entire
level. That there would have been some kind of trial that Shepard would
have to go through within the crucible itself. Speculation of course, but still, it fits the evidence. There is absolutely no possible way that this is the game that they wanted to tell. It was the game they were forced to tell because those bastards at EA rushed them.

[daecath]

sirjimmus86 wrote...

I dunno, I thought about it again recently and a few things came to mind that have shifted me slightly.

The Leviathan DLC at least provides some explanation for the ass-backward logic the Reapers use. Their goal is to prevent synthetic life taking over the galaxy and wiping out all organic life.

Leviathan didn't change anything, didn't expand on anything. It just force-fed us the same "synthetics are evil" bs as the ending.

sirjimmus86 wrote...
They have been doing it for billions of years, and lo and behold - its actually worked. The current cycle where humans, asari, turians, salarians, quarians, krogan, drell, elcor, hanar, batarians etc are able to exist and spread through the galaxy is only possible thanks to the Reapers. Javik hints at this when he says the Protheans lost because they subdued the whole Galaxy and then only fought with one strategy.

Which has nothing to do with the theme of synthetics vs. organics. How does stopping synthetics save us from a single race conquering the galaxy?

sirjimmus86 wrote...
Obviously the counterargument to this is 'yes but the Reapers are about to destroy all these races', except that they don't, because now that the Galaxy has evolved such that there are so many sentient spacefaring races abound, they are actually able to defeat the Reapers - through the catalyst which is still a bit lame but its means the races cooperated on building something, not just creating massive armies and fleets which would then obviously turn on each other.

Which, again, has nothing to do with the theme of "synthetic bad, organic good". Nor does the fact that they don't destroy the races negate the fact that they were planning to. In fact, based on Harbinger's conversation in ME2, the only race that they would do anything with is humanity. Which means that for all the noble talk of preserving the races, the reality is that they all just get wiped out.

[Biotic Sage]

Binary_Helix 1 wrote...

Biotic Sage wrote...

Binary_Helix 1 wrote...

What's the definition of whiners? People who use message boards for the purpose they were intended?

I have a hard time believing that message boards were "intended" to be a place where the same people create threads with the same content/thesis statement in varying forms of prose over and over again for months on end. However, if this was indeed the intended purpose of message boards, then "People who use message boards for the purpose they were intended" is the exact definition of whiners.

How many times do bloggers need to remind us bad things happen and politicians aren't doing anything about it? The ten thousandth time was probably enough but that's not really the point. Ideas are being conveyed and there is a receptive audience that wants to engage in discourse around that. Only passion (love or hate) can keep people engaged like that.

I'm not saying that there isn't a receptive audience who wants to engage in this particular line of discourse.  I'm saying that in this instance the receptive audience is whiny and needs to take a good long moment of reflection to consider the following: 
1.  They choose to spend a large portion of their time engaging with content that puts them in a bad mood or makes them angry, and furthermore that no amount of engagement will change the realities of the situation.
2. A large chunk (varying degrees depending on the individual) of their personal happiness is based off the ending of a form of entertainment.  This has lead to the peculiar situation they find themselves in now: that this particular piece of entertainment has the exact opposite effect as its originally intended purpose; it debilitates instead of pleases.  Extremely ironic that "entertainment" becomes negative.
3. They could instead choose to focus on more positive things in life, thus actively cultivating personal happiness and self-worth.

I'm not saying they shouldn't be free to make the choice to continue to whine about ME3's ending, I'm just trying to point out that it is beneficial to no one, especially them.  I know this is a hard truth for some people and most will probably just get defensive because no one likes a hard truth they don't want to hear.  And I'm not lumping every person who complains about the ending as an "incessant whiner."  When I say "whiner" I mean someone who is on here multiple times a week, every week since release, making threads and posting about the ending and how bad it is.  Someone who just pops in to say, "You know what, after 8 months it still hurts" is much different because they obviously have enough other stuff going on to not wollow, hopefully positive stuff because I wish them the best.

Don't really dig the analogy that equates "keeping people informed about the atrocity of the ME3 ending" with "keeping people informed about the violence in Israel" either...those kinds of things are issues that unfortunately the people involved can't choose to move on from, unlike the ending of a video game, movie, book, or tv show.  Doesn't really work for me.

Modifié par Biotic Sage, 21 novembre 2012 - 10:58 .

[Seival]

Liamv2 wrote...

God this thread is still alive

Frequent whining can be considered as a spam. So, let's hope BioWare will make whining prohibited on BSN eventually. This will reduce number of such useless threads greatly.

[Leem_0001]

Seival wrote...

Liamv2 wrote...

God this thread is still alive

Frequent whining can be considered as a spam. So, let's hope BioWare will make whining prohibited on BSN eventually. This will reduce number of such useless threads greatly.

Don't poke the fires Seival. Not so long ago you were an anti ender and doing exactly this. People have the right to discuss the ending and their feelings on it, good or bad.

[Emphyr]

dorktainian wrote...

people getting all worked up about the ending when the battle was truly lost at the beginning of the game. Admiral Hackedoff threw in the towel...closely followed by The Council. Allers joined the ship, banged shep then was thown out of an airlock. We met Javik (who was always there but he would only come out of hiding if you stumped up bioware points) We met 3 enormous jellyfish after throwing bioware points at them, got weapon packs and armour packs. Liara became truly annoying. Ash had botox and ended up looking like she was sucking on a lemon. We met Vega. ME3s meathead. We saw the Normandy ruined and we met steeeeeve and Trayor. We found the war room to be utterly pointless. We got harassed by some barrier as we travelled through the ship just to save additional load screens. Joker Puled a glorified toaster. Tali took a polaroid. Shep dreamt of dead people. Shep got to do more banging. We discovered london is really a sh...hole. We tried to become usain bolt while running at the beam. We failed. We discovered that the Normandy can travel faster than light through an atmosphere and pick up wounded collegues while sticking its tongue out at harbinger. We discover harbinger wants us to serve him a gyn & Tonic. We discovered TIM was biotic. We discovered anderson could move at bionic man speed. we discovered shepard has a reboot switch in his head to wake him up if he nods off. We then dicovered that actually everything is pointless as we are presented 3 choices by a childs ghost while also learninig we can breath in the vacumm of space. We discovered that we could merge with household appliances. We discovered that by being electrocuted and vaporised we could control the reapers. We discovered the citadel was actually a huge blossum.

You made my day!
I will print this posting and will keep it in my ME CE box!

Thank You!

[Emphyr]

Seival wrote...

Liamv2 wrote...

God this thread is still alive

Frequent whining can be considered as a spam. So, let's hope BioWare will make whining prohibited on BSN eventually. This will reduce number of such useless threads greatly.

Seival you are whining ( as usual)

Take Care