699 réponses à ce sujet

[Dr_Extrem]

it makes sense - but you are still firing up the hate - sometimes, it is just better to say/write nothing.

do you think that the "anti-enders" dont love the game? .. they love it so much, that the terrible ending, flawed plot (i could look over this one) and the stupid deus ex machina keeps them from replaying the whole series. they would not be that vocal, if they would hate the game. haters put a game to the side - lovers dont.

the endings are only a part of the problem - we expected that the endings would come in the typical bioware style - like dragon age, baldurs gate, neverwinter nights, knights of the old republic. all those games providd multiple endings - from sweet to bitter. mass effect only provided 3 bitter and one pseudo ending.

they changed the whole style of the game for the last 10 minutes - me1-2 and even most parts of 3, were like star trek and star wars but the ending was more like 2001: a space odyssey. i love both series and the movie/story of 2001 - but you cant combine them - they are from the complete opposites of the scifi spectrum.
thats one reason, the endings do not "feel" good. isolated, the endings a great storytelling - but they just dont fit to the series as a whole.

claiming that a happy-hollywood ending would be too clishe is another problem - the whole mass effect series (and the third game in particular) are full of cliches:
- self sacrifice of key characters (at least 3 times),
- mad villians (tim went from evil mastermind to braindead),
- protagonist weakend by guilt and loss

all good hollywood traditions. why should a hollywood ending be out of place?

Modifié par Dr_Extrem, 21 novembre 2012 - 07:11 .

[InvincibleHero]

I disagree. They may have ruined it for you, but the game is quite entertaining and was well worth my gaming $. Glad your opinion is the only valid one not the reviews or the people that liked it.

You can't always get what you want out of created media. Learn to accept that. Their story and their way. You didn't get what you expected and so carry on and on far past the minor efect it should have had.

An optional entertainment product didn't meet someone's expectations and didn't give them exactly what they wanted so let's rage 8 months later and not let it go. It is not a major life disappointment or changer not even close.

[Maxster_]

[quote]Persephone wrote...

[quote]Maxster_ wrote...

Lol.
First, to bash ME1, you made some asspull and plain lie about choices:
[quote]The Ending Choices. The Destiny Ascension is worth thousands of lives just because it has a bunch of incompetent idiots on board?[/quote]
Then, when i pointed that you misunderstood the choice, and choice was between asari lives(and council) and human lies -
You, suddenly stated opposite of what you said in first phrase.
[quote]
The human fleet's losses cost many lives. I never denied that.[/quote]
So, i caught you on deliberate lies, which made specifically to defend garbage.
[quote]
Don't tell me what I "need", dearie, condescending remarks like that won't go over well.
[/quote]
Plain lies won't help you to defend garbage. And what are you doing in this thread, exactly? Bashing good ending mod for no reason, and defending garbage writing of ME3, by bashing it's prequels(which you fail at).
[quote]
D'awwwwwwwww, lies? There was no other connection to Saren other than the Conduit? I guess Benezia never existed. Nor did other evidence. Sure.
[/quote]
Lol.
We have your first phrase.
[quote]The Conduit. If I were to be nitpicky, I'd be all "Chasing for something
without even knowing it exists or what it does because it will solve
everything?" Hmmmmmm, sound familiar?[/quote]
Which is, of course, a plain lie. Mission was to chase Saren, then it became chase Saren and investigate Conduit and "Reapers". Where it was stated that Conduit solves everything? You just made it up.
And, knowledge about conduit comes from Tali and recording, and only then there was Benezia identified, and Shepard got other link.
[quote]
And more melodrama. Yeesh. If you already thought ME2 was "bad", why did you even play ME3?

[/quote]
And why do you care? You'll eat everything EAWare serve you, thanks to your low standarts. Why are came to this thread?
[/quote]

Eh?

Did you even understand what I said about the ending choices? That wasting thousands of lives on one ship just because the council is on it is nonsense? I don't even get what you're all worked up about. Saving the DA had nothing to do with the Asari on board. It was all about the Council. That's no lie, that's a fact.
[/quote]
I can't translate this nonsense.
DA had council on board, was a most powerful dreadnought, and had a lot of crew.
Human fleet consisted of cruisers and dreadnought, which also had crew.
Choice was concetrate on Sovereign, sacrifice DA, or save DA(and council) at expense of human fleet.
And you are comparing that to Catalyst's crap choices? Lol.

[quote]Geez, you basically call me a fangirl, yet get all angry when games you love are criticized? Seriously? And not liking a "good ending" Mod ruffles your feathers too, I see. Very reasonable.
[/quote]
If you are want to criticize ME1, do it properly. As for now, you just utterly failed at critique, and failed to prove your point, when you discarded my critique of the EC, because "Lots of things in the ENTIRE trilogy (Including several rescue runs of the Normandy) could be dissected like that."
And then you failed to do just that.

Real problem with ME1 choices, is why Hackett listens to Shepard about fleet operations. But it could be explained, in contrast to Catalyst's crap.
[quote]
No, it's not. The Conduit comes up as quickly as the Crucible does. And until ILOS we don't even bloody know what it is or does!
[/quote]
So, you continuing your lie.
Comparing Conduit, which Shepard was searching, because Shepard investigated Saren and something called "Reapers", and only reason that Shepard searching for it lies with search for Saren.
It didn't solved any problems, it wasn't "explain everything button".
You just made it up to defend ME3 garbage, and failed at that.

To a Crucible, which is plain nonsense and cannot exist, and solves unsolvable problem.

As i said, plain lies won't help you.

[quote]
Juvenile name calling serves no one. Just because I don't hate the endings I am a Bioware drone? Geez, that's a new one. I don't like some of Bioware's most loved games. IE Baldur's Gate 1. And I'm not a KOTOR fan either. But yes, I "eat everything EAware serves me." I hated the original ME3 endings. There were other things in ME3 I disliked. (I.E. Treatment of some ME2 characters)  Whatever. As I said before, there is no way to discuss this with you at this point.

[/quote]
So, you are lying again.
Please show me my post, where i called you drone. Ah, you can't?
How pathetic this was.

You just made up another lie, to strengthen your position.

Modifié par Maxster_, 21 novembre 2012 - 07:15 .

[Robhuzz]

InvincibleHero wrote...

I disagree. They may have ruined it for you, but the game is quite entertaining and was well worth my gaming $. Glad your opinion is the only valid one not the reviews or the people that liked it.

You can't always get what you want out of created media. Learn to accept that. Their story and their way. You didn't get what you expected and so carry on and on far past the minor efect it should have had.

An optional entertainment product didn't meet someone's expectations and didn't give them exactly what they wanted so let's rage 8 months later and not let it go. It is not a major life disappointment or changer not even close.

It may be difficult for you to understand, but many people have been with this series since 2007 and been involved in sharing ideas with bioware and what not, spending 5 years to see where this trilogy will go. To see it end in such a way, with such a giant fiasco...

To be promised over and over again that the choices you made will be wrapped up properly and you can really experience 'your own' ending and to then find out you've been blatantly lied to, then be called whiny and entitled by EA's pr machine. I cannot speak for others but I do not look kindly to that, and thus I still feel the need, even 8 months later, to voice my disgust over the abomination that bioware calls an ending. All to feed EA's greed as they tried to turn ME3 into another generic tps to capture both the COD crowd and the Mass Effect fan.

And now, the next insult: BioWare asking the fans for 'help' again, as if they have any intention of listening. They didn't listen to the fan ideas for ME3. Neither did they listen with the EC when they filled some holes the original ending left with more plot holes and nonsense...

Modifié par Robhuzz, 21 novembre 2012 - 07:20 .

[AlanC9]

Dr_Extrem wrote...
the endings are only a part of the problem - we expected that the endings would come in the typical bioware style - like dragon age, baldurs gate, neverwinter nights, knights of the old republic. all those games providd multiple endings - from sweet to bitter. mass effect only provided 3 bitter and one pseudo ending.

What are you talking about? BG1 had only one ending. BG2 had one ending. BG2:ToB had  two three - one choice with different flavors for the divine option depending on alignment. NWN had one. SoU had one. HotU had one (unless your threshold for what constitutes a different ending is low enough for ME3 to count as having eight or nine endings). KotOR had two

Modifié par AlanC9, 21 novembre 2012 - 07:34 .

[Dr_Extrem]

Robhuzz wrote...

InvincibleHero wrote...

I disagree. They may have ruined it for you, but the game is quite entertaining and was well worth my gaming $. Glad your opinion is the only valid one not the reviews or the people that liked it.

You can't always get what you want out of created media. Learn to accept that. Their story and their way. You didn't get what you expected and so carry on and on far past the minor efect it should have had.

An optional entertainment product didn't meet someone's expectations and didn't give them exactly what they wanted so let's rage 8 months later and not let it go. It is not a major life disappointment or changer not even close.

It may be difficult for you to understand, but many people have been with this series since 2007 and been involved in sharing ideas with bioware and what not, spending 5 years to see where this trilogy will go. To see it end in such a way, with such a giant fiasco...

To be promised over and over again that the choices you made will be wrapped up properly and you can really experience 'your own' ending and to then find out you've been blatantly lied to, then be called whiny and entitled by EA's pr machine. I cannot speak for others but I do not look kindly to that, and thus I still feel the need, even 8 months later, to voice my disgust over the abomination that bioware calls an ending. All to feed EA's greed as they tried to turn ME3 into another generic tps to capture both the COD crowd and the Mass Effect fan.

And now, the next insult: BioWare asking the fans for 'help' again, as if they have any intention of listening. They didn't listen to the fan ideas for ME3. Neither did they listen with the EC when they filled some holes the original ending left with more plot holes and nonsense...

asking for help is not the problem - ignoring it, if it collides with your ego, is.


they should just end the game bioware like. it worked for so many of their games before and it would have worked with mass effect a well.
multiple endings, ranging from bitter to sweet - there would be an ending for almost every taste and people would be ok. only the usual s**tstorm about stuff like: "jacobs lack of personality" and inconsistencies about "thermal clips".

[darthoptimus003]

Robhuzz wrote...

InvincibleHero wrote...

I disagree. They may have ruined it for you, but the game is quite entertaining and was well worth my gaming $. Glad your opinion is the only valid one not the reviews or the people that liked it.

You can't always get what you want out of created media. Learn to accept that. Their story and their way. You didn't get what you expected and so carry on and on far past the minor efect it should have had.

An optional entertainment product didn't meet someone's expectations and didn't give them exactly what they wanted so let's rage 8 months later and not let it go. It is not a major life disappointment or changer not even close.

It may be difficult for you to understand, but many people have been with this series since 2007 and been involved in sharing ideas with bioware and what not, spending 5 years to see where this trilogy will go. To see it end in such a way, with such a giant fiasco...

To be promised over and over again that the choices you made will be wrapped up properly and you can really experience 'your own' ending and to then find out you've been blatantly lied to, then be called whiny and entitled by EA's pr machine. I cannot speak for others but I do not look kindly to that, and thus I still feel the need, even 8 months later, to voice my disgust over the abomination that bioware calls an ending. All to feed EA's greed as they tried to turn ME3 into another generic tps to capture both the COD crowd and the Mass Effect fan.

And now, the next insult: BioWare asking the fans for 'help' again, as if they have any intention of listening. They didn't listen to the fan ideas for ME3. Neither did they listen with the EC when they filled some holes the original ending left with more plot holes and nonsense...

i feel ur pain

[Persephone]

AlanC9 wrote...

Dr_Extrem wrote...
the endings are only a part of the problem - we expected that the endings would come in the typical bioware style - like dragon age, baldurs gate, neverwinter nights, knights of the old republic. all those games providd multiple endings - from sweet to bitter. mass effect only provided 3 bitter and one pseudo ending.

What are you talking about? BG1 had only one ending. BG2 had one ending. BG2:ToB had two. NWN had one. SoU had one. HotU had one (unless your threshold for what constitutes a different ending is low enough for ME3 to count as having eight or nine endings). KotOR had two

There's that. ME1 & II both had two endings each. Even color coded. It almost plays out exactly the same.

DAO had multiple VARIANTS of endings.

DAII had two.

That makes DAO with it multiple variants of endings the oddball among Bioware games.

[Dr_Extrem]

AlanC9 wrote...

Dr_Extrem wrote...
the endings are only a part of the problem - we expected that the endings would come in the typical bioware style - like dragon age, baldurs gate, neverwinter nights, knights of the old republic. all those games providd multiple endings - from sweet to bitter. mass effect only provided 3 bitter and one pseudo ending.

What are you talking about? BG1 had only one ending. BG2 had one ending. BG2:ToB had two. NWN had one. SoU had one. HotU had one (unless your threshold for what constitutes a different ending is low enough for ME3 to count as having eight or nine endings). KotOR had two

you could always choose the path of your hero in bg2 - let him:
- become the new lord of murder,
- become a good new entity or
- reject the legecy and stay human.

ok .. you are right about nwn - but you could decide the fate of aribeth.

kotor had two endings as well - one bitter and one sweet and they were very different.

to me, me2 had 3 choices, leading to multiple endings - paragon control and renegade control are totally different - at least on the surface.

[AlanC9]

Dr_Extrem wrote...

you could always choose the path of your hero in bg2 - let him:
- become the new lord of murder,
- become a good new entity or
- reject the legecy and stay human.

]

Good point about ToB; post edited. Still doesn't change BG2 proper and BG1 only having one ending apiece.

ok .. you are right about nwn - but you could decide the fate of aribeth.

She dies anyway, you know.

kotor had two endings as well - one bitter and one sweet and they were very different.

Yep. I said two. And I wouldn't call the DS ending bitter. For the galaxy, maybe, but not for my PC

to me, me2 had 3 choices, leading to multiple endings - paragon control and renegade control are totally different - at least on the surface.

I don't follow this.

[Robhuzz]

they should just end the game bioware like. it worked for so many of their games before and it would have worked with mass effect a well.
multiple endings, ranging from bitter to sweet - there would be an ending for almost every taste and people would be ok. only the usual s**tstorm about stuff like: "jacobs lack of personality" and inconsistencies about "thermal clips".

Yes they should've. That's what they were promising all the time as well and that's what I was expecting. Then the game came out and the (deserved) sh*tstorm began as it appeared all those promises were sheer lies.

And I'm not totally stupid, of course there's a reason why the sh*tstorm was bigger than anyone anticipated. BioWare's track record (which had, until DA2 just a year earlier, been amazing), means people just expect more from a company like bioware after all this time and will respond more vocally if they mess up. People hating just a bit harder because of EA being responsible for the release date - which was obviously way too early as the game wasn't remotely finished. Of course BioWare's response of calling the people who disliked the ending entitled whiners, 'vocal minority' and other things didn't help a bit either.

[sH0tgUn jUliA]

ME3 ending had some really bad moments. Really bad.

* calling in the ship to rescue... the ship. (if EDI was in the party)

* having Harbinger defending the beam when they were taking humans up into the Citadel for processing anyway. That made a hell of a lot of sense. "Processing this way. Welcome aboard!" "Become a Reaper. This way." "Don't Fear The Reaper. This way." No it was a gratuitous way to strip Shepard of armor and weapons so there wouldn't be able to have the videogamey boss fight or anything close to resembling it that might allow the player to feel like they won in the end.

* a really deep conversation with Anderson (three lines) not because it wasn't accurate, because those could have been step kids in the codex or where ever, but because the cut dialogue would have upstaged glowboy.

* glowboy -- the single thing that ruined the entire story. Lame. Lame. Lame. This single thing has made people go back and nitpick the rest of the plot of ME3 and find every single plot hole. If the game had a decent ending they wouldn't have done that.

If you like it, fine. I hated it. No one has convinced me in 8 months otherwise, and you won't convince me now. I didn't need multiple endings. I needed one great ending. I needed to feel like a big god damned hero. Bioware failed me. Fortunately Mr. Fob did a mod.

[Dr_Extrem]

AlanC9 wrote...

Dr_Extrem wrote...

you could always choose the path of your hero in bg2 - let him:
- become the new lord of murder,
- become a good new entity or
- reject the legecy and stay human.

]

Good point about ToB; post edited. Still doesn't change BG2 proper and BG1 only having one ending apiece.

ok .. you are right about nwn - but you could decide the fate of aribeth.

She dies anyway, you know.

kotor had two endings as well - one bitter and one sweet and they were very different.

Yep. I said two. And I wouldn't call the DS ending bitter. For the galaxy, maybe, but not for my PC

to me, me2 had 3 choices, leading to multiple endings - paragon control and renegade control are totally different - at least on the surface.

I don't follow this.

if we put it this way, mass effect 1 has only on ending, that comes in 4 tastes:

- paragon saved council
- renegade saved council
- paragon sacrificed council
- renegade sacrificed council

the outcome is basicly the same in all four. same for mass effect 2 and arrival (wich is the bridge to me3)


mass effect one and baldurs gate are the first games of a series - they haveonly one ending (plot conclusion), because the story is continued in the next game.

baldurs gate 2 - throne of bhaal, is the "me3" of the bg-series - it is the perfect comparision.

in neverwinter nights, you could at least choose the personal patch of your hero and his/her standing - good/evil whise.

multiple = more than one at least two

kotor had the specialty, that you could choose the path of your hero - become a jedi or sith. bitter and sweet - to your sith revan, the jedi ending would be bitter.

the starchild: you choose between 3 (4) actions:
- touch the rods,
- shoot the pipe or
- walk into the lightbeam.

each of this actions, trigger an ending, depending on your ems and your disposition (paragon/renegade). 3 choices - multiple outcomes per choice.

[Dr_Extrem]

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

ME3 ending had some really bad moments. Really bad.

* calling in the ship to rescue... the ship. (if EDI was in the party)

* having Harbinger defending the beam when they were taking humans up into the Citadel for processing anyway. That made a hell of a lot of sense. "Processing this way. Welcome aboard!" "Become a Reaper. This way." "Don't Fear The Reaper. This way." No it was a gratuitous way to strip Shepard of armor and weapons so there wouldn't be able to have the videogamey boss fight or anything close to resembling it that might allow the player to feel like they won in the end.

* a really deep conversation with Anderson (three lines) not because it wasn't accurate, because those could have been step kids in the codex or where ever, but because the cut dialogue would have upstaged glowboy.

* glowboy -- the single thing that ruined the entire story. Lame. Lame. Lame. This single thing has made people go back and nitpick the rest of the plot of ME3 and find every single plot hole. If the game had a decent ending they wouldn't have done that.

If you like it, fine. I hated it. No one has convinced me in 8 months otherwise, and you won't convince me now. I didn't need multiple endings. I needed one great ending. I needed to feel like a big god damned hero. Bioware failed me. Fortunately Mr. Fob did a mod.

exactly - if there would have been realy differend endings for each taste, most people would have looked over the plotholes and inconsistancies

[Robhuzz]

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

* glowboy -- the single thing that ruined the entire story. Lame. Lame. Lame. This single thing has made people go back and nitpick the rest of the plot of ME3 and find every single plot hole. If the game had a decent ending they wouldn't have done that.

This is so true, at least for me. I guess it's a sort of hypocrisy on my part isn't it? Caring only about the obvious flaws that were all over ME3 because the ending sucked so hard. I most likely would've been able to live with all of them had the ending delivered what was promised.

[Maxster_]

Robhuzz wrote...

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

* glowboy -- the single thing that ruined the entire story. Lame. Lame. Lame. This single thing has made people go back and nitpick the rest of the plot of ME3 and find every single plot hole. If the game had a decent ending they wouldn't have done that.

This is so true, at least for me. I guess it's a sort of hypocrisy on my part isn't it? Caring only about the obvious flaws that were all over ME3 because the ending sucked so hard. I most likely would've been able to live with all of them had the ending delivered what was promised.

For me, it is false. No good ending can wash a horrible intro, Crucible, Cerberus Empire(and coup) and nullification of prequels.
Catalyst just adds to that, story is already nonsense and garbage.

Modifié par Maxster_, 21 novembre 2012 - 08:12 .

[Necrotron]

You, me, and nearly everyone else, buddy.

There are a few who either don't seem to care or actually like it though. Don't know any fans who actually knew a lot of lore about the series who liked it though, although I suspect there is someone out there like that.

I really wish they would have just gone the cliche and satisfying ending route, rather than the novel plot overthrow and canon destroying route.  The feeling most people are left with after finishihg the game is "why would I ever want to do that again?"  It's sad that one of the greatest memes from Mass Effect's legacy is the phrase "still a better ending than Mass Effect."

Modifié par Bathaius, 21 novembre 2012 - 08:29 .

[Robhuzz]

Maxster_ wrote...

Robhuzz wrote...

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

* glowboy -- the single thing that ruined the entire story. Lame. Lame. Lame. This single thing has made people go back and nitpick the rest of the plot of ME3 and find every single plot hole. If the game had a decent ending they wouldn't have done that.

This is so true, at least for me. I guess it's a sort of hypocrisy on my part isn't it? Caring only about the obvious flaws that were all over ME3 because the ending sucked so hard. I most likely would've been able to live with all of them had the ending delivered what was promised.

For me, it is false. No good ending can wash a horrible intro, Crucible, Cerberus Empire(and coup) and nullification of prequels.
Catalyst just adds to that, story is already nonsense and garbage.

I get that. A good ending wouldn't have magically made the crucible plot any less a ****** poor deus ex machina. It wouldn't have made cerberus' transformation from black ops organisation to sith empire any more believable. It wouldn't have made the cerberus coup any more believable or nonsensical.

For me, and I can only speak for myself on this part, a good ending that took into account the major decisions from ME1 - 3, showed the consequences of your actions (eg no identical explosion in 3 colours) and had a proper epilogue detailing what happens to Shepard, his (ex)squad, important npcs (like Hackett, Shiala, Parasini etc) and the various races of the galaxy - pretty much what we could've expected as an ending for a trilogy that has been running for 5 years(!) - would've been enough for me to ignore the other problems with ME3.

They wouldn't magically be solved, but I would've paid much less attention to it and probably not be bothered by them at all.

Modifié par Robhuzz, 21 novembre 2012 - 08:24 .

[Isichar]

My favorite part was when I got all excited to fight Harbinger, and then he disappeared, followed by the Catalysts introduction to tell me I instead get to kill myself to solve a problem I could not have cared less about.

Modifié par Isichar, 21 novembre 2012 - 08:24 .

[dversion]

This one time I read a book that had a bad ending. I got over it.

[Yate]

sooooo many angsty teens who think this is myspace

[Dr_Extrem]

Yate wrote...

sooooo many angsty teens who think this is myspace

and another one, who complains about them.

[Ninja Stan]

Let's please cut out the swearing, the insults, and the name-calling.

[Seival]

AlanC9 wrote...

Dr_Extrem wrote...
the endings are only a part of the problem - we expected that the endings would come in the typical bioware style - like dragon age, baldurs gate, neverwinter nights, knights of the old republic. all those games providd multiple endings - from sweet to bitter. mass effect only provided 3 bitter and one pseudo ending.

What are you talking about? BG1 had only one ending. BG2 had one ending. BG2:ToB had  two three - one choice with different flavors for the divine option depending on alignment. NWN had one. SoU had one. HotU had one (unless your threshold for what constitutes a different ending is low enough for ME3 to count as having eight or nine endings). KotOR had two

6 completely different variants of Control, plus Synthesis, Destroy, and Refusal. And only Refusal is pure negative ending - just a critical mission failure with unique cinematic.

[AlanC9]

Dr_Extrem wrote...
mass effect one and baldurs gate are the first games of a series - they haveonly one ending (plot conclusion), because the story is continued in the next game.

Except, of course, that the game wasn't marketed that way, or conceived of that way. Nobody knew there was going to be a BG2 when BG1 came out. If you think they kept BG1 to one ending to keep the path open for the sequel, you are deluding yourself.

in neverwinter nights, you could at least choose the personal patch of your hero and his/her standing - good/evil whise.

True in every Bio game. Your point?

kotor had the specialty, that you could choose the path of your hero - become a jedi or sith. bitter and sweet - to your sith revan, the jedi ending would be bitter.

You do know what "bitter" means, right? "Bitter" and "sweet" are not very sensible words to use when talking about LS and DS options. But yeah, two endings. Like I said.

Modifié par AlanC9, 21 novembre 2012 - 09:43 .