QFTDarkAbsolution wrote...
Don't worry man. There are plenty of us who agree with you, but we just learned to stay away while the rabid frothy-mouthed raving is in full force on BSN.Titus Thongger wrote...
lol amazing how much flak I get for not hating the collector smg. I'll keep rolling with my my CSMG VI murdering everything I see with my human engineer. hurricane is great but it eats ammo like a fat man and has such heavy recoil
Collector SMG mechanics
Débuté par
corlist
, nov. 20 2012 06:53
#51
Posté 20 novembre 2012 - 11:18
sclera
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- 1 681 messages
Retour en haut
#52
Posté 20 novembre 2012 - 11:26
Ogrinash
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- 913 messages
I have it at I.
Not that good. It has accuracy, yeah. but so does Locust which is a better SMG at X (which is saying a lot). The Collector SMG at X is about as good as the Tempest at X. Which is ok, but nowhere near Hurricane.
Not that good. It has accuracy, yeah. but so does Locust which is a better SMG at X (which is saying a lot). The Collector SMG at X is about as good as the Tempest at X. Which is ok, but nowhere near Hurricane.
#53
Posté 20 novembre 2012 - 11:49
Oggy666
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- 383 messages
I did the challenge with CSMG lvl I on GI on gold. I liked the sniping and no ammo box need.
The CSMG did good on gold, but so did predator and hornet (also on GI, hehe).
Its nice and decent weapon, but nowhere near its ultra rare status.
The CSMG did good on gold, but so did predator and hornet (also on GI, hehe).
Its nice and decent weapon, but nowhere near its ultra rare status.
#54
Posté 20 novembre 2012 - 01:12
ArcaptSSX
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- 713 messages
I use the CSMG III with my Hsent in plat. Basically, i use the Acolyte when striping shields/barriers or fighting phantoms(Acolyte should be renamed "Ghostbuster" !). When it's armor i'm facing, CSMG just does it. Of course 50% armor debuff from Warp helps too, but i'm satisfied with it.
I don't think it's fair to compare Hornet X single-clip dps to a CSMG, since the good thing with it is to make short bursts.
Not that i don't like the Hornet (which is decent with the dampener), but having the comfort of not reloading provides better effective damage in the end, however inferior in raw dps. Even considering the low reload time on Locust/Hornet. For instance if you are sidestepping a Banshee projectile, your CSMG is reloading. Taking cover? CSMG is reloading. Switching weapons? CSMG is reloading.
Moreoverk, if you're comparing Hornet dps to CSMG dps in gold/plat, taking the 1.5 armor damage multiplier into account would make sense.
I don't think it's fair to compare Hornet X single-clip dps to a CSMG, since the good thing with it is to make short bursts.
Not that i don't like the Hornet (which is decent with the dampener), but having the comfort of not reloading provides better effective damage in the end, however inferior in raw dps. Even considering the low reload time on Locust/Hornet. For instance if you are sidestepping a Banshee projectile, your CSMG is reloading. Taking cover? CSMG is reloading. Switching weapons? CSMG is reloading.
Moreoverk, if you're comparing Hornet dps to CSMG dps in gold/plat, taking the 1.5 armor damage multiplier into account would make sense.
Modifié par JohnBobbyTheThird, 20 novembre 2012 - 01:14 .
#56
Posté 20 novembre 2012 - 01:16
peddroelm
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- 2 396 messages
SOG TOUGH wrote...
Shuriken > Collector SMG.
troll
#57
Posté 20 novembre 2012 - 05:07
peddroelm
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CSR & CSMG rof tests
------------------------
conclusions
- both weapons seem to be firing at the advertised 800 RPM (no variable rof)
- CSR eats 2 ammo per shot starting with the second shot in a burst (firing shot by shot like raptor will greatly extend clip "life")
-
------------------------
Bronze ravager test target
Destroyer DM 30% WD 10% rof 35% mag size 25% accuracy
27.5% WD passive
densified ammunition gear V 12% WD
CSR X (base damage) - double AP pierce mod (25% WD) 45/60-61 max ammo
CSMG IV (base damage) - SMG extended mag & smg AP mod 59/71-72 max ammo
=========================
800 RPM means 1000 / (800 / 60) = 75 miliseconds delay between hits (DM off)
880 RPM means 1000 / (880 / 60) = 68,1818182 miliseconds delay between hits (DM on)
CSMG // DM off (59 max ammo)
test 1
milisecond_delay damage inflicted
start 82.531250
68 82.531250
66 82.531250
91 82.531250
67 82.531250
67 82.531250
85 82.531250
71 82.531250
66 82.531250
96 82.531250
65 82.531250
69 82.531250
84 82.531250
80 82.531250
83 82.531250
53 82.531250
81 82.531250
73 82.531250
68 82.531250
75 82.531250
91 82.531250
87 82.531250
44 82.531250
90 82.531250
67 82.531250
73 82.531250
70 82.531250
73 82.531250
112 82.531250
51 82.531250
69 82.531250
75 82.531250
88 82.531250
72 82.531250
71 82.531250
74 82.531250
78 82.531250
69 82.531250
84 82.531250
60 82.531250
86 82.531250
97 82.531250
57 82.531250
69 82.531250
76 82.531250
71 82.531250
73 82.531250
91 82.531250
48 82.531250
96 82.531250
75 82.531250
77 82.531250
51 hits
Repeat
milisecond_delay damage inflicted
Start 82.531250
70 82.531250
71 82.531250
69 82.531250
89 82.531250
71 82.531250
74 82.531250
75 82.531250
72 82.531250
75 82.531250
70 82.531250
106 82.531250
51 82.531250
73 82.531250
75 82.531250
75 82.531250
74 82.531250
73 82.531250
78 82.531250
77 82.531250
72 82.531250
77 82.531250
70 82.531250
88 82.531250
81 82.531250
60 82.531250
73 82.531250
80 82.531250
75 82.531250
75 82.531250
73 82.531250
70 82.531250
74 82.531250
88 82.531250
76 82.531250
70 82.531250
82 82.531250
56 82.531250
78 82.531250
87 82.531250
73 82.531250
72 82.531250
73 82.531250
70 82.531250
74 82.531250
71 82.531250
96 82.531250
55 82.531250
91 82.531250
76 82.531250
70 82.531250
79 82.531250
51 hits
==========================
CSR 45 max ammo // DM off //hipfire penalty (easier to aim)
Test 1
milisecond_delay damage inflicted
start 105.362305
71 105.362305
80 105.362305
82 105.362305
53 105.362305
83 105.362305
82 105.362305
84 105.362305
56 105.362305
80 105.362305
70 105.362305
80 105.362305
73 105.362305
79 105.362305
62 105.362305
100 105.362305
56 105.362305
80 105.362305
82 105.362305
57 105.362305
77 105.362305
83 105.362305
67 105.362305
81 105.362305
83 105.362305
24 hits
Repeat (scopped)
Start 140.482910
68 140.482910
69 140.482910
85 140.482910
67 140.482910
85 140.482910
64 140.482910
83 140.482910
73 140.482910
67 140.482910
84 140.482910
64 140.482910
83 140.482910
68 140.482910
94 140.482910
66 140.482910
66 140.482910
86 140.482910
69 140.482910
84 140.482910
69 140.482910
72 140.482910
87 140.482910
68 140.482910
65 140.482910
24 hits
/////////////////////////////////////////////
/////////////////////////////////////////////
CSMG 72 max ammo DM on (10% rof)
milisecond_delay damage inflicted
Start 100.763672
64 100.763672
67 100.763672
67 100.763672
70 100.763672
68 100.763672
69 100.763672
67 100.763672
66 100.763672
68 100.763672
70 100.763672
67 100.763672
68 100.763672
72 100.763672
77 100.763672
50 100.763672
67 100.763672
70 100.763672
71 100.763672
68 100.763672
71 100.763672
68 100.763672
68 100.763672
70 100.763672
67 100.763672
73 100.763672
68 100.763672
51 100.763672
82 100.763672
68 100.763672
66 100.763672
68 100.763672
68 100.763672
66 100.763672
69 100.763672
67 100.763672
68 100.763672
65 100.763672
63 100.763672
68 100.763672
82 100.763672
67 100.763672
71 100.763672
68 100.763672
76 100.763672
55 100.763672
70 100.763672
70 100.763672
71 100.763672
54 100.763672
73 100.763672
75 100.763672
69 100.763672
53 100.763672
72 100.763672
66 100.763672
73 100.763672
66 100.763672
69 100.763672
69 100.763672
71 100.763672
74 100.763672
71 100.763672
50 100.763672
80 100.763672
69 100.763672
70 100.763672
56 100.763672
67 hits
repeat - now weapon had 71 max ammo
milisecond_delay damage inflicted
start 100.763672
67 100.763672
68 100.763672
67 100.763672
70 100.763672
65 100.763672
69 100.763672
70 100.763672
67 100.763672
63 100.763672
66 100.763672
72 100.763672
70 100.763672
69 100.763672
67 100.763672
71 100.763672
64 100.763672
69 100.763672
71 100.763672
69 100.763672
52 100.763672
71 100.763672
69 100.763672
72 100.763672
70 100.763672
68 100.763672
68 100.763672
74 100.763672
66 100.763672
71 100.763672
50 100.763672
72 100.763672
69 100.763672
64 100.763672
69 100.763672
68 100.763672
67 100.763672
70 100.763672
68 100.763672
66 100.763672
71 100.763672
68 100.763672
68 100.763672
68 100.763672
74 100.763672
69 100.763672
73 100.763672
70 100.763672
53 100.763672
84 100.763672
72 100.763672
54 100.763672
68 100.763672
71 100.763672
69 100.763672
68 100.763672
67 100.763672
70 100.763672
69 100.763672
72 100.763672
75 100.763672
51 100.763672
74 100.763672
71 100.763672
69 100.763672
71 100.763672
68 100.763672
68 100.763672
((40.5167 * (1 + 0.275 + 0.3 + 0.12)) - (15 * 0.1)) * 1.5 = 100.76371
67 hits
//////////////////////
//////////////////////
CSR DM ON 61 max ammo
hipfire test
milisecond_delay damage inflicted
Start 124.577148
58 124.577148
83 124.577148
59 124.577148
77 124.577148
56 124.577148
75 124.577148
77 124.577148
61 124.577148
55 124.577148
75 124.577148
66 124.577148
93 124.577148
41 124.577148
78 124.577148
56 124.577148
81 124.577148
65 124.577148
61 124.577148
83 124.577148
55 124.577148
71 124.577148
79 124.577148
60 124.577148
56 124.577148
79 124.577148
58 124.577148
76 124.577148
74 124.577148
60 124.577148
70 124.577148
77 124.577148
60 124.577148
32 hits
repeat scoped Weapon has 60 max ammo now ..
milisecond_delay damage inflicted
Start 166.103027
70 166.103027
52 166.103027
71 166.103027
74 166.103027
73 166.103027
52 166.103027
75 166.103027
70 166.103027
71 166.103027
71 166.103027
54 166.103027
68 166.103027
75 166.103027
76 166.103027
53 166.103027
72 166.103027
70 166.103027
71 166.103027
73 166.103027
73 166.103027
52 166.103027
73 166.103027
66 166.103027
72 166.103027
74 166.103027
70 166.103027
56 166.103027
77 166.103027
69 166.103027
57 166.103027
71 166.103027
31 hits
85.4 * (1 + 0.3 + 0.25 + 0.275 + 0.12) = 166.103 (notice 0 armor DR - both AP mods used)
------------------------
conclusions
- both weapons seem to be firing at the advertised 800 RPM (no variable rof)
- CSR eats 2 ammo per shot starting with the second shot in a burst (firing shot by shot like raptor will greatly extend clip "life")
-
------------------------
Bronze ravager test target
Destroyer DM 30% WD 10% rof 35% mag size 25% accuracy
27.5% WD passive
densified ammunition gear V 12% WD
CSR X (base damage) - double AP pierce mod (25% WD) 45/60-61 max ammo
CSMG IV (base damage) - SMG extended mag & smg AP mod 59/71-72 max ammo
=========================
800 RPM means 1000 / (800 / 60) = 75 miliseconds delay between hits (DM off)
880 RPM means 1000 / (880 / 60) = 68,1818182 miliseconds delay between hits (DM on)
CSMG // DM off (59 max ammo)
test 1
milisecond_delay damage inflicted
start 82.531250
68 82.531250
66 82.531250
91 82.531250
67 82.531250
67 82.531250
85 82.531250
71 82.531250
66 82.531250
96 82.531250
65 82.531250
69 82.531250
84 82.531250
80 82.531250
83 82.531250
53 82.531250
81 82.531250
73 82.531250
68 82.531250
75 82.531250
91 82.531250
87 82.531250
44 82.531250
90 82.531250
67 82.531250
73 82.531250
70 82.531250
73 82.531250
112 82.531250
51 82.531250
69 82.531250
75 82.531250
88 82.531250
72 82.531250
71 82.531250
74 82.531250
78 82.531250
69 82.531250
84 82.531250
60 82.531250
86 82.531250
97 82.531250
57 82.531250
69 82.531250
76 82.531250
71 82.531250
73 82.531250
91 82.531250
48 82.531250
96 82.531250
75 82.531250
77 82.531250
51 hits
Repeat
milisecond_delay damage inflicted
Start 82.531250
70 82.531250
71 82.531250
69 82.531250
89 82.531250
71 82.531250
74 82.531250
75 82.531250
72 82.531250
75 82.531250
70 82.531250
106 82.531250
51 82.531250
73 82.531250
75 82.531250
75 82.531250
74 82.531250
73 82.531250
78 82.531250
77 82.531250
72 82.531250
77 82.531250
70 82.531250
88 82.531250
81 82.531250
60 82.531250
73 82.531250
80 82.531250
75 82.531250
75 82.531250
73 82.531250
70 82.531250
74 82.531250
88 82.531250
76 82.531250
70 82.531250
82 82.531250
56 82.531250
78 82.531250
87 82.531250
73 82.531250
72 82.531250
73 82.531250
70 82.531250
74 82.531250
71 82.531250
96 82.531250
55 82.531250
91 82.531250
76 82.531250
70 82.531250
79 82.531250
51 hits
==========================
CSR 45 max ammo // DM off //hipfire penalty (easier to aim)
Test 1
milisecond_delay damage inflicted
start 105.362305
71 105.362305
80 105.362305
82 105.362305
53 105.362305
83 105.362305
82 105.362305
84 105.362305
56 105.362305
80 105.362305
70 105.362305
80 105.362305
73 105.362305
79 105.362305
62 105.362305
100 105.362305
56 105.362305
80 105.362305
82 105.362305
57 105.362305
77 105.362305
83 105.362305
67 105.362305
81 105.362305
83 105.362305
24 hits
Repeat (scopped)
Start 140.482910
68 140.482910
69 140.482910
85 140.482910
67 140.482910
85 140.482910
64 140.482910
83 140.482910
73 140.482910
67 140.482910
84 140.482910
64 140.482910
83 140.482910
68 140.482910
94 140.482910
66 140.482910
66 140.482910
86 140.482910
69 140.482910
84 140.482910
69 140.482910
72 140.482910
87 140.482910
68 140.482910
65 140.482910
24 hits
/////////////////////////////////////////////
/////////////////////////////////////////////
CSMG 72 max ammo DM on (10% rof)
milisecond_delay damage inflicted
Start 100.763672
64 100.763672
67 100.763672
67 100.763672
70 100.763672
68 100.763672
69 100.763672
67 100.763672
66 100.763672
68 100.763672
70 100.763672
67 100.763672
68 100.763672
72 100.763672
77 100.763672
50 100.763672
67 100.763672
70 100.763672
71 100.763672
68 100.763672
71 100.763672
68 100.763672
68 100.763672
70 100.763672
67 100.763672
73 100.763672
68 100.763672
51 100.763672
82 100.763672
68 100.763672
66 100.763672
68 100.763672
68 100.763672
66 100.763672
69 100.763672
67 100.763672
68 100.763672
65 100.763672
63 100.763672
68 100.763672
82 100.763672
67 100.763672
71 100.763672
68 100.763672
76 100.763672
55 100.763672
70 100.763672
70 100.763672
71 100.763672
54 100.763672
73 100.763672
75 100.763672
69 100.763672
53 100.763672
72 100.763672
66 100.763672
73 100.763672
66 100.763672
69 100.763672
69 100.763672
71 100.763672
74 100.763672
71 100.763672
50 100.763672
80 100.763672
69 100.763672
70 100.763672
56 100.763672
67 hits
repeat - now weapon had 71 max ammo
milisecond_delay damage inflicted
start 100.763672
67 100.763672
68 100.763672
67 100.763672
70 100.763672
65 100.763672
69 100.763672
70 100.763672
67 100.763672
63 100.763672
66 100.763672
72 100.763672
70 100.763672
69 100.763672
67 100.763672
71 100.763672
64 100.763672
69 100.763672
71 100.763672
69 100.763672
52 100.763672
71 100.763672
69 100.763672
72 100.763672
70 100.763672
68 100.763672
68 100.763672
74 100.763672
66 100.763672
71 100.763672
50 100.763672
72 100.763672
69 100.763672
64 100.763672
69 100.763672
68 100.763672
67 100.763672
70 100.763672
68 100.763672
66 100.763672
71 100.763672
68 100.763672
68 100.763672
68 100.763672
74 100.763672
69 100.763672
73 100.763672
70 100.763672
53 100.763672
84 100.763672
72 100.763672
54 100.763672
68 100.763672
71 100.763672
69 100.763672
68 100.763672
67 100.763672
70 100.763672
69 100.763672
72 100.763672
75 100.763672
51 100.763672
74 100.763672
71 100.763672
69 100.763672
71 100.763672
68 100.763672
68 100.763672
((40.5167 * (1 + 0.275 + 0.3 + 0.12)) - (15 * 0.1)) * 1.5 = 100.76371
67 hits
//////////////////////
//////////////////////
CSR DM ON 61 max ammo
hipfire test
milisecond_delay damage inflicted
Start 124.577148
58 124.577148
83 124.577148
59 124.577148
77 124.577148
56 124.577148
75 124.577148
77 124.577148
61 124.577148
55 124.577148
75 124.577148
66 124.577148
93 124.577148
41 124.577148
78 124.577148
56 124.577148
81 124.577148
65 124.577148
61 124.577148
83 124.577148
55 124.577148
71 124.577148
79 124.577148
60 124.577148
56 124.577148
79 124.577148
58 124.577148
76 124.577148
74 124.577148
60 124.577148
70 124.577148
77 124.577148
60 124.577148
32 hits
repeat scoped Weapon has 60 max ammo now ..
milisecond_delay damage inflicted
Start 166.103027
70 166.103027
52 166.103027
71 166.103027
74 166.103027
73 166.103027
52 166.103027
75 166.103027
70 166.103027
71 166.103027
71 166.103027
54 166.103027
68 166.103027
75 166.103027
76 166.103027
53 166.103027
72 166.103027
70 166.103027
71 166.103027
73 166.103027
73 166.103027
52 166.103027
73 166.103027
66 166.103027
72 166.103027
74 166.103027
70 166.103027
56 166.103027
77 166.103027
69 166.103027
57 166.103027
71 166.103027
31 hits
85.4 * (1 + 0.3 + 0.25 + 0.275 + 0.12) = 166.103 (notice 0 armor DR - both AP mods used)
#58
Posté 20 novembre 2012 - 06:38
Knockingbr4in
-
- Members
- 1 884 messages
koschwarz74 wrote...
Knockingbr4in wrote...
koschwarz74 wrote...
Knockingbr4in wrote...
koschwarz74 wrote...
i like it. and i have a lvl1...
and you are doing it wrong.
Played anything above Silver? I don't think so.
i play nothing below gold.
With a CSMG I?
yep. it's the standard and the only one weapon on my vorcha soldier, now that i have it (the weapon). i know what you may say: yes, i use flamer most of the time (as a close combat tool), but between two flame i shoot heads with it. i use magazine upgrade and HVB mod, and i usually use SMG rail amp. and despite the negativity this weapon gets, i think it's ok... i'm aware of its so called weaknesses but i deal with it, and i found it surprisingly fine.
i always stop firing when i see the "reload" warning, this way i never stuck in the cooldown animation.
somehow i like these "unmanageable" weapons that people used to whine about. i liked the pre"buff" acolyte, i like kishock, argus, etc. and i hate harrier. for me this gun is unmanageable, running constantly to ammo boxes...
Well, yeah.. It's Flamer doing its thing, not the CSMG that is great by any means. Still, it has recieved a little damage buff this week so maybe it's decent at lower level now. I wouldn't bet on it though.
#59
Posté 20 novembre 2012 - 06:41
Tankcommander
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I love the idea behind it, and want to have it for headshots/armor, but it is too weak at lower levels. Even with the new buff, I wonder if there will be enough ammo to justify using it.
This is driving me crazy....why Bioware, why!?
Lord_Sirian wrote...
Feneckus wrote...
It seems people either hate it or love it. There's very few who think it's just decent.
The fact that it uses 2 rounds per shot in the first part of the burst is incredibly poor design IMO. Given that it's supposed to be used in short bursts, for example:
power ---> shoot ---> power etc.
It's just completely backwards design. You would expect it to function the OPPOSITE way.
This is driving me crazy....why Bioware, why!?
Modifié par Tankcommander, 20 novembre 2012 - 06:44 .
#60
Posté 20 novembre 2012 - 06:43
LegionofRannoch
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Lord_Sirian wrote...
Nice work guys.
Horribly designed gun is extremely horrible. It's completely backwards.
Also, this needed a Sirian approved inflammatory title. Something along the lines of:
'CSMG IS RUBBISH AND BIOWARE DESIGNED IT TOTALLY BACKWARDS'.
Rubbish.. Rubbish i say. Rubbish is the fact that the CSMG is being looked downed upon. its one of the best guns in the game.
#61
Posté 20 novembre 2012 - 06:50
NuclearTech76
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It's a good gun if you can consistently headshot and have a class that you don't want to be hitting the ammo box all the time on. Perfect for a vanguard along with the acolyte.
#62
Posté 20 novembre 2012 - 10:59
LegionofRannoch
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@NuclearTech76 I found that the acolyte and CSMG are the best weapons to give to a volus for an overall balance.
#63
Posté 22 novembre 2012 - 09:33
Imp of the Perverse
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Lord_Sirian wrote...
Feneckus wrote...
It seems people either hate it or love it. There's very few who think it's just decent.
The fact that it uses 2 rounds per shot in the first part of the burst is incredibly poor design IMO. Given that it's supposed to be used in short bursts, for example:
power ---> shoot ---> power etc.
It's just completely backwards design. You would expect it to function the OPPOSITE way.
I just used it in a bunch of games (level IX though) and it synergizes really well with the phoenix characters. Smash and lash have long enough animations that you regen a significant amount of ammo, enough so that I can smash->fire->smash indefinitely.
To be honest I'd prefer it if the other heat sink weapons used this system. It's more realistic (if a gun is hot it's constantly radiating heat, it doesn't stop doing so while you're firing) plus instant regeneration means every single break you take from firing regens some ammo, no matter how short. (Incidentally that delay before regeneration that the other guns have means that firing in small bursts is a lot less efficient than firing as much of the clip as you can without overheating, it's just takes less attention to avoid overheating.)
The increased ammo consumption makes some sense physically. These charge gauges are meant to indicate that your weapon is overheating. It's like a temperature gauge, except 0 is the max temperature and 70 (for a level IX CSMG w/ magazine mod) is the ambient temperature. The hotter something gets, the more heat it radiates, so if you were to fire a weapon like this in real life, its temperature would climb faster when you first start firing (and the weapon is radiating the least heat) and progressively slower as the weapon heats up, until it reaches whatever its equilibrium temperature is (which might be hot enough to melt the gun.) Translate that into a charge count and it means you'd be expending charge units more quickly when you first start firing than when you're almost done with the clip.
