121 réponses à ce sujet

[Helena Tylena]

In the Darkspawn Chronicles DLC, the Archdemon very much seemed aware of his surroundings and gave direct orders. He even grasped the concept of 'Grey Warden', and that they were a threat to him. Definitely not mindless in my opinion.

[labargegrrrl]

i think it's an interesting idea, op. that idea about "curing" the old gods particularly, b/c the architect was attempting to do that, if i remember right, but failed. what could happen if you chose to spare/slay him in daa could have some serious weight.

between him, morrigan, her ogb (if she had one), everything that happened in legacy, maybe even that crazy bastard avernus? possible threads could evolve around the TE...

that should almost be its own game, honestly. like da4 should be all about looking into the old gods, once we've finished fixing this nasty little war that's broken out in da3.

[ImperatorMortis]

labargegrrrl wrote...

i think it's an interesting idea, op. that idea about "curing" the old gods particularly, b/c the architect was attempting to do that, if i remember right, but failed. what could happen if you chose to spare/slay him in daa could have some serious weight.

between him, morrigan, her ogb (if she had one), everything that happened in legacy, maybe even that crazy bastard avernus? possible threads could evolve around the TE...

that should almost be its own game, honestly. like da4 should be all about looking into the old gods, once we've finished fixing this nasty little war that's broken out in da3.

That would be great. The Old Gods before they were tainted seemed to be allies to humanity, and helped them out alot. It would be so cool if we had the option to convince people to abandon the Maker for them. 

I would love to see the look on the Chantry/Templars faces

[The Hierophant]

Judging by Corypheus's dialogue here. Wouldn't this mean that the Magisters actually heeded the call of the Old Gods by going to the Golden City where they were infected by the taint like what the Chantry preaches which adds some truth to the Chantry's scriptures, and sermons? If the Old Gods were some benevolent entities why would they guide their followers into contracting the taint, who afterwards almost destroyed all of Thedas during the First Blight?

Dumat and the other Old Gods seem like a bunch of malevolent douche-misers, judging by Corypheus statement.

Modifié par The Hierophant, 26 novembre 2012 - 01:14 .

[ImperatorMortis]

The Hierophant wrote...

Judging by Corypheus's dialogue here. Wouldn't this mean that the Magisters actually heeded the call of the Old Gods by going to the Golden City where they were infected by the taint like what the Chantry preaches which adds some truth to the Chantry's scriptures, and sermons? If the Old Gods were some benevolent entities why would they guide their followers into contracting the taint, who afterwards almost destroyed all of Thedas during the First Blight?

Dumat and the other Old Gods seem like a bunch of malevolent douche-misers, judging by Corypheus statement.

Well it was just Dumat who said that they should go. And I honestly don't believe it really was Dumat. In Dalish Lore its mentioned that the Dread Wolf got the Gods sealed away. And considering what happened to the Old Gods "sealed away" sort of fits their predicament. 

I think that maybe the Dread Wolf pretended to be Dumat, and lured the Magisters into the city so they can unknowingly screw everyone over. It doesn't make sense for Dumat to have wanted that to happen. Considering what happened to him, and the other Gods. 

All Corypheus said was "why did you betray us Dumat" or whatever. The shock in his voice at this betrayal implies that this is a first time thing. I think the Old Gods have been reliable, and straight forward with the Tevinters. And The Golden City trick was a first time thing. 

Modifié par ImperatorMortis, 26 novembre 2012 - 01:23 .

[The Hierophant]

ImperatorMortis wrote...

Well it was just Dumat who said that they should go. And I honestly don't believe it really was Dumat. In Dalish Lore its mentioned that the Dread Wolf got the Gods sealed away. And considering what happened to the Old Gods "sealed away" sort of fits their predicament. 

I think that maybe the Dread Wolf pretended to be Dumat, and lured the Magisters into the city so they can unknowingly screw everyone over. It doesn't make sense for Dumat to have wanted that to happen. Considering what happened to him, and the other Gods. 

All Corypheus said was "why did you betray us Dumat" or whatever. The shock in his voice at this betrayal implies that this is a first time thing. I think the Old Gods have been reliable, and straight forward with the Tevinters. And The Golden City trick was a first time thing. 

There's a theory  that the Dread Wolf might be the Maker as he's the only god in the Chantry pantheon, in contrast to the Elven pantheon who like the Old Gods are stated to be  trapped in some abyss. Also the only widely known/used method for waking the Old Gods is through the taint.  That might be Dumat's or their ulterior motive in teaching the Magisters blood magic (so as to get their trust) then taught the Magisters how to travel to the Golden City with the promise of power, which was the taint all along.

If the Old Gods are as manipulative as I theorize them to be then i'd like to see one make an untainted appaerance in the future.

Modifié par The Hierophant, 26 novembre 2012 - 01:43 .

[ImperatorMortis]

[quote]The Hierophant wrote...

[/quote] There's a theory  that the Dread Wolf might be the Maker as he's the only god in the Chantry pantheon, in contrast to the Elven pantheon who like the Old Gods are stated to be  trapped in some abyss. Also the only widely known/used method for waking the Old Gods is through the taint.  That might be Dumat's or their ulterior motive in teaching the Magisters blood magic (so as to get their trust) then taught the Magisters how to travel to the Golden City with the promise of power, which was the taint all along.

If the Old Gods are as manipulative as I theorize them to be then i'd like to see one make an untainted appaerance in the future.[/quote]

And I don't think the Old Gods were sealed away before them. I think the "abyss" is just the place where the Tainted Gods are sleeping now. Waiting to be woken up till the next blight. 

But what would Dumat have to gain from this? The taint really messes him, and the other Gods up. Also why would he trade in legions of fans, who worship him, and the others faithfully for legions of grumbling tainted savages? 

I think the Old Gods taught the Tevinter's blood magic because well.. Blood Magic is awesome? Its like. Hey these guys who worship us are pretty cool, lets teach them something overpowered as a show of gratitude. 

Yeah I'm pretty much of the belief that Dumat was a pretty cool guy. Man.. I would love if DA3 gave us the option to be a Tevinter. 

Tevinter is so cool. 

[Auintus]

Dumat, or whatever, still gives Corypheus healthy doses of power throughout the battle. Even if he's dead, I want that on my side.
Be cool if there was a questline regarding the Old Gods. Just something to elaborate a bit more.

[ImperatorMortis]

Auintus wrote...

Dumat, or whatever, still gives Corypheus healthy doses of power throughout the battle. Even if he's dead, I want that on my side. 

This. Darkspawn aside, you can't go wrong when you worship The Old Gods. 

Auintus wrote...
Be cool if there was a questline regarding the Old Gods. Just something to elaborate a bit more.

Ditto. I think it would be so cool. If part of Dumat's or one of the other Old Gods conciousness was seperated from them somehow, and we could actually maybe speak with them, and get their perspective. 

And get awesome rewards, and trinkets from them of course. 

[The Hierophant]

ImperatorMortis wrote...

And I don't think the Old Gods were sealed away before then. I think the "abyss" is just the place where the Tainted Gods are sleeping now. Waiting to be woken up till the next blight. 

But what would Dumat have to gain from this? The taint really messes him, and the other Gods up. Also why would he trade in legions of fans, who worship him, and the others faithfully for legions of grumbling tainted savages? 

I think the Old Gods taught the Tevinter's blood magic because well.. Blood Magic is awesome? Its like. Hey these guys who worship us are pretty cool, lets teach them something overpowered as a show of gratitude. 

Yeah I'm pretty much of the belief that Dumat was a pretty cool guy. Man.. I would love if DA3 gave us the option to be a Tevinter. 

Tevinter is so cool. 

I don't know...? I feel that it's suspicious that the Ogs woould teach the Magisters blood magic out of goodwill.

Modifié par The Hierophant, 26 novembre 2012 - 02:24 .

[ImperatorMortis]

The Hierophant wrote...

ImperatorMortis wrote...

And I don't think the Old Gods were sealed away before then. I think the "abyss" is just the place where the Tainted Gods are sleeping now. Waiting to be woken up till the next blight. 

But what would Dumat have to gain from this? The taint really messes him, and the other Gods up. Also why would he trade in legions of fans, who worship him, and the others faithfully for legions of grumbling tainted savages? 

I think the Old Gods taught the Tevinter's blood magic because well.. Blood Magic is awesome? Its like. Hey these guys who worship us are pretty cool, lets teach them something overpowered as a show of gratitude. 

Yeah I'm pretty much of the belief that Dumat was a pretty cool guy. Man.. I would love if DA3 gave us the option to be a Tevinter. 

Tevinter is so cool. 

I don't know...? I feel that it's suspicious that the Ogs woould teach the Magisters blood magic out of goodwill.

Why is it suspicious? Blood Magic can be used for good ya know? For example in the Dragon Age comic there was a Blood Mage who used his powers to heal people. I think he used animal blood for the ritual. 

Blood Magic isn't evil. Its just very powerful. 

I think a lot of people only see Blood Magic as bad becaue "ooh its blood". Honestly if it was replaced with something different.  For example.. Water. There wouldn't be nearly as many complaints.

Ironically "water magic" would technically be able to do everyhing Blood Magic can do. Like controlling blood. 

Modifié par ImperatorMortis, 26 novembre 2012 - 02:48 .

[Auintus]

ImperatorMortis wrote...

Why is it suspicious? Blood Magic can be used for good ya know? For example in the Dragon Age comic there was a Blood Mage who used his powers to heal people. I think he used animal blood for the ritual. 

Blood Magic isn't evil. Its just very powerful. 

Someone...someone understands? No, no I must be hallucinating.

The Hierophant wrote...
I don't know...? I feel that it's suspicious that the Ogs woould teach the Magisters blood magic out of goodwill.

Gods do things like that. Dumat powered up Corypheus just 'cause he asked and he gave me four sovereigns and an amulet for a sacrifice.

Modifié par Auintus, 26 novembre 2012 - 02:49 .

[Josielyn]

So, why would anyone want to wake up an old God that was out to get them in the first place (unless of course they followed all the rules, and then they just hoped to go unnoticed at best). Unless there were some sort of boon that the sleeping gods would grant ("oh, thanks for the wakeup call, here have some gold and +1 speed, now RUN before I eat you") that would be worth the risk. It would be interesting, to say the least.

[Auintus]

Josielyn wrote...

So, why would anyone want to wake up an old God that was out to get them in the first place (unless of course they followed all the rules, and then they just hoped to go unnoticed at best). Unless there were some sort of boon that the sleeping gods would grant ("oh, thanks for the wakeup call, here have some gold and +1 speed, now RUN before I eat you") that would be worth the risk. It would be interesting, to say the least.

Power, naturally. 

Seriously though, nothing indicates that untainted Old Gods are evil. The archdemon gives that impression, but Morrigan implies that there in nothing inherently evil about the gods themselves.

[ImperatorMortis]

Josielyn wrote...

So, why would anyone want to wake up an old God that was out to get them in the first place (unless of course they followed all the rules, and then they just hoped to go unnoticed at best). Unless there were some sort of boon that the sleeping gods would grant ("oh, thanks for the wakeup call, here have some gold and +1 speed, now RUN before I eat you") that would be worth the risk. It would be interesting, to say the least.

I don't think the Old Gods treated their followers badly, or tried to eat them. OK maybe the really crappy followers, but not everyone. 

Modifié par ImperatorMortis, 26 novembre 2012 - 02:53 .

[BlueMagitek]

I think an Old God Worshiper would be a good fit for a Tevinter or a Dragon Cultist, I'm not sure if the Inquisitor is the right character for it.

[ImperatorMortis]

BlueMagitek wrote...

I think an Old God Worshiper would be a good fit for a Tevinter or a Dragon Cultist, I'm not sure if the Inquisitor is the right character for it.

Its never been stated that we're even playing an Inquisitor. Besides, who's to say an Inquisitor can't stray away from the Chantry, and their beliefs? 

[The Hierophant]

ImperatorMortis wrote...

Why is it suspicious? Blood Magic can be used for good ya know? For example in the Dragon Age comic there was a Blood Mage who used his powers to heal people. I think he used animal blood for the ritual. 

Blood Magic isn't evil. Its just very powerful. 

I think a lot of people only see Blood Magic as bad becaue "ooh its blood". Honestly if it was replaced with something different.  For example.. Water. There wouldn't be nearly as many complaints.

Ironically "water magic" would technically be able to do everyhing Blood Magic can do. Like controlling blood. 

I know blood magic is only a tool, but my problem is with Dumat teaching the Magisters the method to traveling to the Golden City with a promise of power. The Magisters ended up being infected with taint instead, which is used by the darkspawn to awaken the Og's from their slumber. Also the darkspawn hear singing from the Old Gods, and actually follow the orders of the Old Gods after they've become an Archdemon.

IIRC Alistair said that he could barely make out what the Archdemon is saying, but believed that the older Wardens could understand it better.


 

Modifié par The Hierophant, 26 novembre 2012 - 03:44 .

[ImperatorMortis]

The Hierophant wrote...

ImperatorMortis wrote...

Why is it suspicious? Blood Magic can be used for good ya know? For example in the Dragon Age comic there was a Blood Mage who used his powers to heal people. I think he used animal blood for the ritual. 

Blood Magic isn't evil. Its just very powerful. 

I think a lot of people only see Blood Magic as bad becaue "ooh its blood". Honestly if it was replaced with something different.  For example.. Water. There wouldn't be nearly as many complaints.

Ironically "water magic" would technically be able to do everyhing Blood Magic can do. Like controlling blood. 

I know blood magic is only a tool, but my problem is with Dumat teaching the Magisters the method to traveling to the Golden City with a promise of power. The Magisters ended up being infected with taint instead, which is used by the darkspawn to awaken the Og's from their slumber. Also the darkspawn hear singing from the Old Gods, and actually follow the orders of the Old Gods after they've become an Archdemon.

IIRC Alistair said that he could barely make out what the Archdemon is saying, but believed that the older Wardens could understand it better.


 

Well Blood Magic wasn't the only method to go into the Fade while in physical form. They did had to use Lyrium as well. Blood Magic just made the Lyrium price considerably smaller. 

They could have done the same thing even without Blood Magic. They just would have had a harder time of it. 

Are you talking about (maybe)Dumat telling the Magisters about the "Golden City", and how to get there? Or the Old Gods teaching them Blood Magic in the first place?

[The Hierophant]

ImperatorMortis wrote...

Are you talking about (maybe)Dumat telling the Magisters about the "Golden City", and how to get there? Or the Old Gods teaching them Blood Magic in the first place?

I mean Dumat, as Corypheus tried to speak with him not knowing he was killed 1000 years ago. Before the encounter with Corypheus i thought the Chant of Light was mostly innacurate historical/religious propoganda, but Corypheus's dialog suggests he's spoken with Dumat before and that his knowledge of entering the GC might of come from Dumat like the Chantry alludes to. I'm not saying the Chantry is 100% right(like the Maker punishing everybody) but that Corypheus's statements actually give some weight to their account of the event.

[Auintus]

The Hierophant wrote...

ImperatorMortis wrote...

Are you talking about (maybe)Dumat telling the Magisters about the "Golden City", and how to get there? Or the Old Gods teaching them Blood Magic in the first place?

I mean Dumat, as Corypheus tried to speak with him not knowing he was killed 1000 years ago. Before the encounter with Corypheus i thought the Chant of Light was mostly innacurate historical/religious propoganda, but Corypheus's dialog suggests he's spoken with Dumat before and that his knowledge of entering the GC might of come from Dumat like the Chantry alludes to. I'm not saying the Chantry is 100% right(like the Maker punishing everybody) but that Corypheus's statements actually give some weight to their account of the event.

Actually, Corypheus insists that the city was always black. Black when they arrived, and tainted. They were only told that it was golden. The only part of the Chantry's story that Corypheus supports is that Tevinter magisters brought the blight to the world from the Black City.

[Vitlen]

Shadow of Light Dragon wrote...

It doesn't matter if they are or aren't gods. You could still worship them.

Yes that`s right. One can worship something that even doesn't exist.....

[Vitlen]

ImperatorMortis wrote...

BlueMagitek wrote...

I think an Old God Worshiper would be a good fit for a Tevinter or a Dragon Cultist, I'm not sure if the Inquisitor is the right character for it.

Its never been stated that we're even playing an Inquisitor. Besides, who's to say an Inquisitor can't stray away from the Chantry, and their beliefs? 

Or he can support Tevinter and Black Chantry...

[ImperatorMortis]

Vitlen wrote...

ImperatorMortis wrote...

BlueMagitek wrote...

I think an Old God Worshiper would be a good fit for a Tevinter or a Dragon Cultist, I'm not sure if the Inquisitor is the right character for it.

Its never been stated that we're even playing an Inquisitor. Besides, who's to say an Inquisitor can't stray away from the Chantry, and their beliefs? 

Or he can support Tevinter and Black Chantry...

True. I forgot about the Black Divines. 

[The Hierophant]

Auintus wrote...

Actually, Corypheus insists that the city was always black. Black when they arrived, and tainted. They were only told that it was golden. The only part of the Chantry's story that Corypheus supports is that Tevinter magisters brought the blight to the world from the Black City.

Corypheus calls out for Dumat, and is shocked that it doesn't respond to him which probably hints that the Chantry's story of the Old Gods teaching the Magisters on how to travel to the GC is partly true. The only verifiable fallacious claim of the CoL is the Magisters tainting the GC, while the verdict is still out on the Maker's existence, and possible motives.