162 réponses à ce sujet

[SpunkyMonkey]

I'd like to see Bioware link the world's fate to the protagonist so that they have no choice but to save it. That way it all becomes about how they save it - good/evil/neutral/whatever - even an evil person who normally slaughters millions would save the world if it meant they had to in order to save their own life.

That way they can still save the world, but murder, kill, rape and pillage etc. as usual in the process.

Modifié par SpunkyMonkey, 26 novembre 2012 - 03:31 .

[Dave of Canada]

Evil doesn't exist.

Good doesn't exist.

Let us be none of these things.

Modifié par Dave of Canada, 26 novembre 2012 - 03:32 .

[Vitlen]

Ultimashade wrote...

Please, refrain from confusing evil with insanity.

How true..Being evil or being sick is not the same but some people don`t get it.........

[Vitlen]

Dave of Canada wrote...

Evil doesn't exist.

Good doesn't exist.

Let us be none of these things.

Yes right...
World doesn`t exist.
You do not exist.
It`s all just bad imagination...... How fun!

[Fredward]

Isn't it weird to have the word "please" in a thread title asking to be evil? There should be more threatening and fist shaking. xp

AND BLOOD SACRIFICE.

[Wulfram]

Foopydoopydoo wrote...

Isn't it weird to have the word "please" in a thread title asking to be evil? There should be more threatening and fist shaking. xp

AND BLOOD SACRIFICE.

Obviously they aren't yet evil, because then the thread would be superfluous.

Modifié par Wulfram, 26 novembre 2012 - 05:24 .

[CrystaJ]

[quote]Chaos Lord Malek wrote...

Why would you be pursued by authorities? That's a mistake right there. You don't have to be criminal to be evil. Almost all of the politicans are evil, mass murderers, and corrupt - and they aren't pursued by authorities.
[/quote][/quote]

Lawful evil =/= chaotic or neutral evil.

Though that's not even always true; if you are generally found to have been responsible for the deaths or death of someone in the eyes of the law, you ARE pursued. Whether or not you're actually charged and convicted is dependent on the government and several other factors.

But if you, say, kill the innkeeper for whatever reason and there's witnesses, I would expect some sort of retaliation. I'm not sure why the law should apply to other NPCs and not you just because you're the main protagonist.

Modifié par CrystaJ, 26 novembre 2012 - 05:40 .

[ObserverStatus]

Vitlen wrote...
How true..Being evil or being sick is not the same but some people don`t get it.........

In my experience, most of the people who think that being evil and being sick are the same thing also seem to think that having a personality and being sick are the same thing.

[SeismicGravy]

EXCELLENT.

[BubbleDncr]

I thought DA:O let me be evil enough - you could do something "evil" with pretty much every quest - the Mage Circle would possibly be the exception, since a truly "evil" thing would be to side with the blood mages, but I managed to feel evil enough when my blood mage used the Litany to save the mages but then told Gregoir that they were probably all blood mages.

DA2 however, did not let me be evil enough. It forced me to be sad when Bethany and Lenora died, even though my evil character was happy Bethany died and would have been indifferent about Lenora.

I think its easier to let the player be evil when they're fighting a force of nature, like the Blight - because even an evil person needs to stop it cos the Blight will kill them too.

[Vitlen]

EntropicAngel wrote...

Vitlen wrote...

Yes right...
World doesn`t exist.
You do not exist.
It`s all just bad imagination...... How fun!

What dave means is that good and bad are based on moral viewpoints, subjective moral viewpoints.

Thank you for kind explanations but all these things exist just in peoples minds. So you can say the same about justice, honor ,dignity etc.But it doesn't mean they do not exist because they are not material. And they still influence material world a lot.

[deuce985]

I'd much prefer moral ambiguity in almost every facet of the DA universe.

A world where you can't clearly define good or evil. Only grey.

[DarkKnightHolmes]

Being evil for the sake of evil makes you........... awesome in my book!

[Realmzmaster]

What makes someone or some action evil? The only way one can have evil is to define something else as good. For example slavery is viewed as evil, but in the Tevinter Imperium it would be considered normal. If the Tevinter society sees it as normal then to them it is not evil. In the Tevinter society would one be considered good or less evil if he/she only owns one slave instead of twenty? Is the person that owns twenty slaves more evil?

Society sets the norms so what is evil in one society may make you a hero or revered figure in another.

The warden can be evil through the whole game, but still ends up killing the ArchDemon thereby becoming a hero. The warden is still the same evil person, but by stopping the Blight the warden becomes a revered figure. Really evil would be that I sell out the Thedas by becoming the ArchDemons right hand man or woman. The warden could not trust the ArchDemon and the ArchDemon would certanly not trust someone with the power to kill it.

Evil only exists to us because we are contrasting it with good in our minds due to our own experiences or upbringing.

Society sets norms because it is essential to keep order otherwise chaos ensues.

Modifié par Realmzmaster, 26 novembre 2012 - 08:28 .

[Fredward]

Realmzmaster wrote...

What makes someone or some action evil? The only way one can have evil is to define something else as good. For example slavery is viewed as evil, but in the Tevinter Imperium it would be considered normal. If the Tevinter society sees it as normal then to them it is not evil. In the Tevinter society would one be considered good or less evil if he/she only owns one slave instead of twenty? Is the person that owns twenty slaves more evil?

Society sets the norms so what is evil in one society may make you a hero or revered figure in another.

The warden can be evil through the whole game, but still ends up killing the ArchDemon thereby becoming a hero. The warden is still the same evil person, but by stopping the Blight the warden becomes a revered figure. Really evil would be that I sell out the Thedas by becoming the ArchDemons right hand man or woman. The warden could not trust the ArchDemon and the ArchDemon would certanly not trust someone with the power to kill it.

Evil only exists to us because we are contrasting it with good in our minds due to our own experiences or upbringing.

Society sets norms because it is essential to keep order otherwise chaos ensues.

And so we have succesfully sequed from gaming to philosophy. Inevitable really. XD

[Fast Jimmy]

Realmzmaster wrote...

What makes someone or some action evil? The only way one can have evil is to define something else as good. For example slavery is viewed as evil, but in the Tevinter Imperium it would be considered normal. If the Tevinter society sees it as normal then to them it is not evil. In the Tevinter society would one be considered good or less evil if he/she only owns one slave instead of twenty? Is the person that owns twenty slaves more evil?

Society sets the norms so what is evil in one society may make you a hero or revered figure in another.

The warden can be evil through the whole game, but still ends up killing the ArchDemon thereby becoming a hero. The warden is still the same evil person, but by stopping the Blight the warden becomes a revered figure. Really evil would be that I sell out the Thedas by becoming the ArchDemons right hand man or woman. The warden could not trust the ArchDemon and the ArchDemon would certanly not trust someone with the power to kill it.

Evil only exists to us because we are contrasting it with good in our minds due to our own experiences or upbringing.

Society sets norms because it is essential to keep order otherwise chaos ensues.

True... a farmer buys a cat to kill rats in his barn so his grain isn't eaten and he can feed his family. This good for the farmer, as he's protecting his family. Its terrible for the rats, who are being slaughtered mercilessly just for trying to survive. The cat is either a good pet, or a ferocious, heartless evil.

So... instead of saying "let my character be evil" you could say "let my character have no social qualms" which is, really, impossible to do. Unless the writers just want to rack their brain for disturbing, bizarre, psychotic things to do that will be hard-pressed to add any value to the story, this may seem a little ridiculous.

That being said, even if they wanted to do this, they couldn't. You couldn't have the option of throwing Allistair off a cliff after the battle with the Archdemon in hopes of taking the crown anymore than you would have the option of declaring yourself Viscount of Kirkwall after you toss out the Arishok. Not only would it be nearly impossible to have the game make sense, but the Save Import puts the nail in the coffin of any "Dark Ending" like what we saw in Arcanum, just because it cripples the future.

[LinksOcarina]

Vitlen wrote...

LinksOcarina wrote...

Evil for Evil's sake just makes you a terrible role-player.

Yes you`re right but I didn't ask for that.
I just wanted to be able to play with hungry for power PC who thinks that his/her goal justifies any means
He/she doesn't give a **** about being evil or kind just want whole world to bend to his/her will.
But everybody will say that he/she is evil.

So what is motivating you then? Just power and control?  And how does this make you no more selfish than a hero who wants power to protect someone? 

[Todd23]

*starts chanting

Murder. Murder. Murder. Murder! Murder!

[Bayonet Hipshot]

I think we should have the option of being evil...Or at least have some quests which you could not complete without being a jerk / evil

Like in Skyrim, to complete most of the Daedric quest you have to sacrifice someone who trusts you, kill & eat someone up, get really drunk in a temple and lay it to waste, delve into the mind of a long dead ruler and mess it up, etc.....you get my idea...& Thieves' Guild involve stealing, forging

We should have quests that rewards people for doing actions against the law ...

[Fredward]

Todd23 wrote...

*starts chanting

Murder. Murder. Murder. Murder! Murder!

“Kill the pig! Cut his throat! Kill the pig! Bash him in!” XD

I'm sorry but that was the first thing that came to mind when murderous chanting was mentioned. xp

Modifié par Foopydoopydoo, 26 novembre 2012 - 09:03 .

[Fredward]

EntropicAngel wrote...

Fast Jimmy wrote...

That being said, even if they wanted to do this, they couldn't. You couldn't have the option of throwing Allistair off a cliff after the battle with the Archdemon in hopes of taking the crown anymore than you would have the option of declaring yourself Viscount of Kirkwall after you toss out the Arishok. Not only would it be nearly impossible to have the game make sense, but the Save Import puts the nail in the coffin of any "Dark Ending" like what we saw in Arcanum, just because it cripples the future.

I'm getting this odd sense that you don't like the Save Import.

Perhaps it's just me.

I think he's just pointing out that it's unsustainable. Which it is. If meaningful world changing decisions remain anyway.

[Fast Jimmy]

Foopydoopydoo wrote...

EntropicAngel wrote...

Fast Jimmy wrote...

That being said, even if they wanted to do this, they couldn't. You couldn't have the option of throwing Allistair off a cliff after the battle with the Archdemon in hopes of taking the crown anymore than you would have the option of declaring yourself Viscount of Kirkwall after you toss out the Arishok. Not only would it be nearly impossible to have the game make sense, but the Save Import puts the nail in the coffin of any "Dark Ending" like what we saw in Arcanum, just because it cripples the future.

I'm getting this odd sense that you don't like the Save Import.

Perhaps it's just me.

I think he's just pointing out that it's unsustainable. Which it is. If meaningful world changing decisions remain anyway.

This. I don't hate the idea of the Save Import, but the reality of it is too mammothly dibilitating for the long term. So anything I can (legitimately) lay at its feet, I will.