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[The Hierophant]

Nizaris1 wrote...

Abandoned what?

Grey Warden, Darkspawn, Archdemon and The Blight

I doubt Darkspawn are the main premise of the series as it's titled after the Dragon Age, an era in Thedas's history.
You'd figure that if Darkspawn were the main theme of the series that it'll be set when the Magisters contracted the taint in the fade.

Modifié par The Hierophant, 05 décembre 2012 - 04:20 .

[upsettingshorts]

Nizaris1 wrote...

Hold on. Nizaris1 isn't an inquisitor sent to discover what happened to The Warden?

A rumble of skeleton in which having Warden Commander helmet as a loot...and codex entry....

He/she will be found next to another skeleton clutching the Howe bow and a note from father.

[upsettingshorts]

Nizaris1 wrote...

He/she will be found next to another skeleton clutching the Howe bow and a note from father.

Sad isn't it?

Bittersweet.  Nate was cool but at least I don't have to be kidnapped into the Grey Wardens anymore.

[NasreddinHodja]

I think to answer the original question: Yes, the Darkspawn is probably still relevant. No, its relevance in the third game will not be as great as in the first game. And no, not everyone will be happy about it, but since the franchise is never strictly about the Taint, it is perfectly rational and consistent for the developers to do that.

[Rpgfantasyplayer]

Nizaris1 I think you are forgetting that the only reason it is called Dragon Age is because the chantry in Orlais saw a dragon and declared it the Dragon Age. An Age can be a really long time covering many different and significant things. So there are other things can happen during the Dragon Age other than the blight, archdemon, grey wardens and darkspawn.

Modifié par Rpgfantasyplayer, 05 décembre 2012 - 04:45 .

[esper]

Rpgfantasyplayer wrote...

Nizaris1 I think you are forgetting that the only reason it is called Dragon Age is because the chantry in Orlais saw a dragon and declared it the Dragon Age. An Age can be a really long time covering many different and significant things. So there other things can happen during the Dragon Age other than the blight, archdemon, grey wardens and darkspawn.

An age is 100 years. I think the Divine had another name ready untill the Dragon (Dragon not archdemom) arrived. I think it was Sun Age or something.

[AlexanderCousland]

It should be noted that the cannon king of fereldan (it pains me to say this) Alistair is a Grey Warden, and the Warden's now hold an Arling and substantial political presence inside of a major nation. Grey Warden's and their mission/plight are still relevant in Thedas, and ANYONE who fails to recognize that the Warden's are essential to preserving Thedas' safety as a whole, is simply ignorant. This is the Legacy the Hero preserved, and established political influence oustside of the Anderfels.



That said, should they be the focus of each and every game? Absolutely not.

Id like to learn about other parts and stories of thedas.

[CarlSpackler]

I'm way late to this discussion and haven't read the entire thread so forgive me if I'm restating something. 
One of the problems I think some folks have is going from the greater to the lesser.  The blight and all of its lore is woven so tightly into the fabric of the DA universe that it is the most mysterious and serious threat to the people of Thedas.  The mage templar war is in and of itself facinating , and I'm greatful that Bioware is not repeating the blight storyline (at least for now.)  The problem is regardless of how the mage / templar storyling plays out, history will continue.  Sure many lives will be ruined in the process and the history of Thedas will unfold differently depending on the outcome, but ultimately life, culture, politics, will continure.  With the blight however, there is a very real threat of total extinction.  Not to mention the grand ideas of the dark city, the fade, all of these great mysteries that are for the moment pushed into the background.  I think it is here that many are getting stuck, they feel like there's this really awesome mysterious "thing" going on in the DA universe and we have to deal with other "stuff" at the moment.  Now this is obviously all perception, and I love the idea of creating a universe and navigating through the (relatively speaking) mundane as well as the fantastic.  I'm hopeful DA3 is going to be an amazing game, that the franchise continues, and that in later games we might get a chance to explore the grander themes that were really only hinted at in DAO anyways.

[ScotGaymer]

No one ever said they wont eventually have the DarkSpawn make a return as the big bad of a game. They aren't gone after all.

But the game is called Dragon Age because it is set during the Dragon Age of Thedas (like our Dark Age, or Middle Age, and so on) and thats it.

So the games can and should explore everything and everywhere related to Thedas.

And Word of GOaiDer says that that is what they are going to do.

Nothing left to really discuss.

[NasreddinHodja]

Nizaris1 wrote...

The world change after a Grey Warden becomes a King (and Queen), the order changed after the 5th Blight, if it is about the world, surely everything changed and grey Warden have more roles outside the Blight.

Similar with urn of Sacred Ashes, before it is revealed, everybody just believe in Andraste blindly, the Chantry have no proof of her existence, everything is just idealism. So when the Urn is located, found, exposed surely it change the world.

but i don't see the changes in DA2...so how far DA is about the world? It is a flase claim, cover up, conspiracy. Like i mentioned before DA is about an epic, heavily depended on story/narative and the story is depended on player choice. DA2 prove that Bioware have toss away this and continue it on DA3.

Why should jump to Kirkwal then Orlais? Why should change places on each games? Want to imitate TES? Ferelden is big, have many settlements, ruins, why not focus on Ferelden and give conclusions....then in the future make about other places.

...or the Warden can be a jackass and keep the location of the Urn a secret.  And then nothing changed.

DA2 changed the world in a major way.  For most of Thedas, mages used to be locked up in Circles, and now the Circle system is falling apart.  I'd consider that a major change.

It's true that DAO is more "epic" (in the sense of grander in scale) and DA2 is more "personal," but to say that one is better than the other because of it is silly because it's a matter of taste.  And to say DA3 will throw away the sense of grandeur we got from DAO is hasty because, well, the game hasn't come out yet.

[Aolbain]

Nizaris1 wrote...

The world change after a Grey Warden becomes a King (and Queen), the order changed after the 5th Blight, if it is about the world, surely everything changed and grey Warden have more roles outside the Blight.

Similar with urn of Sacred Ashes, before it is revealed, everybody just believe in Andraste blindly, the Chantry have no proof of her existence, everything is just idealism. So when the Urn is located, found, exposed surely it change the world.

but i don't see the changes in DA2...so how far DA is about the world? It is a flase claim, cover up, conspiracy. Like i mentioned before DA is about an epic, heavily depended on story/narative and the story is depended on player choice. DA2 prove that Bioware have toss away this and continue it on DA3.

Why should jump to Kirkwal then Orlais? Why should change places on each games? Want to imitate TES? Ferelden is big, have many settlements, ruins, why not focus on Ferelden and give conclusions....then in the future make about other places.

1. The new head of state of Ferelden does not HAVE to be a Grey Warden. Something that have happend in your playthrough (and most of mine) does not equal canon.

2. Why should this change the world? The order already held power in the anderfelts and no-one seemed to be suprised when a ex-warden took over the Collage of Magi. And as for the Ashes: That only proved that everyone but Rivain and the Qunari, the first whom are to small to matter and the second that would just not care, was right. Why would that change "everything"? The only choises we make in DA:O that have the possibilty to be global gamechangers is who get to be king in Orzammar and if The Circle of Kinoch Hold gets royal protection and freedom. The first should take years, maybe decades, to play out and the second gets discussed by Alistair in act 3.

[ScotGaymer]

Yeh @Aolbain logic wont work with this one. He/She will simply insist you are wrong, and DA is ruined forever more!

Because you know... Star Wars. Apparently.

EDIT:
See!

Told you. Logic wont work.

Modifié par FitScotGaymer, 05 décembre 2012 - 07:22 .

[Heimdall]

Nizaris1 wrote...

Mage-Templar conflict in Kirkwall, a town, change the world...but Andraste remain, the very prophet Andrastians worhiping, the most important relic in the world, have "miracle, found don't change a thing? Grey warden become a King and Queen don't change a thing?

I fail to see the logic...

We know you do.

1)Why should the fact that they're Wardens change anything?  So a Warden or two may have taken charge of a backwater like Ferelden, why should that reshape the political landscape for all of Thedas?  All aside that it may not happen at all.  There is no logic that this should change anything substantial for a Free Marcher.

2)Andraste is historical fact in Thedas, her Ashes don't prove anything most people didn't believe already.  What could this have changed.

Modifié par Lord Aesir, 05 décembre 2012 - 07:34 .

[Heimdall]

Nizaris1 wrote...

When my Warden become a Queen and, Alistair the King, i want to see the changes.When i save the Urn of Sacred Ashes, i want to see the changes.I also want to see the changes when the Urn is not saved, and my Warden not a Queen, Alistair not a King.

Nothing change in DA2, DA2 is total different story and different world

you see there what is the problem? You guys claim the game is about the world, but it isn't, the world is stagnant, no matter what you do don't change a thing....about the world eh?

The problem is that you don't understand just how little impact these things have on day to day life in Thedas,especially in another country.

[Heimdall]

FreshIstay wrote...

It should be noted that the cannon king of fereldan (it pains me to say this) Alistair is a Grey Warden, and the Warden's now hold an Arling and substantial political presence inside of a major nation. Grey Warden's and their mission/plight are still relevant in Thedas, and ANYONE who fails to recognize that the Warden's are essential to preserving Thedas' safety as a whole, is simply ignorant. This is the Legacy the Hero preserved, and established political influence oustside of the Anderfels.

That said, should they be the focus of each and every game? Absolutely not.

Id like to learn about other parts and stories of thedas.

Not canon, David Gaider has said as much.  Gaider uses a version of events for other media but they are not canon with respect to our games if they contradict our choices, in which case said events played out differently.

[NasreddinHodja]

Nizaris1 wrote...

When my Warden become a Queen and, Alistair the King, i want to see the changes.When i save the Urn of Sacred Ashes, i want to see the changes.I also want to see the changes when the Urn is not saved, and my Warden not a Queen, Alistair not a King.

Nothing change in DA2, DA2 is total different story and different world

you see there what is the problem? You guys claim the game is about the world, but it isn't, the world is stagnant, no matter what you do don't change a thing....about the world eh?

As someone has said before, what happened in your playthrough is not necessarily canon.  To borrow some Mass Effect examples, by Mass Effect 3, Shepard is still alive (so the ending in 2 where he dies isn't canon) and Udina is still a council member, despite you possibly putting Anderson in power (this one is fixed with a clean-the-slate plot point but still means your particular choice here doesn't matter too).  Now bringing this to the Dragon Age world:  I believe that the setting for 2 is in Kirkwall because there are so many possible different variations from imported save games for the developers to handle gracefully.  It's a limitation of trying to incorporate all the players' experience into a video game; it's just not feasible logistically.

Remember, though, that you CAN still see some of the changes you made in DAO.  For example, if Alistair is king and the Warden is queen, you'll encounter Alistair in Kirkwall talking to Meredith, and a reference is even made about the old "ball-and-chain" the queen, who is implied to be the Warden.

Also, the events in DA2 definitely changed the world (see my last post for details), so your assertion of a stagnant world is false.

[Aolbain]

Nizaris1 wrote...

Mage-Templar conflict in Kirkwall, a town, change the world...but Andraste remain, the very prophet Andrastians worhiping, the most important relic in the world, have "miracle, found don't change a thing? Grey warden become a King and Queen don't change a thing?

I fail to see the logic...

Oh, sure it changes things, but not on a global scale. Ferelden will have diffrent rulers, grey warden influens in Ferelden will grow and that will posibly be a plotthread in future games.
Physical proof of Andrastas existance will only matter to those who already worship her, those who dont are either too stuborn (can you see the qunari abonding the Qun over the Ashes?), too small (the only human nation that is not andrastian is Rivain, a county weaker than even Antivia and if I have understanded corectly, a Qunari puppet to boot) or just to isolated/embittered to really care ("Oh, sure. We could convert to the religion of those that oppress and betrayed our people, defiled our culture and burned our second homeland. Stupid shem.").

@FitScotGaymer : ...are you inplying that starwars is not the answer to all lifes problems? Also, I see you point.

Modifié par Aolbain, 05 décembre 2012 - 07:42 .

[Aolbain]

Nizaris1 wrote...

Remember, though, that you CAN still see some of the changes you made in DAO. For example, if Alistair is king and the Warden is queen, you'll encounter Alistair in Kirkwall talking to Meredith, and a reference is even made about the old "ball-and-chain" the queen, who is implied to be the Warden.

is that the "change"? Just meeting him talking rubbish? the whole part is insignificant. A waste of time and effort.

Alistair got drunk at the Hang Man, why and how the hell he go to Kirkwal to get drunk?

Meet Alistair on the road and he is on a so called Grey Warden mission....

It is all nothing...not worth a thing.

Why wouldnt he go to Kirkwall? He is not longer welcome in Ferelden, left the wardens and I dont think Orlais would hesitate a minute to us an exiled claimat to a smaller, rival, kingdom, no mather how unwiling he is. 
And about the grey warden misson, you dont think this is a sort of build-up for a bigger warden-involved plot? Some of the epiouloges for Awakening seemded to imply that.

[NasreddinHodja]

Nizaris1 wrote...

Remember, though, that you CAN still see some of the changes you made in DAO. For example, if Alistair is king and the Warden is queen, you'll encounter Alistair in Kirkwall talking to Meredith, and a reference is even made about the old "ball-and-chain" the queen, who is implied to be the Warden.

is that the "change"? Just meeting him talking rubbish? the whole part is insignificant. A waste of time and effort.

Alistair got drunk at the Hang Man, why and how the hell he go to Kirkwal to get drunk?

Meet Alistair on the road and he is on a so called Grey Warden mission....

It is all nothing...not worth a thing.

Right.  Who's king of a whole country doesn't matter.  It's relevant to the setting, but you also have to remember that Ferelden is not the only country out there.  Just because Obama is president and not McCain doesn't mean the Soviet Union will experience a revival in eastern Europe.  As I've said before, this is part of the game design:  to set the second game in Ferelden means to acknowledge all of these possibly major (or not, depending on your playthrough) changes and put them into the game, which will bloat the scope beyond what can be handled realisticaly by the medium.  

Also, I'm still waiting on your response whether the Mage-Templar war sparked in the second game is a world-changing event or not.