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[The Elder King]

FreshIstay wrote...

Uh. The Chantry blew up, Anders blew it up.
As Far as Im concerned they could have made DA2 into a movie rather then a game.
As i have said before, Mages or Templars, Templars still win the city. A few mages still escape.
Sure, Kirkwall influences Asunder, however Kirkwall isnt THEE event that made Asunder happen, If anything that had more to do with Cumberland, Wynne, Cole, and Rhys. My point is, the Llomeryn Accords were not broken solely because of Kirkwall.

Fereldan and the Blight has an effect on Orlais politically. It has an effect on Kirkwall and the Free Marches because of the Refugee's.

I agree that without the events of Asunder the war wouldn't have continued/started, but without Kirkwall there wouldn't be any war. Both are crucial events for the war.
About the effect of Ferelden and the blight on the Free Marched, I agree, and DA2 shown that influence. About the influence on Orlais, I don't agree. The only effect on Orlais is that they wouldn't have Ferelden under than domain as Celene planned, and it's not that big effect (other than the fact that there was no way to shown it considering that we were in Kirkwall). Orlais remains in the same situation they were before the Blight, with the only difference that its neighbour is heavily damaged.

[AlexanderCousland]

Considering Fereldan's " weakend state" as result of the Blight. Some Orlesians want to take Fereldan, Alistair mention's that in DA2. In Asunder, it's hinted that the Empress Celene is in danger of usurpation or may be dead already. I think Orlais MIGHT be in political unrest over the descision to take Fereldan, it is a big descision. Arls, Banns, Teryn's, Kings need to be replaced. and what might Orlais lose to Nevarra if they do committ forces to Fereldan. ?

These are questions that can be raised as a direct result of the blight.

[The Elder King]

FreshIstay wrote...

Considering Fereldan's " weakend state" as result of the Blight. Some Orlesians want to take Fereldan, Alistair mention's that in DA2. In Asunder, it's hinted that the Empress Celene is in danger of usurpation or may be dead already. I think Orlais MIGHT be in political unrest over the descision to take Fereldan, it is a big descision. Arls, Banns, Teryn's, Kings need to be replaced. and what might Orlais lose to Nevarra if they do committ forces to Fereldan. ?

These are questions that can be raised as a direct result of the blight.

I doubt that the decision of conquering Ferelden, alone, it's enough to trigger a civil war, with one side that wants to overthrow the other. Plus, there's no reason to think that Nevarra would attack Orlais if Orlais would attack Ferelden. So far, Nevarra and Orlais fought once only because they were contending a territory.
Seven/eight year passed from the Blight to the start of the civil war in Orlais. If the reason would be (alone) about conquering Ferelden or not, the war would've started sooner.
Though even in the case you're right (we're probably going to know the reason during DAI) there were no reason to show this in DA2. It's an influence that would work in a game set in either a part of Orlais or Ferelden, which DA2 didn't show  (with the exception of Lothering and an Orlesian town in MotA).

[AlexanderCousland]

Im not saying the Blight is the sole reason, but it is a reason.
Polticians, King's, Queens, can be thrown into political unrest over a descision to start a war/takeover another nation. When a war should/would have started isnt really debateable, Thats like saying The Lyomeryn Accord should have been broken immediately after Kirkwall.

As for Nevarra, that was just an assumption on my behalf, my thinking was that Nevarra had advanced themselves from a free marches city into a whole nation and won its war with Orlais, maybe if Orlais advanced on Fereldan, then Nevarra might take the opprtunity to claim more Orlesian territory for themselves. Just an assumption/opinion...thought by me.

In any case, We are aware that some Orlesians want to take Fereldan as a result of the blight. And alot of Fereldan refugee's, namely Hawke, fled to the Free Marches. Which proves the point, The events of Origins had an effect on Thedas.

[esper]

hhh89 wrote...

FreshIstay wrote...

Considering Fereldan's " weakend state" as result of the Blight. Some Orlesians want to take Fereldan, Alistair mention's that in DA2. In Asunder, it's hinted that the Empress Celene is in danger of usurpation or may be dead already. I think Orlais MIGHT be in political unrest over the descision to take Fereldan, it is a big descision. Arls, Banns, Teryn's, Kings need to be replaced. and what might Orlais lose to Nevarra if they do committ forces to Fereldan. ?

These are questions that can be raised as a direct result of the blight.

I doubt that the decision of conquering Ferelden, alone, it's enough to trigger a civil war, with one side that wants to overthrow the other. Plus, there's no reason to think that Nevarra would attack Orlais if Orlais would attack Ferelden. So far, Nevarra and Orlais fought once only because they were contending a territory.
Seven/eight year passed from the Blight to the start of the civil war in Orlais. If the reason would be (alone) about conquering Ferelden or not, the war would've started sooner.
Though even in the case you're right (we're probably going to know the reason during DAI) there were no reason to show this in DA2. It's an influence that would work in a game set in either a part of Orlais or Ferelden, which DA2 didn't show  (with the exception of Lothering and an Orlesian town in MotA).

You didn't even see an Orleasian town in MoTA, you saw an Orleasian mansion.

[esper]

Nizaris1 wrote...

Okay...there is too many quotes if i want to quote...

What if Gorge W Bush didn't become president of USA, isn't that change the world today?
- there is no War on Terror
- no invasion of Iraq and Afghanistan
- there is no WMD bull****

What if Obama didn't become the president of USA, isn't that change the world?
- foreign relation changed
- whatever thing i cannot think of right now

What if Saddam still rule Iraq?
- it change the landscape of Middle east right now
- whatever thing i cannot think of right now

The very same thing with Ferelden, what ever changes in Ferelden change the world of Thedas

I don't want to repeat my arguments, i already stated it all in past arguments

Even who become PM of Malaysia change the world....what if Tun Mahathir didn't become PM of Malaysia in past 20 years?
- Bosnia changed, Tun M who greatly involve in helping Bosnian
- many things more about foreign relation things

None of these person acted in a vacuum or made the decision alone, not even Saddam.

[esper]

FreshIstay wrote...

Im not saying the Blight is the sole reason, but it is a reason.
Polticians, King's, Queens, can be thrown into political unrest over a descision to start a war/takeover another nation. When a war should/would have started isnt really debateable, Thats like saying The Lyomeryn Accord should have been broken immediately after Kirkwall.

As for Nevarra, that was just an assumption on my behalf, my thinking was that Nevarra had advanced themselves from a free marches city into a whole nation and won its war with Orlais, maybe if Orlais advanced on Fereldan, then Nevarra might take the opprtunity to claim more Orlesian territory for themselves. Just an assumption/opinion...thought by me.

In any case, We are aware that some Orlesians want to take Fereldan as a result of the blight. And alot of Fereldan refugee's, namely Hawke, fled to the Free Marches. Which proves the point, The events of Origins had an effect on Thedas.

They fled during the blight and just never returned home as it happens to many people who flees. The blight is likely the reason some nobles in Orlais think it would be easily feasiable to conquor Fereldan, but having it as a reason for the civil war alone is just plain stupid, because by da:I and Asunder it is, what... 8, 9... 10? years past the blight.

But what does all this have to do with darkspawn?

[esper]

Nizaris1 wrote...

If British never occupy Malaya, maybe my ancestors never meet

if Japan never attack Malaya in 1941, maybe i will never born

If Malaya today still under British rule, because Malay leaders never act, or some person are not there in the past doing the thing, my country today don't exist, and when my country don't exist, it change everything today...

You see, my country is small, in SEA, but what happen in my country change the world, either you realize it or not

Because everything are related, it is Butterfly Effect

Yes, everything are related, but the effect off some decision are not instantly visable or even noticeable. What you want is dragon age to go the way you want the consequences to go and you flat out ignore when we point out that Fereldan is not the center of Thedas. Not the economic, the cultural, the political or even the religious center-
thus a lot of the choices you make only ressonnate in Fereldan.

[esper]

Nizaris1 wrote...

If Alistair become the King of Ferelden, who is the puppet of Arl Eamon who have Orlesian wife, maybe his decision regarding Orlesian will not the same with Anora who is Loghain daughter, and if Loghain still live...

If they all are in power, Alistair and Anora, and Loghain still live...you see...it change everything

No, I frankly don't see. Because when all come down to it Alistair or Anora both have to proctect their country's sovereignity and after the blight they don't have the luxurary of being the aggressor towards Orlais.

There may be a small change, but there is not so many different ways open for them to act.

[The Elder King]

Nizaris1 wrote...

ah...you guys just want to deny everything i say...alright then...

no use saying anything anymore...

keep you guys denial syndrome...for me DA is dead already...

I don't care about deny everything you say (I'd have quoted a lot more of your posts if that's what I want to do), it's just that I disagree about the events of DAO influencing all Thedas, or that Ferelden is going to be the next superpower (which is objectively impossible in the 10 years from DAO to DAI, considering that it tooks time to recover from a Blight).
About DA, I always though that the Blight and the darkspwan is only one of the various, interesting topic in the DA world, so I don't think that DA is dead because the plot isn't around the Wardens and the darkspwan.

[AlexanderCousland]

I certainly havent said Origins influences ALL of Thedas. It doesnt, but Origins does have influence on Thedas. Kirkwall certainly doesnt Influence ALL of Thedas either. I will say Fereldan will be the next superpower, and only because The Dev's have published material that says that. I dont think the Plot should revolve around solely Wardens or Darkspawn, but I would like them in my game (maybe as a joinable faction). I would like a game centered around Monarchy's and Civil War and an ability to influence Foreign Relation's and or become King/Queen.

[Pzykozis]

FreshIstay wrote...

I certainly havent said Origins influences ALL of Thedas. It doesnt, but Origins does have influence on Thedas. Kirkwall certainly doesnt Influence ALL of Thedas either. I will say Fereldan will be the next superpower, 

That'd quite literally break all logic. Ferelden is in no position to become the superpower in Thedas. It has no real Economic, Trade, or Cultural value, it doesn't boast any particularly unique traits apart from it's political system which is both a hinderance and a benefit, it isn't technologically advanced, isn't renowned for anything other than mud and dogs, and isn't exactly a military powerhouse either, especially so after the whole southern part of the country being decimated and having bits uninhabitable, the blight killing off tons of its population and the decimation of two large forces of its soldiers.

I'd be baffled if Ferelden really moved up in the world and if it did the only way it'd make sense would be if all the other countries randomly imploded at the same time, and even then it'd probably be hard pushed.

[AlexanderCousland]

Pzykozis wrote...

FreshIstay wrote...

I certainly havent said Origins influences ALL of Thedas. It doesnt, but Origins does have influence on Thedas. Kirkwall certainly doesnt Influence ALL of Thedas either. I will say Fereldan will be the next superpower, 

That'd quite literally break all logic. Ferelden is in no position to become the superpower in Thedas. It has no real Economic, Trade, or Cultural value, it doesn't boast any particularly unique traits apart from it's political system which is both a hinderance and a benefit, it isn't technologically advanced, isn't renowned for anything other than mud and dogs, and isn't exactly a military powerhouse either, especially so after the whole southern part of the country being decimated and having bits uninhabitable, the blight killing off tons of its population and the decimation of two large forces of its soldiers.

I'd be baffled if Ferelden really moved up in the world and if it did the only way it'd make sense would be if all the other countries randomly imploded at the same time, and even then it'd probably be hard pushed.

How about  quote my post fully.

It's funny you left out this part:

The Dev's publishing material that says Fereldan is on its way to becoming a power on the continent.  The complete official Dragon Age 2 guide collector's edition in the Encyclopedia section with a detailed description on each nation say's Fereldan "is WELL on it's way to becoming a power on the continent".   If anyone's logic is going to be broken it's your's.

It's quite amusing that you'd question Ferelden's military prowess, considering they stopped a Blight before it could spread itself across the lands. Fereldan is the birthplace of Andraste, and the barbarian tribe's who marched on the Imperium. Is that renowned enough, or should I go further?  Economic's and Trade, How would YOU know?  Are you a Thedasian Economist? .

 You are probably just another one of those people who has been listening to Orlesian npc's and reading how other nation's view Fereldan therefore you have decided what foreigner's say must be true.  

 

 
 

[DarkSpiral]

FreshIstay wrote...

How about  quote my post fully.

It's funny you left out this part:

The Dev's publishing material that says Fereldan is on its way to becoming a power on the continent.  The complete official Dragon Age 2 guide collector's edition in the Encyclopedia section with a detailed description on each nation say's Fereldan "is WELL on it's way to becoming a power on the continent".   If anyone's logic is going to be broken it's your's.

It's quite amusing that you'd question Ferelden's military prowess, considering they stopped a Blight before it could spread itself across the lands. Fereldan is the birthplace of Andraste, and the barbarian tribe's who marched on the Imperium. Is that renowned enough, or should I go further?  Economic's and Trade, How would YOU know?  Are you a Thedasian Economist?

Amusing?  They lost an entire army at Ostagar.  The human forces were one thrid of what hit the darkspawn at Denerim, not the whole army.  The Dalsih and Orzammar forces almost certainly didn't stick around.  Its hardly funny to consider the country is in bad shape, militarily.

And I'm actually taking the word of the (possible) king of the country as being worthwhile.  Alistair tells Hawke that the country isn't in great shape.  A quote from the collector's editon (which was put out by a thrid party) is not word of god.

And waht does the fact that Andraste was born in Denerim have to do with whether the Ferelden is likely to become a great power in Thedas in the near future?  That was a long time ago.

Modifié par DarkSpiral, 09 décembre 2012 - 04:08 .

[AlexanderCousland]

WoW.

It was published (that means printed and distributed) by a third party.
Make no mistake, all of the content in the book was written by the Dev's, It is common for books to be sent to a publisher. So yes, in this case, it is the word of god.

Yes, It is amusing that Fereldan military strength is questioned considering their accomplishments at war. It's also funny that you pretend to know exactly how many troops are lost. We agree that Fereldan is not in it's best condition after the blight, however I still think Fereldan is capable after putting up a fight.

I'd appreciate if you dont double talk me, and mis-construe my statements. My reference to Andraste was in response to another poster questioning Fereldan's renown. I'll stick with the Dev's material in regards to wether or not Fereldan will become a power.

[DarkSpiral]

[quote]FreshIstay wrote...

WoW.

It was published (that means printed and distributed) by a third party.
Make no mistake, all of the content in the book was written by the Dev's, It is common for books to be sent to a publisher. So yes, in this case, it is the word of god.[/quote]

As the official descriptions of the guide say it was authored (that means the person that wrote the material you're reading was not a Bioware employee, even though the information they're referencing was provided to them by Bioware) by by Piggyback, and published by Prima, I find your beliefs hard to credit.  If you could perhaps check the books credits and find Gaider's name in it?  Or Laidlaw's?  They have to be there, legally, if they wrote the material you're reading, rather than provided the raw data.

[/quote]Yes, It is amusing that Fereldan military strength is questioned considering their accomplishments at war.[/quote]

What accomplishments?  The Blight?  They had help.  A lot of it.  Reclaiming there country from Orlais?  I'd give you that one, but ti was something like 20 years before the start of DA:O and has little bearing on their military strength after the Blight. 

[quote]It's also funny that you pretend to know exactly how many troops are lost.[/quote]

Find me the part where I said anything about knowing exactly how many troops were lost.  Other than Ostagar, of course.  That army was routed.  Almost everyone was dead.

[quote]I'd appreciate if you dont double talk me, and mis-construe my statements. My reference to Andraste was in response to another poster questioning Fereldan's renown.[/quote]

Ah, well that's fine.  You could have quotef it properly, then.  Or don't blame others when they take what they see at face value. 
 
[quote]I'll stick with the Dev's material in regards to wether or not Fereldan will become a power.[/quote]

I assume you still mean the game guide, which I stil doubt very much is relaible as you claim.  If you can actualy prove that you're correct, why then I'll be happy to change my stance.  But, in the past quoting a game guide for information relevant to the lore of the game usually created confusion, as it was often incorrect.  Perhaps this one is an exception.

Modifié par DarkSpiral, 09 décembre 2012 - 05:25 .

[DarkSpiral]

Hm.  Double post.  My bad.

Modifié par DarkSpiral, 09 décembre 2012 - 05:23 .

[Heimdall]

Nizaris1 wrote...
Ferelden have
i- Human army
- Redclif army
- Loghain army
- Teyrn and Bann army
- Blackstone Irregular

Nothing special there, all probably suffering large losses due to the Blight anyway

ii- Grey Wardens

Are their own entity not beholden to the Crown or to fight anything that isn't Darkspawn.  Besides, every other country has larger garrisons.

iii - Templar

Also not beholden to the Crown and every other country has them, probably in greater numbers.

iv- Mages
- plus Mages Collective

Again, nothing the other more populous countries don't have greater quantity.

v- Dwarves
- plus Golems
- Legion of the Dead

Seriously?  A)The Dwarves of Orzammar are allies of the Wardens during times of Blight, not Ferelden during times of war in general, they are an independent entity.  B)The Legion only fights Darkspawn.

vi- Dalish
- an excellent archer and guerrilla force

As you've been told many times, not beholden to the crown.

vii- City Elf- they can be militias, or conscript army

All nation have them

viii- Dogs/Ash Warriors

Pretty much the only reasonable point in Ferelden's favor you've mentioned, though I gather that they are few in number

Assasins and Spies with Zevran and Leliana influence/contacts

All the assassins Zevran knows are probably Crows and probably want him dead.  Leliana is working for the Divine so I don't know how much help she'd be.  It's not like she was ever a spy master, she just worked for one.

Qunari ally with Sten

The Qunari would love to ally to Ferelden, if they all abandoned their beliefs, freedoms, and political system and embraced the Qun.  Not happening.