854 réponses à ce sujet

[DarkSpiral]

Nizaris1 wrote...

Arabs also have disadvantages, many disadvantages...the tribes killing each other everyday, economy is well...imagine a desert...army? Arabs have no army at all, because technically Arabs have no country, they either nomad or live in small settlements. Even when at the prophet time, there are war between Muslim Arab and non Muslim Arab

But Makkah become the center of Arab civilization, the arabs are united, gain influence, Muslims in all part of Arabia come to Makkah, that increasing Arab influence over politic, religion and economy

Then Arabs under general Khaled Al Waled manage to defeat Byzantium army in which larger and organized than the Arabs. Then Persian fall under Arab...then Arab gain power over Middle east...then Arabs conquer Spain...nearly wipe the whole Europe...but Arabs stop there in caliph Umar Abdul Aziz time...if not, the whole Europe is Muslim now...then in Turk era Byzantium fall, and up to today the Constantinople/Istanbul never being conquered by anyone ever again

My point is...out of nothing, Arabs become super power in Medieval Era, so i can't see why you guys put Ferelden too low...???

Over a period of CENTURIES.  Centuries!

Of course Ferelden COULD become a superpwoer in centuries.  Or it could become a lyrium-blasted dustbolw.  Who the heck can possibly predict what will happen multiple hundreds of years in the future?  Also, In that much time everything you've ever mentioned as a reason for Ferelden to come out as top dog in thedas wil have lost all meaning.

Every thing except, probably, the Darkspawn.  Hey, topic relevance, maybe?

Modifié par DarkSpiral, 10 décembre 2012 - 12:36 .

[Plaintiff]

DarkSpiral wrote...

Nizaris1 wrote...

Arabs also have disadvantages, many disadvantages...the tribes killing each other everyday, economy is well...imagine a desert...army? Arabs have no army at all, because technically Arabs have no country, they either nomad or live in small settlements. Even when at the prophet time, there are war between Muslim Arab and non Muslim Arab

But Makkah become the center of Arab civilization, the arabs are united, gain influence, Muslims in all part of Arabia come to Makkah, that increasing Arab influence over politic, religion and economy

Then Arabs under general Khaled Al Waled manage to defeat Byzantium army in which larger and organized than the Arabs. Then Persian fall under Arab...then Arab gain power over Middle east...then Arabs conquer Spain...nearly wipe the whole Europe...but Arabs stop there in caliph Umar Abdul Aziz time...if not, the whole Europe is Muslim now...then in Turk era Byzantium fall, and up to today the Constantinople/Istanbul never being conquered by anyone ever again

My point is...out of nothing, Arabs become super power in Medieval Era, so i can't see why you guys put Ferelden too low...???

Over a period of CENTURIES.  Centuries!

Of course Ferelden COULD become a superpwoer in centuries.  Or it could become a lyrium-blasted dustbolw.  Who the heck can possibly predict what will happen multiple hundreds of years in the future?

Nizaris1 can! Do you doubt her prophetic vision? Begone from this sacred place, foul heathen!

All hail our almighty oracle, Nizaris1!

[Rinji the Bearded]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

I know this, but Grey Wardens aren't Ferelden and Fereldens aren't Grey Wardens. The point being raised in context was that Ferelden was itself capable of defeating a Blight with its own resources. That's not true, and that was my point.  

A Grey Warden was present - though unique circumstances including said alliances - and that Warden did his or her job. It was not the great armies of Ferelden that defeated the Blight.  

As such, Ferelden's relative success against the 5th Blight can't be used as evidence of its ability to engage with another nation in conventional war.  If anything, it counts against their chances as an example.

Agreeing with this

In fact, I would wager that the rest of world believes this now:

"Oh, one Warden was able to stop the Blight in Ferelden?  Blights probably aren't that big of a deal then."

[AlexanderCousland]

Nizaris' historical fallacies aside, i think her/his aim was to prove the relevance and capability of Fereldan's military and its ability to gain allies against any foe that may decide to declare war.

Off topic, sure, but relevant pertaining to her/his point, regardless if the info is true or false.

[upsettingshorts]

FreshIstay wrote...

Nizaris' historical fallacies aside, i think her/his aim was to prove the relevance and capability of Fereldan's military and its ability to gain allies against any foe that may decide to declare war.

I don't think that point is lost on any of us.

Ferelden's alleged "strength" is just not reflected in the game in any respect, and if it's mentioned at all, it's contradicted.

Modifié par Upsettingshorts, 10 décembre 2012 - 12:41 .

[Pzykozis]

Nizaris1 wrote...

My point is...out of nothing, Arabs become super power in Medieval Era, so i can't see why you guys put Ferelden too low...???

A disorganised non-united people, uniting and becoming organised and finding they are more than the sum of their parts isn't really applicable to an already fairly united people who whilst they might have trouble with socks if they're like their king, are fairly well organised.

[Pseudo the Mustachioed]

FreshIstay wrote...

Nizaris' historical fallacies aside, i think her/his aim was to prove the relevance and capability of Fereldan's military and its ability to gain allies against any foe that may decide to declare war.

Except it wasn't Ferelden collecting allies, it was the Wardens.

[In Exile]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

I know this, but Grey Wardens aren't Ferelden and Fereldens aren't Grey Wardens. The point being raised in context was that Ferelden was itself capable of defeating a Blight with its own resources. That's not true, and that was my point.

As such, Ferelden's relative success against the 5th Blight can't be used as evidence of its ability to engage with another nation in conventional war.  If anything, it counts against their chances as an example.

Right. My point was more that the army just had to be good enough to keep the darkspawn busy, so even the whole "major" alliance might have actually been totally overrun by Orlais. I wasn't trying to steal your thunder so much as emphasize your point, by pointing out that beating the blight wasn't even about numbers, tactics or skill (past a certain point).

If anything, it was more about Riordan being suicidal.

[upsettingshorts]

Pseudocognition wrote...

Except it wasn't Ferelden collecting allies, it was the Wardens.

Indeed.

Specifically a single ancient treaty signed so long ago as to have been kept in a decayed ruin.

In Exile wrote...

If anything, it was more about Riordan being suicidal. 

Ah the Riordan Maneuver.

"What's your plan?"
"Um, I'm going to climb a tower and jump on it."
"What if that doesn't work?"
"... we lose I guess."

Modifié par Upsettingshorts, 10 décembre 2012 - 12:46 .

[Rinji the Bearded]

In Exile wrote...

Right. My point was more that the army just had to be good enough to keep the darkspawn busy, so even the whole "major" alliance might have actually been totally overrun by Orlais. I wasn't trying to steal your thunder so much as emphasize your point, by pointing out that beating the blight wasn't even about numbers, tactics or skill (past a certain point). 

If anything, it was more about Riordan being suicidal.

The Riordan Maneuver worked as intended!

[upsettingshorts]

It would be fantastic if he would rise from his grave and smite this thread by jumping from a great height and plunging his sword deep into it.

I have just as much faith that such a thing will happen as I would in him had he explained his plans to me beforehand in Origins.

[In Exile]

Upsettingshorts wrote...
Ah the Riordan Maneuver.

"What's your plan?"
"Um, I'm going to climb a tower and jump on it."
"What if that doesn't work?"
"... we lose I guess."

If only humans had invented some kind of contraption that would fire a large projectile at a moving target up in the sky. Like a ... baptista? barrista? Meh, silly idea.

Might as well just throw one of 3 people who could kill the thing at it from a tower.

[LinksOcarina]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

If Alistair turns out to be Thedas' Muhammed, creates his own religion, then he and his followers succeed in converting all of Ferelden and several other nearby states, then within a hundred years or so unites them under the Caliphate then why not, anything is possible in Nizarisland.

Nizaris1 wrote...

Britian didn't become a power at all.

Tell that to Commonwealth countries...

You clearly didn't read his post.  Are you trying to insult him with this reply?  Because I sure as hell would be insulted by it.

It's ok, I have a lot of patience today with this. 

And as an aside, I always assumed Riordan was winging it, so to speak. 

Modifié par LinksOcarina, 10 décembre 2012 - 12:55 .

[Herr Uhl]

In Exile wrote...

Upsettingshorts wrote...
Ah the Riordan Maneuver.

"What's your plan?"
"Um, I'm going to climb a tower and jump on it."
"What if that doesn't work?"
"... we lose I guess."

If only humans had invented some kind of contraption that would fire a large projectile at a moving target up in the sky. Like a ... baptista? barrista? Meh, silly idea.

Might as well just throw one of 3 people who could kill the thing at it from a tower.

It would be a lot more efficient to shoot the people that aim to kill it at the dragon with the ballista. Give them pointy hats.

[upsettingshorts]

Herr Uhl wrote...

It would be a lot more efficient to shoot the people that aim to kill it at the dragon with the ballista. Give them pointy hats.

Then you best have good aim, you've only got three shots.

Four, if circumstances permit and Alistair is convinced to stop being mad and just let himself be shot by a ballista at a dragon already.

Modifié par Upsettingshorts, 10 décembre 2012 - 12:59 .

[DarkSpiral]

LinksOcarina wrote...

And as an aside, I always assumed Riordan was winging it, so to speak. 

Even if you DIDN'T intend that pun, it was painful and I salute you.

[AlexanderCousland]

Pseudocognition wrote...

FreshIstay wrote...

Nizaris' historical fallacies aside, i think her/his aim was to prove the relevance and capability of Fereldan's military and its ability to gain allies against any foe that may decide to declare war.

Except it wasn't Ferelden collecting allies, it was the Wardens.

One, possibly two of which are Fereldan.

[upsettingshorts]

FreshIstay wrote...

One, possibly two of which are Fereldan.

Which in this context is completely meaningless and irrelevant.

[Herr Uhl]

FreshIstay wrote...

Pseudocognition wrote...

FreshIstay wrote...

Nizaris' historical fallacies aside, i think her/his aim was to prove the relevance and capability of Fereldan's military and its ability to gain allies against any foe that may decide to declare war.

Except it wasn't Ferelden collecting allies, it was the Wardens.

One, possibly two of which are Fereldan.

But they didn't collect forces for Ferelden. They collected forces for the Wardens.

There is an important difference.

[In Exile]

Herr Uhl wrote...
But they didn't collect forces for Ferelden. They collected forces for the Wardens.

There is an important difference.

Technically, for killing the archdemon. The allies were never there to fight for the Wardens per se.

[AlexanderCousland]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

Pseudocognition wrote...

Except it wasn't Ferelden collecting allies, it was the Wardens.

Indeed.

Specifically a single ancient treaty signed so long ago as to have been kept in a decayed ruin.

In Exile wrote...

If anything, it was more about Riordan being suicidal. 

Ah the Riordan Maneuver.

"What's your plan?"
"Um, I'm going to climb a tower and jump on it."
"What if that doesn't work?"
"... we lose I guess."

How about draw the Dragon's Attention to the top of Fort Drakon, where the Ballista's are and shoot it.

Sure He made a suicidal jump, So did cassandra...seem's to be the way to destroy dragon's in this series.

[AlexanderCousland]

Herr Uhl wrote...

FreshIstay wrote...

Pseudocognition wrote...

FreshIstay wrote...

Nizaris' historical fallacies aside, i think her/his aim was to prove the relevance and capability of Fereldan's military and its ability to gain allies against any foe that may decide to declare war.

Except it wasn't Ferelden collecting allies, it was the Wardens.

One, possibly two of which are Fereldan.

But they didn't collect forces for Ferelden. They collected forces for the Wardens.

There is an important difference.

So, their goal wasnt to unite Fereldan under a Monarch? Im sure I didnt miss the part when the Warden had to play politician with the nobles to get them to side with him at the Landsmeet, the game was just as much about saving Fereldan as it was about defeating the Darkspawn. Maybe your warden was sleeping during the civil war.

[Herr Uhl]

FreshIstay wrote...

Herr Uhl wrote...

But they didn't collect forces for Ferelden. They collected forces for the Wardens.

There is an important difference.

So, their goal wasnt to unite Fereldan under a Monarch? Im sure I didnt miss the part when the Warden had to play politician with the nobles to get them to side with him at the Landsmeet, the game was just as much about saving Fereldan as it was about defeating the Darkspawn. Maybe your warden was sleeping during the civil war.

They recruited the Fereldans too.

[Neon Rising Winter]

FreshIstay wrote...

How about draw the Dragon's Attention to the top of Fort Drakon, where the Ballista's are and shoot it.

Sure He made a suicidal jump, So did cassandra...seem's to be the way to destroy dragon's in this series.

I'm taken by the idea that the age old wisdom of dragon slaying, passed down from generation to generation, consists of how best to throw yourself off a tall building and hit the thing as it flies by.

[AlexanderCousland]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

FreshIstay wrote...

One, possibly two of which are Fereldan.

Which in this context is completely meaningless and irrelevant.

Not really, Alistair (among others) are Fereldan, what makes you think they didnt have the bright Idea of saving their own homeland while collecting an army?

I suppose your under the impression everyone in the party just wanted to restore the Warden's to greatness, it was all about the Warden's for them?...which goes back to my earlier point of Grey Warden influence in politics.