202 réponses à ce sujet

[Foolsfolly]

As the title says.

If it came to it and a group of mages and a gathered army stood together in the hopes of forging a new state without the Chantry, Circles, or any other mage oppressing organization. Would you stand with them?

Personally, I think it'd be a gas. Carve out a piece of the Free Marches or Orlais and make it a free non-Tevinter Empire state for mages. Does it have a chance of surviving? Hell no. There'd be so many Divine Marches called against it that it'll fall from outside forces long before there'd be any interal collapse.

But free men and women united fighting for independence would be a fun story. Even if it just leads to the gallows.

[unbentbuzzkill]

I would stand with the mage free state

[ImperatorMortis]

A new mage society separate from Tevinter, and anyone else? Hell yes.

[labargegrrrl]

a part of me is like...

oh, hells yes!!!!

and a part of me thinks it a touch... isolationist?

[Chiramu]

This might go the same way as the Dales in the lore.

[Sol Downer]

I choose destroy. We destroy them or they destroy us.

[CrystaJ]

As long as they outlaw blood magic and pursue blood mages vigilantly themselves (as opposed to letting the templars do it), I think it could work.

And yes, I know blood magic itself is not inherently evil, but the power it bestows has a nasty habit of corrupting much like other forms of power do... only it involves demons and cosmic forces.

[ShadowLordXII]

cool

[Celene II]

I would accept that as one of the possible endings for a Mage War and I believe that without enough mages it could stop any attempt to remove them as long as they didnt have an Orsino in charge.

Other endings should be total destruction of one side or the other, a return to the circle system, a more draconian type of restriction like all mages made tranquil, or a new less evil Magocracy that ruled much of Thedas.

I hope that there are at least a dozen ways to resolve mages/chantry disputes.

[ImperatorMortis]

labargegrrrl wrote...

a part of me is like...

oh, hells yes!!!!

and a part of me thinks it a touch... isolationist?

Well the people seem to want the mages to go away. 

Problem solved. 

Ultimashade wrote...

I choose destroy. We destroy them or they destroy us.

How the hell can mundanes destroy a every expanding group of people who can heal themselves, and others at will. Summon rock to protect themselves. Create earthquakes,  and summon lightning from the sky. Shoot fireballs. Can control people like meat puppets.

Make people fall asleep. Literally paralyze people with fear. Crush people with their minds. Manipulate the laws of physics itself(Force Mage). Shapeshift into dragons. Freeze people, and etc.

Gameplay mechanics aside, almost every offensive mage spell is a one shot kill/maim.  

Modifié par ImperatorMortis, 27 novembre 2012 - 05:25 .

[Lee80]

I would support it. They can't do much worse then the current system-and it could actually work.

[ImperatorMortis]

CrystaJ wrote...

As long as they outlaw blood magic and pursue blood mages vigilantly themselves (as opposed to letting the templars do it), I think it could work.

And yes, I know blood magic itself is not inherently evil, but the power it bestows has a nasty habit of corrupting much like other forms of power do...

Why should they have to outlaw bloodmagic? They'd be a free state, it would be none of the other countries business what they did. 

CrystaJ wrote...
only it involves demons and cosmic forces.

Spirit Healer says "hi". 

Modifié par ImperatorMortis, 27 novembre 2012 - 05:27 .

[Plaintiff]

I say unequivocally yes.

There's no good reason to assume that a free mage state would be any worse than any other nation in Thedas. But it's important to remember that's not a high bar to clear.

[TEWR]

I'd only and possibly support if if they recognized the necessity of Circles and magical policing -- the former in the sense of magical education. Otherwise... no. 

Even so... I'm wary of the prospect all the same.

Modifié par The Ethereal Writer Redux, 27 novembre 2012 - 06:10 .

[CrystaJ]

Why should they have to outlaw bloodmagic?

Demon says "hi".

Tevinter wasn't always a blood mage pissing contest.

And I don't think Spirit Healer uses demons, while magic itself is a cosmic force, so I don't know how that relates to this.

[ImperatorMortis]

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

I'd only support if if they recognized the necessity of Circles and magical policing -- the former in the sense of magical education. Otherwise... no.

Why would they need a circle if everyone there were mages? And of course they would educate each other on magic. All mages do that, even apostates. 

CrystaJ wrote...

Demon says "hi".

Tevinter wasn't always a blood mage pissing contest.

And I don't think Spirit Healer uses demons, 

They use Spirits. 

http://dragonage.wik...i/Spirit_healer

I assumed thats what you meant since you used them in the same breath as Demons. 

CrystaJ wrote...
while magic itself is a cosmic force, so I don't know how that relates to this.

Then why would you say only Blood Magic involves "Cosmic Forces"? 

Modifié par ImperatorMortis, 27 novembre 2012 - 05:38 .

[The Teyrn of Whatever]

Foolsfolly wrote...

As the title says.

If it came to it and a group of mages and a gathered army stood together in the hopes of forging a new state without the Chantry, Circles, or any other mage oppressing organization. Would you stand with them?

Personally, I think it'd be a gas. Carve out a piece of the Free Marches or Orlais and make it a free non-Tevinter Empire state for mages. Does it have a chance of surviving? Hell no. There'd be so many Divine Marches called against it that it'll fall from outside forces long before there'd be any interal collapse.

But free men and women united fighting for independence would be a fun story. Even if it just leads to the gallows.

As long as it was slavery-free and a special demonslaying order comprised of mages and non-mages was formed to combat the very real problem of demonic incursions into the mortal plane, demonic possessions, and to deal with abominations, I'd say yes, I support the idea.

Tevinter seems alright if you're a mage, but the slavery factor and the use of blood magic and the overall arrogance of the Magisters is a huge turn-off. An alternative to the Imperium where mages could live freely and where apostates could seek refuge is a good idea.

[ImperatorMortis]

The Teryn of Whatever wrote...

As long as it was slavery-free and a special demonslaying order comprised of mages and non-mages was formed to combat the very real problem of demonic incursions into the mortal plane, demonic possessions, and to deal with abominations, I'd say yes, I support the idea.

Tevinter seems alright if you're a mage, but the slavery factor and the use of blood magic and the overall arrogance of the Magisters is a huge turn-off. An alternative to the Imperium where mages could live freely and where apostates could seek refuge is a good idea.

I agree with the slavery thing, and the Demon Slaying thing would be a given. No one wants a wild Demon running around. But why would Non-Mages have to stink up the place? Regular Mages would arguably be better at Demonslaying than mundanes. 

Wouldn't they just be taking up space/be a liability? 

Modifié par ImperatorMortis, 27 novembre 2012 - 05:42 .

[thats1evildude]

If you want a vision of the future, imagine a templar boot stamping on a mage's face — forever.

[GodWood]

Mage + Mage =/= mage child. At least in most cases.

So how is this dealt with? Is the child deported? If so where? If not than does that mean he's forced to grow in a society where he's undoubtedly an inferior and treated as such. Of course people such as him will quickly become the majority and (assuming the mages haven't used them as fleshy sacks of fuel to funnel their magic) seek to overthrow their oppressors than woops it starts all over again.

Ignoring that it doesn't take a political scientist to know that any state that consists of exclusively super-human people is going to seek to spread their borders and trample those who are 'lesser' beings.

Seriously people, how dumb can you be?

[CrystaJ]

They use Spirits.

http://dragonage.wik...i/Spirit_healer

I assumed thats what you meant since you used them in the same breath as Demons.

Uh, the word "spirit" wasn't anywhere in my post. "Cosmic forces" is just a general term meaning otherworldly, as far as I know.

Then why would you say only Blood Magic involves "Cosmic Forces"?

Where did I say only Blood Magic uses them? I just said that it does.

Dangers seemingly exclusive to Blood Magic seems to be attracting demons or cavorting with them simply to gain access to it, which I think is a good reason to outlaw Blood Magic, assuming you don't want Tevinter 2.0.

[The Hierophant]

ImperatorMortis wrote...
I agree with the slavery thing, and the Demon Slaying thing would be a given. No one wants a wild Demon running around. But why would Non-Mages have to stink up the place? Regular Mages would arguably be better at Demonslaying than mundanes. 

Wouldn't they just be taking up space/be a liability? 

After the Broken Circle questline i highly doubt as the majority of the mages were slaughtered alongside the Templars.

[ImperatorMortis]

thats1evildude wrote...

If you want a vision of the future, imagine a templar boot stamping on a mage's face — forever.

Dude.. You overrate Templars. You know how Templars capture mages? They travel in groups, and take kids from their homes. You know Templars capture/kill apostates? They travel in groups, and ambush them one at a time. 

Templars are not powerful. They have a slightly better chance of survival than a mundane, but seriously? 

5 Templars vs 5 Mages? The Mages would win. Why? 

Range(Mages don't have to whack somone with something for them to die). 
Versatility
Protection(Rock Armor/Arcane Shielding to protect them from swords.)
Healing
POWER
The Templars would probably take out 2 mages. But if any of them were Blood Mages or Force Mages..  Man.. 

The Hierophant wrote...

After the Broken Circle questline i highly doubt as the majority of the mages were slaughtered alongside the Templars.

Most of the mages that died was because theywere young, and inexperienced, and because the Templars ran away, and locked them in. 

Modifié par ImperatorMortis, 27 novembre 2012 - 05:51 .

[Gyrefalcon]

I would really like it but they still have to address the problem of possession and blood magic. If they don't have some non-mages to assist when things go awry, it may be like having foxes guard the hen house. Does not end well if everyone gets sucked in.

But there is the potential to see mages NOT separated from their families, or at least once they have their basic training down. And to be able to actively help their community? That would be a fantastic thing to see in a mage community.

[Plaintiff]

GodWood wrote...

Mage + Mage =/= mage child. At least in most cases.

So what?

So how is this dealt with? Is the child deported? If so where? If not than does that mean he's forced to grow in a society where he's undoubtedly an inferior and treated as such.

'Undoubtedly' nothing. There's no reason why he couldn't be treated as an equal citizen, with all due rights.

Of course people such as him will quickly become the majority and (assuming the mages haven't used them as fleshy sacks of fuel to funnel their magic) seek to overthrow their oppressors than woops it starts all over again.

Also not even slightly guaranteed. If anything, anecdotal evidence suggests that the mage population is acutally increasing.

Ignoring that it doesn't take a political scientist to know that any state that consists of exclusively super-human people is going to seek to spread their borders and trample those who are 'lesser' beings.

Again, there is no reason to assume this would happen. 

Seriously people, how dumb can you be?

The perfect conclusion to an argument composed of nothing but gross assumptions with no supporting evidence.

Modifié par Plaintiff, 27 novembre 2012 - 05:52 .