21 réponses à ce sujet

[termokanden]

I am working on my second mage now and am wondering about a few spells.

Crushing Prison: Exactly how much worse is it after the nerf? When I used it in the Fade this time it still seemed awesome. Any opinions on this after the nerf?

Waking Nightmare: When it controls an enemy, does that mean it becomes blue and can potentially steal your XP? I am wondering actually what exactly happens. It seems to me that even if the enemies start attacking each other, you would lose XP. Otherwise, it seems like a great spell. Perhaps this spell line is still worth it even without Waking Nightmare, just for Sleep and Horror?

Paralysis and Mass Paralysis: Exactly how good are these? Specifically, do they have a long duration or get resisted very often?

Cone of Cold: As with Crushing Prison, I am wondering how good it is after the nerf.

Modifié par termokanden, 04 janvier 2010 - 09:19 .

[jmp0505]

I am still okay with Crushing Prison and Cone of Cold, post nerf patching. I honestly didn't notice *that* much of a difference.



Walking Nightmare or Horror don't make the person an blue ring ally, however, if Walking Nightmare is the topline spell in that line (I forget the exact names), it does basically take a group of enemies and disorient/stun some, while you will see others start to attack their brethren, instead of you or your allies. IT seems to have a decent duration too.



Paralysis is handy as an early spell, but seems to get resisted a fair amount of time (like when you need it most...) Mass paralysis does work, but the spell cast timing seems the lengthiest by far of any of the AoE spells, and I found it got interrupted frequently. So I ended up using Glyph layering to achieve a fun paralyzing effect (though you can paralyze yourself and your friends if you aren't careful. Fortunately it's a shorter duration for the "good" guys.)

[Rahelron]

I don't know about crushing prison, but speaking about cone of cold they just increased the recast timer I think. Maybe it is the same for crushing prison. About Force Field the things are different: it lasts less than before, which is bad against bosses, but better against normal foes (you don't have to wait a century for it to end after you have killed everything else).

About paralisys: if you want something useful in the end game just pick petrify from the earth line. It works better and allows you to shatter the enemy. That said I think that standard paralisys is useful even at level 20 as long as you have a good amount of points in magic and spellpower bonuses from your equipment (which you should have anyway). It doesn't work well against bosses but does its job against anything else.

Mass paralisys: it is not so good I must say, because of the cast time and even for its range (limited). Just pick sleep for the early game and the third spell from the blood magic line (the area damage with stun) for the end game.

Modifié par Rahelron, 05 janvier 2010 - 05:29 .

[termokanden]

Thanks for the answers. I didn't actually realize that Mass Paralysis has a cast time, so now I'm absolutely sure I don't want it. The thing is I'm getting Blood Wound next level and am looking for one more good CC line.

[Mr_Raider]

For CC, the glyph spells continue to impress me. They cast instantly, can be combined for explosion, and cost very little mana. Plus, they are ideal for dungeon crawling or fighting indoors where you can hit enemies at a choke point. Even glyph of neutralization isn't half bad as a substitute for mana clash.

[jmp0505]

Mr_Raider wrote...

For CC, the glyph spells continue to impress me. They cast instantly, can be combined for explosion, and cost very little mana. Plus, they are ideal for dungeon crawling or fighting indoors where you can hit enemies at a choke point. Even glyph of neutralization isn't half bad as a substitute for mana clash.

Yeah, I hilariously discovered the layering of glyph spells effect accidentally in the heat of battle and had to laugh as everything came to a grinding halt except for Leliana, who was happily out of range and merrily picking off enemies while everyone stood frozen.  I have come to really like this class of spells.  In fact, I am rolling a mage where I plan to actually try and fill out that entire class of spells, as if that were her concentrated study, with the exception of the arcane bolt she started with and the basic frost spell, just in case she needs to buy a few seconds if under attack.

[termokanden]

Yes, the glyphs are indeed awesome. I do have those already.



Still not a big fan of the last glyph though, since I already have Mana Clash.

[Catwall]

Plus, glyph spells make my Mage feel...mage-ier.   Tactical, and spiffy looking. I love this line of spells.

[jmp0505]

leafstray wrote...

Plus, glyph spells make my Mage feel...mage-ier.   Tactical, and spiffy looking. I love this line of spells.

Now, if only we could get head-gear that would add to that "mage-ier" feeling, instead of looking like a papal mitre.
Edit for spell papal correctly. d'oh.

Modifié par jmp0505, 05 janvier 2010 - 10:36 .

[termokanden]

jmp0505 wrote...

leafstray wrote...

Plus, glyph spells make my Mage feel...mage-ier.   Tactical, and spiffy looking. I love this line of spells.

Now, if only we could get head-gear that would add to that "mage-ier" feeling, instead of looking like a popal mitre.

Amen to that!

[Ronin 3000]

nerfs?! what the hell...



i do not look forward to seeing the extent of these nerfs.

[termokanden]

Well from what I can tell, the nerfs didn't exactly change a whole lot.

[BlackVader]

Paralysis and Mass Paralysis are aweful spells. They aren't bad all by themself but since glyphs do pretty much the same, what's the point? Glyph of Paralysis stuns a single target just like Paralysis but it's only tier 1 and costs less mana. And Mass Paralysis takes MUCH longer to cast than the Glyph Combe (especially if you use 2 mages for the combo) and costs more mana. Oh, and I've yet to see ANYONE resisting the Gylph Combo while Mass Paralysis is resisted somewhat frequently. Yes, I realize that MP is party friendly but since I usually stun the backrow of the enemies anyway, the Glyphs work WAY better.

Imo, the only reason to invest into the Paralysis line is Miasma for an AW.

[Cybercat999]

Ronin 3000 wrote...

nerfs?! what the hell...

i do not look forward to seeing the extent of these nerfs.

I was delaying patching my game just because I was scared of nerfs. But then I finally got onto it and I was pleasantly surprised. CoC still has very fast recharge and Crushing Prison was extremely annoying when coming from mobs. I rather have mine last bit shorter than stand like an idiot twitching through entire fight.

[Bibdy]

CoC just went from 10 to 15s cooldown, makes it less spammable and actually gives your opponents a 5s window to fight back...TRULY GAME-BREAKING!

Force-Field and Crushing Prison were made a bit crap, in terms of a CC effect, since they have a much shorter duration, but Crushing Prison is freaking scary in terms of damage, since the duration was reduced by like 70%, but the damage only reduced like 15%, so you deal almost the same damage in 1/3 the time.

Mind-Controlled enemies from Waking Nightmare are still attackable, and I think it breaks if you hit them, but I have seen some of them start running off, back the way you came and will continue to run for freaking miles, or until the effect wears off. Weird stuff. Best to be aware of that and try and stop/kill them quick, or you'll end up being stuck in combat with an enemy half-way back the way you just came.

Modifié par Bibdy, 06 janvier 2010 - 07:13 .

[Cybercat999]

Bibdy wrote...
Crushing Prison is freaking scary in terms of damage, since the duration was reduced by like 70%, but the damage only reduced like 15%, so you deal almost the same damage in 1/3 the time.

Yes, I can get yellow mobs to some 15% hp with that single spell, it is still very powerful.

[termokanden]

BlackVader wrote...

Paralysis and Mass Paralysis are aweful spells. They aren't bad all by themself but since glyphs do pretty much the same, what's the point? Glyph of Paralysis stuns a single target just like Paralysis but it's only tier 1 and costs less mana. And Mass Paralysis takes MUCH longer to cast than the Glyph Combe (especially if you use 2 mages for the combo) and costs more mana. Oh, and I've yet to see ANYONE resisting the Gylph Combo while Mass Paralysis is resisted somewhat frequently. Yes, I realize that MP is party friendly but since I usually stun the backrow of the enemies anyway, the Glyphs work WAY better.
Imo, the only reason to invest into the Paralysis line is Miasma for an AW.

Well BlackVader, the idea was to have absolutely ridiculous amounts of CC. The glyphs are good, but there are two main problems with using paralysis explosion as CC:

1. If you cast glyph of paralysis first, you will freeze one mob and the glyph is gone. If you cast repulsion first, you push mobs away from the area of effect, and sometimes they manage to get out of the area of effect of the combo.

2. The glyphs are on a long cooldown. What if you want to CC again after 10 seconds?

This is why I'm looking for more mass CC.

[Cybercat999]

Sleep and Blood Wound for more fast mass CC. No casting time and not resisted as much as Paralysis.

[termokanden]

Indeed. Have Blood Wound, so I'll grab Sleep then.

[Faffnr]

I'm pretty sure even though the glyph disappears you can still cast Repulsion and it will work.

[BlackVader]

[quote]termokanden wrote...

Well BlackVader, the idea was to have absolutely ridiculous amounts of CC.[/qoute]
Then you'll need (at least) 2 mages anyway as a single mage will always have multiple spells on cooldown. And with two mages, you can use the paralysis explosion 2 times every battle. If both mages have Bloodwound , you can pretty much stun a huge group of enemies for a near infinite amount of time.


[quote]1. If you cast glyph of paralysis first, you will freeze one mob and the glyph is gone. If you cast repulsion first, you push mobs away from the area of effect, and sometimes they manage to get out of the area of effect of the combo.[/quote]
Well, casting paralysis first is obvious the one thing you should AVOID at all cost... And even with the knockback of repulsion, the paralysis explsion is still WAY faster than Mass Paralysis.


[quote]2. The glyphs are on a long cooldown. What if you want to CC again after 10 seconds?[/quote]
There are no CC spells that can be cast every 10 seconds (not with teh CoC nerf in 1.02, anyway). The Glyphs have pretty much the same cooldown like most other mass CC-spells. If you want to CC every 10 seconds, you'll need either 2 mages (see above) or multiple different CC spells anyway. So why not take the glyphs?


[quote]This is why I'm looking for more mass CC.[/quote]
Well the glyphs are among the most versatile spells in the game. Mass CC is only ONE of the things the gyphs can be used for.

That being said, I never claimed the glyphs are perfect. I just don't see much point in taking Paralysis and Mass Paralysis instead of the Glyphs.

Modifié par BlackVader, 07 janvier 2010 - 04:28 .

[Clintster75]

termokanden wrote...

I am working on my second mage now and am wondering about a few spells.

Crushing Prison: Exactly how much worse is it after the nerf? When I used it in the Fade this time it still seemed awesome. Any opinions on this after the nerf?

Waking Nightmare: When it controls an enemy, does that mean it becomes blue and can potentially steal your XP? I am wondering actually what exactly happens. It seems to me that even if the enemies start attacking each other, you would lose XP. Otherwise, it seems like a great spell. Perhaps this spell line is still worth it even without Waking Nightmare, just for Sleep and Horror?

Paralysis and Mass Paralysis: Exactly how good are these? Specifically, do they have a long duration or get resisted very often?

Cone of Cold: As with Crushing Prison, I am wondering how good it is after the nerf.

Crushing Prison is still awesome.  I didn't know there was a nerf until now...  It does get resisted rarely and it seems to come off elite mobs quicker but it is still an awesome CC.

Can't say much about nightmare cuz i never used it

My first playthrough my mage had mass paralysis and I liked it.  Yeah the cast time is bad but you can target all your party members and not worry about them, it only hits the bad guys.  It was a lifesaver for me a few times when things were going bad I just froze everyone but my party.

Cone of Cold is still awesome, I haven't noticed much difference since the nerf.  I still shatter many a bad guy..