184 réponses à ce sujet

[Feneckus]

How come so many people are obcessed about the time between each power they cast ?

The time between each kill should be more relevant.

I'd rather be able to one shot Ravagers and two shot Brutes than being able to cast a power one second earlier.

Modifié par Feneckus, 29 novembre 2012 - 10:39 .

[ToLazy4Name]

Two Wraith shots will out damage a Claymore, and on the Turian Soldier, if Marksman's ROF bonus makes the pause between shots faster, I imagine it'll out DPS a Claymore.

[capn233]

Feneckus wrote...

I'd rather be able one shot Ravagers and two shot Brutes than being able to cast a power one second earlier.

What all characters one-shot a Ravager with the Claymore?  Out of the ones that might worry about casting a power?

[Feneckus]

capn233 wrote...

Feneckus wrote...

I'd rather be able one shot Ravagers and two shot Brutes than being able to cast a power one second earlier.

What all characters one-shot a Ravager with the Claymore?  Out of the ones that might worry about casting a power?

Cryo Blast + Claymore
Claymore + Incinerate
Claymore + grenade
Warp + Claymore
Probably Claymore + Throw/overload if you have incendiary ammo, maybe not on platinum though

[Learn To Love Yourself]

Feneckus wrote...

How come so many people are obcessed about the time between each power they cast ?

The time between each kill should be more relevant.

I'd rather be able one shot Ravagers and two shot Brutes than being able to cast a power one second earlier.

I'd argue that CC powers, such as Chain Overload are pretty handy when you have faster cooldowns.  If you can stun enemies and have the power ready shortly after they are done being stunned, you are less likely to take damage, especially if you can OHK them one by one with the Wraith.  1 sec can feel like a big difference when facing a group.

Of course, there are always ways to play to not have to rely on faster cooldowns, but I'd still say it is situationally relevant.

Modifié par Jack Crapper, 29 novembre 2012 - 10:20 .

[Stardusk]

Jack Crapper wrote...

Feneckus wrote...

How come so many people are obcessed about the time between each power they cast ?

The time between each kill should be more relevant.

I'd rather be able one shot Ravagers and two shot Brutes than being able to cast a power one second earlier.

I'd argue that CC powers, such as Chain Overload are pretty handy when you have faster cooldowns.  If you can stun enemies and have the power ready shortly after they are done being stunned, you are less likely to take damage, especially if you can OHK them one by one with the Wraith.  1 sec can feel like a big difference when facing a group.

Of course, there are always ways to play to not have to rely on faster cooldowns, but I'd still say it is situationally relevant.

An excellent point. I was thinking of Chain Overload as well.

[flibber89-2]

Wraith is the number one boom stick for me. It just feels right.

[capn233]

Feneckus wrote...

Cryo Blast + Claymore
Claymore + Incinerate
Claymore + grenade
Warp + Claymore
Probably Claymore + Throw/overload if you have incendiary ammo, maybe not on platinum though

What ammo power are you using on the QFE to one-shot a Ravager after Cryo Blast?  And is this aspect dependent?

Modifié par capn233, 29 novembre 2012 - 11:12 .

[WarmechaM2]

I disagree, I just don't agree with comparing a Rare Weapon to a Ultra Rare Weapon, especially when it comes to damage, obviously the Wraith is better than the claymore.
just like the black widow>Widow and the harrier> geth pulse rifle. All the rare weapons are good in there own aspects, but a ultra rare IS going to be better than it full stop.

They might be some examples in which it's not true. But for your comparison, a wraith 10 > Claymore 10 Thats IF you even have a Wraith 10 because like I said, its an ultra rare, i get psps all the time and am at harrier 3, black widow 1, typhoon 1.

So to me there isn't a comparison to be made. If your going to compare a Rare weapon to something compare it to another Rare weapon.
Also I don't even have a wraith yet, but am not going to switch to it straight away, because at that moment my claymore 7+ > Wraith 1.

[Fortack]

capn233 wrote...

Feneckus wrote...

Cryo Blast + Claymore
Claymore + Incinerate
Claymore + grenade
Warp + Claymore
Probably Claymore + Throw/overload if you have incendiary ammo, maybe not on platinum though

What ammo power are you using on the QFE to one-shot a Ravager after Cryo Blast?  And is this aspect dependent?

Cryo Blast + Claymore with Incendiary Ammo = 1 shot Ravangers, 2 shots Brutes, 3 shots Scions (on gold).

[Sabbatine]

Stardusk wrote...

 Recently after some experimentation I have come to the firm conclusion that, other than for reasons of nostalgia, there is no reason to take the Claymore over the Wraith for most classes. The only area where the Claymore outshines it is damage, other than that the Wraith is MUCH lighter, has the second highest shotgun damage in the game, 2 shots and is more accurate. Most of the time the Claymore is overkill, sure it is cool but in terms of efficiency the Wraith does seem to be better than the Claymore. I feel much the same way about the Black Widow vs. the Widow. Only nostalgia draws me to the Widow but that is it.

Bad comparison.  The widow is weaker on gold+ difficulty because of the shield gate mechanic, not overkill.  On silver and bronze Overkill is a problem but not as serious a problem because an overkilled enemy is still a dead enemy.  An enemy that survives because of shield gate on the other  hand is not dead, but alive and angry.  On the lower difficulties the widow will still often one hit kill shielded enemies which is why most of the problems with it as a rifle don't become real serious until gold difficulty.  These problems that plaguethe widow never actually plague the claymore.

[Xiaolruc]

I recently converted to the Wraith in MP due to two major reasons:
1) Weight (because I'm a Powers AND Weapons guy)
2) Spare Ammo (without using a mod)

I LOVE the Claymore, and I can often reload cancel with ease (console reload-canceling, baby!) but when I play with people who use weapons that have high damage and low spare ammo (Cerberus Harrier), it can really hamper our functionality on higher difficulties.

[UnknownMercenary]

Fortack wrote...

capn233 wrote...

Feneckus wrote...

Cryo Blast + Claymore
Claymore + Incinerate
Claymore + grenade
Warp + Claymore
Probably Claymore + Throw/overload if you have incendiary ammo, maybe not on platinum though

What ammo power are you using on the QFE to one-shot a Ravager after Cryo Blast?  And is this aspect dependent?

Cryo Blast + Claymore with Incendiary Ammo = 1 shot Ravangers, 2 shots Brutes, 3 shots Scions (on gold).

Really? I thought the cryo blast boost only worked with fire powers, not ammo. I'll have to try that. Does it do even more damage under the human infiltrator?

[Learn To Love Yourself]

UnknownMercenary wrote...

Fortack wrote...

capn233 wrote...

Feneckus wrote...

Cryo Blast + Claymore
Claymore + Incinerate
Claymore + grenade
Warp + Claymore
Probably Claymore + Throw/overload if you have incendiary ammo, maybe not on platinum though

What ammo power are you using on the QFE to one-shot a Ravager after Cryo Blast?  And is this aspect dependent?

Cryo Blast + Claymore with Incendiary Ammo = 1 shot Ravangers, 2 shots Brutes, 3 shots Scions (on gold).

Really? I thought the cryo blast boost only worked with fire powers, not ammo. I'll have to try that. Does it do even more damage under the human infiltrator?

It is not the Freeze Combo you are thinking of.  Cryo Ammo debuffs frozen and chilled targets and it also weakens armor

[UnknownMercenary]

Yeah, but he mentioned Cryo Blast, not Cryo Ammo. If Incendiary didn't have a bonus combined with Cryo Blast wouldn't CB + AP ammo do more damage to armor?

Modifié par UnknownMercenary, 30 novembre 2012 - 01:08 .

[Learn To Love Yourself]

UnknownMercenary wrote...

Yeah, but he mentioned Cryo Blast, not Cryo Ammo. If Incendiary didn't have a bonus combined with Cryo Blast wouldn't CB + AP ammo do more damage to armor?

Oops sorry.  That was my typo.  I meant Cryo Blast.  Sorry for the confusion.

Sure, AP ammo is great.  Incendiary is also amazing.  Plus, you have the option to Incinerate afterwards for FE goodness.

[UnknownMercenary]

I might give the FQE another shot. What's a good build for this? I think I have a 6/6/6/4/4 build right now but I imagine a Claymore FQE would want to maximize gun damage.

[TODD 5184]

The wraith is a more powerful version of the eviscerator with 1 less shot.

The black widow is a weaker version of the widow with 2 extra shots.

If anything, the widow and the claymore are most similar to each other in that they are each very powerful, one shot monsters.

But yeah, wraith and claymore very different from each other. UR vs. Rare aside, also much harder to obtain level 10 wraith.

[capn233]

Fortack wrote...

Cryo Blast + Claymore with Incendiary Ammo = 1 shot Ravangers, 2 shots Brutes, 3 shots Scions (on gold).

I don't see how you get 8100 armor damage from that sequence to down a Gold Ravager in one shot.   I guess I will go check it out, unless someone can do the math quickly.  Unless it is aspect dependent, or we are in bizarro world and this is on an HI.

Modifié par capn233, 30 novembre 2012 - 01:45 .

[Bhatair]

I love the claymore.

I also love the wraith.

[himegoto]

Stardusk wrote...

 Recently after some experimentation I have come to the firm conclusion that, other than for reasons of nostalgia, there is no reason to take the Claymore over the Wraith for most classes. The only area where the Claymore outshines it is damage, other than that the Wraith is MUCH lighter, has the second highest shotgun damage in the game, 2 shots and is more accurate. Most of the time the Claymore is overkill, sure it is cool but in terms of efficiency the Wraith does seem to be better than the Claymore. I feel much the same way about the Black Widow vs. the Widow. Only nostalgia draws me to the Widow but that is it.

BW to the Widow, yes completely.
And I've said something similiar on another thread about the Wraith to the Claymore, which for some reason I get trolled on. But I'll have to say it's not as black and white like the BW to Widow.

Wraith to the Claymore is more depending on the kit you are using. Original human soldier for example takes the Wraith so much better, because you cant afford to close in enemies in higher diffculties, Wraith gives you better range (tighter squeeze) and damage potential and survivibility (much faster ARush cooldown)

Claymore works better for classes that could get in closer. For example a Krosent, who most of the time only have time for one shot due to his lack of mobility.
Or a build specific kit like the 3 shot bomber Shadow build.

However most of the time a Reegar works better than a Claymore if we are talking cqc, which, concludes what I said on the other thread that makes the Claymore obsolete. 

[himegoto]

UnknownMercenary wrote...

I might give the FQE another shot. What's a good build for this? I think I have a 6/6/6/4/4 build right now but I imagine a Claymore FQE would want to maximize gun damage.

Better to skip on incinerate if you plan on maximizing gun damage with a claymore.

[Learn To Love Yourself]

capn233 wrote...

Fortack wrote...

Cryo Blast + Claymore with Incendiary Ammo = 1 shot Ravangers, 2 shots Brutes, 3 shots Scions (on gold).

I don't see how you get 8100 armor damage from that sequence to down a Gold Ravager in one shot.   I guess I will go check it out, unless someone can do the math quickly.  Unless it is aspect dependent, or we are in bizarro world and this is on an HI.

Ravagers receive damage spikes when their sacks are broken.  Did you take that into account?  He is probably getting headshots on the Brutes & Scions (plus hump shot... sexy).

[Tybo]

capn233 wrote...

Fortack wrote...

Cryo Blast + Claymore with Incendiary Ammo = 1 shot Ravangers, 2 shots Brutes, 3 shots Scions (on gold).

I don't see how you get 8100 armor damage from that sequence to down a Gold Ravager in one shot.   I guess I will go check it out, unless someone can do the math quickly.  Unless it is aspect dependent, or we are in bizarro world and this is on an HI.

Bursting all the ravager sacs does 30% damage.  This can be increased by a debuff, so cryo blast>bursting sacs will do 37.5% damage, or 3037.5 damage.  So the Ravager now has 5062.5 Armor left.  With Warp Ammo IV, Shotgun Rail III, and Shotgun Amp IV, with the Cryo Blast debuff, a QFE with a Claymore can do 5201.5 damage.

In conclusion, yes this is possible


EDIT: Just realized this was with Incendiary Ammo.  With this, you get 4995.5 damage, or just 67 damage short.  This is well within the realm of possibility.

Modifié par tyhw, 30 novembre 2012 - 02:23 .

[Learn To Love Yourself]

UnknownMercenary wrote...

I might give the FQE another shot. What's a good build for this? I think I have a 6/6/6/4/4 build right now but I imagine a Claymore FQE would want to maximize gun damage.

I used to run the FQE with a Claymore quite a bit.  Smart Choke for tighter spread, HVB for penetration, piercing, and damage, Incendiary Ammo for awesomeness + potential FEs.  I used to use Incendiary before the change, too.

Currently, I use a Wraith w/ Smart Choke, HVB + Acolyte with whatever ammo I feel like at the time.  Lately, I've been on a Disruptor Round kick for Tech Bursts and more effectiveness vs shields.  I guess it depends on what faction you face, but I usually go UUG or UUP

Anyway, I've always had a 6/6/6/5/3 build. 
Durable Rocket Turret (Shield & Damage, Armor Piercing, Rocket)  Set it in high traffic areas & forget it.  It actually nets you kills

Cryo Blast is standard: Radius, Cryo Explosion, Frozen Vulnerability - pure debuff

Incinerate: Radius, Burning Damage, Freeze Combo (now that it works)

Passive: Damage & Capacity, Power Damage.  I have had it like this for a while, and it was mostly to support the Rocket Drone and powers, but I might opt for Headshot Bonus, since they have reintroduced Headshot Bonuses for Bosses.  Still debating this.