37 réponses à ce sujet

[Auintus]

Genlock mages. WTF.
Does it have something to do with the taint? Dwarves are incapable of magic, yet genlocks, their tainted bretheren, are not.
Does anyone have an answer for this?

[xsdob]

Plothole

[Zanallen]

Darkspawn draw upon the taint for magic, yes.

[TEWR]

A couple things to note:

1) Genlocks cast magic by manipulating the Taint in their blood, similar to the Power of Blood thing Avernus' elixir can grant you. It's essentially blood magic.

2) The Primeval Thaig was noted to have been created by magic. Add into this the things about the Dwarves of that Thaig -- along with the Nexus Golem's comments on Dwarves -- and it's pretty evident that the Dwarves were, at one point, capable of being Mages.

[Fredward]

Zanallen wrote...

Darkspawn draw upon the taint for magic, yes.

It is known.

[xsdob]

I didn't know that. Guess it's not a plothole afterall.

[brushyourteeth]

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

A couple things to note:

1) Genlocks cast magic by manipulating the Taint in their blood, similar to the Power of Blood thing Avernus' elixir can grant you. It's essentially blood magic.

2) The Primeval Thaig was noted to have been created by magic. Add into this the things about the Dwarves of that Thaig -- along with the Nexus Golem's comments on Dwarves -- and it's pretty evident that the Dwarves were, at one point, capable of being Mages.

Really? I always kinda figured the magical influences in the deep roads could be attributed to the dwellings they once shared with elves, a la "Witch Hunt."

Not saying that's right, but it's what I always assumed was going on. *shrugs*

[TEWR]

Really? I always kinda figured the magical influences in the deep roads could be attributed to the dwellings they once shared with elves, a la "Witch Hunt."

Not saying that's right, but it's what I always assumed was going on. *shrugs*

They only shared their homes with the Elves during the time their empire existed as we know it, after Tevinter conquered Arlathan. And that was about 2000-4000 years prior to the First Blight. The Primeval Thaig predates that era by 10,000 years IIRC -- for some reason my mind is saying that -- and there's nothing to indicate Elves lived there.

Well... there is a set item you always acquire in the PT called "Carved Ring of the Vhenadahl"... but that's about it. DG said that Dwarves lived in the PT, anyway.

Modifié par The Ethereal Writer Redux, 30 novembre 2012 - 06:09 .

[TCBC_Freak]

I think that their exposure to raw lyrium for millennium eroded their magical abilities, kind of how elves being exposed to humans made them lose their immortality.

Just an idea I have.

[brushyourteeth]

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

Really? I always kinda figured the magical influences in the deep roads could be attributed to the dwellings they once shared with elves, a la "Witch Hunt."

Not saying that's right, but it's what I always assumed was going on. *shrugs*

They only shared their homes with the Elves during the time their empire existed as we know it, after Tevinter conquered Arlathan. And that was about 2000-4000 years prior to the First Blight. The Primeval Thaig predates that era by 10,000 years IIRC -- for some reason my mind is saying that -- and there's nothing to indicate Elves lived there.

Well... there is a set item you always acquire in the PT called "Carved Ring of the Vhenadahl"... but that's about it. DG said that Dwarves lived in the PT, anyway.

Interesting! All I know for sure is this:

1.)  I want more dwarves.

2.)  I want more explanations.

[TEWR]

Filament wrote...

TCBC_Freak wrote...

I think that their exposure to raw lyrium for millennium eroded their magical abilities, kind of how elves being exposed to humans made them lose their immortality.

Just an idea I have.

I understand now. Arlathan elves were eevees, and by branching evolution became modern-day elves and dwarves.

And this is why additional exposure to lyrium turned Branka into a Duggtrio.

As a major Pokemon fan, I'm in love with this post. It wins on so many levels.

[brushyourteeth]

Filament wrote...

TCBC_Freak wrote...

I think that their exposure to raw lyrium for millennium eroded their magical abilities, kind of how elves being exposed to humans made them lose their immortality.

Just an idea I have.

I understand now. Arlathan elves were eevees, and by branching evolution became modern-day elves and dwarves.

And this is why additional exposure to lyrium turned Branka into a Duggtrio.

That explains a lot about Branka, actually.

[Fredward]

Isn't exposure to lyrium a GOOD thing for mages though? Lyrium potions and such.

Also off topic but if Sandal turns out to be a dwarven mage I am going to mucho disappointed. I want him to be something totally different.

[TCBC_Freak]

Foopydoopydoo wrote...

Isn't exposure to lyrium a GOOD thing for mages though? Lyrium potions and such.

Also off topic but if Sandal turns out to be a dwarven mage I am going to mucho disappointed. I want him to be something totally different.

Not raw Lyrium no.

[EmperorSahlertz]

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

A couple things to note:

1) Genlocks cast magic by manipulating the Taint in their blood, similar to the Power of Blood thing Avernus' elixir can grant you. It's essentially blood magic.

It is not blood magic. Not blood magic at all. The only term that could correctly be attributed to what the Darkspawn emisarries are doing would be "Blight Magic". What the Darkspawn are dooing is entirely alien to the Fade, the demons cannot teach or understand it. While it may share some attributes with blood magic, it is most certainly not blood magic.

[EmperorSahlertz]

Foopydoopydoo wrote...

Isn't exposure to lyrium a GOOD thing for mages though? Lyrium potions and such.

Also off topic but if Sandal turns out to be a dwarven mage I am going to mucho disappointed. I want him to be something totally different.

Raw lyrium causes instant death to mages, and severly hurts both physically and mentally any other. So no, exposure to Lyrium is not a good thing.

[Dio Demon]

Foopydoopydoo wrote...

Isn't exposure to lyrium a GOOD thing for mages though? Lyrium potions and such.

Also off topic but if Sandal turns out to be a dwarven mage I am going to mucho disappointed. I want him to be something totally different.

I'd rather Sandal not be some powerful something or other, I would prefer it if it was left unexplained or he's just normal whichever one.

[HurricaneGinger]

Crazy Eyed One wrote...

Foopydoopydoo wrote...

Isn't exposure to lyrium a GOOD thing for mages though? Lyrium potions and such.

Also off topic but if Sandal turns out to be a dwarven mage I am going to mucho disappointed. I want him to be something totally different.

I'd rather Sandal not be some powerful something or other, I would prefer it if it was left unexplained or he's just normal whichever one.

Sandal as "something totally different" would be interesting, but also kinda anticlimactic. Whatever he was revleaed to be, every gamer would go: "Well...duh." I honestly don't have a problem with Sandal being something else, I just wonder if BioWare would actually do it when most, if not all of us, are expecting this.

He may be a dwarf mage for all we know. It would be interesting, and slightly surprising. Sandal is already different...and dangerous. He did kill all those darkspawn in Denerim, the ogre in the Deep Roads, as well as a bunch of demons in Kirkwall. He always manages to find his way to the protagonist with no trouble. Then there's his little prophecy, which he quickly covers up when Bodahn shows suspicion.

Only a mage could harness such power, or maybe he's something more. Who knows? I would like answers, but if nothing is revealed about him and he is just an interesting side-note in the age, then that'd be okay too. Leave some mystery in there.

[Maria Caliban]

Auintus wrote...

Genlock mages. WTF.
Does it have something to do with the taint? Dwarves are incapable of magic, yet genlocks, their tainted bretheren, are not.
Does anyone have an answer for this?

Yes, David has confirmed it's the taint. Human, elven, and qunari mages cast spells by drawing on their natural connection to the Fade. Darkspawn aren't connected to the Fade at all.

Which is a pity. It would be nice to see a genlock turn Abomination and start tearing apart his fellows.

While I'm at it, dwarves can do magic. I want to say it was the second novel where a dwarf manages to do a magical ritual successfully. The Anvil of the Void is magic. I think it's that they can't cast spells.

xsdob wrote...

Plothole

You use this word, but I do not think you know what it means.

Modifié par Maria Caliban, 30 novembre 2012 - 09:04 .

[Mr Mxyzptlk]

TCBC_Freak wrote...

I think that their exposure to raw lyrium for millennium eroded their magical abilities, kind of how elves being exposed to humans made them lose their immortality.

Just an idea I have.

Elves diddnt lose their immortality when exposed to humans, only their knowledge and culture.

BLOOD MAGIC EXPLAINS ALL!

[whykikyouwhy]

Mr Mxyzptlk wrote...

Elves diddnt lose their immortality when exposed to humans, only their knowledge and culture.

BLOOD MAGIC EXPLAINS ALL!

"Immortality" is questionable. It may have just meant an extended life - seemingly endless, especially when factoring in the "slumber" of elders. Perhaps it's some sort of stasis. 

Codex entries do point to a change in that sense of immortality though - and lifespans becoming closer to that of humans.

From Codex entry: Arlathan: Part One - 

"Before the ages were named or numbered, our people were glorious and eternal and never-changing. Like the great oak tree, they were constant in their traditions, strong in their roots, and ever reaching for the sky.They felt no need to rush when life was endless. They worshiped their gods for months at a time. Decisions came after decades of debate, and an introduction could last for years. From time to time, our ancestors would drift into centuries-long slumber, but this was not death, for we know they wandered the Fade in dreams..."

"But the humans brought worse things than war with them. Our ancestors proved susceptible to human diseases, and for the first time in history, elves died of natural causes. What's more, those elves who spent time bartering and negotiating with humans found themselves aging, tainted by the humans' brash and impatient lives. Many believed that the ancient gods had judged them unworthy of their long lives and cast them down among the quicklings. Our ancestors came to look upon the humans as parasites, which I understand is similar to the way the humans see our people in the cities. The ancient elves immediately moved to close Elvhenan off from the humans, for fear that this quickening effect would crumble the civilization."

--"The Fall of Arlathan," as told by Gisharel, keeper of the Ralaferin clan of the Dalish elves

So...maybe not blood magic, but human filth? 

Modifié par whykikyouwhy, 30 novembre 2012 - 11:28 .

[Stroke1986]

Maria Caliban wrote...

Auintus wrote...

Genlock mages. WTF.
Does it have something to do with the taint? Dwarves are incapable of magic, yet genlocks, their tainted bretheren, are not.
Does anyone have an answer for this?

Yes, David has confirmed it's the taint. Human, elven, and qunari mages cast spells by drawing on their natural connection to the Fade. Darkspawn aren't connected to the Fade at all.

Which is a pity. It would be nice to see a genlock turn Abomination and start tearing apart his fellows.

While I'm at it, dwarves can do magic. I want to say it was the second novel where a dwarf manages to do a magical ritual successfully. The Anvil of the Void is magic. I think it's that they can't cast spells.

xsdob wrote...

Plothole

You use this word, but I do not think you know what it means.

I don know for sure but if i remember well the dwarfs are not connected to the Fade so how is this than?  And i guess the anvil and as well the golems are more like alchemy.

[Maria Caliban]

Dwarves are not naturally connected to the Fade, but that doesn't seem to mean that the Fade is something they can never touch. Oghran and Varric can both travel with you to the Fade and interact with it.

I'm going to guess that it's something like 'dwarves can't naturally tap and channel Fade energies so no fireballs, but if they use a medium like lyrium or extensive rituals, they can do magic.'

Wynne says the Anvil is a form of blood magic. She might be wrong, but she's a senior enchanter and there's nothing that contradicts her.

Modifié par Maria Caliban, 30 novembre 2012 - 11:46 .