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Dwarf mages. No, seriously.


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#26
Auintus

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Maria Caliban wrote...

Yes, David has confirmed it's the taint. Human, elven, and qunari mages cast spells by drawing on their natural connection to the Fade. Darkspawn aren't connected to the Fade at all.

Which is a pity. It would be nice to see a genlock turn Abomination and start tearing apart his fellows.

While I'm at it, dwarves can do magic. I want to say it was the second novel where a dwarf manages to do a magical ritual successfully. The Anvil of the Void is magic. I think it's that they can't cast spells.


But how? They use the same spells our mages use. You'd figure they'd be using unique spells at least.

That would be...The Calling? I'll reread that then.
The Anvil of the Void uses lyrium. No magic is provided on the part of the dwarves, they just manipulate the lyrium's magic.

#27
Xewaka

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Dwarfs, as a species, are resilient to magic. This is what allows them to handle Lyrium with reduced risk, compared to humans or elves. While I don't know if it is made explicit or countermanded at a point in the lore, this species-wide magic resilience is probably what keeps them from producing individuals born with the natural capability to touch into the Fade. Or maybe it's the other way around, and their inability to tap the Fade as species is what grants them magic resistance. Whichever way, Dwarves at such cannot cast magic, but can manipulate magic sources (Lyrium) into magic-like effects. (ENCHANTMENT!)

#28
Guest_RainbowPuppy_*

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Auintus wrote...



But how? They use the same spells our mages use. You'd figure they'd be using unique spells at least.


Why wouldn't they? Blood mages can use ordinary magic too. The Taint, like blood and mana, is a source of power the darkspawn use to fuel their spells. There might be some Taint-specific spells we haven't seen yet, though.

Modifié par RainbowPuppy, 30 novembre 2012 - 02:47 .


#29
Solmanian

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Point of note: only dwarves and tranquils can craft magic items. Being a Mage seems to be a perquisite for tranquility, though its unclear if non-mages can become tranquil. It is hinted that the qunari utilize a similar process on those that are unreceptive to the qun (though nothing solid on that, we'll have to wait to DA3 to know what happened to Isabella).

So probably dwarves have the same innate magical abilities of the rest of the races, but since they don't dream (like tranquils) they're unable to manipulate the fade. Since all dark spawn dream (same as the wardens) due to the archdemon presence, genlock don't have that handicap anymore (that's my belief until an ingame genlock say otherwise)

#30
Asdrubael Vect

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1)There are no Dwarf mages and never been

2)The Anvil of the Void...was built over a century after the union with Tevinter, and if you've played the DLC(Golems Amgarak) you understand that it was created with the support of the Tevinter Empire, which has received a lot of dwarf golems, including huge Juggernauts


and golems are created by injecting molten lirium into "armor" (empty golem) with Dwarf/Elf/Human inside

3)Sendai is probably a half-elf dwarf who spent a lot of time with raw lirium....and it still can not be called a mage

Modifié par Dark Korsar, 30 novembre 2012 - 04:33 .


#31
TEWR

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Dark Korsar wrote...

1)There are no Dwarf mages and never been


The Primeval Thaig shows us that it's incredibly likely that the Dwarves were once Mages.

Also, Sandal. Even if he's half-Dwarf, he's still a Dwarf. And in DAII, he froze an Ogre solid using "Not Enchantment".


2)The Anvil of the Void...was built over a century after the union with Tevinter, and if you've played the DLC(Golems Amgarak) you understand that it was created with the support of the Tevinter Empire, which has received a lot of dwarf golems, including huge Juggernauts


That's not the history of the Anvil of the Void at all. While it's true Golems of Amgarrak had Dwarves working with Tevinter, that was to create a new Anvil. It wasn't indicative of the origins of the old Anvil -- otherwise, Tevinter would have no need to buy Golems from the Dwarves as they could've made their own Anvil/Golems.

Given the fact that the Primeval Thaig has golems in it and Caridin talks about a vision the Ancestors gave him, I'd conjecture that the Anvil of the Void is a remnant from the Primeval Thaig era -- an era that predates the Dwarven Empire we know of and predates even Tevinter.

Indeed, the codex on the Primeval Thaigs implies fairly strongly that Orzammar is near a Primeval Thaig as well, because it's a sealed missive from the Royal Archives of Orzammar talking about a Dwarven idol recovered from an old Thaig.

And it'd make no sense for a Dwarf to have somehow survived a trip from Orzammar to Kirkwall's PT and then make the trip back. That simply wouldn't be possible for a scavenger.


and golems are created by injecting molten lirium into "armor" (empty golem) with Dwarf/Elf/Human inside


Broadly, I'd say blood magic could be classified as using life to fuel any sort of magical act -- be it in the form of blood as is typically seen or some other fashion like with lyrium.

So I'd say under a broad sense of blood magic, the Anvil of the Void would be classified as such.

3)Sendai is probably a half-elf dwarf who spent a lot of time with raw lirium....and it still can not be called a mage


Yes, Sandal can be called a Mage. Though a half-Dwarf, he's still a Dwarf just as all Half-Elves are Human. So he's still a Dwarven Mage, considering that he froze an Ogre solid with "not enchantment" -- obviously, a spell.

Also, Bodahn only speculates that Sandal was lyrium addled. Doesn't make it true.

Personally, I'm leaning towards Sandal's mother being an Elf. We know he's the bastard son of an Aeducan male and that his mother was either a human or Elf. David Gaider told us that the reason all half-elves are human has to do with magic -- which I take to mean a Tevinter curse.

#32
XCelfa

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You know, I just noticed something. I can mess with the punctuation in the thread title and change the emphasis to voice my opinion. Check it out.

"Dwarf mages: no. Seriously."

Neat huh?

#33
Asdrubael Vect

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1)What if Primeval Thaig actually has ancient elven origin, even before humans and Tevinter Empire?, we all know that they were the first who lived in Thedas for millennium and they were all blood mages, and in the ancient past they have had some connection with the dwarfs

2)what if dwarfs "mages"(if they really existed) were the same "mages" as Meredith, this explains the appearance of Profanes ("lirium magic" subsequently destroyed them and turned into the "Golems"))....then they can be considered something like a "Templar" but still not a mage

3)about Sandal "magic", i think  he actually used a  Frostrocks and other similar Lifestones...or he broke the magical runes(By the way ALL dwarf runes have ancient Tevinter signs(ancient elven signs) releasing their energy, but I'm more confident in the first version

Modifié par Dark Korsar, 01 décembre 2012 - 02:08 .


#34
whykikyouwhy

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Dark Korsar wrote...

2)what if dwarfs "mages"(if they really existed) were the same "mages" as Meredith, this explains the appearance of Profanes ("lirium magic" subsequently destroyed them and turned into the "Golems"))....then they can be considered something like a "Templar" but still not a mage

The profanes seem to have come about more from sort of ingestion - 

"We who are forgotten, remember,We clawed at rock until our fingers bled,We cried out for justice, but were unheard.Our children wept in hunger,And so we feasted upon the gods.Here we wait, in aeons of silence.We few, we profane."

If that's taken literally, of course. And if so, was it purely the nature of what they feasted upon that changed them, or a combination of who they already were along with what they ate?

As it stands, we haven't yet seen any record, heard any snippet of conversation, etc. to support the existence of dwarf mages. (So the verdict is still out on that.) Which doesn't mean that they never existed. The dwarves may very well have had a stronger connection to the Fade in the far past. Which of course makes Sandal's prophecy, with its hint of things (people) being as they were, all the more interesting.

#35
Obrusnine

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EmperorSahlertz wrote...

Foopydoopydoo wrote...

Isn't exposure to lyrium a GOOD thing for mages though? Lyrium potions and such.

Also off topic but if Sandal turns out to be a dwarven mage I am going to mucho disappointed. I want him to be something totally different.

Raw lyrium causes instant death to mages, and severly hurts both physically and mentally any other. So no, exposure to Lyrium is not a good thing.


Wait, this confuses me. How does one turn raw lyrium into lyrium exactly? Also, if it seriously physically and mentally harms everyone else, how does anyone extract the stuff without killing themselves? I also thought the Tranquil can work around raw Lyrium because they have had their connection to the fade severed, so would it really be any other? Or just any other that isn't tranquil? Or does raw lyrium do something else? 

#36
They call me a SpaceCowboy

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Dark Korsar wrote...

...
3)about Sandal "magic", i think  he actually used a  Frostrocks and other similar Lifestones...or he broke the magical runes(By the way ALL dwarf runes have ancient Tevinter signs(ancient elven signs) releasing their energy, but I'm more confident in the first version


I think you're right. I always took Sandal's "Not enchantment" as 'fanservice' or a reference back to the first game.

#37
Herr Uhl

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Obrusnine wrote...

Wait, this confuses me. How does one turn raw lyrium into lyrium exactly?


From what I've gathered, by heavily diluting it.

#38
Obrusnine

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Herr Uhl wrote...

Obrusnine wrote...

Wait, this confuses me. How does one turn raw lyrium into lyrium exactly?


From what I've gathered, by heavily diluting it.


Just wondering "with what..." but considering your statement was an assumption, I'm guessing you've just got guesses on that, lol