128 réponses à ce sujet

[Genraku]

No offense but one of the best ways to make a proper warrior is not to write it off before you've even leveled it high enough to specialize.
That said, your warrior is going to benefit a lot from having the right gear.It also helps to have a group that can support them. A warrior isn't going to be soloing the game without lots and lots of health potions. Another thing to notice is that due to the swing timer, I've found it msot effective to use special attacks immediately after an autoattack to maximize the burst, but its just taking off a delay of maybe 1.5 seconds. The tactics system does it automatically I think.
Personally I went the route of starfang+warden commander armor. Used Alisatiar to hold things in place, leliana to open holes in their armor, and my warrior would finish them off. If your warrior is dying, you aren't doing a very good job running your tank to keep aggro (change his tactics if need be) Or your healer char isnt' cutting it. Even on hard and NM I was able to keep my warrior up with a few Health potions while the healer concentrated on the tank. Whenever someone got too low I'd just force field them.(honestly I don't think its too hard to set up wynne or morrigan to forcefield someone at 10% and heal someone at 50.)
Then again thats just my own experience, I've found my 2h warrior to deal with fights as quickly as my AW mage, since while he isn't hitting the same as the aw's mana cleanses, His specials hit fast enough that thins will die nearly as fast.

Modifié par Genraku, 05 décembre 2009 - 06:11 .

[Hahren]

FedericoV wrote...

Let me understand: I was planning to play a 2H in my second playthrough.

I dont' mind micromanage and such. I do not use tactics at all in my first playthrough.

But do I have to time each attack manually since the attack are slow and if you do not issue the order at the right time I loose my current attack?

Well, I understand that we cannot queue actions with the stamina/mana system but that's too much even for me. That's sound like Titan Quest where at least there wqas just one charachter to manage!

Watch for when your 2h warrior begins winding up his auto attack hit. Then when you see it connect, and that white number leave the target activate a special attack.

I tend to micro manage 2h and spells heavily. A tank I manage very lightly, and if I have a dual wielder they just auto attack.

[Drunkencelt]

2hand takes more levels and points to become effective. Half of the talent treeis a waste and while it is decent at high levels, it will never be better than DW. Hell, sword and board are about even as far as potential damage wise as well.

It is the worst specialization tree in the game.

[Pellegrin]

I say this a lot but there are some good mods out there that fix this problem. Click on the projects tab at the top. Some item rebalance mods change 2 handed swords so that their DPS is on par with what you expect. My mod improves several talents such as critical strike, two handed sweep, and powerful swings.Other mods offer a combination of both.



Yes, out of the box 2 handed weapons suck but it doesn't have to be that way.

[Drunkencelt]

Rainen89 wrote...

Loetek wrote...

Ummm you dont get anymore +attack from Dex than you do Str. There is no reason to put anything into dex unless you want to tank.

2h weapons are almost useless in this game when you see that duelwielding has this niffty talent called Momentum... As if 1 handed weapons where not fast enough as is.

Momentum is nice and all but two handed is hardly left in the dust. With decent weapons Keening and such you would be auto attacking for 50 ish. Rogue backstab not included, it's impossible to outdps this in a pure dps race. Compare to warrior 2h which is auto attacking for 90 at least and using styles for 120+, it's not left in the dust please stop making overgeneralizations. Indomitable has incredible merrit as well. Not being overwhelmed/grabbed/knockedown affected by both physical and spell knockdowns is just huge. Again I'm not saying it's the best uber dpsing class ever, it's just hardly useless. Also duh dex doesn't contribute to damage heck, unless you get a hotfix dex doesn't contribute to the damage of...anything.

A dw rogue stacking str will do two to three times the damage 2hand will with momentum/duelist/haste up. Seriously, this is just from auto attack alone. The only time 2hand could be better are on dragon fights thanks to Indom but you still get knocked backwards, just not down. My rogue auto attacks for 60-90, not 50. You also end up with just as much survivability and stun/cc to continue backstabbing when you draw agro.

A dw warrior without the backstab advantage will still do more damage just from auto attacks alone. Build one right and compare the two side by side. By the time you get 1 swing in, the dw people are already attacking their second kill.

2hand takes too long to get viable, becomes merely decent, and is still the worst specialization tree in game.

[metatrans]

Torias wrote...

Strength and Willpower are the most important for two-handed weapon warriors... by the end you want to spamming special abilities almost nonstop...

i agree completely. 

the autoattack damage of two handed is terrible compared to dual wield warrior and especially compared to a backstabbing rogue. 

the only way to hold your own is by using special abilities. carefully observe sunder arms and sunder armor. notice that they actually hit twice (doesn't say they do in the description, but its a double hit). those are your bread and butter offensive abilities. if you can use those whenever their cooldown is ready you'll do decent damage. Might Blow and Critical Strike are actually not very good. good single hit damage but their wind up time is very long so they end up not being great. 

the only activated mode you should have on is Indomitable. Powerful Swings is garbage. Precise Striking is useable but probably not worth the stamina. 

if you can, try to support your two handed warrior with a Bard specialized Rogue singing Song of Courage. that will dramatically improve their hit rate and crit rate. very worthwhile buff. reason enough to bring Leliana along. 

[The Capital Gaultier]

 I agree.  With that in mind, I made a set of custom weapons to equip as the game progressed.  Very high bonuses to attack, but otherwise the same as similar-tiered weapons.

Probably not the way the developers intended 2-handers to be enjoyed, but it's my experience and I had much more fun this way.

[Faerell Gustani]

I read about an interesting strategy with 2-handers. It works for them because they get Indominable early. Cast Earthquake in the area. Watch EVERYONE cept 2-handers fall on there asses. Proceed to pwn prone people.

[ITSSEXYTIME]

Slimcharles wrote...

All I ever did was miss and die. I swear 2H sucks in this game.

6 hours in and I rerolled a rogue and having a much easier time in general.

Anyone want to share their magical recipe for success as a 2H warrior?

-Raise your "attack" rating by raising Strength/Dex by a fair bit early on (helps to have the CE items)  This prevents misses.

-Raise Willpower so you can spam abilities and sustainables.

[Giygas Starman]

My note for you: That **** who ambush you before landsmeeting? The woman soldier with a God-like super sword? Take her example and kill harder instead.

[SWAvdb]

 carefully observe sunder arms and sunder armor. notice that they actually hit twice (doesn't say they do in the description, but its a double hit). those are your bread and butter offensive abilities. if you can use those whenever their cooldown is ready you'll do decent damage. Might Blow and Critical Strike are actually not very good. good single hit damage but their wind up time is very long so they end up not being great. 

Man, ever since I found out about Sunder Arms & Armor hitting twice, I've been so much more effective with my 2-hander. I started a new game, with a more streamlined build, and at the moment, my party damage-% is 61% on hard (no haste yet!). Pretty reasonable, if you ask me. Note that this is with Alistair, Leliana and Wynne in my party. 

Especially Sunder Arms is great. It can crit on both hits, has a low cooldown, and low activation cost (compared to other 2-hander abilities). I hardly use Mighty Blow anymore - its activationtime is too slow and the damage is mediocre - and I save Critical Strike for mages. 

Of course I realize there are much more effective builds and characters out there. I just find 2-handed fighting the most fun. 

[Gliese]

Faerell Gustani wrote...

I read about an interesting strategy with 2-handers. It works for them because they get Indominable early. Cast Earthquake in the area. Watch EVERYONE cept 2-handers fall on there asses. Proceed to pwn prone people.

Shh, you're reminding people that this game is all about teamwork and not the best-on-its-own build!

[Taritu]

I've run pretty much every spec through the fade now, and the hardest, by far, was the 2hander. Even harder than an archer rogue.

[DragonRageGT]

Taritu wrote...

I've run pretty much every spec through the fade now, and the hardest, by far, was the 2hander. Even harder than an archer rogue.

Sorry to say but it seems you didn't build a good 2h warrior. Fade in Nightmare was sooooo easy with mine.
But i came here just to brag a little... like I said before, I knew this new char was even better than the first. Where you read 172 greatest damage dealt... you'll soon read 277 g.d.d.! Woot! Heavy Hitter! (at level 18 vs 206 g.d.d on previous level 22)

I don't care if Leliana had 390 dmg dealt in my first run (Hard) or if a mage can get even higher than 600 with corpse explosion... wait, that's D2 necro skill... whatever is the name of the mage spell that  does corpse explosion... hehe

I love the fact that my 2 hander can resist most everything that would impair his combat condition while other classes cannot and he does a hell lot of damage too. And he's uninjured in this run while the other finished with 20 injuries. And he's the only one uninjured in the whole possible party combination (and this time it is nightmare.. woot)

So, if you're having a hard time with a 2 handed and think they suck, have a look at my berserker/champion and you might enjoy a good big sword as much as I do, for a future run!

This without mods that change gameplay whatsoever, except camp storage chest, respec and trailer mod for Leliana's armor + head... she's so cute!!!

check him out
http://social.biowar...&game=dragonage

Gladiator!


EDIT:
Double Woot!
How I got the Achievement. Filmed totally by accident. I probably hit F7 key (my fraps binded for recording) while trying to hit the 7 key for a spell... it kept recording =) (I do that a lot... no wonder my 1TB main hard drive is almost full)

Modifié par RageGT, 06 décembre 2009 - 08:53 .

[Sir Ulrich Von Lichenstien]

Great videos RageGT

To quote Fighter from 8-bit theater.

I like swords

Specially big 2Her ones, I don't consider myself a pro when it comes to this game but I am learning how best to implement the various weapon styles and having fun doing so and I've had situations where I've had a 2Her get his butt whooped and situations where they've kicked arse.

Case in point Oghren, first playthrough I didn't bother bringing him into my party until forced too and he annoyed me a bit specially as I'd swapped out Sten whom I hadn't been having much issue with. Second playthrough I decided to ensure he was in the party from as soon as he joined and found him better. By the 3rd playthrough, I ended up having him as one of my main party members (my PC was a dwarf commoner who didn't like topsiders much) and I had him tanking Archdemon in full wades dragonbone armor set with corruption helm (for its lovely +75% spirit res <3 ) with Shale acting as a Buff-bot in stone aura mode. Did Oghren lose the Archdemon's attention? Nope, he kept on kicking his butt without loss of aggro and nicely chipped away at the demon.

The only fight which I seem to have had more of a struggle with as 2H warrior is Loghain. 1st and 3rd playthrough I had my PC in 1st and Oghren in 3rd playthroughs and 2nd was Alastair and I think I did a bit better job of beating Loghain with Alastair than the 2Hs but I think that may just be down to me still learning.

I aspire to create a 2h warrior (either PC, Sten or Oghren) as good as Ser Cauthrien.

Actually I really wish one of the options you have if you spare Loghain is that you can have Ser Cauthrien join the party too.

Regarding the slowness of 2H in comparison to DW and S&B, in some respects of course they are going to be slower. If they were as fast it would be a bit nuts. The character is wielding a big heavy stick (either bladed, with a big blade on the end or big lump of heavy duty pain), not as swift and swooshy as daggers and longswords.

Way I see it, in terms of speed, your looking at DW fastest, S&B second (specially if using a smaller shield) and 2H last. But in terms of butt kicking in one hit... part from heavy shield carrying S&B characters, it surely is going to fall to the 2H to do most damage in 1 hit.

Whilst the DW is there lobbing several fast hits, the 2H is doing one. Whilst DW is making someone look like swiss cheese the 2H is cleaving them in half

Some folk like the former, some like the latter, I don't mind either as long as they get the job done 

[Dragon Age1103]

I haven't played a 2H char yet & I doubt I will simply b/c the animations are just terrible.your char swigs like an upset teenager with a way too heavy sword throwing himself off balance & just looking ridiculous.

[n_Lion]

Yeah, a 2H character needs to focus on STR first. DEX/CON a split between second and third. Your 2H should not be focusing on CON because the 2H should not be tanking at all.

[themaxzero]

Its not that 2hander Warriors are bad (they can do great) its just that everything else is that much better.

[Bakakenny]

Giygas Starman wrote...

My note for you: That **** who ambush you before landsmeeting? The woman soldier with a God-like super sword? Take her example and kill harder instead.

Heh, yea.

Y'know, after she arrested me for saving that idiot princess' life, i decided to have my hero (Faren) go 1 on 1 with her in that fight at Landsmeet.

I crushed her face in.  I think i'm level 18 or 19 right now, full 2H warrior mastery and full Berserker mastery.  I kept up Indomidable, and Berserking, and just layed her low (i did cheat a little however...had Wynn giving me Heroic Offense, Morrigan had Weakness on her, and Allistair had Rally up).  I'd say for a Boss mob though, the minor "ranged backup" was legit.

Her sword is pretty good though (Summer Sword, or something like that).

[RamsenC]

Gliese wrote...

Faerell Gustani wrote...

I read about an interesting strategy with 2-handers. It works for them because they get Indominable early. Cast Earthquake in the area. Watch EVERYONE cept 2-handers fall on there asses. Proceed to pwn prone people.

Shh, you're reminding people that this game is all about teamwork and not the best-on-its-own build!

I've actually been doing this. Oghren and I run two handers while morrigan keeps us hasted and casts earthquake. I also have her using fireball a lot since it does very little damage to my characters and they cannot be knocked down. DW may be better on its own, but in a well put together party 2h is powerful. I also have bard songs running at all times.

[JJM152]

RamsenC wrote...

Gliese wrote...

Faerell Gustani wrote...

I read about an interesting strategy with 2-handers. It works for them because they get Indominable early. Cast Earthquake in the area. Watch EVERYONE cept 2-handers fall on there asses. Proceed to pwn prone people.

Shh, you're reminding people that this game is all about teamwork and not the best-on-its-own build!

I've actually been doing this. Oghren and I run two handers while morrigan keeps us hasted and casts earthquake. I also have her using fireball a lot since it does very little damage to my characters and they cannot be knocked down. DW may be better on its own, but in a well put together party 2h is powerful. I also have bard songs running at all times.

Indomitable + Earth Quake is practically cheating if you ask me

[RamsenC]

On top of that my 2h is a champ/templar so I'm immune to stun/knockdown/magic and have tons of CC.



2h makes the best warrior tank imo and yes on nightmare. You don't need high defense when you are immune to everything, have high armor, and most of the enemies are knocked on their ass the entire time. For the enemies you can't knock down, thats where 2h really shines.

[DragonRageGT]

Bakakenny wrote...

Giygas Starman wrote...

My note for you: That **** who ambush you before landsmeeting? The woman soldier with a God-like super sword? Take her example and kill harder instead.

Heh, yea.

Y'know, after she arrested me for saving that idiot princess' life, i decided to have my hero (Faren) go 1 on 1 with her in that fight at Landsmeet.

I crushed her face in.  I think i'm level 18 or 19 right now, full 2H warrior mastery and full Berserker mastery.  I kept up Indomidable, and Berserking, and just layed her low (i did cheat a little however...had Wynn giving me Heroic Offense, Morrigan had Weakness on her, and Allistair had Rally up).  I'd say for a Boss mob though, the minor "ranged backup" was legit.

Her sword is pretty good though (Summer Sword, or something like that).

Since this is a spoiler forum... spoiler ahead...

Ser Cathrien has 2 very different version in the game. The one we fight after rescuing Anora is one of the thoughest fights in the game and she is not really supposed to be beaten then. Of course devs didn't gave her God Mode so if you take her away from her soldiers she can be beaten indeed. But it is still very hard and might require a few reloads. She would hit my first char, Hard diff, for all his 330 HP and that's a 1 hit kill!

After a few tries I got her good and I won the Summer Sword as can be seen here . Now, right before the Landsmeet we face her again (don't know if all but I certainly did). She's alive and kicking and with the very same sword... dupper biatch! But she's soooo much weaker than her first version and I was prepared to face that first Cathrien I had met. I was disappointed with her. And I got a second Summer Sword!

The Summer Sword and Yusaris were the very best Greatswords in the game, before DLC introduced Starfang. And I had no DLC at the time of my first run, waiting for my pre-ordered CE to be released where I live. Anyway, my nightmare run with the same char has been a lot easier than my first one in Hard.

I'm seriously considering not using any of the dlc items for my next run to see if NM gets harder or start it in Hard, cuz I feel that something in NM is bugged and making it easier than hard difficulty. But first I'll get my zero injury achievement in Nightmare with my hero! =)

[Faerell Gustani]

Gliese wrote...

Faerell Gustani wrote...

I read about an interesting strategy with 2-handers. It works for them because they get Indominable early. Cast Earthquake in the area. Watch EVERYONE cept 2-handers fall on there asses. Proceed to pwn prone people.

Shh, you're reminding people that this game is all about teamwork and not the best-on-its-own build!

lol, individually the 2-handers are weaker.  It does seem kind of lame that they're only truly worthwhile when coupled with a mage.  If anything, this just speaks of a synergy between Mage an 2-Hander.

This talk of power though reminds me of Order of the Stick and what Xykon says about power:
http://www.giantitp....s/oots0657.html

For those of you who don't read.  A Wizard just tried to take on a Lich in a spell battle and lost.  The Wizard cast invisibility on himself while the Lich goes on a monologue on what is power.
Talking about how he used to think that Spells equaled power.  But really, power equals power.  Power is situational.  The type of power doesn't necessarily matter assuming it's significant power, and that currently power takes form in a bonus to perception checks...as he catches the invisible wizard in a grapple.

The Moral of the story?  A big number of whatever is not enough if the other guy has a big number of the same amount...then has additional abilities on top of it.

You can take this many ways when you bring this analogy to Dragon Age.  You can take it to mean that it doesn't matter what you play, you just got to play to your strengths.
Or you can take it to mean that Mages are indeed OP and it does matter as they can achieve higher numbers in just about any respect (damage, armor, defense, and CC)...so it's not possible to have "big numbers of the same amount" and then some.

Mages in DA:O lack 2 things that would make warriors and rogues completely obsolete:
Immunities and Lockpicking.
Immunity to stun/knockdown abilities that only Warriors get.
Lockpicking can be argued to be worthless or not worthwhile for the items you get.

Those are the only two unique features that mages lack in this game.  Anything using a Warrior or a Rogue must capitalize on these features.

Modifié par Faerell Gustani, 07 décembre 2009 - 02:35 .

[Rainen89]

Sigh they're not alright? Get the chasind great maul from gorim, knight commander armor from Faryn. Spellward from Bodahn and then you've got yourself arguably a powerful fighter. With 70-80 strength (reachable at max 21-22ish just stack strength, nothing else.) You will be auto attacking on nightmare for 80-90 + with a decent attack swing coupled with sunder armor and sunder arms (attacks that once your strength is high enough to ensure adequate hit) you will be hitting for 180-200 I repeat, it is not gimped get a @#*@#ng maul and stop posting that it is. It's not arcane warrior godness but it's not gimped.