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[TEWR]

I'm debating on whether or not to give my thoughts on the whole perspective/privilege/etc. schtick.

Not out of a fear of offending anyone, but more out of a fear of posting a rant that might at best only be tangentially related to this thread.

And I go off on waaaaayyy too many tangents as is.

Modifié par The Ethereal Writer Redux, 02 décembre 2012 - 06:08 .

[HiroVoid]

I'm debating on whether or not to give my thoughts on the whole perspective/privilege/etc. schtick.

Not
out of a fear of offending anyone, but more out of a fear of posting a
rant that might at best only be tangentially related to this thread.

And I go off on waaaaayyy too many tangents as is.

DO IT. It's not that off-topic if it's only one post. It only goes off-topic if you have a bunch of people go pages on end talking about it....(Plus, it's probably going to go that direction at some point anyway.)

Modifié par HiroVoid, 02 décembre 2012 - 06:14 .

[Fishy]

d4eaming . Just saying that after reading you ... The vibe that I got from your wall of text was patronizing.

[HiroVoid]

StreetMagic wrote...

I'm not afraid, being a man, and yet still saying I loathe my own gender every so often. haha.. I don't defend "manhood" on principal or anything. Mostly loathe the juvenile and aggressive aspects of my own gender. It doesn't have much to do with games. It could be at a party, and I could get bored with the idiots I'm there with. I might find better company talking to their GRANDMOTHERS than them. The fact that I'm a man and can think this though also means there are men like me too. So in the end, gender doesn't matter much. It's more about weeding out stupidity - something anyone, man and woman, is capable of. I wouldn't hang out with those idiots' girlfriends either probably. Half of the time, they're just as vapid.

Or maybe I'm just better off being by myself in a corner. I'm just a hater. lol. I'll stop now.

Well, it depends what you define juvenile is.  Sometimes what people find juvenile is just simply plain old fun for other people such as how people find the whole 'Gangnam' thing juvenile.  There are many times I find certain types of humor to be juvenile, but I think that's less because it's juvenile and more that I don't have much of a sense of humor.

[Fishy]

HiroVoid wrote...

StreetMagic wrote...

I'm not afraid, being a man, and yet still saying I loathe my own gender every so often. haha.. I don't defend "manhood" on principal or anything. Mostly loathe the juvenile and aggressive aspects of my own gender. It doesn't have much to do with games. It could be at a party, and I could get bored with the idiots I'm there with. I might find better company talking to their GRANDMOTHERS than them. The fact that I'm a man and can think this though also means there are men like me too. So in the end, gender doesn't matter much. It's more about weeding out stupidity - something anyone, man and woman, is capable of. I wouldn't hang out with those idiots' girlfriends either probably. Half of the time, they're just as vapid.

Or maybe I'm just better off being by myself in a corner. I'm just a hater. lol. I'll stop now.

Well, it depends what you define juvenile is.  Sometimes what people find juvenile is just simply plain old fun for other people such as how people find the whole 'Gangnam' thing juvenile.  There are many times I find certain types of humor to be juvenile, but I think that's less because it's juvenile and more that I don't have much of a sense of humor.

Hmm .. Some people either just loose their sense of humor .. or being stuck up or just need to loosen up. Most of the time it's just a defense mechanism stealthing their insecurity flaw.

Modifié par Suprez30, 02 décembre 2012 - 06:28 .

[HiroVoid]

StreetMagic wrote...

HiroVoid wrote...

Well, it depends what you define juvenile is.  Sometimes what people find juvenile is just simply plain old fun for other people such as how people find the whole 'Gangnam' thing juvenile.  There are many times I find certain types of humor to be juvenile, but I think that's less because it's juvenile and more that I don't have much of a sense of humor.

I think I have a sense of humor, but I guess it's more about subtle, absurd things that don't require a social outlet (as for Gangam, I don't even like to dance, so I'm doubly removed from that). Half of the time I wouldn't know how to convey that humor, unless it was a close friend and we have a sort of "inside joke" about it.

See, I think that'st generally considered to be the elitist 'That's not funny' guy it seems because of not finding fart jokes aren't funny.  While I generally having a hard time getting most humor in general, I still acknowledge there are people that find it funny and can have an enjoyable time of it even while my eyes are rolling.  I personally ackowledge it's probably because I have a hard time with social situations.

Modifié par HiroVoid, 02 décembre 2012 - 06:29 .

[d4eaming]

Suprez30 wrote...

d4eaming . Just saying that after reading you ... The vibe that I got from your wall of text was patronizing.

Not surprising considering how many people completely deny the very existance of a different viewpoint.

[Fishy]

d4eaming wrote...

Suprez30 wrote...

d4eaming . Just saying that after reading you ... The vibe that I got from your wall of text was patronizing.

Not surprising considering how many people completely deny the very existance of a different viewpoint.

Has nothing to do with the viewpoint. It's all about the attitude. Although it's hard to tell on the internet.

[HiroVoid]

Eh. I don't really mean to say it's a bad thing, but.....yeah. It's hard for me to put in words. Basically, different people can find different jokes funny.

[HiroVoid]

Suprez30 wrote...

d4eaming wrote...

Suprez30 wrote...

d4eaming . Just saying that after reading you ... The vibe that I got from your wall of text was patronizing.

Not surprising considering how many people completely deny the very existance of a different viewpoint.

Has nothing to do with the viewpoint. It's all about the attitude. Although it's hard to tell on the internet.

I don't think she was trying to come off as having an agressive attitude.  She was simply noting that females DO have different viewpoints as a result of being raised differently as a result of gender difference.

The last statement is probably an add-on from the earlier discussion and a result of frustration.

[TEWR]

HiroVoid wrote...

DO IT. It's not that off-topic if it's only one post. It only goes off-topic if you have a bunch of people go pages on end talking about it....(Plus, it's probably going to go that direction at some point anyway.)

Okay, here goes. Reposting what I said in a PM a few minutes ago.

 Bear in mind I'm not trying to say David Gaider or anyone else have said some things I might imply/say. I'm just speaking aloud on my personal thoughts on the matter and hopefully not offending anyone with what my exhausted brain is churning out. Poor phrasing might arise, so apologies in advance to anyone just incase:

I find that perspective is all well and good, but it shouldn't be the overriding factor in why a person is hired. As in, they shouldn't be hired just because they're female/homosexual/lesbian/minority/whatever while ignoring all other credentials. That would seem to be too far along the lines of trying to be... politically correct I guess. If a company is predominantly consisting of male writers but is still churning out good works that don't offend anyone, I see no problem.

That isn't to say they wouldn't *benefit* from some added perspective -- they certainly would, at times -- but I don't think a big deal should be made about it.

Perspective's a great thing. It can indeed help you see a few things you might not have seen before.

Frankly, if two writers -- one male, one female -- came to me for a job as a writer for a VG company and the guy was a great writer and the woman only a good writer. And let's go objectively so, as opposed to their writing being subjective. Then I'd probably hire the woman first.

Because while the guy may be the better writer in terms of his published works, the woman's perspective as a woman sort of brings her writing to a higher threshold for future projects, or one would hope anyway. Obviously, it'd all depend on what's being worked on, who's doing what, and if indeed perspective is brought up.

So it'd be a secondary thing. More of a perk really for the company, but certainly the perspective the woman has is a good thing.

I'll be honest in that I don't know everything about people of different genders, orientations, or even ethnicities. What I do know is basically that of a male person.

I don't include my skin color because, with the little bit of Native American blood I do have, I can indeed identify the troubles Native Americans have faced. It may not be much, but I take it seriously.

That said, I don't know what would be best around homosexuals/lesbians/minorities. I mean, I know gay people, I'm friends with people in minorities, and I have some friends that are girls so I can kinda understand what to do or not do, but still.

I think particularly on some level I can understand the latter two more, the minority one because my dad had more experience dealing with friends in minorities then I did. Not that he was in a minority, but that he was very heavily involved with how a minority was treated.

Well, maybe to an extent he was the minority in the particular scenario. It was during some riots by the African-American community in Wilmington back when he was a kid. People were being killed by them and homes were being burned by them.

My grandmother, my dad, and the house they were in was only spared because my dad was good friends with an African-American kid in the neighborhood -- and still is, to this day.

Hell, I don't even know how best to act around some of my female friends at times.

Case in point: one of my best friends is a girl who, suffice to say, had a traumatic experience. Before I even knew about that, I was cracking jokes about traumatic experiences like that. Not in a cruel, malicious, obviously bastard-like way. It was more of a playful way.

And she laughed. She even made the same types of jokes -- playful regarding traumatic experiences like that. Not like her own -- she wasn't the one who told me -- but just in general.

And even though she laughed, made jokes about the subject, and continued to do so... I still really didn't like how I made those jokes at that time because part of me just couldn't help feeling like I was being a douchebag -- whether I was or not.

Later on though... well... she kept making them when we hung out on our own and I kept making them because I realized all was good -- though I wouldn't dare repeat that with just any girl. Still, it just goes to show how you want to be careful about what you say/do lest it hurt/offend someone -- whether it in the end does so or not being... not irrelevant, but something else I guess?

I think those are more or less my thoughts on the whole thing.

Added a few additions/edits as well. Ultimately, I think in the last thread that approached this topic both ReconTeam and Upsettingshorts had valid points.

Even if I'm sitting on the fences a bit for that.

Modifié par The Ethereal Writer Redux, 02 décembre 2012 - 06:54 .

[Fishy]

HiroVoid wrote...

Suprez30 wrote...

d4eaming wrote...

Suprez30 wrote...

d4eaming . Just saying that after reading you ... The vibe that I got from your wall of text was patronizing.

Not surprising considering how many people completely deny the very existance of a different viewpoint.

Has nothing to do with the viewpoint. It's all about the attitude. Although it's hard to tell on the internet.

I don't think she was trying to come off as having an agressive attitude.  She was simply noting that females DO have different viewpoints as a result of being raised differently as a result of gender difference.

The last statement is probably an add-on from the earlier discussion and a result of frustration.

Like I said .. It's difficult to tell on the internet. Like right now .. If you would see my face. You would notice that I am laughing and relaxed. I'm sure you can't see it on your monitor. What I mean is .. I never said it with the intent of provocating d4eaming. I just said what someone could make up of her text. Internet is a sensitive person you know.

Internet is made of fast conclusion.

Modifié par Suprez30, 02 décembre 2012 - 06:53 .

[HiroVoid]

Suprez30 wrote...

HiroVoid wrote...

Suprez30 wrote...

d4eaming wrote...

Suprez30 wrote...

d4eaming . Just saying that after reading you ... The vibe that I got from your wall of text was patronizing.

Not surprising considering how many people completely deny the very existance of a different viewpoint.

Has nothing to do with the viewpoint. It's all about the attitude. Although it's hard to tell on the internet.

I don't think she was trying to come off as having an agressive attitude.  She was simply noting that females DO have different viewpoints as a result of being raised differently as a result of gender difference.

The last statement is probably an add-on from the earlier discussion and a result of frustration.

Like I said .. It's difficult to tell on the internet. Like right now .. If you would see my face. You would notice that I am laughing and relaxed. I'm sure you can't see it on your monitor. What I mean is .. I never said it with the intent of provocating d4eaming. I just said what someone could make up of her text. Internet is a sensitive person you know.

Internet is made of fast conclusion.

Obviously, we need a mood rating to go along with every post.

[KiwiQuiche]

Personally I don't care.
They aren't writing it using their genitals, so what does it matter what gender they are? As long as they write a good story, I'm good.

[HiroVoid]

KiwiQuiche wrote...
They aren't writing it using their genitals, so what does it matter what gender they are? As long as they write a good story, I'm good.

This just gave me an excellent idea to test how well I can type with......uh....nevermind.

[Fredward]

There is absolutely NO WAY this thread is going to go somewhere bad.

[d4eaming]

HiroVoid wrote...

The last statement is probably an add-on from the earlier discussion and a result of frustration.

Considering the contents of the locked post and some of the absolutely infuriating statements made inside it, and how certain people took it upon themselves to deliberately antagonize the people trying to point out that perspectives differ due to the dreaded privilige issue... yeah. I was pretty well disgusted by what I read. So when someone comes along and says it's patronizing when trying to explain how a female's very existance and frame of reference is totally foreign to the priviliged sector of society, it comes across as a method of trying to shut down the poster. I saw enough in that thread to remind me that the notion of privilige and how it effects perception is pretty foreign. People that go out of their way to mock it need a clue by four.

My other point was that it can be sexism to portray women as the more "pure" or "perfect" gender. It's just as sexist to say women are delicate flowers as it is to say they are naturally superior at empathy or something.

Hell, it's too damn late and now I'm even losing my train of thought and even I think I sound dumb now. Time for bed I think.

[KiwiQuiche]

HiroVoid wrote...

KiwiQuiche wrote...
They aren't writing it using their genitals, so what does it matter what gender they are? As long as they write a good story, I'm good.

This just gave me an excellent idea to test how well I can type with......uh....nevermind.

Think of the children!

[HiroVoid]

d4eaming wrote...
My other point was that it can be sexism to portray women as the more "pure" or "perfect" gender. It's just as sexist to say women are delicate flowers as it is to say they are naturally superior at empathy or something.

Hell, it's too damn late and now I'm even losing my train of thought and even I think I sound dumb now. Time for bed I think.

I can certainly understand the point such as cleaing commercials that portray men as stupid and women as the ultimate home cleaners.

As for the last point, get some rest.  Sleepiness is the enemy of us all, and I still dislike recounting my experience of having to stay up all night working on a school project and my day afterwards.

[d4eaming]

HiroVoid wrote...

d4eaming wrote...
My other point was that it can be sexism to portray women as the more "pure" or "perfect" gender. It's just as sexist to say women are delicate flowers as it is to say they are naturally superior at empathy or something.

Hell, it's too damn late and now I'm even losing my train of thought and even I think I sound dumb now. Time for bed I think.

I can certainly understand the point such as cleaing commercials that portray men as stupid and women as the ultimate home cleaners.

As for the last point, get some rest.  Sleepiness is the enemy of us all, and I still dislike recounting my experience of having to stay up all night working on a school project and my day afterwards.

I blame my coworker calling out and then me agreeing to do a split shift x_x Why can't I say noooooo I don't wanna. But I like my job even if it makes me want to hurl fish tanks sometimes. And then it takes OMGHOURS to wind down and sleep even though I have to work in the morning and I end up arguing on the internets and growling at my computer screen.

Okay, not growling as that would be entirely unfabulous of me, but at least scowling severely and gesticulating angrily.

[TEWR]

HiroVoid wrote...

Obviously, we need a mood rating to go along with every post.

I'd abuse the hell outta that, always making posts in an angry mode whether I am or not.