82 réponses à ce sujet

[Todd23]

 Why is blood magic reduced to a simple specialization, it's supposed to offer immense power and had allot of steak in the story. How about we make it a check mark? You can have your mage specialization, and if you're a blood mage it adds extra traits to your specialization, character, and story.

[Naughty Bear]

I'd presume for in-universe reasons, you need to be powerful to wield it.

Then again say hello to Jowen so there goes my theory.

Modifié par Naughty Bear, 04 décembre 2012 - 12:12 .

[esper]

Because it is a specalization.
Blood magic is using your blood instead of the connection to the fade. All the other parts (such as demon, mind control an vice verca) has to be learned as well.

[Auintus]

They are hoping to provide extra story relevance to all specializations.
Let's hope they can do it well.

[xsdob]

I miss jowen, he was the only bloodmage besides merril to not be an evil bloodmage. What happened to him anyway?

[hexaligned]

You have to make some allowances my man, they can't have a drastically different story just for one specialization, that "most" people won't even see, especially not with the decision to go full VO.
I'm not saying it couldn't use some work, some companion banter/arguments over it would help. I also liked the specialization side quests from DAO, they should bring those back. It doesn't have to be much, the AW and Reaver for example were very resource light, but still helped to add some backstory and meat (story wise), to the specs themselves. .

Modifié par relhart, 04 décembre 2012 - 12:29 .

[Drakar123]

You don't really have to be all that powerful to use blood magic.Any mage could use it.It's a quick way to get power which is why Jowan turned to it.He wanted to surpass the mage warden.

I do however believe it should play a bigger role in the story.With how powerful mind control is and all the precausions the chantry takes to make sure blood mages don't take over a kingdom you never really see them try anything like that.

For some reason they prefer to summon demons and become crazy abominations.Really most apostates could just mind control the nearest noble into letting them freeload while being completely safe from the templars.It's a wonder none of them thought of doing that.It sure beats running from the templars and hiding all the time.

Given how easy it is for blood mages to mind control kings and such I am really surprised there is not a single case of such a thing happening...

[Herr Uhl]

xsdob wrote...

I miss jowen, he was the only bloodmage besides merril to not be an evil bloodmage. What happened to him anyway?

Depends. He ends up in the prison cell in Redcliffe. From there he can be executed, tranquilized or run away and take up the alias "Levyn".

[xsdob]

Drakar123 wrote...

You don't really have to be all that powerful to use blood magic.Any mage could use it.It's a quick way to get power which is why Jowan turned to it.He wanted to surpass the mage warden.

I do however believe it should play a bigger role in the story.With how powerful mind control is and all the precausions the chantry takes to make sure blood mages don't take over a kingdom you never really see them try anything like that.

For some reason they prefer to summon demons and become crazy abominations.Really most apostates could just mind control the nearest noble into letting them freeload while being completely safe from the templars.It's a wonder none of them thought of doing that.It sure beats running from the templars and hiding all the time.

Given how easy it is for blood mages to mind control kings and such I am really surprised there is not a single case of such a thing happening...

I think that's mostly due to the demon telling them to do that. Sort of like the dark side of the force or indoctrination. You just slowly stop acting like you would and start just doing what the demon tells you to do.

[sully.nathan]

Why not Bioware make Blood magic like they did with Dragon age origins but also with more offensive spells, and a 20% damage boost to all non-blood magic spells. But they should also counter like depending on how many times you use blood magic you have a higher chance of a demon or spirit attacking you in battle, and the more you use it it goes from being a rage demon attacking you randomly in a battle to a Pride demon attacking you in battle. What if you can tell people you are a blood mage ( or use blood mage in a town) will they automatically attack you or flee and report you to templars.

[hexaligned]

As it is, the way to "fix" blood magic mechanically is to get rid of potions. It's main feature is to give you another resource mechanic, but when you can just drink pots it becomes almost pointless, other than for flavor.

Modifié par relhart, 04 décembre 2012 - 01:09 .

[Drakar123]

Demons don't just randomly appear when you use blood magic.It is the only form of magic rooted in the physical world and has nothing to do with the fade.It doesn't really have anything to do with demons and is the safest form of magic to use if you don't want to get possessed.You are far less likely to attract the attention of a demon if you use only blood magic then if you use regular magic.

Most blood mages we've seen use it to summon demons but that is because they were circle mages and demons were the only place where they could learn blood magic from.They didn't have to summon them of course or have any dealings with them once the magic was learned but most blood mages we've seen so far are completely insane and devoid of any logic...

[Maria Caliban]

Drakar123 wrote...

Demons don't just randomly appear when you use blood magic.It is the only form of magic rooted in the physical world and has nothing to do with the fade.It doesn't really have anything to do with demons and is the safest form of magic to use if you don't want to get possessed.You are far less likely to attract the attention of a demon if you use only blood magic then if you use regular magic.

May I ask for your source?

[Auintus]

Maria Caliban wrote...

Drakar123 wrote...

Demons don't just randomly appear when you use blood magic.It is the only form of magic rooted in the physical world and has nothing to do with the fade.It doesn't really have anything to do with demons and is the safest form of magic to use if you don't want to get possessed.You are far less likely to attract the attention of a demon if you use only blood magic then if you use regular magic.

May I ask for your source?

Source. "Tied to the physical, not favors to spirits or demons,"
I would like to note that the page on blood magic itself states that blood magic is rare enough that it can usually only be learned from demons.

[Solmanian]

Anything that adds more importence to one specialization, immediatly diminishes if not trivialize the other speccs. How do you suggest to compensate for it? give extra dialogues to berseeker when meeting dwarves? Reavers called abominations and hunted by templars?

Making one spec a snowfalke is against every instinct a game developer has. That being said, Bioware officials did say that specialezations will be more importent in DA3. That may imply you'll only get to pick one instead of two. Very likely that will see something along the lines of the advanced classes in SWOTOR.

[Solmanian]

relhart wrote...

As it is the way to "fix" blood magic mechanically is to get rid of potions. It's main feature is to give you another resource mechanic, but when you can just drink pots it becomes almost pointless, other than for flavor.

In DA2 you had a very strict (and too harsh for my taste) limitation on how often you could use potions. I think 5min. It allways looks like forever when you need them...

[thats1evildude]

Auintus wrote...

Maria Caliban wrote...

Drakar123 wrote...

Demons don't just randomly appear when you use blood magic.It is the only form of magic rooted in the physical world and has nothing to do with the fade.It doesn't really have anything to do with demons and is the safest form of magic to use if you don't want to get possessed.You are far less likely to attract the attention of a demon if you use only blood magic then if you use regular magic.

May I ask for your source?

Source. "Tied to the physical, not favors to spirits or demons,"
I would like to note that the page on blood magic itself states that blood magic is rare enough that it can usually only be learned from demons.

I'm not sure where people get the idea that using magic — blood or otherwise — attracts demons. Mages can be possessed by demons even if they haven't cast a spell in years, or if they never cast a spell. Mages are conduits to the Fade by virtue of who they are, not what they do.

I also think that people take that "tied to the physical" line too literally. Yes, it's "tied to the physical" in the sense that a blood mage can use his own life force or that of another person to work magic and doesn't need to summon spirits and the like to use certain spells.

We know that demons can teach blood magic, and it's been strongly hinted that blood magic originated with demons. That doesn't mean that, if every mage practiced blood magic, no one would have to worry about demons again.

If you have evidence pointing otherwise, prove me wrong.

Modifié par thats1evildude, 04 décembre 2012 - 01:19 .

[Solmanian]

"normal" people have been showen to be turned into abomination aswell. Anyone connected to the fade (which is every one except dwarves), can become an abomination. All they need is to agree to let the deamon in. Mages and the fade and deamons are more like fireman and fire: Fireman are more likely to be burned than the average man on the street, but they are more likely to know what to do in case of a fire. I allways figured that the fade is alot like the warp in WH40K. Normal man only interact with the fade in a passive way while they sleep, while mages are more active.

[Drakar123]

Magic in general doesn't attract demons.Power does.Blood Magic doesn't draw it's power from the fade which is why if you stick to only using it demons will have a harder time noticing you.It's why they don't usually possess nobles despite them being a better target then a circle mage.They know about mages because they are awake in the fade and have power there.They don't notice other people.

Blood Magic comes from a completely seperate source then regular magic.It might even be possible for non mages to use blood magic assuming they are given training.Being a reaver is a form of blood magic technically.And blood magic is far more likely to come from the old gods like the magisters claim.Dragons have a wierd conection to blood magic what with their blood giving you special abilities and them being the ''blood of the world'' in the words of Yavena.It's also more powerful then regular blood.While demons do teach people blood magic it is a form of magic that has nothing to do with the fade which is why it it highly unlikely they invented it.

[thats1evildude]

Solmanian wrote...

"normal" people have been showen to be turned into abomination aswell. Anyone connected to the fade (which is every one except dwarves), can become an abomination.

No, that is not the case. The only time non-mages can become abominations is through exceptional circumstances  — a blood mage implanting a demon inside a mundane host, for example, or in areas where the Fade is so weak that demons can slip through. Only mages are susceptible to being possessed at any time.

Modifié par thats1evildude, 04 décembre 2012 - 01:54 .

[PsychoBlonde]

xsdob wrote...

I miss jowen, he was the only bloodmage besides merril to not be an evil bloodmage. What happened to him anyway?

Erm, I'd say lying to your girlfriend and then poisoning a man after which your proposed solution involves killing the man's wife qualifies as being pretty evil.  Jowan was more the "are you seriously that stupid?" kind of evil rather than the "MWAHAHAHAHAH!!!" kind of, say, Uldred.

Also, Ketojan didn't strike me as particularly evil, but he did have that blood magic amulet on him . . .

[ImperatorMortis]

PsychoBlonde wrote...

xsdob wrote...

I miss jowen, he was the only bloodmage besides merril to not be an evil bloodmage. What happened to him anyway?

Erm, I'd say lying to your girlfriend and then poisoning a man after which your proposed solution involves killing the man's wife qualifies as being pretty evil.  Jowan was more the "are you seriously that stupid?" kind of evil rather than the "MWAHAHAHAHAH!!!" kind of, say, Uldred.

Also, Ketojan didn't strike me as particularly evil, but he did have that blood magic amulet on him . . .

Jowan was not evil. All the things he did was for good intentions. None of his actions were malicious. 

Jowan is actually a good person. He's just made mistakes, live everyone else. 

Modifié par ImperatorMortis, 04 décembre 2012 - 10:19 .

[Fox In The Box]

ImperatorMortis wrote...


Jowan was not evil. All the things he did was for good intentions. None of his actions were malicious. 

Jowan is actually a good person. He's just made mistakes, live everyone else. 

If there is any gif that accurately describes Jowan as a character, it's this one:



As for the topic, I'm halfways starting to think that it shouldn't be implemented as a specialization at all, if the developers don't have the will/resources to implement it well. And I'm not just talking about the power, either - blood magic is so important and so controversial in the DA-universe that a blood magic-using PC should provoke strong reactions from their surroundings. It was so jarring for me to play an blood mage and not getting any mentions of it - even being praised to the heavens by characters like Anders who spends half the game hissing at Merrill for her naughty habits - that I had to change specialization to Force mage.

Modifié par Fox In The Box, 04 décembre 2012 - 02:55 .

[nightscrawl]

Yeah, let's just screw over anyone who doesn't want to play a mage by making one spec of one class have all sorts of meaning and importance.

My main class IS mage btw.

Modifié par nightscrawl, 04 décembre 2012 - 04:22 .

[Fox In The Box]

nightscrawl wrote...

Yeah, let's just screw over anyone who doesn't want to play a mage by making one spec of one class have all sorts of meaning and importance.

My main class IS mage btw.

It wouldn't screw anyone over anymore than having the queen ending restricted to Human Female Nobles screws over people who'd rather dig out their own eyeballs with a rusty spoon than play human. Lore-wise, non-humans can't be royalty (among humans). Lore-wise, blood mages are almost considered the evil incarnate and I don't think it's unreasonable to ask for there to be consequences in-game for people who choose to play as blood mages. Such a feature was almost implemented in Dragon Age:Origins, where Wynne and the templars turn against a blood mage Warden, unless he or she manages to pass a Persuade check. I think it was removed because it made the game unfinishable? I don't rightly remember.

Though, I should retract my previous statement about having it removed as a specialization - a lot of people do enjoy hosing blood all over the battlefield. Wouldn't want to kill their buzz.

Modifié par Fox In The Box, 04 décembre 2012 - 05:07 .