611 réponses à ce sujet

[Uh Cold]

Feneckus wrote...

RB26D3TT wrote...

Jesus Christ, why are you kids so cranky? Why the f would you post this crap on forums? Don't like the GI? DON'T PLAY WITH IT. Don't like one on the team? KICK HIM. All this theoretical forum crap is just so annoying. This is JUST A GAME, enjoy it and don't ruin fun for others.

Ironic considering an infiltrator did ruin the Havoc Soldier.

People are stupid and miss the point entirely, thus BSN in a nutshell.

[Pedro Costa]

SpockLives wrote...

My Tactical Cloak Fix:

#1 End the shortened cooldown for breaking cloak early. You get the full cooldown regardless of how long you were cloaked. Now infiltrators care about weight.  Maybe have grenades and stim packs end cloak, as well.

#2 Block all power use during cloak without picking the rank 6 evolution. Want to cast powers while cloaked? Do it like Adrenaline Rush and pick that evolution. (The Huntress might need an exception.)

#3 Remove power damage bonus from Tactical Cloak. (Huntress will need an exception.) Infiltrators are supposed to be a "shooty" class. Don't make their powers better, too.

Now you may balance the game because Infiltrators cannot do everything better than everyone else.

Pretty much this.

[RB26D3TT]

After reading lots of comments I came to a conclusion. The guys that hate Infiltrators just suck with them and hate the fact that others make good use of them. THAT SIMPLE.
Also why would you hate your teammates so much? Even if they had an edge. This is a team game not PvP.

Modifié par RB26D3TT, 05 décembre 2012 - 03:38 .

[RB26D3TT]

Uh Cold wrote...

Feneckus wrote...

RB26D3TT wrote...

Jesus Christ, why are you kids so cranky? Why the f would you post this crap on forums? Don't like the GI? DON'T PLAY WITH IT. Don't like one on the team? KICK HIM. All this theoretical forum crap is just so annoying. This is JUST A GAME, enjoy it and don't ruin fun for others.

Ironic considering an infiltrator did ruin the Havoc Soldier.

People are stupid and miss the point entirely, thus BSN in a nutshell.

Exactly. Forums should be for sharing experince and interesting ideas. Not whining.

[Dark Tlaloc]

So we've been hearing for weeks about how overpowered the TGI was, and that stimpacks needed a nerf, so they get a nerf. Now ALL infiltrators are too powerful, and people are begging for ALL of them to be nerfed. What will be next? The destroyer? Adepts? Where does it end? Why is everyone always crying for kits to be nerfed? This isn't a competitive game, and if you don't like a class because it's overpowered, simply avoid it. What ACTUALLY needs to be done, is that a few underpowered classes/weapons need buffs, so that everyone will feel like they're on a relatively (skill notwithstanding) even playing field.

[Trontor]

Feneckus wrote...

ME3 would have been a much better game without Infiltrators. 

No, but Tactical Cloak should work differently:

• It shouldn't provide ridiculous damage bonuses.
• It should make your properly undetectable unless you do something stupid like bumping into an enemy.

At the moment it is mostly useful as a damage booster and gets used mostly as that.

But there are lot of other things which are wrong with the combat system e.g. the broken weight system (at least in multiplayer) or the overpowered shotguns (which in particular includes your beloved Reegar Carbine).

Powers and weapons felt much more ballanced in Mass Effect 2 to me.

[CNevarezN]

RB26D3TT wrote...

After reading lots of comments I came to a conclusion. The guys that hate Infiltrators just suck with them and hate the fact that others make good use of them. THAT SIMPLE.

Nobody sucks while rockin an Infiltrator class. OP is just pointing out that half of the nerfs they dished was Infiltrator related. Wanted to point that out to you, slugger.

[Dark Tlaloc]

JustAnotherVanguard wrote...

Feneckus wrote...

ME3 would have been a much better game without Infiltrators. 

No, but Tactical Cloak should work differently:

• It shouldn't provide ridiculous damage bonuses.
• It should make your properly undetectable unless you do something stupid like bumping into an enemy.

At the moment it is mostly useful as a damage booster and gets used mostly as that.

But there are lot of other things which are wrong with the combat system e.g. the broken weight system (at least in multiplayer) or the overpowered shotguns (which in particular includes your beloved Reegar Carbine).

Powers and weapons felt much more ballanced in Mass Effect 2 to me.

If cloak made you properly undetectable, I'd be okay with the damage bonus being drastically reduced. Essentially Bioware would have to write into the code for TC that when you cloak, you are at all times prioritized below all other targets, unless you as you said bump into an enemy, at which case they're made mildly aware of you. I doubt they'll let this happen though (for what I would imagine are game balance reasons), so I figure the damage-oriented infiltrator is here to stay.

[snarf001]

I like infiltrators, they are an asset to the team. Only time when Im not over the moon is when there are 3 of them in the group. Spawning enemies gets messed up and then they all cloak leaving you in the middle of a clusterf8ck, all match long.

[Feneckus]

RB26D3TT wrote...

After reading lots of comments I came to a conclusion. The guys that hate Infiltrators just suck with them and hate the fact that others make good use of them. THAT SIMPLE.

I was part of a team that did a 10 min Gold speed run without rockets. I guess I suck with infiltrators ?

Dark Tlaloc wrote...

So we've been hearing for weeks about how overpowered the TGI was, and that stimpacks needed a nerf, so they get a nerf. Now ALL infiltrators are too powerful, and people are begging for ALL of them to be nerfed. What will be next? The destroyer? Adepts? Where does it end? Why is everyone always crying for kits to be nerfed? This isn't a competitive game, and if you don't like a class because it's overpowered, simply avoid it. What ACTUALLY needs to be done, is that a few underpowered classes/weapons need buffs, so that everyone will feel like they're on a relatively (skill notwithstanding) even playing field.

I don't really want infiltrators to be nerfed. I don't really care to be honest.  Nerfing them wouldn't solve anything.

What I do care about however is how they've been ruining the game. They were badly designed to begin with.

[Uh Cold]

CNevarezN wrote...

Nobody sucks while rockin an Infiltrator class

mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm gonna have to disagree, I've seen it all.

[RB26D3TT]

CNevarezN wrote...

RB26D3TT wrote...

After reading lots of comments I came to a conclusion. The guys that hate Infiltrators just suck with them and hate the fact that others make good use of them. THAT SIMPLE.

Nobody sucks while rockin an Infiltrator class. OP is just pointing out that half of the nerfs they dished was Infiltrator related. Wanted to point that out to you, slugger.

Oh really? If this was true then instead of whining you would be playing with Infiltrators right now, wouldn't you?

[RB26D3TT]

[quote]Feneckus wrote...

[quote]RB26D3TT wrote...

After reading lots of comments I came to a conclusion. The guys that hate Infiltrators just suck with them and hate the fact that others make good use of them. THAT SIMPLE.[/quote]

I was part of a team that did a 10 min Gold speed run without rockets. I guess I suck with infiltrators ?
[/quote]
[/quote]
Any proof? Would really like to see this.

[Uh Cold]

The concept of variety does not seem to exist to a vast majority of BSN.

[Dark Tlaloc]

Feneckus wrote...

RB26D3TT wrote...

After reading lots of comments I came to a conclusion. The guys that hate Infiltrators just suck with them and hate the fact that others make good use of them. THAT SIMPLE.

I was part of a team that did a 10 min Gold speed run without rockets. I guess I suck with infiltrators ?

Dark Tlaloc wrote...

So we've been hearing for weeks about how overpowered the TGI was, and that stimpacks needed a nerf, so they get a nerf. Now ALL infiltrators are too powerful, and people are begging for ALL of them to be nerfed. What will be next? The destroyer? Adepts? Where does it end? Why is everyone always crying for kits to be nerfed? This isn't a competitive game, and if you don't like a class because it's overpowered, simply avoid it. What ACTUALLY needs to be done, is that a few underpowered classes/weapons need buffs, so that everyone will feel like they're on a relatively (skill notwithstanding) even playing field.

I don't really want infiltrators to be nerfed. I don't really care to be honest.  Nerfing them wouldn't solve anything.

What I do care about however is how they've been ruining the game. They were badly designed to begin with.

I can’t argue too much with that. They’re not necessarily my
favorite class, but they are certainly the most well-rounded class (since they’re
great offensively and defensively, and are the best class for completing
objectives), and could have used more balancing before being released. I feel
like part of the issue is the sheer amount of data Bioware has to deal with in
MP now; they’ve got so many things to consider when releasing new kits, weapons
and gear, that they probably don’t think to test out the most extreme abuses of
each beforehand, which is what leads to “OP” setups, which lead to nerfs. The
concept of the infiltrator would be fine if they were limited to certain types
of weapons (as in previous Mass Effect games), but since they have access to
all the most powerful weapons and combinations, their innate abilities bring
out the bleeding edge of DPS in the game.

[Caldari Ghost]

Uh Cold wrote...

The concept of variety does not seem to exist to a vast majority of BSN.

I like raw onions.

[HolyAvenger]

Uh Cold wrote...

CNevarezN wrote...

Nobody sucks while rockin an Infiltrator class

mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm gonna have to disagree, I've seen it all.

Agree. PUGs gonna PUG.

[Clayless]

Wait is someone who can solo Platinum trying to get balance changes made because of his experiences?

Talk about elitist, it's people like the OP that ruin this game. It'd be like me asking for the Geth Trooper to be nerfed because I can do good with him.

[CmnDwnWrkn]

I agree with a lot of what is being said in this thread. There are plenty of examples of how Infiltrators get substantial perks that other classes simply don't have.

1) Turian Soldier Marksman vs. GI/SI Tac Cloak - GI/SI can fire Proxy Mine from cloak, and it gets the damage bonus from cloak and shares cooldown with cloak. Turian Soldier can't even use Proxy Mine from Marksman, let alone gain a large damage bonus.

2) Quarian Male Engineer vs. Quarian Male Infiltrator - basically the same, except one has Tac Cloak, while the other has Incinerate. While the Engineer's Arc Grenade + Incinerate combo is nice for Tech Bursts, it's situationally powerful. The Infiltrator gets the Tac Cloak damage bonus applied to Arc Grenades AND weapon damage, and draws less aggro while in Cloak. The QMI's power set is simply more powerful across the board.

3) Turian Havoc Soldier vs. Turian Ghost Infiltrator - No discussion needed. It's obvious which one is 100x more powerful than the other.

4) Salarian Engineer vs. Salarian Infiltrator - Again, it's obvious which one is far more powerful.

Infiltrators are simply better at pretty much everything than their non-Infiltrator counterparts. BioWare simply hasn't paid enough attention to how this class stacks up against the others in the game.

SpockLives wrote...

My Tactical Cloak Fix:

#1 End
the shortened cooldown for breaking cloak early. You get the full
cooldown regardless of how long you were cloaked. Now infiltrators care
about weight.  Maybe have grenades and stim packs end cloak, as well.

#2
Block all power use during cloak without picking the rank 6 evolution.
Want to cast powers while cloaked? Do it like Adrenaline Rush and pick
that evolution. (The Huntress might need an exception.)

#3
Remove power damage bonus from Tactical Cloak. (Huntress will need an
exception.) Infiltrators are supposed to be a "shooty" class. Don't
make their powers better, too.

Now you may balance the game because Infiltrators cannot do everything better than everyone else.

These are very good suggestions.  I have no idea why BioWare felt it was appropriate to allow casting a power from cloak, sharing the cooldown with cloak (without adding to it), AND getting the huge damage bonus from cloak.  It makes no sense from a balance perspective whatsoever.

Modifié par CmnDwnWrkn, 05 décembre 2012 - 04:08 .

[billpickles]

RB26D3TT wrote...

Feneckus wrote...

RB26D3TT wrote...

After reading lots of comments I came to a conclusion. The guys that hate Infiltrators just suck with them and hate the fact that others make good use of them. THAT SIMPLE.

I was part of a team that did a 10 min Gold speed run without rockets. I guess I suck with infiltrators ?

Any proof? Would really like to see this.

You must be new here.  Feneckus is well-known to be an exceptional player.  Search for some of his Youtube videos, or simply search here for his name or for Gold/Plat speedrun videos.  There is plenty of evidence.

Modifié par billpickles, 05 décembre 2012 - 04:10 .

[Cohen le Barbare]

Uh Cold wrote...

*edit*
Also nice 12 credits, I see you are saving up.

Well I only had 7 ops pack left yesterday so spent my money on jumbo packs. No point in saving, i'll get more than enough money before the next character is out, as I only have that to unlock

[RB26D3TT]

billpickles wrote...

RB26D3TT wrote...

Feneckus wrote...

RB26D3TT wrote...

After reading lots of comments I came to a conclusion. The guys that hate Infiltrators just suck with them and hate the fact that others make good use of them. THAT SIMPLE.

I was part of a team that did a 10 min Gold speed run without rockets. I guess I suck with infiltrators ?

Any proof? Would really like to see this.

You must be new here.  Feneckus is well-known to be an exceptional player.  Search for some of his Youtube videos, or simply search here for his name or for Gold/Plat speedrun videos.  There is plenty of evidence.

Found a video. Judging by his voice he is not legaly allowed to play this game. Nuff said.

[spudspot]

RB26D3TT wrote...

After reading lots of comments I came to a conclusion. The guys that hate Infiltrators just suck with them and hate the fact that others make good use of them. THAT SIMPLE.
Also why would you hate your teammates so much? Even if they had an edge. This is a team game not PvP.

Wow, you've misread that pretty bad, even by BSN standards. The point is not how good people are with Infiltrators but rather the question why the Havoc (somewhere between decent and underpowered) had to be nerfed?

Because the Ghost was too much a jack of all trades. Guess what, the nerf actually didn't do that much to him in terms of survivability. Further, I don't see how the Havoc Strike buff is supposed to make up for that, because if you want to utilize it for dealing damage, you're gonna have to charge often. This certainly hasn't become less dangerous by nerfing stimpacks.

On that hating teammates issue: Vanguards for example are much better medics than most  Infiltrators. 

There also have been quite some nerfs to weapons - not that we've had many nerfs compared to all the buffs - that were a direct result of what (some) Infiltrators were able to do with that weapon.

RB26D3TT wrote...

Found a video. Judging by his voice he is not legaly allowed to play this game. Nuff said.

Lol. 

Modifié par spudspot, 05 décembre 2012 - 04:21 .

[Shampoohorn]

CmnDwnWrkn wrote...

I agree with a lot of what is being said in this thread. There are plenty of examples of how Infiltrators get substantial perks that other classes simply don't have.

1) Turian Soldier Marksman vs. GI/SI Tac Cloak - GI/SI can fire Proxy Mine from cloak, and it gets the damage bonus from cloak and shares cooldown with cloak. Turian Soldier can't even use Proxy Mine from Marksman, let alone gain a large damage bonus.

2) Quarian Male Engineer vs. Quarian Male Infiltrator - basically the same, except one has Tac Cloak, while the other has Incinerate. While the Engineer's Arc Grenade + Incinerate combo is nice for Tech Bursts, it's situationally powerful. The Infiltrator gets the Tac Cloak damage bonus applied to Arc Grenades AND weapon damage, and draws less aggro while in Cloak. The QMI's power set is simply more powerful across the board.

3) Turian Havoc Soldier vs. Turian Ghost Infiltrator - No discussion needed. It's obvious which one is 100x more powerful than the other.

4) Salarian Engineer vs. Salarian Infiltrator - Again, it's obvious which one is far more powerful.

Infiltrators are simply better at pretty much everything than their non-Infiltrator counterparts. BioWare simply hasn't paid enough attention to how this class stacks up against the others in the game.

SpockLives wrote...

My Tactical Cloak Fix:

#1 End
the shortened cooldown for breaking cloak early. You get the full
cooldown regardless of how long you were cloaked. Now infiltrators care
about weight.  Maybe have grenades and stim packs end cloak, as well.

#2
Block all power use during cloak without picking the rank 6 evolution.
Want to cast powers while cloaked? Do it like Adrenaline Rush and pick
that evolution. (The Huntress might need an exception.)

#3
Remove power damage bonus from Tactical Cloak. (Huntress will need an
exception.) Infiltrators are supposed to be a "shooty" class. Don't
make their powers better, too.

Now you may balance the game because Infiltrators cannot do everything better than everyone else.

These are very good suggestions.  I have no idea why BioWare felt it was appropriate to allow casting a power from cloak, sharing the cooldown with cloak (without adding to it), AND getting the huge damage bonus from cloak.  It makes no sense from a balance perspective whatsoever.

Agreed & Signed.

And despite my love of melee infiltrators, they should also remove the melee damage bonus from TC except for the Rank 5 evolution.  That would shift it from an 80%-130% bonus to 0%-50%.

The class shold not outclass the specialists (adept/engineer/soldier) at their specialties in the manner that it does.

[capn233]

Feneckus wrote...

Ironic considering an infiltrator did ruin the Havoc Soldier.

He is not outright ruined, but my Havoc was noticeably weaker.  But mine was melee that used the shield / melee evolutions.