Modifié par HolyAvenger, 05 décembre 2012 - 01:26 .
classes with highest skill curve for use on Gold and Plat?
Débuté par
TheKillerAngel
, déc. 05 2012 12:18
#51
Posté 05 décembre 2012 - 01:26
HolyAvenger
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I agree with Sirian on how few GIs I see in PUGs. Just read through this thread (http://social.biowar...index/15116871/) and note how rare they are.
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#52
Posté 05 décembre 2012 - 01:31
jaydubs67
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Deerber wrote...
I agree with all the kits you names in the OP, KillerAngel. And for one, I'm inclined to say that Sirian is right about GIs, they still need quite a bit of skills to be played effectively and not be down all the time. Yes, even with cyclonics. They aren't going to do that much of a difference on such a squishy class.
Sure, they don't need the amount of skills the drellguard, or the novaguard, do. But quite a bit anyway.
A GI with cyclonic IV has more shields than salarians, quarians, humans, asari, volus, drell, and vorcha. Basically everything but krogans (no dodge), turians (classic has no dodge), and batarians (no dodge). A GI with just a cyclonic I still has more shields than humans, asari, volus, drell, and vorcha. And it has permanent wallhacks, aggro dump, and one of if not the best offense in the game. That's with hunter mode on, and 4 in fitness for each.
Sorry, but the "it's squishy" argument only holds water without cyclonics. Because there's a whole host of classes with less shields and less damage/utility/damage avoidance.
#53
Posté 05 décembre 2012 - 01:32
TommyNg
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Of course Fury , not GI ,GI can see through wall ,no one can hit u
#55
Guest_Lord_Sirian_*
Posté 05 décembre 2012 - 01:35
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jaydubs67 wrote...
Deerber wrote...
I agree with all the kits you names in the OP, KillerAngel. And for one, I'm inclined to say that Sirian is right about GIs, they still need quite a bit of skills to be played effectively and not be down all the time. Yes, even with cyclonics. They aren't going to do that much of a difference on such a squishy class.
Sure, they don't need the amount of skills the drellguard, or the novaguard, do. But quite a bit anyway.
A GI with cyclonic IV has more shields than salarians, quarians, humans, asari, volus, drell, and vorcha. Basically everything but krogans (no dodge), turians (classic has no dodge), and batarians (no dodge). A GI with just a cyclonic I still has more shields than humans, asari, volus, drell, and vorcha. And it has permanent wallhacks, aggro dump, and one of if not the best offense in the game. That's with hunter mode on, and 4 in fitness for each.
Sorry, but the "it's squishy" argument only holds water without cyclonics. Because there's a whole host of classes with less shields and less damage/utility/damage avoidance.
Comparing classes with cyclonics to classes without.
:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol: Ok. The FQE only lacks in damage output if you don't put disruptor ammo on her. A FQE with disruptor ammo 4, a weapon amp 3 and a talon will out damage a GI with no consumables.
See? I can use that incredibly brainless argument as well!
#56
Posté 05 décembre 2012 - 01:37
jaydubs67
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Lord_Sirian wrote...
jaydubs67 wrote...
Deerber wrote...
I agree with all the kits you names in the OP, KillerAngel. And for one, I'm inclined to say that Sirian is right about GIs, they still need quite a bit of skills to be played effectively and not be down all the time. Yes, even with cyclonics. They aren't going to do that much of a difference on such a squishy class.
Sure, they don't need the amount of skills the drellguard, or the novaguard, do. But quite a bit anyway.
A GI with cyclonic IV has more shields than salarians, quarians, humans, asari, volus, drell, and vorcha. Basically everything but krogans (no dodge), turians (classic has no dodge), and batarians (no dodge). A GI with just a cyclonic I still has more shields than humans, asari, volus, drell, and vorcha. And it has permanent wallhacks, aggro dump, and one of if not the best offense in the game. That's with hunter mode on, and 4 in fitness for each.
Sorry, but the "it's squishy" argument only holds water without cyclonics. Because there's a whole host of classes with less shields and less damage/utility/damage avoidance.
Comparing classes with cyclonics to classes without.
Ok. The FQE only lacks in damage output if you don't put disruptor ammo on her. A FQE with disruptor ammo 4, a weapon amp 3 and a talon will out damage a GI with no consumables.
See? I can use that incredibly brainless argument as well!
No. That's both classes with 4 in fitness and cyclonics. A human with cyclonic I and 4 in fitness has 850 shields. A GI with hunter mode on, 4 in fitness, and cyclonic I has 900 shields.
#57
Posté 05 décembre 2012 - 01:41
CNevarezN
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I think the Human Adept is a tricky class to use as well. Also, the Asari Huntress. I see people play the Huntress like an Adept, which imo is a mistake. Anyways, agree with Sirian on the fact that it takes some skill and logic to rock the GI. If you can't survive, you will fail miserably.
#58
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Posté 05 décembre 2012 - 01:41
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Lord_Sirian wrote...
jaydubs67 wrote...
Deerber wrote...
I agree with all the kits you names in the OP, KillerAngel. And for one, I'm inclined to say that Sirian is right about GIs, they still need quite a bit of skills to be played effectively and not be down all the time. Yes, even with cyclonics. They aren't going to do that much of a difference on such a squishy class.
Sure, they don't need the amount of skills the drellguard, or the novaguard, do. But quite a bit anyway.
A GI with cyclonic IV has more shields than salarians, quarians, humans, asari, volus, drell, and vorcha. Basically everything but krogans (no dodge), turians (classic has no dodge), and batarians (no dodge). A GI with just a cyclonic I still has more shields than humans, asari, volus, drell, and vorcha. And it has permanent wallhacks, aggro dump, and one of if not the best offense in the game. That's with hunter mode on, and 4 in fitness for each.
Sorry, but the "it's squishy" argument only holds water without cyclonics. Because there's a whole host of classes with less shields and less damage/utility/damage avoidance.
Comparing classes with cyclonics to classes without.
Ok. The FQE only lacks in damage output if you don't put disruptor ammo on her. A FQE with disruptor ammo 4, a weapon amp 3 and a talon will out damage a GI with no consumables.
See? I can use that incredibly brainless argument as well!
My GI with Hunter Mode ON (4 points in fitness) has more shields than my Asari Adept. And since GI has high base shields, any Cynclonic turns him from kinda squishy into durable.
#59
Guest_Lord_Sirian_*
Posté 05 décembre 2012 - 01:41
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Oh and let's not forget comparing them to classes that get DR (Drell, Krogan, Volus), Health regen (Vorcha), shield regen (Volus, Asari, Drell, Human) and/or superior dodge moves (Drell, Vorcha, New Turians, Asari, humans, Volus).
Sure, if you set the goalposts wherever you want, you can make a convincing argument for anything.
Sure, if you set the goalposts wherever you want, you can make a convincing argument for anything.
#60
Posté 05 décembre 2012 - 01:44
joker_jack
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CQC classes, excluding the batguard and kroguard. If you can't manage cqc situations, you're going to rage dying every 3 seconds from a cannibal.
#61
Posté 05 décembre 2012 - 01:46
Feneckus
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People trying to argue the GI is balanced. That never gets old.
Oh wait, it does.
Oh wait, it does.
#62
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Posté 05 décembre 2012 - 01:48
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Lord_Sirian wrote...
Oh and let's not forget comparing them to classes that get DR (Drell, Krogan, Volus), Health regen (Vorcha), shield regen (Volus, Asari, Drell, Human) and/or superior dodge moves (Drell, Vorcha, New Turians, Asari, humans, Volus).
Sure, if you set the goalposts wherever you want, you can make a convincing argument for anything.
DR is just that. DR. You're still getting hit. Wallhack let's you avoid getting hit all together + TC. And GI speed
#63
Guest_Lord_Sirian_*
Posté 05 décembre 2012 - 01:48
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Feneckus wrote...
People trying to argue the GI is balanced. That never gets old.
Oh wait, it does.
People using the top 0.01% of players as standards for what is OP or not. That never gets old.
Oh wait, it does.
#64
Guest_Lord_Sirian_*
Posté 05 décembre 2012 - 01:49
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Air Quotes wrote...
Lord_Sirian wrote...
Oh and let's not forget comparing them to classes that get DR (Drell, Krogan, Volus), Health regen (Vorcha), shield regen (Volus, Asari, Drell, Human) and/or superior dodge moves (Drell, Vorcha, New Turians, Asari, humans, Volus).
Sure, if you set the goalposts wherever you want, you can make a convincing argument for anything.
DR is just that. DR. You're still getting hit. Wallhack let's you avoid getting hit all together + TC. And GI speed
YAAAAAAAAAWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNN.
#65
Posté 05 décembre 2012 - 01:50
xTh3xBusinessx
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Rule of thumb for the ppl that dont know. DONT EVER PUT CHARACTERS IN TIERS OF ANY GAME WITH ADDS LIKE CONSUMEABLES!! Base character is only suppose to be used. Sorry but I had to say it. And I mostly agree with Sirian but too many ppl on BSN are just biased against all infiltrators.
#66
Posté 05 décembre 2012 - 01:52
Gr1zz Dawg
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I'm inclined to agree with Sirian...the GI is dependent on consumables. The reason the GI is so popular is because there are by far more threads and videos that show how to use him than any other character. I don't think he ranks up there with highest learning curves though.
I think OP needs to qualify the topic a little bit because it seems that the thread has changed from steep learning curve, to survivability in platinum. I think if everyone was to put their noob hats on, it would be obvious that Vanguards are the easiest class to play with on low difficulties. Go in any Bronze or even Silver PUG and there's bound to be a Novaguard or Slayer in it.
For a noob, one of the most difficult classes is the infiltrator. It requires learning the synergy between your TC, your powers, your passives and your weapons. Knowing when (and on whom) to take damage over duration for TC. It's a sniper specialized class, so you have to be able to cloak and not miss that one shot before your gun takes an eternity to reload (even with reload cancel, they still take longer than most other less damaging guns).
Of the infiltrators, the one with the steepest learning curve (for noobs and even experience players) is the Shadow. She's an extremely squishy, CQC, melee class, that can't afford to carry a heavy weapon, suffers from vanguard-esque glitches, and doesn't have any quickly executable powers.
I think OP needs to qualify the topic a little bit because it seems that the thread has changed from steep learning curve, to survivability in platinum. I think if everyone was to put their noob hats on, it would be obvious that Vanguards are the easiest class to play with on low difficulties. Go in any Bronze or even Silver PUG and there's bound to be a Novaguard or Slayer in it.
For a noob, one of the most difficult classes is the infiltrator. It requires learning the synergy between your TC, your powers, your passives and your weapons. Knowing when (and on whom) to take damage over duration for TC. It's a sniper specialized class, so you have to be able to cloak and not miss that one shot before your gun takes an eternity to reload (even with reload cancel, they still take longer than most other less damaging guns).
Of the infiltrators, the one with the steepest learning curve (for noobs and even experience players) is the Shadow. She's an extremely squishy, CQC, melee class, that can't afford to carry a heavy weapon, suffers from vanguard-esque glitches, and doesn't have any quickly executable powers.
#67
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Posté 05 décembre 2012 - 01:52
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Oh c'mon Sirian. GI got nerfed twice. And he's still a beast. He has everything. And his drawback (hunter mode penalty) can be fixed with any shield boosters.
#68
Posté 05 décembre 2012 - 01:53
Deerber
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jaydubs67 wrote...
Lord_Sirian wrote...
jaydubs67 wrote...
Deerber wrote...
I agree with all the kits you names in the OP, KillerAngel. And for one, I'm inclined to say that Sirian is right about GIs, they still need quite a bit of skills to be played effectively and not be down all the time. Yes, even with cyclonics. They aren't going to do that much of a difference on such a squishy class.
Sure, they don't need the amount of skills the drellguard, or the novaguard, do. But quite a bit anyway.
A GI with cyclonic IV has more shields than salarians, quarians, humans, asari, volus, drell, and vorcha. Basically everything but krogans (no dodge), turians (classic has no dodge), and batarians (no dodge). A GI with just a cyclonic I still has more shields than humans, asari, volus, drell, and vorcha. And it has permanent wallhacks, aggro dump, and one of if not the best offense in the game. That's with hunter mode on, and 4 in fitness for each.
Sorry, but the "it's squishy" argument only holds water without cyclonics. Because there's a whole host of classes with less shields and less damage/utility/damage avoidance.
Comparing classes with cyclonics to classes without.
Ok. The FQE only lacks in damage output if you don't put disruptor ammo on her. A FQE with disruptor ammo 4, a weapon amp 3 and a talon will out damage a GI with no consumables.
See? I can use that incredibly brainless argument as well!
No. That's both classes with 4 in fitness and cyclonics. A human with cyclonic I and 4 in fitness has 850 shields. A GI with hunter mode on, 4 in fitness, and cyclonic I has 900 shields.
One question: do you use GI much? Cause I've been learning how to use a talon GI lately, so I used him a lot.
Sure, his shields are not bad. But whenever someone thinks about "squishy" and "tanky" in this game, he only thinks about shields. You know what?
Health has got a part in that, too. Believe it or not.
So yeah, humans and whatever else that has got no way to regenerate health/shields (not many kits, actually, if you think about it, and they all have full dodge capabilities, while GI only has a stupid sidestep...) might have (slightly) less shields.
But once its shields are down, a GI on platinum goes down by 2 swarmers. Yeah, you read it right. 2 swarmers hit you after you were shieldgated? Better use an ops pack, or ask for a revive already.
You walk on a bit of ravager blood by mistake, after being shieldgated? Not even the time to use the ops pack, it's either gel or revive.
So yes, GIs need a bit of know-how to work. I always thought they didn't, but I started using them a lot lately, as I said, and realized they do.
Still a lot less than drellguard, but they do.
#69
Guest_Lord_Sirian_*
Posté 05 décembre 2012 - 01:54
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Air Quotes wrote...
Oh c'mon Sirian. GI got nerfed twice. And he's still a beast. He has everything. And his drawback (hunter mode penalty) can be fixed with any shield boosters.
Arguing that any class is OP/easy mode if you slap x y z consumables on it is just moronic.
#72
Posté 05 décembre 2012 - 01:55
CNevarezN
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People think the electric slash on the Shadow is good when in reality it's not. I spec out of that and just make her all melee. With the right equipment you can one shot any mook, including phantoms.
#73
Posté 05 décembre 2012 - 01:55
Deerber
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Air Quotes wrote...
Lord_Sirian wrote...
Oh and let's not forget comparing them to classes that get DR (Drell, Krogan, Volus), Health regen (Vorcha), shield regen (Volus, Asari, Drell, Human) and/or superior dodge moves (Drell, Vorcha, New Turians, Asari, humans, Volus).
Sure, if you set the goalposts wherever you want, you can make a convincing argument for anything.
DR is just that. DR. You're still getting hit. Wallhack let's you avoid getting hit all together + TC. And GI speed
Honestly, I'm not that good of a player and still wallhack isn't that much helpful to me. I can easily know where the enemy is without it anyway. It's helpful, sure... But not that much.
#75
Guest_Air Quotes_*
Posté 05 décembre 2012 - 01:57
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Deerber wrote...
jaydubs67 wrote...
Lord_Sirian wrote...
jaydubs67 wrote...
Deerber wrote...
I agree with all the kits you names in the OP, KillerAngel. And for one, I'm inclined to say that Sirian is right about GIs, they still need quite a bit of skills to be played effectively and not be down all the time. Yes, even with cyclonics. They aren't going to do that much of a difference on such a squishy class.
Sure, they don't need the amount of skills the drellguard, or the novaguard, do. But quite a bit anyway.
A GI with cyclonic IV has more shields than salarians, quarians, humans, asari, volus, drell, and vorcha. Basically everything but krogans (no dodge), turians (classic has no dodge), and batarians (no dodge). A GI with just a cyclonic I still has more shields than humans, asari, volus, drell, and vorcha. And it has permanent wallhacks, aggro dump, and one of if not the best offense in the game. That's with hunter mode on, and 4 in fitness for each.
Sorry, but the "it's squishy" argument only holds water without cyclonics. Because there's a whole host of classes with less shields and less damage/utility/damage avoidance.
Comparing classes with cyclonics to classes without.
Ok. The FQE only lacks in damage output if you don't put disruptor ammo on her. A FQE with disruptor ammo 4, a weapon amp 3 and a talon will out damage a GI with no consumables.
See? I can use that incredibly brainless argument as well!
No. That's both classes with 4 in fitness and cyclonics. A human with cyclonic I and 4 in fitness has 850 shields. A GI with hunter mode on, 4 in fitness, and cyclonic I has 900 shields.
One question: do you use GI much? Cause I've been learning how to use a talon GI lately, so I used him a lot.
Sure, his shields are not bad. But whenever someone thinks about "squishy" and "tanky" in this game, he only thinks about shields. You know what?
Health has got a part in that, too. Believe it or not.
So yeah, humans and whatever else that has got no way to regenerate health/shields (not many kits, actually, if you think about it, and they all have full dodge capabilities, while GI only has a stupid sidestep...) might have (slightly) less shields.
But once its shields are down, a GI on platinum goes down by 2 swarmers. Yeah, you read it right. 2 swarmers hit you after you were shieldgated? Better use an ops pack, or ask for a revive already.
You walk on a bit of ravager blood by mistake, after being shieldgated? Not even the time to use the ops pack, it's either gel or revive.
So yes, GIs need a bit of know-how to work. I always thought they didn't, but I started using them a lot lately, as I said, and realized they do.
Still a lot less than drellguard, but they do.
Health drops much faster than shields and doesn't regen for most characters. Shields do. High base shields ------> High base health that doesn't regen.
And so what if you have high shields, but that hunter snuck up on you. You will go down. With GI - you're much more safe.
