176 réponses à ce sujet

[Jay_Hoxtatron]

Feneckus wrote...

I see a lot of questionable things on BSN, but I gotta say this "Typhoon sucks and needs a buff" myth is definitely in my top 3.

Jay_Hoxtatron wrote...

I'm quoting Derek Hollan

We always have to take more in consideration than dps and weight. The combined factors of given weapons (including their passives) are also what gives them their particular niche. The Typhoon, for example, has damage reduction for the player when leaning out of cover. This is something that places it in its own category. This combined with its penetration bonus means the player doesn't need the piercing mod and can use another mod instead. So, while the pure DPS of the Typhoon might not stack up against other ARs, it does have advantages those other weapons do not.

Another proof the devs have absolutely no idea what they're talking about. I guess they completely forgot about the armor damage reduction  And how it's a bigger deal on the Typhoon than on any other weapon ....

The question is : do you balance weapons on Gold/Plat, where Armor DR matters, or Silver, the 'average' level of difficulty.

[Stardusk]

megabeast37215 wrote...

Stardusk wrote...

Lord_Sirian wrote...

Locutus_of_BORG wrote...

I thought the consensus was that the Typhoon was terribad until it got to high level (whatever high level means, presumably X).

 

It was awesome even when I had it at level 1.

People saying it's terribad are probably terribad players.

My. aren't you nice.

He's so much more lovable when he's surly....

I felt like the 'nice sweet' krogan who wrote the guide thread was somebody else...

Sirian is an odd guy. Sometimes you think he believes everyone who is not Jay or Stentron is a scrub, other times...who knows? Indeed, perhaps that guide was in fact a farce...after all, it was addressed to so-called low level players?

[BlackDahlia424]

Feneckus wrote...

I see a lot of questionable things on BSN, but I gotta say this "Typhoon sucks and needs a buff" myth is definitely in my top 3.

Jay_Hoxtatron wrote...

I'm quoting Derek Hollan

We always have to take more in consideration than dps and weight. The combined factors of given weapons (including their passives) are also what gives them their particular niche. The Typhoon, for example, has damage reduction for the player when leaning out of cover. This is something that places it in its own category. This combined with its penetration bonus means the player doesn't need the piercing mod and can use another mod instead. So, while the pure DPS of the Typhoon might not stack up against other ARs, it does have advantages those other weapons do not.

Another proof the devs have absolutely no idea what they're talking about. I guess they completely forgot about the armor damage reduction  And how it's a bigger deal on the Typhoon than on any other weapon ....

I was thinking the exact same thing. Unless the Typhoon was designed to ignore the damage reduction from armor?

In fact, I would argue that would be the thing that made the gun perfectly balanced. Then you really could ignore AP mods and ammo.

[Kenadian]

Granted the innate piercing on the Typhoon means you don't have to take AP ammo, and can substitute Warp IV with an EB and get pretty decent results too.

[Fly064]

If you stabilise the weapon and use the right ammobonus it's actually overpowerd

For people who don'tz like the Typhoon I hope that it just doesn't fit their playstyle. The alternative would be that they just suck at playing.

[Cakekey]

Mine is only at I, but even then I'm a fan. I definitely agree that it only belongs on classes which somehow provide buffs to accuracy and RoF, my favorite being the Geth Trooper so far. I'm waiting to have it upgraded before trying it on a Marksman class, though; the weight is just too much for me.

[inversevideo]

TxC_Denali2012 wrote...

I agree with you, although I really do want to like this gun. I want to try it on a Turian Soldier or the new Quarian under Marksman, with fire rate increase and head shot damage. I am probably grasping at straws here, but the weapon looks so cool, and I really do want to like it. Thing is, I do not like the Destroyer. Blasphemy right?

So far, due to it being so heavy, only my destroyer or demolisher can use it.

I would love to try it on my QM, but the weight makes that iffy.

That said, on a destroyer or demolisher, where weight is not an issue, the gun shreds enemy shields and armor; it is a beast.  

[Fixx21]

It's a boss killer, very good.
I have the Typhoon X

[BlackDahlia424]

Kenadian wrote...

Granted the innate piercing on the Typhoon means you don't have to take AP ammo, and can substitute Warp IV with an EB and get pretty decent results too.

Right, but you would still lose 50 damage per bullet, which amounts to a loss of hundreds of DPS. I know it would take a patch to fix, but if I were to balance the Typhoon, I'd increase either its base damage by 10% or increase the multiplier from 1.5 to 1.65 (essentially the same thing) AND remove the AR penalty.

Then it becomes the best boss killer in the game, which its supposed to be anyway. Now I wouldn't have to waste a mod or ammo slot to make it not gimped against what it's intended for. Then you can run EB+EM and Warp ammo for no penalty.

Modifié par BlackDahlia424, 10 décembre 2012 - 07:19 .

[ryoldschool]

inversevideo wrote...

TxC_Denali2012 wrote...

I agree with you, although I really do want to like this gun. I want to try it on a Turian Soldier or the new Quarian under Marksman, with fire rate increase and head shot damage. I am probably grasping at straws here, but the weapon looks so cool, and I really do want to like it. Thing is, I do not like the Destroyer. Blasphemy right?

So far, due to it being so heavy, only my destroyer or demolisher can use it.

I would love to try it on my QM, but the weight makes that iffy.

That said, on a destroyer or demolisher, where weight is not an issue, the gun shreds enemy shields and armor; it is a beast.  

Its also good on the Ghost, Krogan Sentinel ( no incinerate ), Human Soldier ( cryo blast-free build )  as well as the other classes you mentioned ( Destroyer and Demolisher ).

The thing is that I don't trust using anything except ap ammo and the EB on it because it was so lackluster until they undid the stability factor.

[BlackDahlia424]

Lord_Sirian wrote...

BlackDahlia424 wrote...

Kenadian wrote...

Granted the innate piercing on the Typhoon means you don't have to take AP ammo, and can substitute Warp IV with an EB and get pretty decent results too.

Right, but you would still lose 50 damage per bullet, which amounts to a loss of hundreds of DPS. I know it would take a patch to fix, but if I were to balance the Typhoon, I'd increase either its base damage by 10% or increase the multiplier from 1.5 to 1.65 (essentially the same thing) AND remove the AR penalty.

Then it becomes the best boss killer in the game, which its supposed to be anyway.

 

Changing the multiplier/base damage wouldn't require a patch.

BW just don't want to do it because they balance this game around bronze difficulty.

Not to fix the multiplier, but to remove the AR penalty.

[Jay_Hoxtatron]

BlackDahlia424 wrote...

Lord_Sirian wrote...

BlackDahlia424 wrote...

Kenadian wrote...

Granted the innate piercing on the Typhoon means you don't have to take AP ammo, and can substitute Warp IV with an EB and get pretty decent results too.

Right, but you would still lose 50 damage per bullet, which amounts to a loss of hundreds of DPS. I know it would take a patch to fix, but if I were to balance the Typhoon, I'd increase either its base damage by 10% or increase the multiplier from 1.5 to 1.65 (essentially the same thing) AND remove the AR penalty.

Then it becomes the best boss killer in the game, which its supposed to be anyway.

 

Changing the multiplier/base damage wouldn't require a patch.

BW just don't want to do it because they balance this game around bronze difficulty.

Not to fix the multiplier, but to remove the AR penalty.

The base damage could use a buff.

[AaronEh]

BlackDahlia424 wrote...

Kenadian wrote...

Granted the innate piercing on the Typhoon means you don't have to take AP ammo, and can substitute Warp IV with an EB and get pretty decent results too.

Right, but you would still lose 50 damage per bullet, which amounts to a loss of hundreds of DPS. I know it would take a patch to fix, but if I were to balance the Typhoon, I'd increase either its base damage by 10% or increase the multiplier from 1.5 to 1.65 (essentially the same thing) AND remove the AR penalty.

Then it becomes the best boss killer in the game, which its supposed to be anyway. Now I wouldn't have to waste a mod or ammo slot to make it not gimped against what it's intended for. Then you can run EB+EM and Warp ammo for no penalty.

No you don't.  Warp IV gives 65% armour weakness - same as the basic Assault Rifle piercing mod.  It will have the same effect on Armour DR

[inversevideo]

ryoldschool wrote...

inversevideo wrote...

TxC_Denali2012 wrote...

I agree with you, although I really do want to like this gun. I want to try it on a Turian Soldier or the new Quarian under Marksman, with fire rate increase and head shot damage. I am probably grasping at straws here, but the weapon looks so cool, and I really do want to like it. Thing is, I do not like the Destroyer. Blasphemy right?

So far, due to it being so heavy, only my destroyer or demolisher can use it.

I would love to try it on my QM, but the weight makes that iffy.

That said, on a destroyer or demolisher, where weight is not an issue, the gun shreds enemy shields and armor; it is a beast.  

Its also good on the Ghost, Krogan Sentinel ( no incinerate ), Human Soldier ( cryo blast-free build )  as well as the other classes you mentioned ( Destroyer and Demolisher ).

The thing is that I don't trust using anything except ap ammo and the EB on it because it was so lackluster until they undid the stability factor.

I can see it on KS & HS with those builds. TGI? Would not the weight slow down the use of  havoc strike?
What about TS with marksman? Though again the weight. Damn, BW, do guns have to be so heavy that only krogans can use them?  

[Feneckus]

Kenadian wrote...

Granted the innate piercing on the Typhoon means you don't have to take AP ammo, and can substitute Warp IV with an EB and get pretty decent results too.

The Typhoon loses 75 damage per shot against armor on Gold/Plat.

With Warp IV, you lose 26.25 per shot.
With AP IV, you only lose 7.5 per shot.

At that rate of fire, that's a massive difference.

So you need either AP Ammo IV or the new piercing mod to be really effective.

[BlackDahlia424]

Jay_Hoxtatron wrote...

The base damage could use a buff.

I agree, a 10% buff would be perfect, I think. Especially if AR was removed from it.

AaronEh wrote...
No you don't.  Warp IV gives 65% armour
weakness - same as the basic Assault Rifle piercing mod.  It will have
the same effect on Armour DR

The way I thought it worked was that armor weakness just meant that armor took more damage from all sources, but the armor reduction from weapons still applied the same way as before. So while armor weakening might increase the damage against armor, it still suffers a penalty. Correct me if I'm wrong.

Modifié par BlackDahlia424, 10 décembre 2012 - 07:30 .

[Kenadian]

Feneckus wrote...

Kenadian wrote...

Granted the innate piercing on the Typhoon means you don't have to take AP ammo, and can substitute Warp IV with an EB and get pretty decent results too.

The Typhoon loses 75 damage per shot against armor on Gold/Plat.

With Warp IV, you lose 26.25 per shot.
With AP IV, you only lose 7.5 per shot.

At that rate of fire, that's a massive difference.

So you need either AP Ammo IV or the new piercing mod to be really effective.

Eh, HVB + Warp IV may be too much of a loss versus EB + Warp IV in overall damage, especially against non-bosses. You'd notice it more on plat than gold anyways. If the gun didn't get weight from the HVB like the older guns did, I'd be more inclined to skip AP ammo + EB combo though.

Modifié par Kenadian, 10 décembre 2012 - 07:31 .

[UnknownMercenary]

Feneckus wrote...

Kenadian wrote...

Granted the innate piercing on the Typhoon means you don't have to take AP ammo, and can substitute Warp IV with an EB and get pretty decent results too.

The Typhoon loses 75 damage per shot against armor on Gold/Plat.

With Warp IV, you lose 26.25 per shot.
With AP IV, you only lose 7.5 per shot.

At that rate of fire, that's a massive difference.

So you need either AP Ammo IV or the new piercing mod to be really effective.

+1

Warp ammo IV is a good substitute, but armor is the main reason the Typhoon loses damage. I've run it a lot with both Warp and AP IV and the bonus damage versus barriers from Warp IV is negligible compared to the extra armor damage from AP IV. For Gold, as long as you have some form of armor piercing/negation it's fine, but for maximum effectiveness/Platinum, AP IV is the way to go.

Plus the whole "shoot through walls" thing.

[cgj]

Feneckus wrote...

Kenadian wrote...

Granted the innate piercing on the Typhoon means you don't have to take AP ammo, and can substitute Warp IV with an EB and get pretty decent results too.

The Typhoon loses 75 damage per shot against armor on Gold/Plat.

With Warp IV, you lose 26.25 per shot.
With AP IV, you only lose 7.5 per shot.

At that rate of fire, that's a massive difference.

So you need either AP Ammo IV or the new piercing mod to be really effective.

is there a thread explaining how armor DR works ?

from what i 've read on gold it's a flat 50 damage reduction per bullet
but wouldn't that mean that a modless GPR  without passives would deal no damage at all

[UnknownMercenary]

BlackDahlia424 wrote...

Jay_Hoxtatron wrote...

The base damage could use a buff.

I agree, a 10% buff would be perfect, I think. Especially if AR was removed from it.

AaronEh wrote...
No you don't.  Warp IV gives 65% armour
weakness - same as the basic Assault Rifle piercing mod.  It will have
the same effect on Armour DR

The way I thought it worked was that armor weakness just meant that armor took more damage from all sources, but the armor reduction from weapons still applied the same way as before. So while armor weakening might increase the damage against armor, it still suffers a penalty. Correct me if I'm wrong.

I've suggested before that the Typhoon should get the same base damage as the Revenant, but that'd make it more powerful than it was pre-nerf

Also I was under the impression that armor weakening works the same as piercing, except it applies to damage from all sources, not just the individual's gun. Warp ammo has a listed bonus damage to armor/barriers/health separate from the weakening.

[BlackDahlia424]

cgj wrote...

Feneckus wrote...

Kenadian wrote...

Granted the innate piercing on the Typhoon means you don't have to take AP ammo, and can substitute Warp IV with an EB and get pretty decent results too.

The Typhoon loses 75 damage per shot against armor on Gold/Plat.

With Warp IV, you lose 26.25 per shot.
With AP IV, you only lose 7.5 per shot.

At that rate of fire, that's a massive difference.

So you need either AP Ammo IV or the new piercing mod to be really effective.

is there a thread explaining how armor DR works ?

from what i 've read on gold it's a flat 50 damage reduction per bullet
but wouldn't that mean that a modless GPR  without passives would deal no damage at all

The Typhoon loses more damage against armor than other guns due to its multipliers to protections - meaning it loses 50*1.5 damage, which is 75. This is a HUGE problem because the whole point of the gun is to take down heavy armored targets.

As far as a modless GPR, I think the damage can't go any lower than 5.

[AaronEh]

BlackDahlia424 wrote...

Jay_Hoxtatron wrote...

The base damage could use a buff.

I agree, a 10% buff would be perfect, I think. Especially if AR was removed from it.

AaronEh wrote...
No you don't.  Warp IV gives 65% armour
weakness - same as the basic Assault Rifle piercing mod.  It will have
the same effect on Armour DR

The way I thought it worked was that armor weakness just meant that armor took more damage from all sources, but the armor reduction from weapons still applied the same way as before. So while armor weakening might increase the damage against armor, it still suffers a penalty. Correct me if I'm wrong.

It's in Peddro's thread here social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/347/index/10639449/1#10639449

Modifié par AaronEh, 10 décembre 2012 - 07:44 .

[Whapa]

I must be doing something wrong then, my highest scores on Gold (from a new to gold player, less than 100 gold games so far) came from playing it on my Turian Sentinel Warp Ammo 3, AR Gear 3, AR amp 3, Typhoon lvl 1, vs Cerberus and Collectors, both times scored above 120K, and the group I play with I normally end up with 75-100K is all.

I am going to love every upgrade I get for this gun.  ( I probably was doing it wrong, probably should have just had the EB V instead of the HVB V on it.)