57 réponses à ce sujet

[BubbleDncr]

The only game I've played with a protagonist switch was LA Noir and I wasn't particularly a fan. Mainly because I liked the second protagonist a LOT better than the first one, so when time came to switch back, I was disappointed.

When its for short amounts of time, like ME2 or the prison rescue in Origins, then it's cool tho.

[Dragoonlordz]

Switching protaganists is what put me off even buying that recent game which I think might have been Game of Thrones. I thought was silly and would be very detrimental to building the character / player relationship. I don't mind it in things like DLC because the game is about you and your character, if left to only switch in DLC then that is outside of the main game and the different perspective as an optional thing if people wanted to do such.

Like Leliana's Song and Darkspawn Chronicles, as DLC I thought was fine, in main game no thanks. The Joker mission in ME2 was okay but only because it was a one off short period of time and were not faffing about switching constantly or too much, if the mission took much longer I would of started to get annoyed because he was not my character of which I spent whole game creating and crafting persona plus building the player / character relationship.

Modifié par Dragoonlordz, 11 décembre 2012 - 08:08 .

[Dragoonlordz]

"Hey dude I heard you like made your own character and stuff..."

Yeh his name is....

"Whatever dude, forget him, here's random Joe. Give him a whirl instead!"

Wait.. what? But I was just about to...

"Naw man forget it, maybe I will let you play your character later but for now use this dude."

I don't want to, I want to continue my characters story...

"Boo hoo man, cry me a river. Too bad...so sad. Don't get attached to your character. trololo"

Modifié par Dragoonlordz, 11 décembre 2012 - 08:20 .

[Medhia Nox]

@Dragoonlordz: See - you envision this much more like tabletop RPing than I do. There's not enough programming in the world to compensate for tabletop gaming - so, I look at video game RPGs as more of an interactive story (a complex choose your own adventure really).

So I have no problem making a handful of main characters and having each one take the lead at various parts in the story.

Have you ever played the antiquated Gold Box games? Primitive to be sure - but it was nice to make all the characters. Can't think of a single RPG that's done this in a decade (and if someone can - tell me, I'd probably love it)

[Narosian]

AnacondaDarce wrote...

Judging from the Storytelling aspect and end of DA2 and the name of DA3 (Inquisition), lets assume (for the sake of this post) your job as the inquisitor is too figure out how the mage/templar rebellion started and to find the man/woman at the center of  it's starting point, Hawke.
 
How would you feel about playing a portion of the game, be it small or large, as the inquisitor and after finding him/her reprising your role as Hawke as the main character for the remainder of the game while your inquisitor dies, drops into a companion role or simply fades away?

I'm aware you could do this with a simple party member switch (RB, LB etc) but when i say reprise role as Hawke i mean he/she would become the games focus point. I assume Cassandra didn't spend all that time questioning Varric on Hawke's whereabout's for nothing, did she?

I've had the assumption for a while now that it was and we will never see hawke again.  I'm probably in the minority though in that I actually kind of liked hawke.

[Steppenwolf]

Why would our task in the new game be a repeat of a task an NPC was already doing in the previous game? Is Cassandra's information not good enough?

[Dragoonlordz]

Medhia Nox wrote...

@Dragoonlordz: See - you envision this much more like tabletop RPing than I do. There's not enough programming in the world to compensate for tabletop gaming - so, I look at video game RPGs as more of an interactive story (a complex choose your own adventure really).

So I have no problem making a handful of main characters and having each one take the lead at various parts in the story.

Have you ever played the antiquated Gold Box games? Primitive to be sure - but it was nice to make all the characters. Can't think of a single RPG that's done this in a decade (and if someone can - tell me, I'd probably love it)

I think of the way I play to be no different to choose your own adventure books though tabletop style is also quite accurate too. I don't recall any choose your own adventure books from my past etc that had me switching characters (I just ordered entire fighting fantasy, lone wolf and freeway warrior collections for christmas this year out of coincidence).

It is just the main game I hate switching characters as I consider the core game to be about me (generally more a self-insert RPer in most RPG's where possible) and the world, my characters role in it and my choices. I do think different perspective, alternative view of world and story via alternative protaganist is okay in DLC however because it is optional, you are not forced disconnect from your character and his story.

In the olden days you were given character selection in order to play a different perspective on stories but these days due to CC, choice/consequence, dialogue and plot branching etc you can generally create a different perspective without having to write an entire different game or expansion or multiple switching in game. Playing a different role within the same world under different pre-existing character I think is better handled just as DLC. The main game these days has enough elements to gain multiple different perspectives using current gameplay mechanics I just described for most people.

Modifié par Dragoonlordz, 11 décembre 2012 - 09:00 .

[lil yonce]

GTA5 is building its entire story around switching protagonists from what I understand. I like this idea, though to a lesser degree for Dragon Age. Its one way to bring back both Hawke and the Warden, even only briefly, and shed light on their disappearances, and have their current actions impact the main story. Both previous protagonists are back in action and better yet, player agency is preserved.

Modifié par Youth4Ever, 11 décembre 2012 - 09:01 .

[Felya87]

I have to say I don't like Hawke. But I'd like, fot the time of a mission, to be able to use her again, or, much better, my old Warden. I would not like a total switch, an even less find my Warden and Hawke face to face with the new character.
Still, would be refreshing play for the time of a mission, like in Fort Drakon and during the battle in Denerim against the Darkspawn, have the control of old character and companions, than return to the actual protagonist.
I'd like to see My CE Warden fight her last battle in the Deep Roads with her brother in arms/lover Alistair, maybe helping the Inquisitor or an important character escape Darkspawn. And finally have a really closure to the character, thing that was taken away by Leliana with just few words in DA2.

Still, those should be few occasions and well used, just to made the game less repetitive.
I would be pissed to have to use Hawke more than the necessary, and in the end I just want to know what happened to my Warden, so I would be more than happy with only a mission. even a death mission.

[Dragoonlordz]

Also I should add, I feel no need to play Hawke or Warden again. They had their games and DLC or expansions I got to play them in. This next game is about a new character for me, one to play during game and DLC for this next title -his story and his role not previous characters. I think cheapens the character of this next game and his story if invaded and taken over by previous characters which already had entire games and DLC to play them in and tell their stories.

Modifié par Dragoonlordz, 11 décembre 2012 - 09:19 .

[DarkKnightHolmes]

Why would I want to be Hawke, of all people, again?

[lil yonce]

I'd like to start out as Hawke. See what he's been up to since the end of DA2, move to the Inquisitor, at some point much later in the story briefly take control of the Warden, and then go back to the Inquisitor for the rest of the game.

[lil yonce]

Dragoonlordz wrote...

Also I should add, I feel no need to play Hawke or Warden again. They had their games and DLC or expansions I got to play them in. This next game is about a new character for me, one to play during game and DLC for this next title -his story and his role not previous characters. I think cheapens the character of this next game and his story if invaded and taken over by previous characters which already had entire games and DLC to play them in and tell their stories.

Their storylines aren't entirely independent, and they haven't been wrapped up just yet. Hawke and the Warden both disappeared. I want to know what happened to them.

Modifié par Youth4Ever, 11 décembre 2012 - 09:35 .

[Dragoonlordz]

Youth4Ever wrote...

Dragoonlordz wrote...

Also I should add, I feel no need to play Hawke or Warden again. They had their games and DLC or expansions I got to play them in. This next game is about a new character for me, one to play during game and DLC for this next title -his story and his role not previous characters. I think cheapens the character of this next game and his story if invaded and taken over by previous characters which already had entire games and DLC to play them in and tell their stories.

Their storylines aren't entirely independant, and they haven't been wrapped up just yet. Hawke and the Warden both disappeared. I want to know what happened to them.

For that I rather they use cameos and not playable. Like I said the next game (for me) is about the new guy and his story not theirs. I had entire games where could play as them, explaining what happened to them for me does not require playing them again. As I also said it cheapens the next character for me if forced to disconnect from him to replay one that I have spent entire previous games playing.

Modifié par Dragoonlordz, 11 décembre 2012 - 09:30 .

[lil yonce]

Dragoonlordz wrote...

For that I rather they use cameos and not playable. Like I said the next game for me as about the new guy and his story not theirs. I had entire games where could play as them, explaining what happened to them for me does not require playing them again. Like I said it cheapens the next character for me if forced to disconnect from him to replay one that I have spent entire previous games playing.

But with cameos you have issues with player agency. And their role in DA3 could involve more than an explanation for their disappearance. If they make a decision that has an impact on the story, I don't want to just hear about it, I want to play it.

[Dragoonlordz]

Youth4Ever wrote...

Dragoonlordz wrote...

For that I rather they use cameos and not playable. Like I said the next game for me as about the new guy and his story not theirs. I had entire games where could play as them, explaining what happened to them for me does not require playing them again. Like I said it cheapens the next character for me if forced to disconnect from him to replay one that I have spent entire previous games playing.

But with cameos you have issues with player agency. And their role in DA3 could involve more than an explanation for their disappearance. If they make a decision that has an impact on the story, I don't want to just hear about it, I want to play it.

And I don't want to disconnect from my character in DA3 to be sidetracked into replaying one I already spent entire games and DLC playing already which can go back and continue to playing over again anytime I want. I want the next character to be given the same respect, time and attention as those previous ones already received in their respective games. Such is life, what you want and what I want are merely different things, personal preferences. No right, no wrong just different desires.

Modifié par Dragoonlordz, 11 décembre 2012 - 09:44 .

[lil yonce]

Dragoonlordz wrote...

And I don't want to disconnect from my character in DA3 to be sidetracked into replaying one I already spent entire games and DLC playing already which can go back and continue to playing over again anytime I want.

What if the Inquisitor's story doesn't actually begin until say, an opening playable cameo of Hawke's has been completed? Then you wouldn't be disconnected from the new protagonist, as he hasn't even been introduced.

Such is life, what you want and what I want are merely different things, personal preferences. No right, no wrong just different desires.

True, but I think there can be some kind of compromise.

Modifié par Youth4Ever, 12 décembre 2012 - 05:30 .

[Dragoonlordz]

Youth4Ever wrote...

Dragoonlordz wrote...

And I don't want to disconnect from my character in DA3 to be sidetracked into replaying one I already spent entire games and DLC playing already which can go back and continue to playing over again anytime I want.

What if the Inquisitors story doesn't actually begin until say, an opening cameo of Hawke's has been completed? Then you wouldn't be disconnected from the new protagonist as he hasn't even been introduced.

Would feel like someone just plopped in some DAO and DA2 DLC on the disc prior to playing DA3. It would have to be pretty big in content to have any actual decent impact on story which would end up limiting the amount of content for main protaganists story. Only so much time, money and resources available which is why DLC tends to be created after the game has shipped because of the amount of time even couple hour ones like Omega and Leviathan (recently took months each). Your going to probably be cutting out months of time that could be spent on increasing, improving and adding to the Inquisitors story to put in this pre-game pre-protaganist addon to the game. My preference is take those months and make new protaganists story longer and better instead.

Modifié par Dragoonlordz, 11 décembre 2012 - 10:09 .

[lil yonce]

Dragoonlordz wrote...

Would feel like someone just plopped in some DAO and DA2 DLC on the disc prior to playing DA3. It would have to be pretty big in content to have any actual decent impact on story which would end up limiting the amount of content for main protaganists story.

Not necessarily. In Dragon's Dogma, you control a former Arisen for a ten minute mission at the beginning of the game before starting the main story as your own Arisen, but your action as the former Arisen affects your understanding of what's happening to your own Arisen as the story progresses.

Modifié par Youth4Ever, 12 décembre 2012 - 05:29 .

[Dragoonlordz]

I simply have no desire to play Hawke or Warden again. I want to spend (all my time) playing the Inquisitor in DA3. I would like any previous protaganist to be handled in cameos and overhearing banter, dialogue with NPC's etc. That is merely my preference, I see no reason why that should change. If push comes to shove maybe they can put playable Hawke and Warden part as optional (day one) DLC like Javik and Sebastion (in fact that would probably make them vast amounts of money).

If they decide to add playable previous protaganists to the game then that is merely something I will have to deal with, I am sure might improve game for some but not others like myself who does not want or desire to play Warden or Hawke again. If they decide to not add them as playable and restrict to cameo, banter, dialogue then some like yourself might not like that while I myself might prefer that situation.

Whatever they do there will be some who like and some who do not. I have no idea what they will do I can only state what I want and others do the same. No game is perfect, all have parts that every person will like and not like. I am pretty sure your not going to be able to convince me to want something I do not want.

Modifié par Dragoonlordz, 11 décembre 2012 - 10:32 .

[lil yonce]

Dragoonlordz wrote...

If push comes to shove maybe they can put playable Hawke and Warden part as optional (day one) DLC like Javik and Sebastion (in fact that would probably make them vast amounts of money).

Don't give them ideas! No more day-one DLC of that nature. Nothing that can influence the story in any way if it doesn't come with a new copy of every game. It's not fair.

No game is perfect, all have parts that every person will like and not like. I am pretty sure your not going to be able to convince me to want something I do not want.

I'm not trying to make you want Hawke or the Warden back for DA3, just demonstrate that their appearances don't have to negatively affect your playtime as the Inquistor, as you said it would cheapen that experience.

Modifié par Youth4Ever, 12 décembre 2012 - 05:31 .

[The Hierophant]

Sylvius the Mad wrote...

The Hierophant wrote...

I'd rather the pc be optional for side quests, and the companion that's designated as party leader in their stead would have dialogue options to compliment their persona.

This is a terrific suggestion.  The PC should not always have to be part of the active party.

Much like the rescue in KotOR, the assault in KotOR2, or the rescue in DAO.

Exactly, but unlike the Leviathan and the Fort Drakon rescue mssions the pc's absence in the mission is up to the player.

Modifié par The Hierophant, 11 décembre 2012 - 10:53 .

[Dragoonlordz]

Youth4Ever wrote...

Dragoonlordz wrote...

If push comes to shove maybe they can put playable Hawke and Warden part as optional (day one) DLC like Javik and Sebastion (in fact that would probably make them vast amounts of money).

Don't give them ideas! No more day-one DLC of that nature. Nothing that can influence the story in any way if it doesn't come with a new copy of every game. It's not fair.

No game is perfect, all have parts that every person will like and not like. I am pretty sure your not going to be able to convince me to want something I do not want.

I'm not trying to make you want Hawke or the Warden back for DA3, just that their appearances don't have to negatively affect your playtime as the Inquistor, as you said it would cheapen that experience.

My playtime with the new character would be effected negatively by forcing me to play as a previous ones from previous games because the amount of content to make room for this additional time spent playing a different character has to come out of the time that could of been spent making the new characters story longer and better.

In the end however it cannot escape the reality of that I personally do not wish to play Hawke or Warden in DA3 since I feel I spent enough time playing them and can play them again whenever want in previous games, just wanting to play the new one, the game to be about him not them, time spent making his story as great as can be. No desire to play as Warden or Hawke not prior to new character, not in the middle and not at the end.

I am not saying would be the end of the world to do so, it is just not something that interests me and I think would have a negative impact on my enjoyment of the new character. It would be like forcing the player to play Leliana's Song at the start of every new playthrough in DAO to me, it was better done as optional DLC if has to be playable. If it is not playable then can be referenced and cameo'd for the information you require about what happened to them after previous games.

I simply see no adequate reason to make them playable outside of fanservice to those who want to play them again of which I do not personally. I would rather the time spent on the new protaganist and certainly not disconnecting me from the new protaganist during the game itself. I think I made clear how I feel about this over course of thread so far, so I will leave it at that.

Modifié par Dragoonlordz, 12 décembre 2012 - 12:10 .

[philippe willaume]

Sylvius the Mad wrote...

The Hierophant wrote...

I'd rather the pc be optional for side quests, and the companion that's designated as party leader in their stead would have dialogue options to compliment their persona.

This is a terrific suggestion.  The PC should not always have to be part of the active party.

Much like the rescue in KotOR, the assault in KotOR2, or the rescue in DAO.

+1

[Dragoonlordz]

The other solution is making them a temporary companion and not a temporary replacement protaganist at all. Not switching protaganists but letting Hawke or Warden tag along as part of the party would be acceptable to me as long as the new protaganist from DA3 remains the protaganist not disconnected or switched out of play. Would make for some interesting scenes if given dialogue wheel to both characters at once in conversations with each other but I do not want to have my new protaganist kicked out of the story (at any time) during the game. It should be about him not them, they had their stories now it's his turn.

Modifié par Dragoonlordz, 12 décembre 2012 - 12:03 .