341 réponses à ce sujet

[xTh3xBusinessx]

Someone ready's up in my lobby=insta kick. Same goes for people who just slap anything on to make it look good. Im lookin at the ppl using an AR with smg rails on -.- But seriously, in gold/platinum, use them. Makes a better impression.

[Kenadian]

Miniditka77 wrote...

hostaman wrote...

This is a very strange argument. Consumables are no more a crutch, than going into a game with a level X weapon. You always want to give yourself the best chance of (a) doing well, and ( serving your team.

^^This^^

The Harrier is a crutch, so I'm not going to use mine any more.  If I finish 1st on the scoreboard in my Gold match, I feel like it was my Harrier and not me.  In fact, I'm only using the Avenger X from now on.  That way, the scoreboard will accurately reflect my skill.

You lazy ****, use your powers only. No, your face.

[Xena_Shepard]

Miniditka77 wrote...

The Harrier is a crutch, so I'm not
going to use mine any more.  If I finish 1st on the scoreboard in my
Gold match, I feel like it was my Harrier and not me.  In fact, I'm only
using the Avenger X from now on.  That way, the scoreboard will
accurately reflect my skill.

The irony is that this
is exactly (sans the sarcasm) how one of my xbox buddies feels. He
stopped using the Harrier because he felt it makes the game too easy.

xTh3xBusinessx wrote...

Someone ready's up in my lobby=insta kick. Same goes for people who just slap anything on to make it look good. Im lookin at the ppl using an AR with smg rails on -.- But seriously, in gold/platinum, use them. Makes a better impression.

There seems to be a lot of illogical arguments made, and your last sentence is one of them. I ask this: why am I interested in giving random strangers in a game a good impression? I can all ready tell you the answer: I'm not. But I'd like to know why you think I should. It seems people put a lot of weight on giving good impressions to strangers, rather strange...

Modifié par Xena_Shepard, 11 décembre 2012 - 11:37 .

[Xena_Shepard]

Double post.

Modifié par Xena_Shepard, 11 décembre 2012 - 11:37 .

[Shinnyshin]

Xena_Shepard wrote...

Not sure why you say that, I've been nothing but civil. It's quite rude, however, to assume something about me when you've never played with/talked to me.

Probably because of this:

Xena_Shepard wrote...

Zero132132 wrote...

Xena_Shepard wrote...

I'm the type that values actual inherent player skill. People think they're good if they use consumable gear, but it's just the gear that's good.

This is an RPG-shooter. Decisions about your build and how it interacts with your playstyle are going to affect your effectiveness substantially. In a game where intelligent decision-making benefits your effectiveness, deciding on effective builds IS a skill.

This game isn't really that difficult in terms of gameplay. If you lack the ability to ensure that you're effective with a given character and loadout, then you lack one of the only skills that's actually useful in this game. If your loadout never includes equipment, then you probably lack this skill, and I don't want to have to carry you.

That's fine, I don't want to have to play with you and carry you either [smilie]http://social.bioware.com/images/forum/emoticons/happy.png[/smilie]

That part where a guy politely and concisely presented a case for why consumables as part of a build can be tied to player skill given the RPG elements in this game.

And where you jumped down his throat for saying that statistically, people without consumables are more likely to lack the kind of skill he was discussing and need to be carried more often...rather than acknowledging his argument, which very politely and reasonably casts doubt on some of the fundamental (mis)assumptions you're using to fuel all of your points.  This happened several times, often with you responding to polite and reasonable arguments with ad hominem attacks in lieu of a proper counterargument.

Xena_Shepard wrote...

xTh3xBusinessx wrote...

Someone ready's up in my lobby=insta kick. Same goes for people who just slap anything on to make it look good. Im lookin at the ppl using an AR with smg rails on -.- But seriously, in gold/platinum, use them. Makes a better impression.

There seems to be a lot of illogical arguments made, and your last sentence is one of them. I ask this: why am I interested in giving random strangers in a game a good impression? I can all ready tell you the answer: I'm not. But I'd like to know why you think I should. It seems people put a lot of weight on giving good impressions to strangers, rather strange...

It's a perfectly logical argument.  You made this thread because someone called you a "noob" for not having consumables.  We're saying that many people without consumables give a bad enough impression that many of us kick (or barely decide not to kick) them.  You've said many times you're interested in not getting kicked.  Which is exactly what people are talking about here.

There's no binding contract that people must suffer through a game with someone they think will make it miserable.  If you give the impression that you'll be a leech (even if you aren't), it's completely understandable that people would kick you.  Perfectly logical.  

Modifié par Shinnyshin, 12 décembre 2012 - 12:23 .

[Counter_Mixture]

I think they're a reasonable requirement for gold or platinum games.

[Zjarcal]

Xena_Shepard wrote...

Hence why I consider equipment a crutch, which I don't need.

Newsflash for you, you're not the only who doesn't need it.

Xena_Shepard wrote...

If I said the real reason why I understand why people use equipment, I'd get blasted for it.

Lemme take a guess, you think we all could never come even close to clearing a gold or platinum game in a timely fashion without equipment and that we're terribad players without it?

Did I guess correctly? Something tells me I did.

Also, speak your mind freely, you're gonna get blasted anyway. 

EDIT: Lol, just saw your manifest... for someone who never uses consumables, your stockpile isn't as high as one would imagine. 

Modifié par Zjarcal, 12 décembre 2012 - 12:15 .

[Xena_Shepard]

Shinnyshin wrote...

Xena_Shepard wrote...

Not sure why you say that, I've been nothing but civil. It's quite rude, however, to assume something about me when you've never played with/talked to me.

Probably because of this:

Xena_Shepard wrote...

Zero132132 wrote...

Xena_Shepard wrote...

I'm the type that values actual inherent player skill. People think they're good if they use consumable gear, but it's just the gear that's good.

This is an RPG-shooter. Decisions about your build and how it interacts with your playstyle are going to affect your effectiveness substantially. In a game where intelligent decision-making benefits your effectiveness, deciding on effective builds IS a skill.

This game isn't really that difficult in terms of gameplay. If you lack the ability to ensure that you're effective with a given character and loadout, then you lack one of the only skills that's actually useful in this game. If your loadout never includes equipment, then you probably lack this skill, and I don't want to have to carry you.

That's fine, I don't want to have to play with you and carry you either [smilie]http://social.bioware.com/images/forum/emoticons/happy.png[/smilie]

That part where a guy politely and concisely presented a case for why consumables as part of a build can be tied to player skill given the RPG elements in this game.

And where you jumped down his throat for saying that statistically, people without consumables are more likely to lack the kind of skill he was discussing and need to be carried more often...rather than acknowledging his argument, which very politely and reasonably casts doubt on some of the fundamental (mis)assumptions you're using to fuel all of your points.

Xena_Shepard wrote...

xTh3xBusinessx wrote...

Someone ready's up in my lobby=insta kick. Same goes for people who just slap anything on to make it look good. Im lookin at the ppl using an AR with smg rails on -.- But seriously, in gold/platinum, use them. Makes a better impression.

There seems to be a lot of illogical arguments made, and your last sentence is one of them. I ask this: why am I interested in giving random strangers in a game a good impression? I can all ready tell you the answer: I'm not. But I'd like to know why you think I should. It seems people put a lot of weight on giving good impressions to strangers, rather strange...

It's a perfectly logical argument.  You made this thread because someone called you a "noob" for not having consumables.  We're saying that many people without consumables give a bad enough impression that many of us kick (or barely decide not to kick) them.  You've said many times you're interested in not getting kicked.  Which is exactly what people are talking about here.

There's no binding contract that people must suffer through a game with someone they think will make it miserable.  If you give the impression that you'll be a leech (even if you aren't), it's completely understandable that people would kick you.  Perfectly logical.  

I don't really see how saying anybody "with intelligence" WILL use equipment, or how saying he'll have to carry me (when it'd probably be the opposite) is polite in the slightest... If I misundrstood his tone, sorry.

I believe I said at some point that I've only ever been called a noob for lack of equipment once... I made this thread because I was (as stated in the initial post) genuinely curious as to why people think that way.

I've also only ever been kicked once because of my lack of equipment... so it's not because of that either.

Zjarcal wrote...

Xena_Shepard wrote...

Hence why I consider equipment a crutch, which I don't need.

Newsflash for you, you're not the only who doesn't need it.

Xena_Shepard wrote...

If I said the real reason why I understand why people use equipment, I'd get blasted for it.

Lemme
take a guess, you think we all could never come even close to clearing a
gold or platinum game in a timely fashion without equipment and that
we're terribad players without it?

Did I guess correctly? Something tells me I did.

Also, speak your mind freely, you're gonna get blasted anyway. [smilie]http://social.bioware.com/images/forum/emoticons/wizard.png[/smilie]

EDIT: Lol, just saw your manifest... for someone who never uses consumables, your stockpile isn't as high as one would imagine. [smilie]http://social.bioware.com/images/forum/emoticons/sideways.png[/smilie]

OK, I'll say it: in my experience, the people who use equipment are just out to ramp up their score. They're the ones I see the most not bother with objectives, or not be a team player.

Well... I have a around 20-30 of the level III's and 10+ of the level IV's... That seems like a relatively big stockpile to me.

Modifié par Xena_Shepard, 12 décembre 2012 - 12:28 .

[aimimia]

I sent you a message to get you to add me on origin. I need to figure out how there is someone with madz skills like you that I haven't seen before. I might be able to learn a thing or two since you top score boards without using any consumables

[Bolo Xia]

does the planet you come from have a name?

[Zjarcal]

Xena_Shepard wrote...

OK, I'll say it: in my experience, the people who use equipment are just out to ramp up their score. They're the ones I see the most not bother with objectives, or not be a team player.

Oh dear, I may have been off in my guess, but this reply is priceless. 

[SOMETHING_FOR_NOTHING]

Xena_Shepard wrote...


OK, I'll say it: in my experience, the people who use equipment are just out to ramp up their score. They're the ones I see the most not bother with objectives, or not be a team player.

Well... I have a around 20-30 of the level III's and 10+ of the level IV's... That seems like a relatively big stockpile to me.

they are the same ppl who use all 5 missiles in rapid succession on wave 11 just to stat pad there score higher....its the only conclusion why anyone would waste 5 god dam missiles on wave 11

[Jay_Hoxtatron]

Quick question : how long are the matches for you on average OP?

[Caligno]

Xena_Shepard wrote...

OK, I'll say it: in my experience, the people who use equipment are just out to ramp up their score. They're the ones I see the most not bother with objectives, or not be a team player.

I really don't see how other people using consumables having less of a chance to work together as a team translates to refusing to use them because they're a crutch.

[aimimia]

Caligno wrote...

Xena_Shepard wrote...

OK, I'll say it: in my experience, the people who use equipment are just out to ramp up their score. They're the ones I see the most not bother with objectives, or not be a team player.

I really don't see how other people using consumables having less of a chance to work together as a team translates to refusing to use them because they're a crutch.

Lol I thought you would have given up sense after the first page >.<

[Caligno]

aimimia wrote...

Caligno wrote...

Xena_Shepard wrote...

OK, I'll say it: in my experience, the people who use equipment are just out to ramp up their score. They're the ones I see the most not bother with objectives, or not be a team player.

I really don't see how other people using consumables having less of a chance to work together as a team translates to refusing to use them because they're a crutch.

Lol I thought you would have given up sense after the first page >.<

I just want to see more. I don't really know why.

[Shinnyshin]

Xena_Shepard wrote...
I don't really see how saying anybody "with intelligence" WILL use equipment, or how saying he'll have to carry me (when it'd probably be the opposite) is polite in the slightest... If I misundrstood his tone, sorry. 

I believe I said at some point that I've only ever been called a noob for lack of equipment once... I made this thread because I was (as stated in the initial post) genuinely curious as to why people think that way.

I've also only ever been kicked once because of my lack of equipment... so it's not because of that either.

Yeah, you misunderstood his tone.  He wasn't saying he'd have to carry you PERSONALLY.  He was saying that if someone comes into a game without equipment, there's a much higher chance that he'll have to carry them.  If you walk into my room with zero consumables and a Widow II, you could be Jay Hoxatron on a friend's account...or you could be someone who clearly shouldn't be in this game and is going to make the run much, much, much harder for everyone.

Given that there's about a 99% chance of the latter, he was saying that he'd probably have to carry someone who brought in that loadout.

His other point was that optimizing your build is a kind of skill that's inherent in games with RPG mechanics.  He stated that we have to make intelligent decisions about how to spec and what loadouts to bring for each kit...and that equipment plays a part with this.  That's what his bit with intelligence was.  He wasn't calling you an idiot; instead, he was saying that equipment factors into the equation while making those intelligent, informed decisions about builds.

[Whapa]

Been following this thread throughout the day, still trying to wrap my head around OP's point/reasoning, at some points seems willing to be logical and seeing others viewpoints, but other posts seem pretty trollish.

Honestly if your 1 that doesn't need consumables, fine, whatever.  I personally don't see a point to not using them anymore, it helps everyone out, not just yourself, and if you honestly think that the consumables are what are getting you your scores........ yeah I got nothing for that train of thought.

edit: 

Caligno wrote...

[I just want to see more. I don't really know why.

Thats how I feel about this thread, just wanting part of it to make sense in my brain

Modifié par Phyrex82, 12 décembre 2012 - 12:54 .

[SGreenwell]

One question Xena - Do you also consider rockets and medigels consumables? From a practical standpoint, they're no different than the things like the ammo equipment and armor buffs, except that you don't have to equip them pre-mission.

[jotun04]

It is kind of a dick move to not use equipment if everyone else is.

[Invader Nemesis]

xTh3xBusinessx wrote...

Someone ready's up in my lobby=insta kick. Same goes for people who just slap anything on to make it look good. Im lookin at the ppl using an AR with smg rails on -.- But seriously, in gold/platinum, use them. Makes a better impression.

This. I can understand if someone is out of something though. Like shotgun rail amps(I am very low on those myself), they could use the gear bonus instead. 

[Xena_Shepard]

Jay_Hoxtatron wrote...

Quick question : how long are the matches for you on average OP?

20~25 mins.

[Eriseley]

Smoke 'em if you got 'em?

Plus I like combining Warp ammo with biotic classes, using AP ammo on guns so I can use other mods, and Incindiary or Disrupter for comboing.

[Whapa]

Eriseley wrote...

Smoke 'em if you got 'em?

Plus I like combining Warp ammo with biotic classes, using AP ammo on guns so I can use other mods, and Incindiary or Disrupter for comboing.

Seen this argument made throughout the thread but it seems as though this is considered "crutch" use of them by the OP, the reason for that I would like to know.

[doozerdude]

Xena_Shepard wrote...

In my opinion, it's quite the opposite. Consumable gear is just a crutch that helps people with no skill limp through a match...

I LOLed.

Yeh well, people who spec into rank 4 or higher of any powers are also just using those bonuses as a crutch cuz they have no skill.

Reall men builds:
3/3/3/3/3