223 réponses à ce sujet

[BridgeBurner]

Here's a few numbers for you:

Asari Heavy melee with full gear, omni-blade V and all bonusses active:

5422.5 points of damage versus shields/ barriers and armour.

And it gets better, that's resolved against up to THREE targets.



Now here's how much krogan heavy melee can do:

Let's take the strongest of the 3 krogan (vanguard doesn't count as a proper krogan), in this case, the soldier. Who incidentally also has the lowest survivability.

(Krogan soldier, with identical gear, full melee in rage, plus purging fortification at 100% melee damage)

5271 points of damage versus shields / barriers, 3953.25 damage versus armour.

Admittedly, he also does 5271 damage to health (more than the asari). He can't kill 3 things with one melee though.

He has ZERO aoe damage, he requires TWO kills and must sacrifice his damage protection power to reach maximum damage output; gains no 50% modifier versus shields and LOSES 25% damage versus armour.

The asari huntress requires ONE kill, and sacrifices NOTHING for activating her cloak; can carry a heavy shotgun to add extra weapon damage as she is pretty much unaffected by cooldowns. She also doesn't need to be right up in the enemy's face to melee them.

Krogan are large, lack mobility, lack cloak, to reach the damage listed must sacrifice DR, are more vulnerable to sync kills due to low mobility and their melee has no range.

Here's how it looks: (number of heavy melee's with full bonusses to kill)

Phantom: Huntress: 1 / Krogan soldier: 1

Pyro: Huntress: 1 / Krogan soldier: 2

Scions: Huntress: 4 / Krogan soldier: 5

Brutes: Huntress: 3 / krogan soldier: 4

Ravagers: Huntress: 2 / Krogan soldier: 3

Primes / Banshees: Huntress: 6 / Krogan soldier: 7

Modifié par Annomander, 12 décembre 2012 - 06:44 .

[Eriseley]

Eh, no mobility though. I like the Krogan melee much better to setting up in range of the People's Elbow.

[TheKillerAngel]

The asari is much less durable than a krogran, so on average it is more difficult to kill a target using her melee than any krogan kit's..

[BurningLiquor]

It is hilariously absurd, I know.

[Darkshadowmark]

Krogans are cooler. So is the fury. Thus, your argument is invalid. I'm sorry.

[DullahansXMark]

The Krogan's melee is fast enough to hit those two other targets before the Asari finishes her orgasm, though.

[Tyrannus00]

Annomander wrote...

DIsclaimer: "kroguard" is not a counter argument, the kroguard is for pansies.

Here's a few numbers for you:

Asari Heavy melee with full gear, omni-blade V and all bonusses active:

5422.5 points of damage versus shields/ barriers and armour.

And it gets better, that's resolved against up to THREE targets.



Now here's how much krogan heavy melee can do:

(Krogan soldier, with identical gear, full melee in rage, plus purging fortification at 100% melee damage)

5271 points of damage versus shields / barriers, 3953.25 damage versus armour.

He also has ZERO aoe damage, requires TWO kills to reach his max damage bonus, and must sacrifice his damage protection power to reach maximum damage output; gains no 50% modifier versus shields and LOSES 25% damage versus armour.

The asari huntress requires ONE kill, and sacrifices NOTHING for activating her cloak; can carry a heavy shotgun to add extra weapon damage as she is pretty much unaffected by cooldowns. She also doesn't need to be right up in the enemy's face to melee them.

Krogan are large, lack mobility, lack cloak, to reach the damage listed must sacrifice DR, are more vulnerable to sync kills due to low mobility and their melee has no range.

Here's how it looks: (number of heavy melee's with full bonusses to kill)

Phantom: Huntress: 1 / Krogan soldier: 1

Pyro: Huntress: 1 / Krogan soldier: 2

Scions: Huntress: 4 / Krogan soldier: 5

Brutes: Huntress: 3 / krogan soldier: 4

Ravagers: Huntress: 2 / Krogan soldier: 3

Primes / Banshees: Huntress: 6 / Krogan soldier: 7

Bout your graph there. It's got like seven things on the right side, and three on the left. Of course it's going to be unbalanced. 

[capn233]

I support Krogan melee dominance.

[Jay_Hoxtatron]

Yeah but before everything, buff the Typhoon Biower.

[BridgeBurner]

TheKillerAngel wrote...

The asari is much less durable than a krogran, so on average it is more difficult to kill a target using her melee than any krogan kit's..

You need to play with me more often when I'm melee'ing.

I am pretty darn good at it, and I can safely say as a veteran of a lot of melee builds, that the krogan right now are second rate. Health and shields + DR =/= dodge, cloak and more damage.

[BridgeBurner]

Jay_Hoxtatron wrote...

Yeah but before everything, buff the Typhoon Biower.

Actually, when I was making my "scale of balance" I decided I'd throw the typhoon on there because I know some people who really like it.

[Shampoohorn]

I love my melee QFI (6007.5 max damage), but cloak's 130%-170% melee bonus is an effing joke.

[BridgeBurner]

DullahansXMark wrote...

The Krogan's melee is fast enough to hit those two other targets before the Asari finishes her orgasm, though.

Wrong.

[CNevarezN]

Hm.. Stick with the Huntress then, OP. I like both characters, but the Krogan Soldier will always be Gangsta.

[JerZey CJ]

I still like the Shadow for melee the best.

[chefcook90]

CNevarezN wrote...

Hm.. Stick with the Huntress then, OP. I like both characters, but the Krogan Soldier will always be Gangsta.

"Haw, Haw, they're Dead! And on fire!"

[Lovaas]

The asari recovery time is an enemy to that strategy. While you finish her pillow talk animations you would get picked off by a sion/ravager/phantom/rocket pooper every time. Yes the numbers are in the Asari's favor but you have to consider:

1. No self respecting krogan forgives all health and damage reduction just to gain more melee damage on a race that already has superior melee capabilities.

2. Orgasm animation is a death trap when her melee is used unwisely.

This is the battle of what happens on paper versus what happens on the battlefield argument we see constantly on bsn. 
inb4 all infiltrators are op. 

Modifié par Lovaas, 12 décembre 2012 - 01:42 .

[X-Frame]

Would you suggest they buff the Krogan Soldier's melee bonuses? And any other classes like the Vorcha as well?

[Darkshadowmark]

X-Frame wrote...

Would you suggest they buff the Krogan Soldier's melee bonuses? And any other classes like the Vorcha as well?

Annoying petition thread.

Now.

[Shampoohorn]

X-Frame wrote...

Would you suggest they buff the Krogan Soldier's melee bonuses? And any other classes like the Vorcha as well?

The problem, as with many problems in MP is due to tactical cloak.   Cloak gets her a 170% boost to base damage which is then compounded by a 1.5x racial melee bonus to armor/barriers/shields.

[Ares Caesar]

The problem isnt with the Asari, its still with the Krogan.

You should simply change your topic title to "Buff Krogan Melee"

Quite frankly even at a nearly 10k damage melee, it'd still have its limits the higher you went up in difficulty due to stagger and sync-kill. Of course then it'd actually be a true "risk vs reward" power, unlike now where its mostly all risk with no real reward (compared to just shooting your gun the whole time).

The Krogan Soldier/Sentinel DEFINITELY need some work. They arent terrible, but they arent as good as they should be, particularly in what it seems like they were intended for (melee tanks).

Dont see a problem with the Asari Huntress, merely a problem with the Krogans that has existed since release 9 months ago.

[BridgeBurner]

X-Frame wrote...

Would you suggest they buff the Krogan Soldier's melee bonuses? And any other classes like the Vorcha as well?

I don't know.

I don't want the kroguard buffed in any way.

Which presents a problem, as the rage tree could possibly be shared for all 4 krogan: the shaman, sentinel and soldier need something, the kroguard doesn't.

Most of my preferred solutions require patching.... like having rage an activated ability instead of a passive....

And removing the penalty krogan receive for damage to armour etc....

Modifié par Annomander, 12 décembre 2012 - 01:46 .

[DullahansXMark]

Annomander wrote...

DullahansXMark wrote...

The Krogan's melee is fast enough to hit those two other targets before the Asari finishes her orgasm, though.

Wrong.

How?

[CmnDwnWrkn]

ha

Lovaas wrote...

The asari recovery time is an enemy to that strategy. While you finish her pillow talk animations you would get picked off by a sion/ravager/phantom/rocket pooper every time. Yes the numbers are in the Asari's favor but you have to consider:

1. No self respecting krogan forgives all health and damage reduction just to gain more melee damage on a race that already has superior melee capabilities.

2. Orgasm animation is a death trap when her melee is used unwisely.

This is the battle of what happens on paper versus what happens on the battlefield argument we see constantly on bsn. 
inb4 all infiltrators are op. 

I love that you're making an excuse for the fact that a damn Asari can now be speced to have a more power melee than a Krogan.  Before arguing, just take a minute to think about how ridiculous this is.

BioWare is turning this game into a ****ing joke.  Every week it gets that much worse.

[BridgeBurner]

DullahansXMark wrote...

Annomander wrote...

DullahansXMark wrote...

The Krogan's melee is fast enough to hit those two other targets before the Asari finishes her orgasm, though.

Wrong.

How?

Wind-up time + pimp slap will kill 1 target by the time the asari heavy melee has killed all 3. The wind up time isn't monumentally shorter for the krogan's HM, even if you engage at point blank range with the krogan.