359 réponses à ce sujet

[TattyUD]

I find the choice of powers very underwhelming. When you actually look at all of the the powers that he could have been given its difficult to not be disappointed.

Speaking of disappointment I'm surprised we've not seen this thread yet -

BEST EVER TURIAN ENGINEER BUILD! (Acolyte and Incendiary Ammo required)

[Stardusk]

TattyUD wrote...

I find the choice of powers very underwhelming. When you actually look at all of the the powers that he could have been given its difficult to not be disappointed.

Speaking of disappointment I'm surprised we've not seen this thread yet -

BEST EVER TURIAN ENGINEER BUILD! (Acolyte and Incendiary Ammo required)

...with the portable flamer...

[tCruzin4lyfe]

Not really feeling this guy, I may give him another go but it's too many better choices.

[Ziegrif]

Lord_Sirian wrote...

No amount of player skill can make a class good if the powers are horribly synergised. For example, imagine a class with:

Nova
Sabotage
Phase Disruptor

The best player in the world could not make the powers on this class work well together. The only way to make the class viable would be to strap a decent weapon on it, and rely on headshotting everything with a power used every now and then. But the vast majority of the class' usefulness (what little there would be) would come ENTIRELY from the player shooting his weapon of choice.

Phase Disruptor isn't bound on sabotage CD.
So.

Skip Nova.

6 points in everything else.

Sabotage + Phasors = Tech burst I think.

Compensate Sabotage slow CD with phasors + ammo power + falcon to create more explosions.
Have to use Shield recharge gear if you wanna use Phasors more can get enough with consumable.
Got to also utilize soft cover a lot but that's just normal.

Yeah I like that setup actually. Anyway we could change the Tengis powers to be these and the turret?

Edit: No wait! Sabotage, Stim packs and Phase disruptor! HAWT!

Modifié par Ziegrif, 12 décembre 2012 - 05:47 .

[UnknownMercenary]

xFCx Shade wrote...

UnknownMercenary wrote...

xFCx Shade wrote...

The player using it has the ability to make it good in their own way. Others do not need to agree.

I don't see what your point is. A good gun is all you need, so it doesn't matter what class you play?

**** then, everybody should play the Batarian Sentinel! He's not an awful class at all, just slap a Claymore or Harrier on him and dominate every gold match!

Or you could have some sense and realize that some classes are not as good as others. I can't say for sure yet, but I don't think the Turian Engineer is a good class.

You left out the part you seem to be talking about. And like said, it is up to your abilities to make a character good.<_<

What abilities? I'm with Sirian and most others here in saying that putting a good gun on a crap character doesn't mean a thing. I did a bunch of rounds with the Batarian Sentinel to finish Resurgence Mastery today and the whole time I was thinking "I could be playing the Batarian Soldier instead and have fun with powers instead of walking around shooting a Claymore for 20 minutes, which I could do better with the Human Soldier."

I put a good weapon on the Turian Engineer. What can I do with him that I can't do with the FQI (better Sabotage, more damage output) or the Turian Sentinel (better tech powers and debuff)?

Sabotage without Tactical Cloak boosting it does poor damage. The Backfire CC is ok but the hacking tree is terrible because Bioware destroyed it back in the early metagame. Right now hacking is useful for getting the occasional Prime/Atlas/Turret to momentarily stop shooting. The tech burst evolution is fine if you have other engineers on your team. For self-TBs, Sabotage -> Homing Grenade feels slower but more reliable than Sabotage -> Sticky Grenade simply because Stickies have trouble landing on things that aren't Atlas sized.

Modifié par UnknownMercenary, 12 décembre 2012 - 05:50 .

[Ziegrif]

Lord_Sirian wrote...
Stim packs would make it usable. But having two barrier dependent powers and no way to recharge barriers gimps the class' powers severely.

True but that's why you invest in shield recharge gear and equipment.
They're there to be used, no real reason not to use em.

[Ziegrif]

UnknownMercenary wrote...

 I did a bunch of rounds with the Batarian Sentinel to finish Resurgence Mastery today and the whole time I was thinking "I could be playing the Batarian Soldier instead and have fun with powers instead of walking around shooting a Claymore for 20 minutes, which I could do better with the Human Soldier."

Brotip.
Try the Falcon or Scorpion with any ammo power out there and completely skip sub net.
EXPLOSIONS! EXCITEMENT!
My favorite is to go in Scorpion + shockwave texh burts = Takes out shields then light melee to stagger the enemy and wait for the scorpion to blow it up. It ends up looking like your little fist tap blew the enemy up. HILARIOUS.

Edit. Double post! I shall now hit myself in shame!

Modifié par Ziegrif, 12 décembre 2012 - 05:56 .

[xFCx Shade]

UnknownMercenary wrote....

What abilities? I'm with Sirian and most others here in saying that putting a good gun on a crap character doesn't mean a thing. I did a bunch of rounds with the Batarian Sentinel to finish Resurgence Mastery today and the whole time I was thinking "I could be playing the Batarian Soldier instead and have fun with powers instead of walking around shooting a Claymore for 20 minutes, which I could do better with the Human Soldier."

I put a good weapon on the Turian Engineer. What can I do with him that I can't do with the FQI (better Sabotage, more damage output) or the Turian Sentinel (better tech powers and debuff)?

Sabotage without Tactical Cloak boosting it does poor damage. The Backfire CC is ok but the hacking tree is terrible because Bioware destroyed it back in the early metagame. Right now hacking is useful for getting the occasional Prime/Atlas/Turret to momentarily stop shooting. The tech burst evolution is fine if you have other engineers on your team. For self-TBs, Sabotage -> Homing Grenade feels slower but more reliable than Sabotage -> Sticky Grenade simply because Stickies have trouble landing on things that aren't Atlas sized.

Honestly, you aren't quite getting the point. You (along with your unlocked guns) can vary your score, even with the sh*ttiest character you can think of. If you aren't "good" with a kit, then so be it. Trying to argue with me won't get you anywhere.

[Fly064]

Stardusk wrote...

 And yes I fully expect people popping in with claims of topping the scoreboard on Platinum and screenshots and blah, blah...predictable apologetics.

BUT....he is quite simply not a good engineer. Even the Vorcha Engineer has more utility than he does with incinerate, bloodlust and submission net. 

Sentry Turret: ****** poor damage, poor crowd control

Homing Grenades: only worthwhile using at near point blank range because of travel speed, damage is ok but nothing earth shattering

Sabotage: long cooldown, damage is not that great, lacks real synergy with his other powers

I am not sure what BW was thinking when they made this character but he is not not well designed.

He is not a character with which you can archieve godlike Killingsprees (love Quarian Male Engineer:wub:) but certainly better on Platinum than many other characters, not to mention a Vorcha Hunter...
Main Problem for a Turian per se is that he is not very flexible with avoiding damage.
Try him with a assult rifle and buffs for rechargetime, be a little careful and you've got a fine character
I'd never use the torrent, it just sucks.

btw you should really stop looking down on younger people.

Modifié par Fly064, 12 décembre 2012 - 05:59 .

[Learn To Love Yourself]

What I like about this character is how the powers actually do work well together.

The Sentry Turret (although I opt for rocket turret on the QFE with some degree of success) & Sabotage (without TC boosts) are underwhelming by themselves. The Homing Grenades do decent damage, but they are slow.

However, when you combine the three, which you can fairly easily, you get very good results. Again, I'll have to test on a solo to really know to what extent.

The Sentry Turret with Shock & Flamer is a great crowd control & priming tool (I admit that I wish it did more damage). Add Sabotage for the Tech buff, and it does much more damage. On top of that, Sabotage will prime the Homing Nades for TBs (which also benefit from Sabo's Tech buff), and the Flamer primes for FEs. You'll get one or the other, and sometimes both (depending on the enemies' protection, and if split nade evo is taken).

Of course you can put a good weapon on a bad character and make it work, but I feel that the powers do their job of whittling down enemies, containing spawns, and giving me freedom to unload my weapon upon them, a symphonic harmony of destruction.

Hopefully, this will all hold up in the solo test, but for 5 matches played, I felt weapon and power went hand in hand quite well. He is less of a caster and more of a hybrid, imo. Somewhat like I view the Huntress or Valkyrie. They have powers, but I only use them to complement my weapon usage.

I'm not saying he is the best character out there, but I do feel he is far from the worst. I don't feel it is just novelty speaking either.

Modifié par Jack Crapper, 12 décembre 2012 - 06:03 .

[Ziegrif]

Lord_Sirian wrote...

Ziegrif wrote...

Lord_Sirian wrote...
Stim packs would make it usable. But having two barrier dependent powers and no way to recharge barriers gimps the class' powers severely.

True but that's why you invest in shield recharge gear and equipment.
They're there to be used, no real reason not to use em.

 

Missing the point. The fact that the powers have no synergy with each other apart from PD setting off tech bursts set up by sabotage would be an indication of poor design. Same way that the T Eng's poor power synergy is an indication of lack of thought/poor design.

Lack of synergy is Marksmans ''can't use anything with it easily'' quality.
Synergy with Sabotage comes straight off the bat because it is not bound by the same cooldown as Phase disruptor or Nova. If it can tech burst or can be used in conjunction with something then it synergyses enough that you can compensate and build on it.

In other words. Think of something more ****ed up as an example.

Modifié par Ziegrif, 12 décembre 2012 - 06:11 .

[UnknownMercenary]

Ziegrif wrote...

UnknownMercenary wrote...

 I did a bunch of rounds with the Batarian Sentinel to finish Resurgence Mastery today and the whole time I was thinking "I could be playing the Batarian Soldier instead and have fun with powers instead of walking around shooting a Claymore for 20 minutes, which I could do better with the Human Soldier."

Brotip.
Try the Falcon or Scorpion with any ammo power out there and completely skip sub net.
EXPLOSIONS! EXCITEMENT!
My favorite is to go in Scorpion + shockwave texh burts = Takes out shields then light melee to stagger the enemy and wait for the scorpion to blow it up. It ends up looking like your little fist tap blew the enemy up. HILARIOUS.

Edit. Double post! I shall now hit myself in shame!

I might try that. I have way too much disruptor ammo lying around, but I don't want to use up my last respec card on a character I don't like, and it feels weird to skip out on a what was at the time his only unique power.

If respec was tied to a fee instead of a rare card I'd be doing it more often.

Modifié par UnknownMercenary, 12 décembre 2012 - 06:14 .

[Learn To Love Yourself]

Lord_Sirian wrote...

Ziegrif wrote...

Lord_Sirian wrote...

Ziegrif wrote...

Lord_Sirian wrote...
Stim packs would make it usable. But having two barrier dependent powers and no way to recharge barriers gimps the class' powers severely.

True but that's why you invest in shield recharge gear and equipment.
They're there to be used, no real reason not to use em.

 

Missing the point. The fact that the powers have no synergy with each other apart from PD setting off tech bursts set up by sabotage would be an indication of poor design. Same way that the T Eng's poor power synergy is an indication of lack of thought/poor design.

Lack of synergy is Marksmans ''can't use anything with it easily'' quality.
Synergy with Sabotage comes straight off the bat because it is not bound by the same cooldown as Phase disruptor or Nova. If it can tech burst or can be used in conjunction with something then it synergyses enough that you can compensate and build on it.

 

lol.

Ok then, on the Turian soldier, spec out of marksman, take full points in PM/CS and use a rapid fire priming weapon with incendiary ammo for rapid fire explosions.

WHO SAYS THE T SOL HAS NO POWER SYNERGY? 

What about Sabotage on the Quarian Marksman?  The only sense that it makes there is the fact that he is Quarian.  No synergy with TS or MM there.

[TheCandlejack]

Jack Crapper wrote...

Lord_Sirian wrote...

Ziegrif wrote...

Lord_Sirian wrote...

Ziegrif wrote...

Lord_Sirian wrote...
Stim packs would make it usable. But having two barrier dependent powers and no way to recharge barriers gimps the class' powers severely.

True but that's why you invest in shield recharge gear and equipment.
They're there to be used, no real reason not to use em.

 

Missing the point. The fact that the powers have no synergy with each other apart from PD setting off tech bursts set up by sabotage would be an indication of poor design. Same way that the T Eng's poor power synergy is an indication of lack of thought/poor design.

Lack of synergy is Marksmans ''can't use anything with it easily'' quality.
Synergy with Sabotage comes straight off the bat because it is not bound by the same cooldown as Phase disruptor or Nova. If it can tech burst or can be used in conjunction with something then it synergyses enough that you can compensate and build on it.

 

lol.

Ok then, on the Turian soldier, spec out of marksman, take full points in PM/CS and use a rapid fire priming weapon with incendiary ammo for rapid fire explosions.

WHO SAYS THE T SOL HAS NO POWER SYNERGY? 

What about Sabotage on the Quarian Marksman?  The only sense that it makes there is the fact that he is Quarian.  No synergy with TS or MM there.

Tac Scan and then Marksman w/ a Saber = Dead Praetorian 

[oO Stryfe Oo]

SpineVomit wrote...

The Sentry Turret struggles to kill mooks on Silver. This saddens me.

So much this. I know it's not supposed to be straight destroying everything in its path, but it should at least act like a throw-able gun, now that the distraction element of pets is so terrible.

[Ziegrif]

Lord_Sirian wrote...
lol.

Ok then, on the Turian soldier, spec out of marksman, take full points in PM/CS and use a rapid fire priming weapon with incendiary ammo for rapid fire explosions.

WHO SAYS THE T SOL HAS NO POWER SYNERGY? 

True.
I won't deny it.
CS works well that way it having a really short CD.
I just don't like stopping the shooting.
But those work pretty much because there's a small CD on both.
Never liked Marksmans duration = can't use powers, routine so I opted to never use anything other than Marksman just to keep it simple.
Has worked extremely well for me.

Modifié par Ziegrif, 12 décembre 2012 - 06:25 .

[Screenbetween]

Jack Crapper wrote...

What I like about this character is how the powers actually do work well together.

The Sentry Turret (although I opt for rocket turret on the QFE with some degree of success) & Sabotage (without TC boosts) are underwhelming by themselves. The Homing Grenades do decent damage, but they are slow.

However, when you combine the three, which you can fairly easily, you get very good results. Again, I'll have to test on a solo to really know to what extent.

The Sentry Turret with Shock & Flamer is a great crowd control & priming tool (I admit that I wish it did more damage). Add Sabotage for the Tech buff, and it does much more damage. On top of that, Sabotage will prime the Homing Nades for TBs (which also benefit from Sabo's Tech buff), and the Flamer primes for FEs. You'll get one or the other, and sometimes both (depending on the enemies' protection, and if split nade evo is taken).

Of course you can put a good weapon on a bad character and make it work, but I feel that the powers do their job of whittling down enemies, containing spawns, and giving me freedom to unload my weapon upon them, a symphonic harmony of destruction.

Hopefully, this will all hold up in the solo test, but for 5 matches played, I felt weapon and power went hand in hand quite well. He is less of a caster and more of a hybrid, imo. Somewhat like I view the Huntress or Valkyrie. They have powers, but I only use them to complement my weapon usage.

I'm not saying he is the best character out there, but I do feel he is far from the worst. I don't feel it is just novelty speaking either.

There is intelligent life in the universe! lol

You're right, he's solid. I'll go as far and say there's some interesting potential here, but it will take time until he's really figured out. Bioware's clever. Every class seems to hold some secret, some special combination that can work well. After all that though, it's simply personal preference.

Man, I love this game.

[Learn To Love Yourself]

TheCandlejack wrote...

Jack Crapper wrote...

Lord_Sirian wrote...

Ziegrif wrote...

Lord_Sirian wrote...

Ziegrif wrote...

Lord_Sirian wrote...
Stim packs would make it usable. But having two barrier dependent powers and no way to recharge barriers gimps the class' powers severely.

True but that's why you invest in shield recharge gear and equipment.
They're there to be used, no real reason not to use em.

 

Missing the point. The fact that the powers have no synergy with each other apart from PD setting off tech bursts set up by sabotage would be an indication of poor design. Same way that the T Eng's poor power synergy is an indication of lack of thought/poor design.

Lack of synergy is Marksmans ''can't use anything with it easily'' quality.
Synergy with Sabotage comes straight off the bat because it is not bound by the same cooldown as Phase disruptor or Nova. If it can tech burst or can be used in conjunction with something then it synergyses enough that you can compensate and build on it.

 

lol.

Ok then, on the Turian soldier, spec out of marksman, take full points in PM/CS and use a rapid fire priming weapon with incendiary ammo for rapid fire explosions.

WHO SAYS THE T SOL HAS NO POWER SYNERGY? 

What about Sabotage on the Quarian Marksman?  The only sense that it makes there is the fact that he is Quarian.  No synergy with TS or MM there.

Tac Scan and then Marksman w/ a Saber = Dead Praetorian 

Don't get me wrong.  I love the QMS, but I spec out of Sabotage because I have personally found not enough value in it for this character, especially with the key power competing with cooldowns.  What you state above has no mention of Sabotage

[Miniditka77]

Stardusk wrote...

It would be nice if this thread could get back to the original point; what about his powers is so amazing? as an Engineer? Compare him to other Engineers; he has better weapon passives and jetboots. What else?

I think there's some confusion in this discussion.  You said that the character was not well designed, and that can mean different things.  From a synergy standpoint, the TE is very well designed, and it offers an interesting and unique play style. 

The problem with the TE is that 2 of his 3 powers need to be buffed.  Sabotage needs a lower cooldown (or at least a bigger cooldown bonus at R5), and Sentry Turret still needs a large damage buff.  If the Sentry Turret got a 100% damage buff tomorrow, all of a sudden throwing the Sentry Turret, then using Sabotage to increase the Turret's damage and cause a bunch of backfire explosions, then firing a Grenade or two to get some additional damage and tech/fire explosions would be pretty effective on spawns or at choke points.  So I wouldn't say the TE is poorly designed - its problems could be 100% fixed by the weekly balance changes.

[TheCandlejack]

Jack Crapper wrote...

TheCandlejack wrote...

Jack Crapper wrote...

Lord_Sirian wrote...

Ziegrif wrote...

Lord_Sirian wrote...

Ziegrif wrote...

Lord_Sirian wrote...
Stim packs would make it usable. But having two barrier dependent powers and no way to recharge barriers gimps the class' powers severely.

True but that's why you invest in shield recharge gear and equipment.
They're there to be used, no real reason not to use em.

 

Missing the point. The fact that the powers have no synergy with each other apart from PD setting off tech bursts set up by sabotage would be an indication of poor design. Same way that the T Eng's poor power synergy is an indication of lack of thought/poor design.

Lack of synergy is Marksmans ''can't use anything with it easily'' quality.
Synergy with Sabotage comes straight off the bat because it is not bound by the same cooldown as Phase disruptor or Nova. If it can tech burst or can be used in conjunction with something then it synergyses enough that you can compensate and build on it.

 

lol.

Ok then, on the Turian soldier, spec out of marksman, take full points in PM/CS and use a rapid fire priming weapon with incendiary ammo for rapid fire explosions.

WHO SAYS THE T SOL HAS NO POWER SYNERGY? 

What about Sabotage on the Quarian Marksman?  The only sense that it makes there is the fact that he is Quarian.  No synergy with TS or MM there.

Tac Scan and then Marksman w/ a Saber = Dead Praetorian 

Don't get me wrong.  I love the QMS, but I spec out of Sabotage because I have personally found not enough value in it for this character, especially with the key power competing with cooldowns.  What you state above has no mention of Sabotage

I know, but had to be said. Sabotage I feel doesn't work very well on the QMS, they could have chosen a different power. I would have preferred something like a grenade or Energy Drain.

Modifié par TheCandlejack, 12 décembre 2012 - 06:34 .