38 réponses à ce sujet

[Lazarus Magni]

THis is what the game manual states:

“Multiplayer
Journeying Online
 
…
 
The first time that you play online, you will be prompted for a
player profile. The player profile allows Neverwinter Nights to differentiate
between the different players and allows you to access
special areas in the Neverwinter Nights community site (www.neverwinternights.
com). If you have already created a player profile
either in the game or on the Neverwinter Nights community site,
simply enter your player name and password to continue. If you
haven’t yet created a profile, press the create profile button and
enter in your desired player name and password. You will also be
prompted for an email address. Although you are not required to
enter an email address, if you do not enter one, you will be unable
to recover your password if it is lost.
 
 
Joining a Multip[b]layer Game
If you just wish to play in a game, you click multiplayer at the
start menu and then choose the join option. A listing of games
will appear in a game browser window. If you are playing without
an Internet connection, the game may pause at this screen for a
moment. You can click the LAN tab at the top of the panel to
scan your local network for games instead of scanning the
Internet matching service. If you have an Internet connection you
will see a large listing of the games currently available. You can
sort the games using the various filters at the top of the matching
page by simply clicking the filter name. You can also click the
gameplay types toggle on the bottom left and it will show you the
games that are posted as that type of gameplay. When you find a
game you like, click the game and then click the connect button
and you are underway….”

Modifié par Lazarus Magni, 13 décembre 2012 - 07:05 .

[Pearls]

not seeing the interesting except for a choice of font colours that made me have to highlight the text to read it, this kind of stuff is in any game's manual

[Baaleos]

As with all games with an online element to them.
Bioware likely has a disclaimer that says that online game experience may change - and they are not responsible for whether we like it or not.

We can still play online, its just become our responsibility to match make - which was never biowares responsibility either - it was Gamespys

[SHOVA]

The game is 10 years old. Many things that were released with the original game, have been changed over the years. Scripting funtions, rideable horses, prestige classes. Since its release, Bio-ware was bought out, Atari fell apart. Wizards of the Coast created 3.5 edition, and now 4th edition. Now, official support is gone. It is not going to come back, no mater how many times some one bleats about it. Now that gamespy is also moving on, once again its on this community to work it out. We will. Its not going to happen overnight, but it will get fixed.

[Lazarus Magni]

The questions are, should the game manual that comes with the game be modified to reflect the current state of affairs?

If modifying the manual is not possible (which it likely isn't) should the distributor (gog.com, and anywhere else you can get it), include some information with the purchase regarding the current state of affairs, and what possible workarounds there are (xfire), or will be (a community driven one)?

The issue is new players will have no clue about this, unless there is information provided with their purchase informing them. At the very least, in terms of this site, there should be a stickey here, and in the PW forums (if not all the NWN 1 and 2 forums) informing customers what the current state of things is, and what alternative solutions are out there.

[Shadooow]

who reads manuals?

[Baaleos]

Lazarus Magni wrote...

The questions are, should the game manual that comes with the game be modified to reflect the current state of affairs?

If modifying the manual is not possible (which it likely isn't) should the distributor (gog.com, and anywhere else you can get it), include some information with the purchase regarding the current state of affairs, and what possible workarounds there are (xfire), or will be (a community driven one)?

The issue is new players will have no clue about this, unless there is information provided with their purchase informing them. At the very least, in terms of this site, there should be a stickey here, and in the PW forums (if not all the NWN 1 and 2 forums) informing customers what the current state of things is, and what alternative solutions are out there.

Updating the manual is very unlikely.
I worked in a company on a QA Team - the company manufactured Security Camera systems, and they had QA Teams that were responsible for proof reading manuals, localization of the manuals, and ensuring the validity and legality of the content.

No one would do that for free.
Short answer is - 
It would cost bioware money to update the manual.
Even if we think it is a single paragraph - its an afternoon or two for X amount of people, who are charging YYY per hour for their time.

The best we would get, would be GOG including a text file with the installation to state that online capabilities are now limited.

But even then - they may or may not be allowed to put that in.
No doubt they have contractual arrangements with Bioware/Atari that says what they can and cannot put in the installer package.
Before GOG could change the installer, they would need bioware to vet it first.
(Same reason why game companies cant release updates instantly to PS3 Games - Sony needs to check them)

And then this brings us back to issue 1 - Cost.

If GOG needs Biowares Permission to include a new object / artefact in the bundle - it would likely need to be covered by a contract.

These companies arent best buddies - they dont simply send an e-mail across to eachother and say
'Hey, can I include this in the installer?'
'Yeah.. go right ahead'

The proposed changes need to be proposed, vetted, signed off, tested, etc.

Which costs money - cause it costs time.

Unless GOG has an arrangement that allows them to add anything they want - which I doubt.
I would even suspect that a change to the GOG NWN Page would require biowares input.

(Imagine facebook going onto your facebook profile, and updating it without your consent - Same sort of thing with GOG -  Just because GOG host/sell the product, doesnt mean they can change how its described or advertised without the OK Nod from Bioware)


All in all -  I think the best we can hope for as far as GOG goes - is maybe a notice on the NWN Page - before people buy it, alerting them to Multiplayer capabilities are limited/require a patch.
But as mentioned - even then, they may have their hands tied through contractual obligations.

[Baaleos]

ShaDoOoW wrote...

who reads manuals?

When I was younger, and I got Diablo 1 for my birthday (18+ Game for an 11 year old - I know.... )
I was so excited to play it - but my Mum and Dad wouldnt let me play it until it was actually my birthday.

But in the days leading up to it, they did let me open the box, and read the manual.
Just cause I love manuals that have lore sections etc.

Also - the Diablo 1 Manual had lovely printed pages, that smelt - I dunno how to describe it - just like a really expensive tome.
Every page was watermarked with a cloud/hazy texture/backdrop - and the Art Work was great.

So - who reads manuals?
I do.

[Lazarus Magni]

Regarding informing the consumers of NWN 1 as to the current state of multiplayer functionality, and the existing workarounds, I don't care who does it, but someone should. It would take less than an hour for 1 person (hi Chris) to create stickies on these boards explaining the situation, and highlighting the existing workarounds (Xfire, and what ever else may be coming.) And the same goes for the NWN 1 page on gog.com or even including a text file in the installation.

Modifié par Lazarus Magni, 13 décembre 2012 - 06:59 .

[NWN_baba yaga]

There is no one left to blame for anything that we as a community cant accomplish or find ways around. And thats the last time i will comment on these kind of topics because the only thing matters is how good we are keeping this game alive and improving. The latest gamespy thing and how quick you guys were to find ways around shows we can honestly say we dont need anyone official:)

and back on topic, someone who buys nwn now might have enough brain to go to the original dev´s forum and start asking or searching for related questions on how to play online;)

Modifié par NWN_baba yaga, 13 décembre 2012 - 07:04 .

[Lazarus Magni]

And if there is no Stickey? There is a stickey about the masterserver, why wouldn't there be one about the loss of gamespy service, and possible alternatives (at this point, only Xfire, and perhaps a browser based server listing, although neither at this point are true full listings)?

Modifié par Lazarus Magni, 13 décembre 2012 - 07:11 .

[NWN_baba yaga]

then we bump one topic without replies or just an updated serverlist infinite till one of the lost mods is so nice and does it...

[NWN_baba yaga]

"BUMP" you see... it´s easy

[Baaleos]

@ Laz
We havent lost anything that Bioware was responsible for.
Gamespy may have sold out - but thats not Biowares responsibility.

Multiplayer is still possible- granted, its a bit more complicated to find servers, but nothing NWN wise has been broken.

Besides - I messaged Chris over the weekend, asking him to comment on the situation - as im sure others have, and got no response.

Bioware have washed their hands of this game - it is community driven now.
Dont expect anything from Bioware, and you wont be disappointed.

[AlgernonsGhost]

The GOG.com edition comes with 3 pdf manuals. There might be copyright issues with them changing the official manual, but it would be simple for them to add a fourth pdf titled "Changes to Multiplayer NWN/How To" or something similar. This would be a good step in the right direction (in addition to a sticky on their forum as well).

Once we have any community alternatives for match making squared away, we could write up some instructions in a pdf to send to GOG, just to make their job easier.

[HipMaestro]

The Grimoire is the most accurate pdf available and even that needs quite a bit of revision.  If you have a decent pdf editor, I suppose you could attempt to update it and load to the Vault, including a supplement about any of the information applicable to installing and running digital versions of the game.

The NWNwiki remains as close to gospel information for the default game and has value for players and designers of any level of experience.  One huge benefit of the wiki format is that one can navigate very quickly and with multiple windows as compared to a pdf which only displays the most currently linked page.

Next to nobody uses physical documents anymore.  Just too dern slow, especially for those of us who can hear the clock ticking louder each day.

[Lazarus Magni]

Baaleos wrote...

@ Laz
We havent lost anything that Bioware was responsible for.
Gamespy may have sold out - but thats not Biowares responsibility.

Multiplayer is still possible- granted, its a bit more complicated to find servers, but nothing NWN wise has been broken.
.

Last I checked; e.g. loaded the game, the gamespy server listings were intergrated into the game. So say we haven't lost anything Bioware was respoinsible for is like saying... well this part in my machine is faulty, but I didn't make it, I only included it in my machine, so I am not responsible for it.

Don't get me wrong, gamespy hijacking it's customers (e.g. bioware, ect...) is messed up. But bioware being like... oh we are not even going to try to help our consumers out by providing information about the situation, and present workarounds, is akin to being like, oh we have a perfect scapegoat (gamespy), it's all their fault, we wash our hands of it, despite the fact that we entered into a contract with them to provide a service (which apparantely they can change the terms of at will), and since they changed the terms, which we don't want to ante up to, they are the jerks, and we owe our consumers no information about our stance on this issue, let alone possible alternatives...

Modifié par Lazarus Magni, 14 décembre 2012 - 05:06 .

[Lazarus Magni]

Baaleos wrote...

Besides - I messaged Chris over the weekend, asking him to comment on the situation - as im sure others have, and got no response.
.

Big supprise...

[Lazarus Magni]

Baaleos wrote...

Bioware have washed their hands of this game - it is community driven now.
Dont expect anything from Bioware, and you wont be disappointed.

Sorry.. I don't accept that. You don't just wash your hands of a child you bore, unless you are a cold hearted baztard.

[Lazarus Magni]

AlgernonsGhost wrote...

... it would be simple for them to add a fourth pdf titled "Changes to Multiplayer NWN/How To" or something similar. This would be a good step in the right direction (in addition to a sticky on their forum as well).

Here here...

[Lazarus Magni]

AlgernonsGhost wrote...
Once we have any community alternatives for match making squared away, we could write up some instructions in a pdf to send to GOG, just to make their job easier.

Again here, here (aka cheers).

[Lazarus Magni]

HipMaestro wrote...

The Grimoire is the most accurate pdf available and even that needs quite a bit of revision.  If you have a decent pdf editor, I suppose you could attempt to update it and load to the Vault, including a supplement about any of the information applicable to installing and running digital versions of the game.

The NWNwiki remains as close to gospel information for the default game and has value for players and designers of any level of experience.  One huge benefit of the wiki format is that one can navigate very quickly and with multiple windows as compared to a pdf which only displays the most currently linked page.

Next to nobody uses physical documents anymore.  Just too dern slow, especially for those of us who can hear the clock ticking louder each day.

Umm... I use physical documents. I refer to my original manuals quite often, even after 9+ years of playing... but hey call me oldshool. You do make a good point though, updating the wiki and what not will be crucial moving forward to help keep those players who actually take the time to look, rather than just assume the game is dead from the initial install, and lack of official info here, informed.

[HipMaestro]

Lazarus Magni wrote...
Umm... I use physical documents. I refer to my original manuals quite often, even after 9+ years of playing... but hey call me oldshool.

So does the legal and banking community to a great degree.  But it is quickly coming to an end.  With the trend to reduce the staff and floorspace in all industries, the copy machines are being replaced by scanners, memos have become emails, FAXed transmission are stored and archived in digital format or microfiche and physical contact with service folks replaced by audio menus.  People and paper have become passe'.  The public have become merely vectors for the flow of information and technolgy today.  It's a hungry monster for sure, but one we all lent a hand in nurturing and lauding.

Scan those manuals before the paper becomes too yellow or brittle to use anymore.  Better yet. Use OCR software and convert into editable, searchable medium for your grandkids who will still enjoy NWN. 

I am old school as well, with endless notebooks and catalogs still cluttering sagging shelves.  But I can read the writing on the wall though I can barely read the contents of the library anymore.

[Lazarus Magni]

"♦ ♦ ♦ Madness is a beautiful thing... a blessing for the chosen few. ♦ ♦ ♦"

Cheers M8.

Modifié par Lazarus Magni, 14 décembre 2012 - 08:49 .

[Baaleos]

Lazarus Magni wrote...

Baaleos wrote...

@ Laz
We havent lost anything that Bioware was responsible for.
Gamespy may have sold out - but thats not Biowares responsibility.

Multiplayer is still possible- granted, its a bit more complicated to find servers, but nothing NWN wise has been broken.
.

Last I checked; e.g. loaded the game, the gamespy server listings were intergrated into the game. So say we haven't lost anything Bioware was respoinsible for is like saying... well this part in my machine is faulty, but I didn't make it, I only included it in my machine, so I am not responsible for it.

Don't get me wrong, gamespy hijacking it's customers (e.g. bioware, ect...) is messed up. But bioware being like... oh we are not even going to try to help our consumers out by providing information about the situation, and present workarounds, is akin to being like, oh we have a perfect scapegoat (gamespy), it's all their fault, we wash our hands of it, despite the fact that we entered into a contract with them to provide a service (which apparantely they can change the terms of at will), and since they changed the terms, which we don't want to ante up to, they are the jerks, and we owe our consumers no information about our stance on this issue, let alone possible alternatives...

Gamespy server listings are still integrated into the game, its not biowares fault that gamespy listings arent there anymore to be listed.
Bioware as a company cannot be held accountable for the actions or inaction of an external vendor - aim your rant at Gamespy.
Biowares Code still works - its gamespy that is no longer providing the service.

NWN1 is a dwindling player base -  less than a few hundred to thousand players at any one time world wide.
In order for them to provide a new multiplayer service, they would need to start new development projects, and devote time and money to those projects.

Your talking
1. A project that creates the server (one project at the very least)
2. A project for the client patch (lots of game testers to regression test the entire game afterwards)

Each project having  X amount of people, charging Y about of dollars per hour.
Your probably thinking - hey but they get their hourly rate anyway just for being bioware employees, thats true, but it doesnt work like that in a company.

Companies generally have different projects, which have different project codes, which they assign their hours to.
Each project has a budget, and the amount of hours allocated to a project dictates how much that project is spending.

Taking people from their normal day to day activities (which might be SWTOR development) and putting them onto NWN1 development, would be like saying.

Ok - I want to take money away from Starwars, and give it to NWN1, regardless of the fact that its a game with a smaller player base.

It wouldnt be a business wise decision -  and in these economic times - A bad business decision can be the end of a company, which would be the end of all future game productions from that company.