362 réponses à ce sujet

[mpompeo27]

Eric Fagnan wrote...

According to our player data based on completion rates, the Collectors are slightly harder than other factions on Gold, but about the same as other factions on other difficulties. On Silver, they are the easiest faction.

Completion rates are deceptive. Just because people are completing Collector matches with close to the same frequency as other factions doesn't mean they aren't significantly more difficult. Average completion time and average # of deaths per player would be metrics that also need consideration.

Though, to be honest, I like the fact that Collectors are noticeably more difficult than the other factions. Makes beating them more satisfying.

Modifié par mpompeo27, 15 décembre 2012 - 04:38 .

[CmnDwnWrkn]

Stinja wrote...

Eric Fagnan wrote...

According to our player data based on completion rates

What do the stats say on NON-completion rates?

Can you tell when a PS3 gold collector game hard-froze all four players, and forced a console reset?
Or less tangible stats, like players quitting U/U/x games wave 1 when collectors show up?
Or players avoiding choosing them to start with?

These are excellent points.  Many people quit upon seeing it's a Collector match or simply don't play them.  The people who end up staying and playing are therefore likely to be better on average than the player base as a whole.  I wonder what the data says about matches played vs. the Collectors vs. the other factions.

The implication that Collectors are the easiest faction on Silver is ridiculous.

[Beerfish]

Game completion rates surely do not tell the story about game difficulty on any level. You would need some kind of formula to determine conusmmables used vs success rate. I would guess that WAY more consummables are used facing the collectors, especially on the lower levels such as bronze. Seeing as that one hack objective you often have to face two praetorians and usually 4 scions to go along with all the rest a bronze team just can't kill the bosses from a distance quick enough.

I would not call the collectors cheap as they don't use cheap tactics but they are the toughest faction for me and come into play so quickly after being killed it verges on the ridiculous. Plus they have the most over powered unit in the game (for their function), that being abominations.

[tonnactus]

Yes,i prefer Geth to Collectors by a mile. Casters are gimped enough and Collectors spam their stupid damping nets nonstop.

[Xeraphas]

Bigger hit zones do not matter so much if half of them become possessed and gain all that damage inflicted upon them back and also become a lot tougher.

Also, would it not be more logical if the Abominations had to prime themselves or something first before they can explode?  With all the crap that causes player characters precious time, you would expect a little more consideration for those same delays on enemies.  You have a delay to equip a rocket, and one to fire.   You have delays to use ops packs apparently or they would work more often especially when you needed them most.  You have delays for medigel, before and after you are revived.  You have delays for some powers such as biotic charge, which is why it often takes several button depressions to activate even if it is charged.  You have delays for some melee attacks, dodges, cover, revives, and sometimes even to run or running itself.  Some characters are delayed I suppose to reflect their slower speed.  With all those delays, this abomination, for example has none when he explodes, neither do many other enemy units, (Rocket trooper gatling guns for instance).

Modifié par Xeraphas, 15 décembre 2012 - 08:14 .

[Felis Menari]

The Collectors are the most difficult faction to fight (in particular as a power-reliant class). I know this not from data collection, but experience gained from action on the battlefield. Analyzing data only gets you so far good sir Fagnan, and you've apparently reached the limits of what that alone can do.

[KevTheGamer]

The collectors are a fun faction but yeah on Gold they are a nightmare.

[ValorOfArms777]

Eric Fagnan wrote...

According to our player data based on completion rates, the Collectors are slightly harder than other factions on Gold, but about the same as other factions on other difficulties. On Silver, they are the easiest faction.

thats odd on silver they may seem "easier" but thats a semi illusion at times, the notably thing is cause of the wave compasition you provide for silver vs gold

and hwo rediclouse the compasistions of Cerb can get with dragoons 

[UWxMaserati]

The Collectors are the most balanced faction, they are capable of causing issues for any build. The Geth are more black and white, some classes can romp over them with ease while others struggle against them.

Personally in PUGs I prefer to face the Collectors. If the team struggles I have never had an issue staying mobile and picking them off. But with the Geth if the team struggles I find it much harder to revive the team because even if you get them up they usually get stagger killed again before they can get away or you end up getting killed and the team runs though half their gel just trying to get up. Sometimes you have to rocket hoards of pyros, hunters, and rocket troopers just to get to your fallen teammates, Primes don't even need to be present.

So I have found myself preferring the Collectors over the Geth especially with randoms.

[ZoM_Head]

Eric Fagnan wrote...

According to our player data based on completion rates, the Collectors are slightly harder than other factions on Gold, but about the same as other factions on other difficulties. On Silver, they are the easiest faction.

Are Praetorians designed to shoot through every cover across the map? or is that a bug?

A few weeks ago, you guys said that, the Scion bug is fixed, so how come a scion can still remove my 750 shields in one shot?

I do not play against the Collectors, not because they are "hard"; infact the Collector General banner was the first challenge i completed, and this was with the "scion bug". I do not touch them, due to those issues i mentioned above.

Geth are a stun lock fiesta, which we know there is no counter to stun locks. Cerberus were ok, the Phantoms were OP a bit, but then you added burning damage from the Atlas missile, increased their speed and added a whole bunch of dragoons that spawn with phantoms. Basically, see a phantom, take cover, a dragoon rollerskates to you and pushes you out of cover.....you see where this will end?

I loved the reapers and still love them at the moment, the only bug i find in the reapers, is the banshee with her magnetic arms grabbing you from a good 15+ meter away even when hosting, as well as her warp going through certain corners (not curving, but actually penetrating).

At least, i can take cover, and not worry about lasers going through cover acorss the map, one shot no shields, or an OP ballerina who has her gay skating boyfriend just mindlessly rushing. 

[Felhand]

Praetorians are hilarious on my volus adept, they have alot of issues hitting him with their laser beams of doom. While collectors are by far the nastiest for 'overall grief capacity' they arnt THAT bad, just very aggressive and any possessed praetorians or scions need to be treated like hitler. (lots and lots of bullets as soon as possible.)

[Star fury]

UWxMaserati wrote...

The Collectors are the most balanced faction, they are capable of causing issues for any build. The Geth are more black and white, some classes can romp over them with ease while others struggle against them.

Personally in PUGs I prefer to face the Collectors. If the team struggles I have never had an issue staying mobile and picking them off. But with the Geth if the team struggles I find it much harder to revive the team because even if you get them up they usually get stagger killed again before they can get away or you end up getting killed and the team runs though half their gel just trying to get up. Sometimes you have to rocket hoards of pyros, hunters, and rocket troopers just to get to your fallen teammates, Primes don't even need to be present.

So I have found myself preferring the Collectors over the Geth especially with randoms.

Collectors are the most imbalanced faction. Not having any weaknesses is horrible balance, and no, I don't count "big heads" as a weakness.

Collectors have highest firepower with goddamned scions, praetorians, captains and troopers. They're CQC nightmare with strong melee and instakills. They're lightning fast. Scions can flush you out of the cover with endless grenadees and then immediately kill when you're running to another cover. Collectors are caster's worst nightmare with seeker swarms and glitched resistance to biotic explosions. They can control map with webs.

YES, Collectors are totally balanced in biower's way.

[N7 Banshee Bait]

LAZERAK47 wrote...

Seriously, they make Gold and Platinum nearly impossible

Do you really NEED to play gold or platinum?  I just grinded through countless gold matches to unlock the Map Mastery challenge & unlock my "Best Of The Best" banner. I'm totally happy that I don't need to play gold anymore. I get to go back to running around care free with my Shadow in Silver & just have fun.

For me Collectors are strictly bronze & silver enemies. There's no reason to struggle with them on gold or platinum. If you make it through gold or platinum Collectors guess what! Nobody cares! It means nothing. It's a pointless waste of time. If you simply need the credits or exp. then just play against Geth.

If you can get through gold or platimnum Collectors I'm not impressed. So can I as long as my team is good. Yeah, Collectors are hard but nobody is forcing you to fight them on gold or platinum. So quit yer whining!

[chefcook90]

Steelgrave wrote...

LAZERAK47 wrote...

Seriously, they make Gold and Platinum nearly impossible

Do you really NEED to play gold or platinum?  I just grinded through countless gold matches to unlock the Map Mastery challenge & unlock my "Best Of The Best" banner. I'm totally happy that I don't need to play gold anymore. I get to go back to running around care free with my Shadow in Silver & just have fun.

For me Collectors are strictly bronze & silver enemies. There's no reason to struggle with them on gold or platinum. If you make it through gold or platinum Collectors guess what! Nobody cares! It means nothing. It's a pointless waste of time. If you simply need the credits or exp. then just play against Geth.

If you can get through gold or platimnum Collectors I'm not impressed. So can I as long as my team is good. Yeah, Collectors are hard but nobody is forcing you to fight them on gold or platinum. So quit yer whining!

Hell, I gave up on Gold difficulty after Retaliation came out!
(Check my manifest, I've only got one gold extraction registered )
I'm cool with playing on Silver - it's nice and cozy, and I get to stroke my EPEEN with all the first place finishes

[Aerialight]

Eric Fagnan wrote...
On Silver, they are the easiest faction.

My failing biotics must disagree with that. They still die, but I can cut down any other faction was easier than these guys. Theres gotta be at least 25% resistance to biotics from what I've calculated.

[DarthVarner]

Yeah there's a STRONG self-selection bias for the data on squads that will actually engage the Collectors on Silver.

I've played a lot of matches, and I judge the Collectors on Silver to be more difficult than non-Geth enemies on Gold. Gold Collectors are far and away the hardest to beat within that difficulty, and Collector Platinum is in its own tier entirely.

At minimum, the Praetorian's bubble should force it to be stationary. You can't take a tech/biotic team into U/U/x anymore thanks to these guys; weapons or GTFO. Part of that is the still-broken explosion scaling, but even if that were fixed this would be a problem.

[Ser Reevo Von Bartlesby]

I love playing against the Collectors, sadly it is nearl impossible to do since 9 times out of 10 I get a complete freeze of my system, as well as the rest of the team, usually.

I have played a grand total of one U/U match since the Collector/Hazard Freeze/Lag bugs have come about.

Please fecking fix this already. Having to choose maps/factions for the mere purpose of avoiding my console eventually getting fried is not an in-game mechanic I am too fond of.

[Miniditka77]

Eric Fagnan wrote...

According to our player data based on completion rates, the Collectors are slightly harder than other factions on Gold, but about the same as other factions on other difficulties. On Silver, they are the easiest faction.

With all due respect, either this data is incorrect or the way you guys are analyzing/interpreting the data is flawed.  I literally cannot remember the last time I did a Silver match against any non-Collector faction that didn't end in at least one person getting extracted.  With Collectors, I'd say the extraction rate of my matches is around 70%.  Like others have said, I find Collectors/Silver to be about the same difficulty as other factions on Gold.

Modifié par Miniditka77, 16 décembre 2012 - 05:29 .

[dirtdiver32318]

I dont mind the collectors. Doesnt anyone like a challenge anymore. I can honestly say yes I have trouble with them on gold but I do not mind it. Are they cheap? maybe but that is the fun of it.. Besides why would you let Abom. close enough to kill you ? haha

[chefcook90]

reevoluti0n wrote...

I love playing against the Collectors, sadly it is nearl impossible to do since 9 times out of 10 I get a complete freeze of my system, as well as the rest of the team, usually.

I have played a grand total of one U/U match since the Collector/Hazard Freeze/Lag bugs have come about.

Please fecking fix this already. Having to choose maps/factions for the mere purpose of avoiding my console eventually getting fried is not an in-game mechanic I am too fond of.

Yeah, part of the reason why stopped playing Gold after Retaliation came out:
Three possessed abominations explode at once = "Your connection to the game has been lost"

[Neverwinter_Knight77]

Today, I just found out that my new asari huntress's biotic explosions eat praetorians up. Then again, that might be due to the team. I only played one game (and an N7 fury was in it).

Generally, though, the Collectors and the Geth are both terribly cheap.

[Beerfish]

dirtdiver32318 wrote...

I dont mind the collectors. Doesnt anyone like a challenge anymore. I can honestly say yes I have trouble with them on gold but I do not mind it. Are they cheap? maybe but that is the fun of it.. Besides why would you let Abom. close enough to kill you ? haha

Why?  Because two new scions have spawned immediately after the other two were killed and are already in firing range.  A new possessed praetorian is closing in and there are still some collector troopers after you.  Abominations appear to have their very own spawn locations, move very fast, zig zag, have very high  hit points for an ancilliary unit and will put you in a real bind if they get ahold of you.  All of this being the non posessed ones.  Most over powered unit in the game in my opinion.

[Lord Thornos]

Regardless of completion rates I still feel they are the cheapest. The praetorian and seeker swarms are super fast. The scion can just cross map you. The praetorian, seeker swarm, scions, and abominations all do annoying aoe. The praetorian laser eyes are glitchy and its melee attack is almost impossible to escape. The abominations are glitched when you shoot them in the head, killing them with that head shot, but still explode. The seeker swarms just soak up damage, despite being just a bunch of bugs. Finally missiles do not consistently kill praetorians and scions, despite being launched right next to them.

It's a close one. Geth stun lock, the dragoon/phantom melee and shooting combo, and the banshee grabs are all cheap, but collectors take home the prize for most annoying.

[Putok]

I do not believe for a second that Collectors are the easiest on silver. I'm neither that good nor that experienced at MP, only been doing it for a week, but early this evening I got into a pretty good u/u/s PUG. We were consistently doing stress free 15 minute extractions, until we got collectors/condor. One person dropped right away, and we ended up wiping on wave 9. Pincered by possessed Scions and Praetorians.