22 réponses à ce sujet

[Mark of the Dragon]

I am curious how other people want the story in DA3 to play out?
By that I mean how do you want the story presented. Do you want a couple longer main quests you can do in any order like DAO? Or would you rather have smaller broken up quests like DA2?
For me I preferred Origins. I loved doing the quests whenever I wanted. I also like how the quests felt long and how I felt sated after each quest. Each quest had its own arc that played into the bigger story and it mad the game feel like a true adventure game.
As far as DA2 goes I did not really like how main quests played out. It seemed like the quests were to broken up and it really felt like a bunch of strung together side quests. I do however think that the style would work for some meatier side quests in DA3. I think it would be fun to have some side quests that relate to each other or go together (quests like the ones involving Feynriel). However it is also important to have some fun quick little side quests with no over arching importance besides to flesh out the game.

How do other people feel on this topic?

[In Exile]

DA:O was silly, because there shouldn't have been consequences and there weren't. If I leave Redcliffe with Conor, and then do every single other quest, they just stand there waiting for me. DA:I, if it wants to give freedom, has to give real branching choice.

And the other thing is that DA:O didn't really have plot development. There was Ostagar - Fetch Quest - Landsmeet - Endgame. The middle portion didn't feel like we were doing anything other than spinning our wheels while the blight waited.

[Mark of the Dragon]

In Exile wrote...

DA:O was silly, because there shouldn't have been consequences and there weren't. If I leave Redcliffe with Conor, and then do every single other quest, they just stand there waiting for me. DA:I, if it wants to give freedom, has to give real branching choice.

And the other thing is that DA:O didn't really have plot development. There was Ostagar - Fetch Quest - Landsmeet - Endgame. The middle portion didn't feel like we were doing anything other than spinning our wheels while the blight waited.

I am not arguing they were the most reactive quests. I agree more consequence would be better. I just think the presentation was better.
WOuld you say DA2 did it better? It never had any consequences and the whole game felt like one giant side quest :/

[In Exile]

Mark of the Dragon wrote...
WOuld you say DA2 did it better? It never had any consequences and the whole game felt like one giant side quest :/

I like clearly defined acts more, so in theory I would say DA2 could have done it better... but obviously DA2 failed to actually do it better. 

[Fraq Hound]

I think at this point, I'd be happy with just a main storyline. Maybe give some side quests involving the companion characters and that's it.

Side quests are never as satisfying as the main adventure anyways so why not throw them out and give us a slightly longer main quest.

ME3 had TERRIBLE side quests and from what I remember (admittedly very little) DA2's were just as bad.

Edit: Also, I always found it annoying that I'm on a quest to beat the big baddy, save the galaxy/realm, or uncover some huge secret.

Then random NPC #271 asks me to pick up their laundry and walk their dog. Which I then do, because it's a side quest and I feel like maybe I'll need that useless armor piece or 5 bucks that they gimme as a reward. >_<

The safety of the Realm and all those who live within it will have to wait!!! Sprinkles needs to void his bladder!

Da-da-da-daaaaahh!!!

Hero shtuff!

Modifié par Fraq Hound, 14 décembre 2012 - 10:28 .

[PsychoBlonde]

In Exile wrote...

Mark of the Dragon wrote...
WOuld you say DA2 did it better? It never had any consequences and the whole game felt like one giant side quest :/

I like clearly defined acts more, so in theory I would say DA2 could have done it better... but obviously DA2 failed to actually do it better. 

Yeah, implementation was not so good in DA2.  I think the framed narrative kind of killed exposition delivery.

Ideally, I'd like the crit path to be pretty massive, and for side activities to be integrated in an organic sort of way.  I didn't like how pretty much every quest in DA2 sent you area-hopping.  There should be some kind of natural flow to the order you do things in, even if you can choose to do them in a different order.  And, I like it if it makes a small difference what order you do things in.

Basically, I like the game to be reactive at least on a minor level, so the world seems *aware* that you exist and are doing stuff.  It can be incredibly minor, but it really makes a difference.

[Fast Jimmy]

I would like it set up somewhat similar to ME2.

A few main plot quests open to do in any way you see fit, but, after a certain point, a Main Plot Event occurs and sets off some events. Once this is done, you can go back to choosing which order you want to do the remaining plot quests (with perhaps a few newer options available) and, after doing that, another Plot Event happens... etc.,etc.

In DA:O, it felt like the main story was just waiting for you to get there with your fully recruited army. The same could be said of ME1. ME3 and DA2, on the other hand, had pretty much a set path for you to cruise down, in pretty much a fairly set order.

Having options in where you go, but a few Events that happen and demand your party's attention right away, is a pretty good way to pace things.

Also, having a way to make WHEN you go to do a quest would be cool. Such as in ME1, if you waited to rescue Liara until the last mission, she is delirious with starvation and it really affects how she interacts with you. I would like to see this done on more quests in DA3, where you have the option of going to X, Y or Z, and the order you reach them affects how some things play out.

For instance, if you go to a quest first, a battle could be looming and its inhabitants are scared, but you can do a few things to help them prepare or even stem the tide of battle since you arrived "early." If you wait to do this quest until last/later, the battle will be in full pitch, with casualties or losses to the group you could have saved if you came earlier. However, by saving it for last, you were able to help/save/gain an advantage in another quest. So all things equal out, but it also gives the sense that things are happening in the world when your character isn't looking.

[Todd23]

I want that one boss in the game not everyone will find that's tougher than the final boss to be The Warden.

[philippe willaume]

Fast Jimmy wrote...

I would like it set up somewhat similar to ME2.

A few main plot quests open to do in any way you see fit, but, after a certain point, a Main Plot Event occurs and sets off some events. Once this is done, you can go back to choosing which order you want to do the remaining plot quests (with perhaps a few newer options available) and, after doing that, another Plot Event happens... etc.,etc.

In DA:O, it felt like the main story was just waiting for you to get there with your fully recruited army. The same could be said of ME1. ME3 and DA2, on the other hand, had pretty much a set path for you to cruise down, in pretty much a fairly set order.

Having options in where you go, but a few Events that happen and demand your party's attention right away, is a pretty good way to pace things.

Also, having a way to make WHEN you go to do a quest would be cool. Such as in ME1, if you waited to rescue Liara until the last mission, she is delirious with starvation and it really affects how she interacts with you. I would like to see this done on more quests in DA3, where you have the option of going to X, Y or Z, and the order you reach them affects how some things play out.

For instance, if you go to a quest first, a battle could be looming and its inhabitants are scared, but you can do a few things to help them prepare or even stem the tide of battle since you arrived "early." If you wait to do this quest until last/later, the battle will be in full pitch, with casualties or losses to the group you could have saved if you came earlier. However, by saving it for last, you were able to help/save/gain an advantage in another quest. So all things equal out, but it also gives the sense that things are happening in the world when your character isn't looking.

+1 

[Maria Caliban]

Todd23 wrote...

I want that one boss in the game not everyone will find that's tougher than the final boss to be The Warden.

My Warden has better things to do than fight random people.

[Fast Jimmy]

Maria Caliban wrote...

Todd23 wrote...

I want that one boss in the game not everyone will find that's tougher than the final boss to be The Warden.

My Warden has better things to do than fight random people.

Blood Magic Mind Control/Red Lyrium Corruption. 

Problem solved! 

[Todd23]

Maria Caliban wrote...

Todd23 wrote...

I want that one boss in the game not everyone will find that's tougher than the final boss to be The Warden.

My Warden has better things to do than fight random people.

I didn't say as a random encounter.  They could put a story behind it.  Like after you get Vigilance, The Warden fights you for it.  Or he needs to prove to the blade that he's worthy.

Or as apart of Casandras' companion quest:

You've gained enough trust from her to unlock her companion quest: Find the warden. Once unlocked There's a random encounter and a zombie looking magister approaches you. He is carrying Vigilance. Vigilance speaks through the man and tells you that this man is to weak to wield him, and that the blade would like to test your strength. After the battle the blade excepts you as being worthy of wielding it, and so long as you have it, it has party banter that only you can hear. And when faced with someone powerful you can feel the blades blood-lust. But after obtaining it, a new map marker is unlocked marked "Grey Warden". Going there will cause some dialogue with the warden, as he offers a reward for his lost blade. If you give it to him or tell him that it doesn't know if he's worthy, it will cause a fight, one so difficult that you're not expected to win. Like the fight with Ser Cauthrien at the estate. If you lose the warden thanks you, takes his blade, and will join you for the final boss fight. If you win, the blade won't except him so you get to keep it. And you can 1 - extort him for a lot of gold 2 - kill him and loot whatever equipment your warden had at the end of your save file 3 - Let him go, in which case he joins you at the boss fight or 4 - Bring him to Cassandra, which during her interrogation you find out some cool DA lore.

[Mark of the Dragon]

Fast Jimmy wrote...

I would like it set up somewhat similar to ME2.

A few main plot quests open to do in any way you see fit, but, after a certain point, a Main Plot Event occurs and sets off some events. Once this is done, you can go back to choosing which order you want to do the remaining plot quests (with perhaps a few newer options available) and, after doing that, another Plot Event happens... etc.,etc.

In DA:O, it felt like the main story was just waiting for you to get there with your fully recruited army. The same could be said of ME1. ME3 and DA2, on the other hand, had pretty much a set path for you to cruise down, in pretty much a fairly set order.

Having options in where you go, but a few Events that happen and demand your party's attention right away, is a pretty good way to pace things.

Also, having a way to make WHEN you go to do a quest would be cool. Such as in ME1, if you waited to rescue Liara until the last mission, she is delirious with starvation and it really affects how she interacts with you. I would like to see this done on more quests in DA3, where you have the option of going to X, Y or Z, and the order you reach them affects how some things play out.

For instance, if you go to a quest first, a battle could be looming and its inhabitants are scared, but you can do a few things to help them prepare or even stem the tide of battle since you arrived "early." If you wait to do this quest until last/later, the battle will be in full pitch, with casualties or losses to the group you could have saved if you came earlier. However, by saving it for last, you were able to help/save/gain an advantage in another quest. So all things equal out, but it also gives the sense that things are happening in the world when your character isn't looking.

I wouldnt be opposed to this. Thought I do feel its important we control the flow of the story most of the time.

Surprises can be good things. It adds flare to the story and makes it feel more realistic.

The collectors taking the normandy in ME2 or Cerberus attack on the Citadel in ME3 are perfect examples. It could make for a fun experience in DA3.

[Mark of the Dragon]

Fraq Hound wrote...

I think at this point, I'd be happy with just a main storyline. Maybe give some side quests involving the companion characters and that's it.

Side quests are never as satisfying as the main adventure anyways so why not throw them out and give us a slightly longer main quest.

ME3 had TERRIBLE side quests and from what I remember (admittedly very little) DA2's were just as bad.

Edit: Also, I always found it annoying that I'm on a quest to beat the big baddy, save the galaxy/realm, or uncover some huge secret.

Then random NPC #271 asks me to pick up their laundry and walk their dog. Which I then do, because it's a side quest and I feel like maybe I'll need that useless armor piece or 5 bucks that they gimme as a reward. >_<

The safety of the Realm and all those who live within it will have to wait!!! Sprinkles needs to void his bladder!

Da-da-da-daaaaahh!!!

Hero shtuff!

This I dont agree with as I find side quests are necessary to any RPG. Yes a lot of sidequests in DA2 werent good but that just means they need to be implemented better ( a problem DA2 had with a lot of things).

EItherway I enjoyed some of the side quests in ME3. In fact aI liked most the side quests involving ME2 squad members. Disregarding them completely is not the solution, imo. They just need to be used better.

[Arppis]

I liked DA2 style more to be honest. I like it when story molds and changes, instead of being clear from the start. That's why I like Simpsons. Every episode starts off telling a story, but the story changes in the 10 min mark or so and takes a new track.

So I WISH DA2 style was present here too. Sadly most people don't like stories like that and want them clear cut.

[MichaelStuart]

I would like to be able to do quests in any order.

[Fast Jimmy]

Mark of the Dragon wrote...

Fast Jimmy wrote...

I would like it set up somewhat similar to ME2.

A few main plot quests open to do in any way you see fit, but, after a certain point, a Main Plot Event occurs and sets off some events. Once this is done, you can go back to choosing which order you want to do the remaining plot quests (with perhaps a few newer options available) and, after doing that, another Plot Event happens... etc.,etc.

In DA:O, it felt like the main story was just waiting for you to get there with your fully recruited army. The same could be said of ME1. ME3 and DA2, on the other hand, had pretty much a set path for you to cruise down, in pretty much a fairly set order.

Having options in where you go, but a few Events that happen and demand your party's attention right away, is a pretty good way to pace things.

Also, having a way to make WHEN you go to do a quest would be cool. Such as in ME1, if you waited to rescue Liara until the last mission, she is delirious with starvation and it really affects how she interacts with you. I would like to see this done on more quests in DA3, where you have the option of going to X, Y or Z, and the order you reach them affects how some things play out.

For instance, if you go to a quest first, a battle could be looming and its inhabitants are scared, but you can do a few things to help them prepare or even stem the tide of battle since you arrived "early." If you wait to do this quest until last/later, the battle will be in full pitch, with casualties or losses to the group you could have saved if you came earlier. However, by saving it for last, you were able to help/save/gain an advantage in another quest. So all things equal out, but it also gives the sense that things are happening in the world when your character isn't looking.

I wouldnt be opposed to this. Thought I do feel its important we control the flow of the story most of the time.

Surprises can be good things. It adds flare to the story and makes it feel more realistic.

The collectors taking the normandy in ME2 or Cerberus attack on the Citadel in ME3 are perfect examples. It could make for a fun experience in DA3.

Nothing wrong with surprises. Or the main story popping and "forcing" an event to happen.

The problem with ME3 was that we were given control, but only to do side quests. We didn't have the option to go to Tuchanka first, or Rannoch, or Paralven, or defending the Citadel. EVERY mission was controlled/in sequence. The side quests that involved our former ME2 companions were decently detailed, but they were pretty much the only quests at all outside the main story, except for the random planet scanning/eavesdropping quests. 

I also don't think ME2 had the best pacing, as all of its main missions were recruitment quests or Main Plot Events (like Horizon, or the Collector Attack, or the Reaper IFF). It did have a good mix of side quests, though. Not all of them were Loyalty missions. 

If DA3 can give us DA:O level main quests, ME2-style "events" that broke up the action with unexpected surprise events and then some more reference/consequences to the order in whcih we do our main quests, then I think that could be Story Presentation Perfection.

[Wulfram]

I'm not too bothered about choice which in the end just amounts to which order you do things in. Not against it - for some people the illusion of choice that creates may be worthwhile - but I personally don't value it that much.

If DA:O had required you to go Redcliffe - Tower - Dalish - Orzammar, I don't think it would have lost much.

If there were actual consequences to the order you chose to do things, that could be cool

[Nefla]

I hated the quests in DA2 they were incredibly easy/mindless with no exploration, nothing to discover, we're all like 5-10 minutes long and were all exactly the same.

1) go into that same cave/warehouse/sewer
2) fight like 15 exploding enemies
3) talk to some crazy mage or murderer with no option to do anything except fight them
4) fight and kill crazy mage/murderer
5) rinse and repeat.

The copy pasted maps didn't even look good, they looked
Like lazy crap. There was never a point in DA2 where I was awed by the scenery like the frozen temple, Ostagar, etc...

[Adugan]

Nefla wrote...

I hated the quests in DA2 they were incredibly easy/mindless with no exploration, nothing to discover, we're all like 5-10 minutes long and were all exactly the same.

1) go into that same cave/warehouse/sewer
2) fight like 15 exploding enemies
3) talk to some crazy mage or murderer with no option to do anything except fight them
4) fight and kill crazy mage/murderer
5) rinse and repeat.

The copy pasted maps didn't even look good, they looked
Like lazy crap. There was never a point in DA2 where I was awed by the scenery like the frozen temple, Ostagar, etc...

/find corpse
/give corpse to NPC
"OH THANK YOU! I cant believe I lost this! It was in my family for generations!"

That was like half the quests in DA2 lol

[XX-Pyro]

I'd only prefer Origins way of doing it if for example I went to the Circle first, that had drastic effects on the Orzammar and Dalish Elf situations, or vice versa. There needs to be some consequence for choosing one first over the other, ad more reactivity between them. If this isn't done, DA2's method is better for story telling.

[Sacred_Fantasy]

Mark of the Dragon wrote...
How do other people feel on this topic?

The story should be presented from PC's POV. Not from Cassandra's or Varric's or any other third person narrators' POVs. Especially not unreliable narrator's POV. The story should be progressive unless it's a flashback told by PC like Alpha Protocol or The Twilight. Not a flashback told by some fools who have no slightest idea about PC's emotion and thought.  

Modifié par Sacred_Fantasy, 17 décembre 2012 - 08:26 .

[Uccio]

Firts and foremost it should have nothing to do with ME. Even though Shepar.. I mean Hawke was a obvious ripoff from the ME serie. Its a Dragon Age serie and lets keep it that way. Best storyline? Try BG, partially open world with some local and character tied quests and of course the main quest which requires some of the aforementioned done in order to succeed the best way.