155 réponses à ce sujet

[Rip504]

The misinformation being spewed just to hate is hilarious.

[Peranor]

Pantanplan wrote...

Oh my god, people are actually defending this. I guess it's true then, some people will defend absolutely anything.

yepp

[paul165]

Rip504 wrote...

The misinformation being spewed just to hate is hilarious.

Which bit:
the Citadel being the centre of Alliance government (stated in clip linked in this thread)?
Nazara being intact (shown in clip etc.)?
James being N7 at the end of the programme?
The glasses? (clip)
The comments about Liara? (clip - screwy continuity but arguable ish)
Or the animation quality? (clip)

Which of those things is "misinformation"? It may be stunning despite those issues I wouldn't know but as far as I can tell those things are all valid points.

If something in this list is wrong do please correct it as I'm always looking to improve my understanding of the lore.

[dreman9999]

paul165 wrote...

Zkyire wrote...

anorling wrote...

Zkyire wrote...

anorling wrote...

Wow... Bad analogy is bad.

Wow... Bad post is bad.

Surely you must see how bad that paticular analogy of yours was?

Every single thing I listed was legitimate.

In every single case, none of those things were neccessary. Glasses, hat, scars, all of them purely for aesthetic purposes and served no practical purpose, and were only kept/worn for the fact that those individual characters wanted to keep/wear them.

But yes I'm sure "bad post is bad herpderp"

Glasses aren't traditionally aesthetic though -they're worn to correct eyesite which in the ME universe would be corrected in utero and certainly would be corrected by the military.

Someone doesn't look into current fads.

[paul165]

True enough; allow me to respond with -seen anyone in the games with glasses? anyone described wearing glasses in the books?

If not it is reasonable to assume that it is either exotic enough to raise eyebrows and hence require in program commentary or was a failure of research brought about, I would argue, by poor animation standards.

[Peranor]

dreman9999 wrote...

paul165 wrote...

Zkyire wrote...

anorling wrote...

Zkyire wrote...

anorling wrote...

Wow... Bad analogy is bad.

Wow... Bad post is bad.

Surely you must see how bad that paticular analogy of yours was?

Every single thing I listed was legitimate.

In every single case, none of those things were neccessary. Glasses, hat, scars, all of them purely for aesthetic purposes and served no practical purpose, and were only kept/worn for the fact that those individual characters wanted to keep/wear them.

But yes I'm sure "bad post is bad herpderp"

Glasses aren't traditionally aesthetic though -they're worn to correct eyesite which in the ME universe would be corrected in utero and certainly would be corrected by the military.

Someone doesn't look into current fads.

So that's what's cool in the military these days? Wearing glasses for giggles whether you need them or not?

[K4im4lino]

paul165 wrote...

K4im4lino wrote...

paul165 wrote...

They retconned the whole N7 training programme thing along with various other things from ME1 (and therefore Revelations). There is an N series training programme but 7 is a grade from that programme like a distinction in an academic programme.

http://masseffect.wikia.com/wiki/N7

Vega cannot be N7 by the end of PL because he is agonising about accepting N series training in ME3 hence the problem.

 
Do you know that for a fact? Please site where you saw it was retconned? But on a whole as far as the N Program  and Vega goes I think we are saying the same thing. But the original gripe if you will look back, is that Vega finished PL with N7 status. Maybe they should have said N class status? Regardless it was an invite and the argument was why he received it then and then agin in ME3.

I linked the info in the post you quoted and assumed that you stated Revelations correctly (my copy is in storage)....

Sure Vega can finish PL as an N1 but that doesn't appear to be what is stated in PL and given other continuity issues in the thread Occam's Razor suggests they just made (yet) another stupid screw up with regards to lore.

But it all comes down to what source you are citing. Revelations refer to the N7 Training Program. N7 wiki thread refers to ICT. So technically it is not wrong if Vega was invited to N7TP as an N1 and not given N7 status. I really do apprciate you citing the mass effect wiki as your source.I enjoy the healthy debate. Honestly the BSN could use more of it instead of the flame wars we live with (to much passion, not enough thought). But since there is no formal admission by Bioware that Revelation has been retconned, it is still a valid source. I think I will have to agree to disagree, since both are valid points. Perhaps it was retconned or there is maybe more to it. "How many licks does it take to get to the center of a Tootsy Pop, the world may never know!

[K4im4lino]

anorling wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

paul165 wrote...

Zkyire wrote...

anorling wrote...

Zkyire wrote...

anorling wrote...

Wow... Bad analogy is bad.

Wow... Bad post is bad.

Surely you must see how bad that paticular analogy of yours was?

Every single thing I listed was legitimate.

In every single case, none of those things were neccessary. Glasses, hat, scars, all of them purely for aesthetic purposes and served no practical purpose, and were only kept/worn for the fact that those individual characters wanted to keep/wear them.

But yes I'm sure "bad post is bad herpderp"

Glasses aren't traditionally aesthetic though -they're worn to correct eyesite which in the ME universe would be corrected in utero and certainly would be corrected by the military.

Someone doesn't look into current fads.

So that's what's cool in the military these days? Wearing glasses for giggles whether you need them or not?

Its just an interpretation. Someone elses take. The Devs have 25min + Doc that comes with PL that says they were intersested to see someone elses take on the Universe. I was pshyced to get the back story. I will give people the Reaper and the Planet. But the rest is a stretch. The Alliance goverment is such a stretch since PL references it in no way. To assume no race in ME has milatary repersentation on the Citadel is "mind bottleling". " hey we are all here at the Citadel, but lets go all the way back to Earth for this tribunal even though we have a perfectly good embassy to meet in."

[K4im4lino]

K4im4lino wrote...

paul165 wrote...

K4im4lino wrote...

paul165 wrote...

They retconned the whole N7 training programme thing along with various other things from ME1 (and therefore Revelations). There is an N series training programme but 7 is a grade from that programme like a distinction in an academic programme.

http://masseffect.wikia.com/wiki/N7

Vega cannot be N7 by the end of PL because he is agonising about accepting N series training in ME3 hence the problem.

 
Do you know that for a fact? Please site where you saw it was retconned? But on a whole as far as the N Program  and Vega goes I think we are saying the same thing. But the original gripe if you will look back, is that Vega finished PL with N7 status. Maybe they should have said N class status? Regardless it was an invite and the argument was why he received it then and then agin in ME3.

I linked the info in the post you quoted and assumed that you stated Revelations correctly (my copy is in storage)....

Sure Vega can finish PL as an N1 but that doesn't appear to be what is stated in PL and given other continuity issues in the thread Occam's Razor suggests they just made (yet) another stupid screw up with regards to lore.

But it all comes down to what source you are citing. Revelations refer to the N7 Training Program. N7 wiki thread refers to ICT. So technically it is not wrong if Vega was invited to N7TP as an N1 and not given N7 status. The scene at the end of PL where Vega is wearing the N7 armor could have easily happened after the events of ME3. I really do apprciate you citing the mass effect wiki as your source.I enjoy the healthy debate. Honestly the BSN could use more of it instead of the flame wars we live with (to much passion, not enough thought). But since there is no formal admission by Bioware that Revelation has been retconned, it is still a valid source. I think I will have to agree to disagree, since both are valid points. Perhaps it was retconned or maybe there is more to it. "How many licks does it take to get to the center of a Tootsy Pop, the world may never know!

[Bill Casey]

anorling wrote...

So that's what's cool in the military these days? Wearing glasses for giggles whether you need them or not?

Because Voltron...

[MattFini]

Pantanplan wrote...

The Citadel being the Alliance's base and being in orbit around a planet is a serious continuity error. It can't be considered a minor issue.

Are you freaking kidding me!?

I hate to say this but ... pre-order cancelled. 

[Rip504]

paul165 wrote...

Rip504 wrote...

The misinformation being spewed just to hate is hilarious.

Which bit:
the Citadel being the centre of Alliance government (stated in clip linked in this thread)?
Nazara being intact (shown in clip etc.)?
James being N7 at the end of the programme?
The glasses? (clip)
The comments about Liara? (clip - screwy continuity but arguable ish)
Or the animation quality? (clip)

Which of those things is "misinformation"? It may be stunning despite those issues I wouldn't know but as far as I can tell those things are all valid points.

If something in this list is wrong do please correct it as I'm always looking to improve my understanding of the lore.

Prove That Image of Sovereign isn't missing any parts. As we know it was defeated in Combat,so Obviously something is missing. Meaning it is not left Intact,especially if the Reaper is dead. A dead Human only missing his/her heart is not an "Intact" human. Even if the picture of the dead human does not represent the missing heart and absence of life.  It was a reflection of what Sovereign looked like and that it was recovered. Would the audience know what Sovereign looked like w/o this scene and have never played ME1? IMO the scene was meant to represent Sovereign,its destruction,and our recovery of it. As the Asari states it was just a ship piloted by a rouge spectre. Well what is so special about that? Now we know. A pile of rubble would not have represented this. The size of a Reaper etc.

James Vega becomes an official N7 operative aboard the SR2 in ME3,and chooses Shepard to be his teacher. The N7 on his armor means nothing. It could mean he was accepted to become a N7 trainee,and only becomes an operative in ME3. Prove this is not the case. masseffect.wikia.com/wiki/James_Vega After PL Vega is still a Marine. Stating a break in service after PL and before ME3 was taken. Reinstatement as a marine and acceptance as a N7 operative.

Asari having a convo breaks anything? How? Because they simply had a convo about an artifact. A field in which they both work in? At a time before the rumors of Shepard had emerged? Really? Is it really so hard to believe that a young Asari in the same field as Liara would hold Liara in a high light? What about all of the Liara fans?

Glasses and Animation are a point of personal opinion and minor nitpicking complaints. As animation has a great many styles. I agree the Collectors could have been more detailed or maybe a little more color.

The Alliance does hold a seat of power aboard the Citadel,established in the Games.
Provide the link or proof as I have watched the movie twice and must of missed this line of dialogue. As we have seen multiple humans,Anderson,Hackett,and Udina all aboard the Citadel at some point within the games. It is undeniably a seat of power for the Alliance within the ME games. I am not stating it is the main or only seat.

What clip? The only clip I saw was the Convo Between the Asari.

Yes the Planet is a fail.

I know I have edited this three times now lol. I am only trying to provide a sensible way to accept the scenes in question.

Modifié par Rip504, 18 décembre 2012 - 02:22 .

[Ticonderoga117]

Rip504 wrote...
Haters gonna Hate.
Prove That Image of Sovereign isn't missing any parts. As we know it was defeated in Combat,so Obviously something is missing. Meaning it is not left Intact,especially if the Reaper is dead. A dead Human only missing his/her heart is not an "Intact" human. Even if the picture of the dead human does not represent the missing heart and absence of life.

James Vega becomes an official N7 operative aboard the SR2 in ME3,and chooses Shepard to be his teacher. The N7 on his armor means nothing. It could mean he was accepted to become a N7 trainee,and only becomes an operative in ME3. Prove this is not the case.

Asari having a convo breaks anything? How? Because they simply had a convo about an artifact. A field in which they both work in? At a time before the rumors of Shepard had emerged? Really? Is it really so hard to believe that a young Asari in the same field as Liara would hold Liara in a high light? What about all of the Liara fans?

Glasses and Animation are a point of personal opinion and minor nitpicking complaints. As animation has a great many styles. I agree the Collectors could have been more detailed or maybe a little more color.

The Alliance does hold a seat of power aboard the Citadel,established in the Games.

What clip? The only clip I saw was the Convo Between the Asari.

That image of Sovereign shows an intact sillouette (sp?), which is  inherently false given ME1.

The N7 thing I haven't seen myself so no comment.

Ditto for the Asari.

The Alliances main seat of power, however, is Arcturus Station, NOT, the Citadel. The movie implies otherwise. Also, there's a freakin' planet right next door! Did that pop into existance then back out again? The hell?

The last one bugs me the most really.

[Reth Shepherd]

Rip504 wrote...

Prove That Image of Sovereign isn't missing any parts. As we know it was defeated in Combat,so Obviously something is missing. Meaning it is not left Intact,especially if the Reaper is dead. A dead Human only missing his/her heart is not an "Intact" human. Even if the picture of the dead human does not represent the missing heart and absence of life.  It was a reflection of what Sovereign looked like and that it was recovered. Would the audience know what Sovereign looked like w/o this scene and have never played ME1? IMO the scene was meant to represent Sovereign,its destruction,and our recovery of it. As the Asari states it was just a ship piloted by a rouge spectre. Well what is so special about that? Now we know. A pile of rubble would not have represented this. The size of a Reaper etc.

Here's your proof. Sorry, but Sovereign exploded. Short of duct taping the rubble together in order to tow it off, there is no nice silhouette to drag off.

[Rip504]

Reth Shepherd wrote...

Rip504 wrote...

Prove That Image of Sovereign isn't missing any parts. As we know it was defeated in Combat,so Obviously something is missing. Meaning it is not left Intact,especially if the Reaper is dead. A dead Human only missing his/her heart is not an "Intact" human. Even if the picture of the dead human does not represent the missing heart and absence of life.  It was a reflection of what Sovereign looked like and that it was recovered. Would the audience know what Sovereign looked like w/o this scene and have never played ME1? IMO the scene was meant to represent Sovereign,its destruction,and our recovery of it. As the Asari states it was just a ship piloted by a rouge spectre. Well what is so special about that? Now we know. A pile of rubble would not have represented this. The size of a Reaper etc.

Here's your proof. Sorry, but Sovereign exploded. Short of duct taping the rubble together in order to tow it off, there is no nice silhouette to drag off.

Nope that is not in the film. I asked you to prove this is what the film is stating. Showing the Video of the end of ME1 is completely and utterly pointless. Disprove what I am saying,you hardcore failed to do so with this post.
Am I saying it was left Intact? No. Wow lmao.

[Reth Shepherd]

Rip504 wrote...

Reth Shepherd wrote...

Rip504 wrote...

Prove That Image of Sovereign isn't missing any parts. As we know it was defeated in Combat,so Obviously something is missing. Meaning it is not left Intact,especially if the Reaper is dead. A dead Human only missing his/her heart is not an "Intact" human. Even if the picture of the dead human does not represent the missing heart and absence of life.  It was a reflection of what Sovereign looked like and that it was recovered. Would the audience know what Sovereign looked like w/o this scene and have never played ME1? IMO the scene was meant to represent Sovereign,its destruction,and our recovery of it. As the Asari states it was just a ship piloted by a rouge spectre. Well what is so special about that? Now we know. A pile of rubble would not have represented this. The size of a Reaper etc.

Here's your proof. Sorry, but Sovereign exploded. Short of duct taping the rubble together in order to tow it off, there is no nice silhouette to drag off.

Nope that is not in the film. I asked you to prove this is what the film is stating. Showing the Video of the end of ME1 is completely and utterly pointless. Disprove what I am saying,you hardcore failed to do so with this post.
Am I saying it was left Intact? No. Wow lmao.

You wanted proof that the PL video wasn't missing any parts, I'm proving it in reverse, by pointing out that there could not have been an recognizable silhouette to drag off. PL may or may not have been missing parts. It was still recognizable as a Reaper, however, which means that it does not match the shapes (yes, plural) that we KNOW Sovereign was in at the end of ME1.

[Reth Shepherd]

Ok, let me put this another way. If you observed a car accident and the crash was so bad that the car wound up in multiple pieces, would you later look at a tow-truck carrying off a merely badly dented car of similar make, model, and color and assume they were the same car?

[Grubas]

hi so its confirmed?
1.citadel in the orbit of a planet?
2. souvereigns body mostly in one piece?
3. engineer wears glasses?

the first 2 are lore breaking.
no respect for lore= no respect for fans

[David7204]

I hope you're prepared to say that every third-party contribution to any franchise in existence has 'no respect for fans,' then. Because small errors of the sort are pretty much inevitable in such things.

Modifié par David7204, 18 décembre 2012 - 06:43 .

[paul165]

David7204 wrote...

I hope you're prepared to say that every third-party contribution to any franchise in existence has 'no respect for fans,' then. Because small errors of the sort are pretty much inevitable in such things.

Personally I'm just discussing the lore and am making no statement at all about the actual quality or otherwise of the programme (other than the animation but that isn't particulary related to ME). That said some of the errors do seem kind of sloppy given the extensive information available just from looking at the codex - more than I'd expect from say SW.

[paul165]

Rip504 wrote...

Reth Shepherd wrote...

Rip504 wrote...

Prove That Image of Sovereign isn't missing any parts. As we know it was defeated in Combat,so Obviously something is missing. Meaning it is not left Intact,especially if the Reaper is dead. A dead Human only missing his/her heart is not an "Intact" human. Even if the picture of the dead human does not represent the missing heart and absence of life.  It was a reflection of what Sovereign looked like and that it was recovered. Would the audience know what Sovereign looked like w/o this scene and have never played ME1? IMO the scene was meant to represent Sovereign,its destruction,and our recovery of it. As the Asari states it was just a ship piloted by a rouge spectre. Well what is so special about that? Now we know. A pile of rubble would not have represented this. The size of a Reaper etc.

Here's your proof. Sorry, but Sovereign exploded. Short of duct taping the rubble together in order to tow it off, there is no nice silhouette to drag off.

Nope that is not in the film. I asked you to prove this is what the film is stating. Showing the Video of the end of ME1 is completely and utterly pointless. Disprove what I am saying,you hardcore failed to do so with this post.
Am I saying it was left Intact? No. Wow lmao.

Sovvy exploded bits flying off everywhere and PL shows a reasonably intact hull being towed off given the state of the ship post ME1 this is impossible - unless of course you're suggesting they put it back together on site.

[B.Shep]

Just watched it and I liked the movie. Vega's choice by the ending was brutal . Almost everyone but three(counting him) died. And the scene showing everyone dying was amazing...

Lots of complains here are just petty(the movie isn't a new ME:Deception in this regard) but i have to say the thing with Sovereign's body and the N7 logo on Vega's armor by the ending of the movie are a bit problematic indeed.

Also, to add another nail to the coffin: Cerberus was indeed seelling intel on human colonies on the Terminus Systems to the collectors in exchange to information on the collector's itself. At least until Fehl Prime when a collector general decided to cut ties.

I would give the movie a 7.8/10

Modifié par B.Shep, 18 décembre 2012 - 10:50 .

[paul165]

Rip504 wrote...

paul165 wrote...

Rip504 wrote...

The misinformation being spewed just to hate is hilarious.

Which bit:
the Citadel being the centre of Alliance government (stated in clip linked in this thread)?
Nazara being intact (shown in clip etc.)?
James being N7 at the end of the programme?
The glasses? (clip)
The comments about Liara? (clip - screwy continuity but arguable ish)
Or the animation quality? (clip)

Which of those things is "misinformation"? It may be stunning despite those issues I wouldn't know but as far as I can tell those things are all valid points.

If something in this list is wrong do please correct it as I'm always looking to improve my understanding of the lore.

Prove That Image of Sovereign isn't missing any parts. As we know it was defeated in Combat,so Obviously something is missing. Meaning it is not left Intact,especially if the Reaper is dead. A dead Human only missing his/her heart is not an "Intact" human. Even if the picture of the dead human does not represent the missing heart and absence of life.  It was a reflection of what Sovereign looked like and that it was recovered. Would the audience know what Sovereign looked like w/o this scene and have never played ME1? IMO the scene was meant to represent Sovereign,its destruction,and our recovery of it. As the Asari states it was just a ship piloted by a rouge spectre. Well what is so special about that? Now we know. A pile of rubble would not have represented this. The size of a Reaper etc.

Discussed below at great length

James Vega becomes an official N7 operative aboard the SR2 in ME3,and chooses Shepard to be his teacher. The N7 on his armor means nothing. It could mean he was accepted to become a N7 trainee,and only becomes an operative in ME3. Prove this is not the case. masseffect.wikia.com/wiki/James_Vega After PL Vega is still a Marine. Stating a break in service after PL and before ME3 was taken. Reinstatement as a marine and acceptance as a N7 operative.

He actually has an N7 on his armour? That means the program is claiming he is an N7 you don't wear rank/qualification insignia you haven't earned yet. That would be like someone accepted for paratrooper training wearing the wings before attending training it just does. not. happen.

Asari having a convo breaks anything? How? Because they simply had a convo about an artifact. A field in which they both work in? At a time before the rumors of Shepard had emerged? Really? Is it really so hard to believe that a young Asari in the same field as Liara would hold Liara in a high light? What about all of the Liara fans?

Liara doesn't work in the field in this time frame she works in the revenge / information broking field. And yes it is that hard to beleive pre ME1 she was socially inept, reclusive and on the fringes of accepted science. Post ME1 she is less socially inept even more fringe and effectively leaves the profession to go become a criminal. Bearing in mind how young Liara is herself when exactly was she supposed to have mentored this asari let alone gained the kind of respect the film indicates?

Glasses and Animation are a point of personal opinion and minor nitpicking complaints. As animation has a great many styles. I agree the Collectors could have been more detailed or maybe a little more color.

The animation is personal opinion sure given the quality of some of their other work I feel they should have done better with the style chosen but different strokes and all that. Glasses however are not personal opinion they do contravene established lore. It is however incredibly nitpicky and the original comment was meant more as a joke than a serious critique.

The Alliance does hold a seat of power aboard the Citadel,established in the Games.
Provide the link or proof as I have watched the movie twice and must of missed this line of dialogue. As we have seen multiple humans,Anderson,Hackett,and Udina all aboard the Citadel at some point within the games. It is undeniably a seat of power for the Alliance within the ME games. I am not stating it is the main or only seat.

You're not PL on the other hand. In the clip provided earlier in the thread "they went straight for the Alliance's throat" there is no way the Citadel is "Alliance's throat" that would be Arcturus or Earth depending.

What clip? The only clip I saw was the Convo Between the Asari.

Regarding what, sorry?

Yes the Planet is a fail.

I know I have edited this three times now lol. I am only trying to provide a sensible way to accept the scenes in question.

[paul165]

B.Shep wrote...

Just watched it and I liked the movie. Vega's choice by the ending was . Almost everyone but three(counting him) died. And the scene showing everyone dying was amazing...

Lots of complains here are just petty(the movie isn't a new ME:Deception in this regard) but i have to say the thing with Sovereign's body and the N7 logo on Vega's armor by the ending of the movie are a bit problematic indeed.

Also, to add another nail to the coffin: Cerberus was indeed seelling intel on human colonies on the Terminus Systems to the collectors in exchange to information on the collector's itself. At least until Fehl Prime when a collector general decided to cut ties.

I would give the movie a 7.8/10

Good to hear; glad you enjoyed it.

[B.Shep]

paul165 wrote...

Sovvy exploded bits flying off everywhere and PL shows a reasonably intact hull being towed off given the state of the ship post ME1 this is impossible - unless of course you're suggesting they put it back together on site.

That is the only plausible explanation we could come up in-universe.

Truth be told i believe they simply wanted to show the reaper(for new audiences) and they ended up making this lore mistake along the way.