292 réponses à ce sujet

[Ninja Stan]

Let's cut out the swearing, please, and try to keep things ME3 story or campaign related. Somehow.

[Dr_Extrem]

iakus wrote...

JasonShepard wrote...

I was attached to my Shepard, but that only made the ending more powerful for me.

In everything from the night before Cronos station, through battling in London, to getting blown up by Harby and struggling through the Citadel, you can see Shepard steadily getting more tired, more worn down. You can see the effect that the war was having on him, until he is crawling across the floor, exhausted, wounded, but unable to give up (just before the Catalyst scene). To me, that made his death... not abrupt at all. It felt suiting, it felt right, that Shepard would give everything he had to end the Reaper threat and succeed. It was a victory, even if it cost him his life, his humanity (meaning that in a literal, no-longer-human-as-of-Control-ending, sense) and his remaining time with the people he loved. It was bittersweet - and I loved it.

It felt railroaded.

It felt like it wasn't my Shepard

It felt like Bioware was telling me the story rather than letting me be a part of it.

If it worked for you, if the train was heading towards the destination you wanted anyway, that 's great.  But that's not what a large number of other people want.  And if Bioware was truly serious about drawing a larger audience, they have to take that into account.

jasonshepard was really lucky. the story progressed as he wanted.

all i can say is, good that at least some persons still felt attached to their shepard.


i was not that lucky - but i wish i was.


my shepard showed wear and tear but always wanted to come home afterwards ... this was the driving force behind my shepard .. "get the job done and go home." .. rest .. sleep .. get a clear head and mourne the dead.

[Clayless]

iakus wrote...

o Ventus wrote...

Our_Last_Scene wrote...

Someone made a thread detailing all the mistreatment of fans that Bioware did.

It quickly died when they found almost none.

What in the entire f**k are you talking about?

Oh, I remember who I'm replying to. Tangential incoherence is your fortè, no?

I think that's called "attempted thread derailment"

Is that what they call addressing something said in the OP these days.

[GreyLycanTrope]

Missing the point, if your opinion gets quantified and fed into an average it by itself isn't much of a review, more of  dash in an opinion poll.

Modifié par Greylycantrope, 16 décembre 2012 - 08:41 .

[o Ventus]

Our_Last_Scene wrote...

iakus wrote...

o Ventus wrote...

Our_Last_Scene wrote...

Someone made a thread detailing all the mistreatment of fans that Bioware did.

It quickly died when they found almost none.

What in the entire f**k are you talking about?

Oh, I remember who I'm replying to. Tangential incoherence is your fortè, no?

I think that's called "attempted thread derailment"

Is that what they call addressing something said in the OP these days.

Where in the OP did you see a comment about the "mistreatment of fans" by Bioware, as your earlier post indicates?

Because I don't.

[JasonShepard]

Dr_Extrem wrote...
jasonshepard was really lucky. the story progressed as he wanted. 

Thanks. I know that, in some ways, I did get lucky. I could easily be in your camp if I also felt that my Shepard had acted OOC - it just seems that myself and Bioware had some similar ideas.

Modifié par JasonShepard, 16 décembre 2012 - 08:46 .

[adam32867]

its just like with that yelling at joker thread, its so unnecessary for them to give 2 options for the same emotion, especially in areas that don't effect the flow of the story. it would be just as easy to give an option where shep is okay with the joke. in me3 you don't feel like you control what Shepard is thinking but rather just how angry or calm he is when he is thinking something.

[Dr_Extrem]

JasonShepard wrote...

And Bioware was always just telling you the story. The dialogue wheel is actually a trick - you determine the tone, but they decide what you say. In that sense, I prefer DA:O's approach. The problem is that the facade had faded by the time ME3's ending rolled around - there wasn't an easy way to ask "would your Shepard be feeling exhausted by now?" so they decided "Most real people would be worn down by now, so yes". You can disagree with that decision - heck, you're welcome to - but I happen to agree and prefer it.

the problem is, that if you go down a road and people follow you, you cant just leave the road at the end.

if the facade drops at the end, the player cant adjust and acceptance is not granted.


it would have been better not to drop the facade and grant the player the option to end the game more personally. it could have ended with your prefered ultimate sacrifice or with my prefered "get it done and go home"-theme.

in this case, all would be happy (or at least happier) with the ending.

changing the tone of your story at the end is a bad advice .. it confuses the audience.

Modifié par Dr_Extrem, 16 décembre 2012 - 08:48 .

[Jadebaby]

lol OP, you got it all wrong when you said "our" Shepard.

It's Mac Walter's Shepard.

[Iakus]

JasonShepard wrote...

Dr_Extrem wrote...
jasonshepard was really lucky. the story progressed as he wanted. 

Thanks. I know that, in some ways, I did get lucky. I could easily be in your camp if I also felt that my Shepard had acted OOC - it just seems that myself and Bioware had some similar ideas.

That's just it, though.  Bioware always toued Commander Shepard as being our Shepards.  No canon, choices get imported across games.  Everyone story is different.

And as I heard someone say "Even after I made a difference, it didn't make any difference"

And it's true, because in the end it wasn't my Shepard.  It was Bioware's Shepard.  Mine got taken away and burned while I was forced to watch.

[GreyLycanTrope]

Jade8aby88 wrote...

lol OP, you got it all wrong when you said "our" Shepard.

It's Mac Walter's Shepard.

And I suddenly feel like I paid for bad fanfiction.

[adam32867]

Greylycantrope wrote...

Jade8aby88 wrote...

lol OP, you got it all wrong when you said "our" Shepard.

It's Mac Walter's Shepard.

And I suddenly feel like I paid for bad fanfiction.

hahahahahaha

[Clayless]

o Ventus wrote...

Our_Last_Scene wrote...

Is that what they call addressing something said in the OP these days.

Where in the OP did you see a comment about the "mistreatment of fans" by Bioware, as your earlier post indicates?

Because I don't.

Surely you can't be asking me something that has already been answered a mere 11 posts under the one you quoted.

Our_Last_Scene wrote...

iakus wrote...

Our_Last_Scene wrote...

Someone made a thread detailing all the mistreatment of fans that Bioware did.

It quickly died when they found almost none.

What does that have to do with anything in this thread?

I guess you never read the OP:

Profanity Beaver wrote...

Yet they still treat us like whiny entitled brats who don't really care about Mass Effect!

I for one, do truely care about Mass Effect! It is my favorite thing ever! Yet I still feel betrayed about the auto-dialouge when it comes to forging the personality of Commander Shepard! That doesn't make me a bad fan! Why the hell would they treat me like it does!?

Modifié par Our_Last_Scene, 16 décembre 2012 - 08:55 .

[katamuro]

4stringwizard wrote...

You could say a lot of things: game being rushed, lazy writing, wanting to focus on the MP aspect of it, etc. They all probably factor in, but the biggest in my opinion is just not knowing their fan base. Honestly, they just didn't have a clue. Or at least they felt like they could sacrifice some aspects of the game to appeal to a broader demographic and everything would be A-OK. Nope.

This. They probably didnt think we cared about other characters. Like Tali's face. Unmasking of such important character was just badly done. Very badly.

[JasonShepard]

Dr_Extrem wrote...

it would have been better not to drop the facade and grant the player the option to end the game more personally. it could have ended with your prefered ultimate sacrifice or with my prefered "get it done and go home"-theme.

in this case, all would be happy (or at least happier) with the ending.

Trust me, I agree. And (IMHO) the actual, EC ending isn't that far off from what you describe - if Destroy always had Shepard survive, and provided a scene with them reuniting with the crew on high EMS, I think most people would be happy. Although there is the issue of the build-up of steadily exhausting Shepard throughout the game - but in that case, once the war is over, he can finally relax.

The problem is, if you're going to have an 'ultimate sacrifice' option, it has to mean something, which doesn't leave space for a 'Get it done and *everyone* goes home'. In my case, it means saving the Geth.



***********************DA:O spoilers:***********************





Again, DA:O did this better. In that case, the Ultimate Sacrifice means ensuring that there isn't a chance for a future blight if the Old God's soul gets corrupted again, whereas survival (which I actually picked) leaves an interesting potential for guilt with the Warden, even though it can be seen as a "Get it done and go home' option.

Modifié par JasonShepard, 16 décembre 2012 - 08:59 .

[Jadebaby]

Greylycantrope wrote...

Jade8aby88 wrote...

lol OP, you got it all wrong when you said "our" Shepard.

It's Mac Walter's Shepard.

And I suddenly feel like I paid for bad fanfiction.

Only if you didn't romance Liara, because let's face it. Nothing else matters

Modifié par Jade8aby88, 16 décembre 2012 - 08:59 .

[SpamBot2000]

Jade8aby88 wrote...

Greylycantrope wrote...

Jade8aby88 wrote...

lol OP, you got it all wrong when you said "our" Shepard.

It's Mac Walter's Shepard.

And I suddenly feel like I paid for bad fanfiction.

Only if you didn't romance Liara, because let's face it. Nothing else matters

Life is ours, we live it our way? All these words I don't just say! 

Never cared for the games they play...

Modifié par SpamBot2000, 16 décembre 2012 - 09:12 .

[o Ventus]

Our_Last_Scene wrote...

Surely you can't be asking me something that has already been answered a mere 11 posts under the one you quoted.

You said--

Our_Last_Scene wrote...

Someone made a thread detailing all the mistreatment of fans that Bioware did.

It quickly died when they found almost none.

Unless you're an idiot, 1 passing statement in the OP doesn't make it the topic of this thread.

[Dr_Extrem]

JasonShepard wrote...

Dr_Extrem wrote...

it would have been better not to drop the facade and grant the player the option to end the game more personally. it could have ended with your prefered ultimate sacrifice or with my prefered "get it done and go home"-theme.

in this case, all would be happy (or at least happier) with the ending.

Trust me, I agree. And (IMHO) the actual, EC ending isn't that far off from what you describe - if Destroy always had Shepard survive, and provided a scene with them reuniting with the crew on high EMS, I think most people would be happy. Although there is the issue of the build-up of steadily exhausting Shepard throughout the game - but in that case, once the war is over, he can finally relax.

The problem is, if you're going to have an 'ultimate sacrifice' option, it has to mean something, which doesn't leave space for a 'Get it done and *everyone* goes home'. In my case, it means saving the Geth.



***********************DA:O spoilers:***********************





Again, DA:O did this better. In that case, the Ultimate Sacrifice means ensuring that there isn't a chance for a future blight if the Old God's soul gets corrupted again, whereas survival (which I actually picked) leaves an interesting potential for guilt with the Warden, even though it can be seen as a "Get it done and go home' option.

if we assume that shepard really survives the high ems destroy and reunites with the crew, there would have been the analogy to the surviving warden. the geth and edi are dead - ground for guilt trips and lots of therapy sessions.

the problem is, that high ems destroy is incredibly vague and the implications that shepard can survive are ... unpleasant.

the endings as a whole are problematic, because they only lead to the sacrifice conclusion. suddenly, we shape the galaxy and not shepard.



my approach would have been different. my ending would have concluded the universe in only one way - lets say .. the reapers dissapear (either way). but to achieve this, the player can go several routes to get it done. depending on previous and current choices. 
in this scenario, the player could decide how shepard achieves victory ... by sacrificing himself, or if the "ems" is high enough, with the chance to survive at the end.
this could be expanded with the option to control the reapers with a device similar to the one in "overlord". depending on the choices and ems, shepard can control the reapers for all time or just let them repair everything with the chance for shepard to savely release the reapers afterwards, granting them eternal peace (if ems is high enough).


a personal ending for a personal journey.

if such an end would cater to the different shepards out there, everyone would be happier ...

Modifié par Dr_Extrem, 16 décembre 2012 - 09:15 .

[Clayless]

o Ventus wrote...

Our_Last_Scene wrote...

Surely you can't be asking me something that has already been answered a mere 11 posts under the one you quoted.

You said--

Our_Last_Scene wrote...

Someone made a thread detailing all the mistreatment of fans that Bioware did.

It quickly died when they found almost none.

Unless you're an idiot, 1 passing statement in the OP doesn't make it the topic of this thread.

So let me get this straight, you're surprised that someone responded to something in the OP?

[mnomaha]

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

The way ME3 was written you could have played it without playing either of the other two games. You probably would have felt better at the end. It was a better place to start. You wouldn't be attached to the plot or the characters. You would have cared about shooting and game mechanics and multiplayer. The ending would have been "meh" so what, it sucks. You might not have even gotten that far. You might have just gotten as far as say Thessia then just played multiplayer or gone on to another game.

The rest of us who played all the way through felt the pain. There was no way in hell Shepard could have survived that explosion. In all three endings you died, all the mass relays were destroyed, the Normandy was stranded on some planet god knows where, the ships in the Sword Fleet either blew up because their drive cores and computers were targeted or everyone starved. The galaxy was a wasteland. And then if you worked really hard and chose destroy they teased you with this breath scene which given the size of the explosion on the Citadel makes absolutely no sense at all, unless Shepard never made it to the Citadel in the first place, and this gives rise to indoctrination theory.

Many of us played multiple plays of ME1 and ME2. Some explored every possibility, This could have resulted in 1600 hrs total for some players for two games. I had 1200. How could we not be attached to "our Shepards". They each had different names. They each had different faces.

Then they say "we didn't know you wanted closure."

So they give us "clarification" like we're a bunch of idiots. Still, no closure. Still same (expletives deleted) of an ending. 5 years we waited. This game could have been the best of the decade. It could have been a legitimate Game of the Year (forget that paid shill GameInformer), better than Skyrim. But they broke my heart. I am holding the line and waiting to see if they come up with something with Puzzle Theory. Until then I use MEHEM. Thank you MrFob. It took a community member to save this game.

Exactly this. I am playing a non-import because some of us wanted to know the difference. It is better by far. They made this game for a new fanbase. Apparently those of us that have been around since the first game are dispensible.

[SpamBot2000]

mnomaha wrote...

They made this game for a new fanbase. Apparently those of us that have been around since the first game are dispensible.

Hey now, 'dispensible' is such an ugly word for 'taken for granted'...

[Iakus]

mnomaha wrote...

Exactly this. I am playing a non-import because some of us wanted to know the difference. It is better by far. They made this game for a new fanbase. Apparently those of us that have been around since the first game are dispensible.

Someone should tell Bioware that fans are not Doritos and "Crunch all you want, we'll make more" is not a good philosophy to have regarding them.

[mnomaha]

Dispensable, Doritos, bantha poodoo, it's all the same thing...

[AchesOfDoom]

Such a potential wasted....