256 réponses à ce sujet

[Kel Riever]

Liked how it was originally. I'm glad they switched it back.

[Chaoswind]

****ing great!!!!

People should learn to play, charge up weapons need to be used in a different way to be effective.

All charged weapons need to be charged before engaging enemies, if you don't want to remember the old days of megaman go and pick a carnifex.

[upinya slayin]

count_4 wrote...

upinya slayin wrote...

count_4 wrote...

upinya slayin wrote...

count_4 wrote...

upinya slayin wrote...

count_4 wrote...

upinya slayin wrote...
The acolyte was better pre-nerf and i'm happy its back

No, it wasn't. It could still strip shields in one shot from any enemy besides bosses after the nerf, which means it wasn't actually a nerf in practice.
And how is a one second delay before firing preferable to a second delay after firing (and killing the target)?

I have yet to hear even one single argument from the pro-chargers why it was better before that actually makes sense.

how about reading my whole posts on it?

I did.
The ROF increase is negligible as it is too minor to really do anything in practice.

The damage increase? Sure helps a bit against bosses but the bosses aren't the ones killing me, it's the mooks and minor bosses, both of which can be one-shot with the chargeless Acolyte.

And firing on impact? What keeps you from firing on impact manually?

Reverting the Acolyte to the charge mechanic takes away the ability to react instantly to any threat without giving us anything worthwhile in return.
And while I know that lore isn't really a concern to people on MP, nobody in their right mind would build a weapon where you have to constantly pull the trigger and release it only if you want to fire.

it takes away 245 damage per shot against shields/barriers and tahts w/o any amps. thats alot.

anyway with that said the firing on impact can't be done since you can't fire in the middle of a charge. if you charge the weapon then perform a Biotic charge it releases up impact stripping away the shields then letting teh force and damage from BC affct health.

and yes it takes away the ability to react insatnly unless you know you run around with it charged and then you can react even faster

When rolling my Asari Vanguard I usually fire first and instantly BC afterwards, result is about the same, except that I don't have to wait a second before I can engage and the BC takes away the biggest chunk of the cooldown., when I'm done BC'ing, I can almost instantly fire again

So while you are still charging your Acolyte I'd have already killed one Phantom and stripped the shields of a second one. 

Lift Grenade
Damage: 2970/2970/4455/2970 (health/shields/barries/armor)

i charge and throw in 2 lift grenades and the whole spawn dies. Acoltye what?

Well, I charge in and use a missile. Your point?
It's about the Acolyte not how fast you can kill things with some arbitrary means.

the AV isn't built on weapons. its built on lift grenades. its one of the highest damage output classes in the game

My point is i listed several situations where the charge is better, you listed 1 that hardly made any sense.

I could say the harrier sucks on a human adept cause it ruins my cooldown. it makes no sense to say it but i could. You are complaining becuase this made teh agme "harder for you" get over it.

[ted striker33]

 Just tried it....its total garbage. Will never use again.

[CmnDwnWrkn]

Agreed - remove the charge. I want this game to be easy mode. Unlimited power w/ no drawbacks.

[Miniditka77]

upinya slayin wrote...

People don't realize that the charge removal was a nerf not a buff. I'm happy to have it back the way it was.

No, it wasn't.  It was a "nerf" to the gun's theoretical maximum possible DPS, but that DPS could only be achieved if you were able to fire unobstructed repeatedly and never over- or under-charged the gun before firing.  And even if you did it perfectly, it might save you a half second to drop a Banshee's shields completely.  Big whoop.  The fact that you can't fire it repeatedly from hard cover is a nerf.  The fact that being staggered can mess up your firing is a nerf.  The fact that my finger gets sore from running around holding the trigger down all the time in case a Hunter pops up in front of me is a nerf.  Making a gun easier to use is a buff.

EDIT:  I'm fine with this change because it came with increased damage - so it is a buff.  But if the change was simply the charge mechanic, it would be a nerf.

Modifié par Miniditka77, 18 décembre 2012 - 08:41 .

[Riot Inducer]

Eh, the charge mechanic makes it clunky but I'd say it's a fair tradeoff given how tremendously powerful it is against shields/barriers. I mean really, in a single clip it can invalidate half the health pool of most of the toughest enemies in the game.

[count_4]

upinya slayin wrote...

count_4 wrote...

upinya slayin wrote...

count_4 wrote...

upinya slayin wrote...

count_4 wrote...

upinya slayin wrote...

count_4 wrote...

upinya slayin wrote...
The acolyte was better pre-nerf and i'm happy its back

No, it wasn't. It could still strip shields in one shot from any enemy besides bosses after the nerf, which means it wasn't actually a nerf in practice.
And how is a one second delay before firing preferable to a second delay after firing (and killing the target)?

I have yet to hear even one single argument from the pro-chargers why it was better before that actually makes sense.

how about reading my whole posts on it?

I did.
The ROF increase is negligible as it is too minor to really do anything in practice.

The damage increase? Sure helps a bit against bosses but the bosses aren't the ones killing me, it's the mooks and minor bosses, both of which can be one-shot with the chargeless Acolyte.

And firing on impact? What keeps you from firing on impact manually?

Reverting the Acolyte to the charge mechanic takes away the ability to react instantly to any threat without giving us anything worthwhile in return.
And while I know that lore isn't really a concern to people on MP, nobody in their right mind would build a weapon where you have to constantly pull the trigger and release it only if you want to fire.

it takes away 245 damage per shot against shields/barriers and tahts w/o any amps. thats alot.

anyway with that said the firing on impact can't be done since you can't fire in the middle of a charge. if you charge the weapon then perform a Biotic charge it releases up impact stripping away the shields then letting teh force and damage from BC affct health.

and yes it takes away the ability to react insatnly unless you know you run around with it charged and then you can react even faster

When rolling my Asari Vanguard I usually fire first and instantly BC afterwards, result is about the same, except that I don't have to wait a second before I can engage and the BC takes away the biggest chunk of the cooldown., when I'm done BC'ing, I can almost instantly fire again

So while you are still charging your Acolyte I'd have already killed one Phantom and stripped the shields of a second one. 

Lift Grenade
Damage: 2970/2970/4455/2970 (health/shields/barries/armor)

i charge and throw in 2 lift grenades and the whole spawn dies. Acoltye what?

Well, I charge in and use a missile. Your point?
It's about the Acolyte not how fast you can kill things with some arbitrary means.

the AV isn't built on weapons. its built on lift grenades. its one of the highest damage output classes in the game

My point is i listed several situations where the charge is better, you listed 1 that hardly made any sense.

Wow, are you being stupid on purpose now?
I chose the Asari Vanguard because it is the the only vanguard I play at the moment. Feel free to exchange her for any other Vanguard if you are unable to abstract from a specific example - the point still stands.

[MetalDeggial]

I dislike the change as well. It was unusable off-host for me as the charged projectile wouldn't appear on-screen until like, 2 seconds later after releasing the trigger. Guess I'l just use the Talon instead. I hate charge mechanics.

[GeneralMoskvin_2.0]

So, if it is not point and shoot like the harrier/black widow/hurricane/piranha/paladin it is bad?

Players these days.

[Chevyboy88]

The only thing better than the reverted charge mechanic, is all the crying about the reverted charge mechanic.

I love it.

[sandboxgod]

 count_4 I believe you  to be incorrect because according to the balance notes the Acolyte was returned to it's original state. That means they removed the damage nerf. 

[upinya slayin]

count_4 wrote...

upinya slayin wrote...

count_4 wrote...

upinya slayin wrote...

count_4 wrote...

upinya slayin wrote...

count_4 wrote...

upinya slayin wrote...

count_4 wrote...

upinya slayin wrote...
The acolyte was better pre-nerf and i'm happy its back

No, it wasn't. It could still strip shields in one shot from any enemy besides bosses after the nerf, which means it wasn't actually a nerf in practice.
And how is a one second delay before firing preferable to a second delay after firing (and killing the target)?

I have yet to hear even one single argument from the pro-chargers why it was better before that actually makes sense.

how about reading my whole posts on it?

I did.
The ROF increase is negligible as it is too minor to really do anything in practice.

The damage increase? Sure helps a bit against bosses but the bosses aren't the ones killing me, it's the mooks and minor bosses, both of which can be one-shot with the chargeless Acolyte.

And firing on impact? What keeps you from firing on impact manually?

Reverting the Acolyte to the charge mechanic takes away the ability to react instantly to any threat without giving us anything worthwhile in return.
And while I know that lore isn't really a concern to people on MP, nobody in their right mind would build a weapon where you have to constantly pull the trigger and release it only if you want to fire.

it takes away 245 damage per shot against shields/barriers and tahts w/o any amps. thats alot.

anyway with that said the firing on impact can't be done since you can't fire in the middle of a charge. if you charge the weapon then perform a Biotic charge it releases up impact stripping away the shields then letting teh force and damage from BC affct health.

and yes it takes away the ability to react insatnly unless you know you run around with it charged and then you can react even faster

When rolling my Asari Vanguard I usually fire first and instantly BC afterwards, result is about the same, except that I don't have to wait a second before I can engage and the BC takes away the biggest chunk of the cooldown., when I'm done BC'ing, I can almost instantly fire again

So while you are still charging your Acolyte I'd have already killed one Phantom and stripped the shields of a second one. 

Lift Grenade
Damage: 2970/2970/4455/2970 (health/shields/barries/armor)

i charge and throw in 2 lift grenades and the whole spawn dies. Acoltye what?

Well, I charge in and use a missile. Your point?
It's about the Acolyte not how fast you can kill things with some arbitrary means.

the AV isn't built on weapons. its built on lift grenades. its one of the highest damage output classes in the game

My point is i listed several situations where the charge is better, you listed 1 that hardly made any sense.

Wow, are you being stupid on purpose now?
I chose the Asari Vanguard because it is the the only vanguard I play at the moment. Feel free to exchange her for any other Vanguard if you are unable to abstract from a specific example - the point still stands.

the play somthing else. sorry if your easy win button is gone. get better with other things. I used it exclusivley on my slayer pre nerf charge gun, then BC you get a TB from that (using dis rounds) dodge back, PD, PD, PD, = dead spawn

[Shyde01]

Zardoc wrote...

Shyde01 wrote...

count_4 wrote...

upinya slayin wrote...
The acolyte was better pre-nerf and i'm happy its back

No, it wasn't. It could still strip shields in one shot from any enemy besides bosses after the nerf, which means it wasn't actually a nerf in practice.
And how is a one second delay before firing preferable to a second delay after firing (and killing the target)?

I have yet to hear even one single argument from the pro-chargers why it was better before that actually makes sense.

This is incorrect. I know for a fact on gold+ the chargeless nerfed acolyte (no consumables) left 3 bars of shields on a phantom, requiring a second shot. Playing as a drell adept, this was detrimental. My jacket has the holes to prove it

That's bull. Maybe on Plat, but on Gold you needed exactly one shot to completely strip the shields of a Phantom.

It has been verified on gold+ that the nerfed acolyte left some shield on a phantom after 1 shot. Posters here have noted this.  Please check in-game. (We all make mistakes; no shame in admitting it.)

Re-instating its damage with the charge mechanic is probably the only reason many casters here are pleased (since the charge mechanic has disadvantages and is, admitedly, annoying to get used to and employ).

[Swansuite]

Chaoswind wrote...

"****ing great!!!!

People should learn to play, charge up weapons need to be used in a different way to be effective."

All charged weapons need to be charged before engaging enemies, if you don't want to remember the old days of megaman go and pick a carnifex.

Your point would make more sense if, in fact, the acolyte was a charged weapon, but it isn't or least hasn't been for a long, long time. Folks have gotten used to it. For those saying try something different..... well, some of us simply like to find a nice character/weapon and stick with it. That's what made the game fun for me. I've done three golds since this change and, frankly, it just isn't really very fun to play anymore and feels like a grind. 

Take a quick look at the comments here and it's obvious that about 70% of the posters DON'T like this change and a few uber-hip think it's okay to just come on in and spam their insults. Thanks for that.... I hadn't gotten hit yet today. 

[Badpanzer]

I hate the change...I liked the chargeless Acolyte and I wasnt bothered by the nerf as it was still good.
However i cannot stand the stupid charge up mechanic...the idea of a weapon that you hold down the trigger and it fires only when the trigger is released is so deeply stupid as to defy description.
It really is a shame and I cannot see why BW decided to backslide.

Bioware please remove the charge mechanic as it is stupid...in the meantime Im back to my old love the Talon.

[upinya slayin]

Lord_Sirian wrote...

Shyde01 wrote...

Zardoc wrote...

Shyde01 wrote...

count_4 wrote...

upinya slayin wrote...
The acolyte was better pre-nerf and i'm happy its back

No, it wasn't. It could still strip shields in one shot from any enemy besides bosses after the nerf, which means it wasn't actually a nerf in practice.
And how is a one second delay before firing preferable to a second delay after firing (and killing the target)?

I have yet to hear even one single argument from the pro-chargers why it was better before that actually makes sense.

This is incorrect. I know for a fact on gold+ the chargeless nerfed acolyte (no consumables) left 3 bars of shields on a phantom, requiring a second shot. Playing as a drell adept, this was detrimental. My jacket has the holes to prove it

That's bull. Maybe on Plat, but on Gold you needed exactly one shot to completely strip the shields of a Phantom.

It has been verified on gold+ that the nerfed acolyte left some shield on a phantom after 1 shot. Posters here have noted this.  Please check in-game. (We all make mistakes; no shame in admitting it.)

Re-instating its damage with the charge mechanic is probably the only reason many casters here are pleased (since the charge mechanic has disadvantages and is, admitedly, annoying to get used to and employ).

 

With the damage nerf, all you needed to do was take the +% weapon damage increase in rank 6 evo of character training and the Acolyte would strip Gold Phantom barriers in 1 shot.

Nope. Doesn't add up
you would need a 40% passive boost to do 3087 damage to barriers with 1 shot. a godl pahntom has 3075. Nobody has 40% weapon damage in their paassives

[Swansuite]

Here's a thought since it's obvious that some of the vets here liked the charging aspect of this weapon.... why not make an acolyte I and II and one charges, the other doesn't. Everyone is served and the glitchers have TWO choices! Win/win.

[MarkNinety9]

I am very disappointed with this change. I didn't like the charge mechanism to start with and began to use it only after the charge was dropped.

If it must be a charge weapon at least it should be like the arc pistol and shoot something when you hit the fire button.

I suppose I'm going back to the Carnifex. I might be giving up on gold for a while too. At least I had it for my gold and silver solos for lone wolf. With my Asari adept and Incendiary IV+warp+throw it was quite a FE / BE machine. Too bad I still have map mastery left to finish for BoB banner.

[codename2o2]

Not happy with it? Don't use it then. You lived without it before it came out, you can live without it now.

I am VERY happy with reverting it back to how it was before because after they removed the charge, it just felt like every other gun I'd use. Now that it has the charge back, it's unique to me again. Thank you Bioware

[Poison_Berrie]

Swansuite wrote...

Second, this gun is useful as a shield stripper and pretty much nothing else (it has a little bit of kick, but not much).

Que?
It's almost on level with the heavier and rare Scorpion in terms of damage, a good staggerer, applies ammo powers like a boss and has a proximity trigger. 
It nearly invalidates both the Scorpion and Falcon.

Essentially, you've forced me to completely revamp the way I pla (paladin/Sentinel/acolyte=strip, spray, explode).

Oh no! If only he had a shield stripping power of his ow... Wait it does.

STOP with the niggling changes and improve the game engine/server so it actually works right. Now THAT would be an improvement! 

As much as everyone wants that, it's not going to come much faster if you stop doing balance changes (separate teams, different processes).

Also I'd almost think that there was only 1 weapon that was viable for casters. However did casters excist before Earth.

[ThatGuyThatPlaysThisGame]

Zhuinden wrote...

InTheZone wrote...

regack wrote...

upinya slayin wrote...

Zhuinden wrote...

After messing with the Carnifex and the Piranha, there should be at least one Caster weapon left.

The Acolyte did not need to be reverted, I'd laugh if the missile glitchers would be more abundant yet again.

People don't realize that the charge removal was a nerf not a buff. I'm happy to have it back the way it was.

I am sooooooo in agreement with upinya on this...  having the charge mechanic back is the best thing they could do to the acolyte.

Can either of you explain how this is the best thing?

I'm also confused, the only thing this achieves is that you cannot shoot with the thing when you want to shoot with it, which just makes it frustrating and infuriorating.

I'm enjoying the charge acolyte more. I love how they literally reverted everything thanks to the charge coming back. I missed the old damage.

Here's a secret: Use soft cover!