1388 réponses à ce sujet

[dreman9999]

Dr_Extrem wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Rifneno wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

fr33stylez wrote...

Bill Casey wrote...

SeptimusMagistos wrote...

Please try. Shepard has always imposed his morality on others. I just want to hear why that suddenly becomes a bad thing now that he can do it to more people at once.

It's the difference between being a moderate and an extremist...

Or the difference between the police and a police state. Or the military and a military-state.

We have yet to even see how Shepard applies his/her power.

Shepard is dead.  There's a Reaper running around with data extracted from any idiot Shepard who thought it was a good idea to upload into a Reaper.  Nothing more.  The dialogue makes this abundantly clear.  Controllers really to stop kidding themselves with all the "what Shepard will do".  Shepard is dead.

Shepard is no longer human. Not dead. The dialogue only shows thatShepoardis just no longer human.

well .. getting vapourised by electric current, fits the definition of being dead. whatever was given birth after sheps death, is no longer shepard - shepard would not talk of him/herself like of another person.

it is something new - the epilogue is clear.

Death for the body. But if the mind still lives on, then your still alive.

[Dr_Extrem]

dreman9999 wrote...

Dr_Extrem wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Rifneno wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

fr33stylez wrote...

Bill Casey wrote...

SeptimusMagistos wrote...

Please try. Shepard has always imposed his morality on others. I just want to hear why that suddenly becomes a bad thing now that he can do it to more people at once.

It's the difference between being a moderate and an extremist...

Or the difference between the police and a police state. Or the military and a military-state.

We have yet to even see how Shepard applies his/her power.

Shepard is dead. There's a Reaper running around with data extracted from any idiot Shepard who thought it was a good idea to upload into a Reaper. Nothing more. The dialogue makes this abundantly clear. Controllers really to stop kidding themselves with all the "what Shepard will do". Shepard is dead.

Shepard is no longer human. Not dead. The dialogue only shows thatShepoardis just no longer human.

well .. getting vapourised by electric current, fits the definition of being dead. whatever was given birth after sheps death, is no longer shepard - shepard would not talk of him/herself like of another person.

it is something new - the epilogue is clear.

Death for the body. But if the mind still lives on, then your still alive.

if i live on in a different form but i call myself something new and speak of myself as of a different person .. is it still me? or is it something new that possessey my memories and thoughts?

dreman .. 4 posts in a row, does that count as spamming?


well .. is it time for the "dont argue with a stone"-analogy again?

Modifié par Dr_Extrem, 21 décembre 2012 - 11:33 .

[dreman9999]

clennon8 wrote...

lolwut. Shepard dies in the Control ending. He's stone dead. Not resting. Not stunned. Not pining for the fjords. Seriously, can we all get on the same plane of existence here?

The ending show he is still alive as an ai.

[Iakus]

jtav wrote...

clennon8 wrote...

lolwut. Shepard dies in the Control ending. He's stone dead. Not resting. Not stunned. Not pining for the fjords. Seriously, can we all get on the same plane of existence here?

It's...a little more complicated than that. Shepard dies, but the stuff that makes him "him" continues in an altered form. Effectively, he's gone to an AI afterlife. If I got hit by a truck and came back as a ghost with some powers, I'd be dead but you wouldn't think of me as gone in the usual sense and I'd have a case for considering myself the same person as before.

"You will die.  You will control us but you will lose everything youre"

Yeah Shepard's mind gets uploaded to an AI.  but it's an AI, not Shepard.  There is no attatchment to the memories, it doesn't identify with organics (the Catalyst expressly says this will be the case)  It's basically no more Shepard than an echo of your voice is you.

[EpicBoot2daFace]

Even if you were able to upload your thoughts and memories to a robot, it doesn't mean the robot is you.

[Iakus]

dreman9999 wrote...

iakus wrote...

You know, I watched the finale to Burn Notice, and Sam Axe had a really good point about this whole "whatever it takes" line of thought:

"You have good intentions, but you do enough bad things, you become the bad guy"

That pretty much sums up ME3's endings in general.

But none ofthe ending makes Shepard the bad guy.

In my book all the endings make Shepard worse than Saren

[jtav]

Or let's put it another way:

The idea that some part of us lives on after death is a very old one. Control is that idea dressed up in sci-fi clothes.

[Rifneno]

dreman9999 wrote...

clennon8 wrote...

lolwut. Shepard dies in the Control ending. He's stone dead. Not resting. Not stunned. Not pining for the fjords. Seriously, can we all get on the same plane of existence here?

The ending show he is still alive as an ai.

The ending shows there's a Reaper that knows what dead Shepard's thoughts were, and it considers them primitive as a human wasn't able to understand like it does.  Sucks to be all the people Shepbinger is going to harvest.

[Ticonderoga117]

dreman9999 wrote...

clennon8 wrote...

lolwut. Shepard dies in the Control ending. He's stone dead. Not resting. Not stunned. Not pining for the fjords. Seriously, can we all get on the same plane of existence here?

The ending show he is still alive as an ai.

No, you don't get it. Shepard died, and another AI was created that has his memories. Memories does not a person make.

Shepard is dead and the galaxy holds it's breath.

[dreman9999]

Dr_Extrem wrote...

well .. is it time for the "dont argue with a stone"-analogy again?

Because he literal ending does not show that Shepard is still alive as an AI.

Are we also mising the fact here the death of a person and the body are 2 different things? If a person has amnisia, is what that person was before still alive? If a person is brain dead, is that person still alive?

ME covers these issues.http://www.youtube.c..._QmG57VwZs#t=84s



Ifany on being the rock hear it's you.

Modifié par dreman9999, 21 décembre 2012 - 11:39 .

[clennon8]

Shepard has passed on. He's deceased. He is no more. He has expired and gone to meet his maker.

[string3r]

dreman9999 wrote...

clennon8 wrote...

lolwut. Shepard dies in the Control ending. He's stone dead. Not resting. Not stunned. Not pining for the fjords. Seriously, can we all get on the same plane of existence here?

The ending show he is still alive as an ai.

His "mind" is still alive but that's about it. His physical manifestation is gone, so no one is going to know where he is or what happened to him.

[Iakus]

jtav wrote...

Or let's put it another way:

The idea that some part of us lives on after death is a very old one. Control is that idea dressed up in sci-fi clothes.

Most people don't take a journal the dead hero left behind as a literal interpretation that the hero lives though

[Iakus]

clennon8 wrote...

Shepard has passed on. He's deceased. He is no more. He has expired and gone to meet his maker.

This is an ex-Spectre!

[dreman9999]

Ticonderoga117 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

clennon8 wrote...

lolwut. Shepard dies in the Control ending. He's stone dead. Not resting. Not stunned. Not pining for the fjords. Seriously, can we all get on the same plane of existence here?

The ending show he is still alive as an ai.

No, you don't get it. Shepard died, and another AI was created that has his memories. Memories does not a person make.

Shepard is dead and the galaxy holds it's breath.

No, that's Shepard reborn as an ai. Shepard is not dead.

[jtav]

Thoughts and memories. And in my philosophy of the mind, that means that thing is Shepard whether they are stored in data bytes or neurons.

[Someone With Mass]

dreman9999 wrote...
Your missing the causeof the problem.Thecatalyst only did what it did because he was programed to. It is a shackled AI. The Shepard ai has free will.

Right, right.

That's why it killed pretty much everyone it was supposed to protect.

[Rifneno]

ITT: Headcanon. Lots and lots of headcanon.

[EpicBoot2daFace]

string3r wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

clennon8 wrote...

lolwut. Shepard dies in the Control ending. He's stone dead. Not resting. Not stunned. Not pining for the fjords. Seriously, can we all get on the same plane of existence here?

The ending show he is still alive as an ai.

His "mind" is still alive but that's about it. His physical manifestation is gone, so no one is going to know where he is or what happened to him.

Oh, God. I just got this terrible image of Liara hugging or trying to hug reaper-Shepard.

Modifié par EpicBoot2daFace, 21 décembre 2012 - 11:40 .

[jtav]

iakus wrote...

jtav wrote...

Or let's put it another way:

The idea that some part of us lives on after death is a very old one. Control is that idea dressed up in sci-fi clothes.

Most people don't take a journal the dead hero left behind as a literal interpretation that the hero lives though

Even if the journal could create new entries? 

[SeptimusMagistos]

EpicBoot2daFace wrote...

He's dead. His thoughts and memories and are somehow transferred to the reapers, but he's still dead.

But...the thoughts and memories of Shepard is what Shepard is. Everything else is just a bunch of organic matter, not special in any way.

[dreman9999]

clennon8 wrote...

Shepard has passed on. He's deceased. He is no more. He has expired and gone to meet his maker.

Are we also mising the fact here the death of a person and the body are 2 different things? If a person has amnisia, is what that person was before still alive? If a person is brain dead, is that person still alive?

ME covers these issues.http://www.youtube.c..._QmG57VwZs#t=84s

Shepard is alive as an AI because his thoughts and memoriesare still alive. Only his body died.

[clennon8]

The mind cannot be separated from the flesh. Our mind is a product of the physical arrangement of our brain. You cannot separate the mind fom the flesh. You can only hope to make a digital approximation of it.

[dreman9999]

Someone With Mass wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...
Your missing the causeof the problem.Thecatalyst only did what it did because he was programed to. It is a shackled AI. The Shepard ai has free will.

Right, right.

That's why it killed pretty much everyone it was supposed to protect.

It repurpused them. Not killed them.

[Olympiclash]

I agree his body is dead and gone but his essence is now, thanks to the crucible, controlling all reapers. I don't see why that's so infeasible.