279 réponses à ce sujet

[Zhuinden]

HolyAvenger wrote...

The original design was the way it was always meant to be used. They changed to try and curb missile glitching, saw it had no impact, so changed it back to the original design.

Wasn't a nerf.

It was still more user-friendly, and I still say this was a bad decision.

[Striker93175]

[quote]Najarati wrote...

[quote]Striker93175 wrote...
X360 here.  And I prefer the charge.  It *is* better.  If you're getting ambushed by a phantom keep it charged, problem solved.  It's not suppose to be a primary gun to kill everything with, run with it charged -- it still is your panic button.  With charge, you can switch weapons immediately.. It's 100x easier on the hands (coming from an older gamer who cramps up after a doz matches) to hold a button and let it go than to mash on a button with weapons like the raptor or the mattok... [/quote]

The charge is better... for you.  Don't imply it's better for me because you are in no position to say so.  Yes, in the Acolyte's current state I could hold the charge and fire; however, before I wouldn't have to worry about holding the charge and instead could focus on other matters (more attention on what's happening around me and less on my weapon); then, if a Phantom ambushes me I could just  turn and  pull the trigger. 

You also mention button mashing, but the Acolyte in either form does not require this, especially in the chargeless state.  It's rate-of-fire was quite slow.  I'm not sure why the chargeless version would cause any cramping due to rapid button pressing.
[/quote]

Considering most of the dubed "elite" players on these boards prefer it with a charge.  In my mind tells ya something.  There is an audio cue to the charge, and muscle memory kicks in after a couple matches and you dont think about it.  Although I have no problem and with say, the arc pistol where every single shot is a charged shot.  Honestly I feel managing PPR or CSMG ammo to be more attention drawing than the charging a gun.  But your right, I am no position to argue.  Bioware however is, and has.  /end argument

[quote]Najarati wrote...

[quote]Striker93175 wrote...
Harrier has a dreadfully small clip and requires frequent trips to ammo boxes... and on a character with a high rate of fire like the Tsol or QMark you can empty all ammo all spare ammo in seconds.  Harrier is also UR, acolyte is only rare.
[/quote]

Likewise, the Acolyte does not have a large clip; it's reserve is also not particularly vast.  As for rarity, the developers once stated that ultra-rares are not necessarily better than rares, but are intended to fill particular niches outside of those usually attributed to the weapon's class regardless of much the players way -want- ultra rares to be flat-out better than rares.  I'd be hard-pressed to find this quote, though.  I'd have to do some digging.
[/quote]

For its intended purpose the acolyte doesn't require a large clip.  Strip shields, kill w/ biotics/powers. 25 shots would be 25 shielded enemy kills.  About rarity - I do understand.  It's also why the claymore is still top tier arm cannon.  Actually quite suprised people don't talk about the claymore/balance, just watched a vid of a warp warp ammo 1 shot kill on gold brutes.
[/quote]

[quote]Najarati wrote...

[quote]Striker93175 wrote...
Honestly, had they kept it changeless I would have wanted it to do as intended.  Shield dmg only.  0 health or armor damage.  Fire it at a basic trooper all day long and it wouldn’t do a thing.  Read the weapon description, its not the Asari win button... it suppose to deal with shields to allow biotics to do the rest.[/quote]

You're implying two incorrect things here:  That I want an "I win" button and that I haven't read the weapon's description.  Frankly, I don't play biotics at all.  I prefer engineers, in particular the FQE.  I used the Acolyte for its exact purpose--stripping shields/barriers (also staggering).  If something was heavily armored I'd switch to a Hurricane or Wraith.  Aside from that, Cryo blast and Incinerate did most of the killing for me.  Put in another way, I'd maybe get a bronze in pistol kills, but always a gold in tech kills.[/quote]
[/quote]

If you actually read what was written I never said YOU wanted it or that YOU havn't read it - I am not implying anything about you at all.  I am stating in very general terms that had they kept it chargeless - 0 damage to health or armor would have been the best "balance" since the intent is not an asari win button but a means of dealing with shields.  As is, *I* (god forbid I imply anything right) actually prefer the charged verion as well on my FQE as it was the first character I ever used the weapon on and allowed for simultanious shield strip/cryo blast without stopping my movements instead of having to stand still a second to shoot, then use cryo, then incin, and then a delay on weapon switching/reloading... and I can keep a charge ready fo cyro incin combo on units that do not require the acolyte, and higher RoF means that atlas is down to its armor even faster.

Modifié par Striker93175, 19 décembre 2012 - 08:13 .

[Najarati]

Striker93175 wrote...
Considering most of the dubed "elite" players on these boards prefer it with a charge. In my mind tells ya something. There is an audio cue to the charge, and muscle memory kicks in after a couple matches and you dont think about it. Although I have no problem and with say, the arc pistol where every single shot is a charged shot. Honestly I feel managing PPR or CSMG ammo to be more attention drawing than the charging a gun. But your right, I am no position to argue. Bioware however is, and has. /end argument

Regarding the "elite" comment, it tells me there are vocal people out there who have an opinion on what works for them.  That's it.  If you're trying to appeal to these "elites" in some effort to prop up a "my playstyle is better than your playstyle" stance then yes, you're right, the argument is over because it's not an argument at that point, it's swaggering.

As for weapon usage, sure I can tell people how to use something like the Crusader, one of my favorite shotguns and one I do well with despite popular dislike for the weapon.  I can suggest ways to help mitigate its aiming quirks.  In fact, I've done just that in the past, but it's still not going to work for everyone and that's fine.  It's a tricky gun to use, but people aren't "noobs" and aren't "doing it wrong" for not liking it, which some individuals love throwing around for those of us who like the non-charge Acolyte.

Bioware has indeed changed Acolyte, and they can change it again.  I've already suggested what I think is a better solution.  Perhaps they will listen, perhaps they won't.

Striker93175 wrote...
If you actually read what was written I never said YOU wanted it or that YOU havn't read it - I am not implying anything about you at all.  I am stating in very general terms that had they kept it chargeless - 0 damage to health or armor would have been the best "balance" since the intent is not an asari win button but a means of dealing with shields...

Well, considering you were quoting me directly in your post and very clearly wrote "Read the weapon description, its not the Asari win button," what was I supposed to think?  But fine, I'll chalk it up to miscommunication.  If you'd like to continue talking about this I propose we do so in private messages.  I've given my opinion, given my proposed solution, and anything further is likely going to get this thread locked.

Modifié par Najarati, 19 décembre 2012 - 10:40 .

[JaimasOfRaxis]

Ryan Torant wrote...

Edit: Excuse me for the following ****storm, it was the heat of the moment and stuff. I didnt know taht they had asked peope whether to keep the acolyte as it is, or change it. So please excuse that. I reamain with my opinion that it kinda sukcs now, but I see a lot of peope dont think the same. 

I think the title explains it. WHY THE F**K BIOWARE!!. Hated the Acolyte when it had the charge ****, then they change it, and it was really good for adepts, now they change it again, AND THAT SUCKS!
Come on, is the only gun in the game that dosent fire when you pull the trigger. It gets you kill the charge time!
So yes, really really angry about that! Congratulations Bioware, you managed to f**k up one of the best guns!! Nerfs for everyone!!!!!

[Krazy_Kirby]

They should have made it optional charge for more damage instead. I now hate the acolyte again. Its only use is to charge it then use flamer and fire during flamer.....(btw the charge fire is NOT faster than the normal fire idk people have said that,)

[N172]

Striker93175 wrote...

Honestly, had they kept it changeless I would have wanted it to do as intended.  Shield dmg only.  0 health or armor damage.  Fire it at a basic trooper all day long and it wouldn’t do a thing.  Read the weapon description, its not the Asari win button... it suppose to deal with shields to allow biotics to do the rest.

They whould need to overhaul it in order to live up to its description.

1. Weight
The acolyte is meant to be a shield-stripper for casters who do damage mainly by using powers.
In other words: those that run around with one weapon.
You can easily use a Paladin and still be at 190% cooldown-bonus, so they wont need it as low weight as it is.
It beeing low weight only benefits those who run around with two weapons, not casters.
low weight => BS, make it heavier

2. Damage vs Armor and Health
As you said it should be shield and barrier damage only.
=> 0 damage vs armor/health

3. AoE, and Stagger
We already have the ultra-rare Scorpion for that. It has an AoE that staggers and it has a delay.
=> Remove AoE, not sure about the stagger

4. Able to shoot while running
This is not like Reload Cancel (exists because it whould suck if it did not reload just because you started anything else too early) and Pizza-Running (not easy to accompli)

5. You have to stay out of cover to use it and it is an asari weapon
That is the worst part for me, except for the new ones Asari need cover the most.
Yet that description says that it is developed by asari to be used by asari.
Seriously, what is next? Will Graal and Kishock stop working after a melee?
Will using a power decrease spare ammo of scorpion and Reegar?
Will the Punisher suffer from reduced RoF as long as we regenerate health?
Or will we get a new Drell weapon that will need a reload every time after we dare to run?

[Zhuinden]

YOU have the ultra rare Scorpion for that...
you should also think of the players who haven't played for 700 hours straight.

[elamo73]

So they removed the charge for the acolyte to stop missile glitchers but let other charging weapons that can do the same thing and now they reverted it and screwed everyone else instead of fixing that stupid glitch??? Does this make any sense to anyone???

And by the way, by that logic they will probably remove platinum level to stop the glitchers.

[elamo73]

If you want a middle ground for the Acolyte, how's this? Charging for bronze and silver, No Charging for gold and platinum, it reduces the amount of powers that are actually useful and fun (like pull and throw) with so many shielded and armored enemies, yeah, you stop and charge that gun while a buttload of enemies are charging you. I like playing with the Asari Justicar so it feels like they nerfd the adept class, this will just make this game boring.

[born2beagator]

Zhuinden wrote...

HolyAvenger wrote...

The original design was the way it was always meant to be used. They changed to try and curb missile glitching, saw it had no impact, so changed it back to the original design.

Wasn't a nerf.

It was still more user-friendly, and I still say this was a bad decision.

and theirn was the problem.  The moment they took the charge off everyone started using it.  They nerfed it once, and you saw Fagnan's post, he said that nerf wasn't going to be enough.  It was either this, or bioware continueing to nerf it.

[redBadger14]

OP you must suck at the game.

Acolyte was always meant to wipe out enemy shields/barriers. The revert back to charge up and previous damage hardly did anything. I used the Acolyte yesterday on Platinum, it still wipes out barriers and shields easily. And if you actually know how to use it, you account for the charge-up time and shoot it from a safe distance.

So, quit whining and learn2play.

[SgtAmazing]

redBadger14 wrote...

OP you must suck at the game.

Acolyte was always meant to wipe out enemy shields/barriers. The revert back to charge up and previous damage hardly did anything. I used the Acolyte yesterday on Platinum, it still wipes out barriers and shields easily. And if you actually know how to use it, you account for the charge-up time and shoot it from a safe distance.

So, quit whining and learn2play.

While I agree with your statement about the Acolyte, your delivery in it is childish and moronic. You need to stop being that person who thinks they are better than others and come to the realization that you are not.  This is a game, and everyone has a different experience with it.  So, quit lying to yourself thinking you mean something and get a life.  Not being able to use the weapon does not mean they suck at the game. 

Modifié par SgtAmazing, 20 décembre 2012 - 04:08 .

[steverw1975]

Ryan Torant wrote...

Edit: Excuse me for the following ****storm, it was the heat of the moment and stuff. I didnt know taht they had asked peope whether to keep the acolyte as it is, or change it. So please excuse that. I reamain with my opinion that it kinda sukcs now, but I see a lot of peope dont think the same. 

I think the title explains it. WHY THE F**K BIOWARE!!. Hated the Acolyte when it had the charge ****, then they change it, and it was really good for adepts, now they change it again, AND THAT SUCKS!
Come on, is the only gun in the game that dosent fire when you pull the trigger. It gets you kill the charge time!
So yes, really really angry about that! Congratulations Bioware, you managed to f**k up one of the best guns!! Nerfs for everyone!!!!!

Of course there are a number of people on this forum that wanted to see the acolyte go back to the way it started out (most especially, forum members who also follow the devs on other social media so that they actually know when the devs want feedback). Sure, this was designed as a cooperative game, and anything that helps your teammates helps you suceed as well. They are elite, however, and the rest of the playerbase (scrubs, of course) should not be able to keep up with them. No, the lesser masses should fall before the onslaught of our shared enemies so that they can heroicly kite the rest of the wave and bask in the adulation of inferior players (and then immediately following the match log on to bsn and whine about how bad their team was and brag about how they single-handedly put the team on their back and carried it to victory.

[Jay_Hoxtatron]

steverw1975 wrote...

Ryan Torant wrote...

Edit: Excuse me for the following ****storm, it was the heat of the moment and stuff. I didnt know taht they had asked peope whether to keep the acolyte as it is, or change it. So please excuse that. I reamain with my opinion that it kinda sukcs now, but I see a lot of peope dont think the same. 

I think the title explains it. WHY THE F**K BIOWARE!!. Hated the Acolyte when it had the charge ****, then they change it, and it was really good for adepts, now they change it again, AND THAT SUCKS!
Come on, is the only gun in the game that dosent fire when you pull the trigger. It gets you kill the charge time!
So yes, really really angry about that! Congratulations Bioware, you managed to f**k up one of the best guns!! Nerfs for everyone!!!!!

Of course there are a number of people on this forum that wanted to see the acolyte go back to the way it started out (most especially, forum members who also follow the devs on other social media so that they actually know when the devs want feedback). Sure, this was designed as a cooperative game, and anything that helps your teammates helps you suceed as well. They are elite, however, and the rest of the playerbase (scrubs, of course) should not be able to keep up with them. No, the lesser masses should fall before the onslaught of our shared enemies so that they can heroicly kite the rest of the wave and bask in the adulation of inferior players (and then immediately following the match log on to bsn and whine about how bad their team was and brag about how they single-handedly put the team on their back and carried it to victory.

I have to admit, I laughed . Seems like an accurate description of BSN at times.

[redBadger14]

SgtAmazing wrote...

redBadger14 wrote...

OP you must suck at the game.

Acolyte was always meant to wipe out enemy shields/barriers. The revert back to charge up and previous damage hardly did anything. I used the Acolyte yesterday on Platinum, it still wipes out barriers and shields easily. And if you actually know how to use it, you account for the charge-up time and shoot it from a safe distance.

So, quit whining and learn2play.

While I agree with your statement about the Acolyte, your delivery in it is childish and moronic. You need to stop being that person who thinks they are better than others and come to the realization that you are not.  This is a game, and everyone has a different experience with it.  So, quit lying to yourself thinking you mean something and get a life.  Not being able to use the weapon does not mean they suck at the game. 

I'm only speaking the truth, honestly. And if you think my post is childish, read the OP!

Instead of telling me I don't know what I'm talking about, why don't you actually test these things out yourself. I am not by any means saying I'm better than everyone else (implying I don't know what I'm talking about), but the Acolyte is a relatively easy weapon to use. You'll see the Acolyte is still awesome on all difficulties, does its job of stripping barriers and shields, and the charge-up time is absolutely no problem if someone actually knows how to use it.

Perhaps if the OP asked how to use the Acolyte effectively, instead of making some immature, whiny, accusatory post toward BioWare, I wouldn't have made such a "learn2play" post. Sadly, a learn2play post is appropriate for the OP's ineptitude. 

Modifié par redBadger14, 20 décembre 2012 - 04:31 .

[Ryan Torant]

redBadger14 wrote...

OP you must suck at the game.

Acolyte was always meant to wipe out enemy shields/barriers. The revert back to charge up and previous damage hardly did anything. I used the Acolyte yesterday on Platinum, it still wipes out barriers and shields easily. And if you actually know how to use it, you account for the charge-up time and shoot it from a safe distance.

So, quit whining and learn2play.

Im so hurt, Im really am *cry*cry*
 "previous damage hardly did anything" And im the one that sucks. 
Besides, did you even read the edit in the first post before talking?

Modifié par Ryan Torant, 20 décembre 2012 - 04:33 .

[Dragonhalls]

to charged up acolyte,just hold on the trigger
wtf skill u guys talking about?

try using the gun when having a lag with the host...it sux

[redBadger14]

Ryan Torant wrote...

redBadger14 wrote...

OP you must suck at the game.

Acolyte was always meant to wipe out enemy shields/barriers. The revert back to charge up and previous damage hardly did anything. I used the Acolyte yesterday on Platinum, it still wipes out barriers and shields easily. And if you actually know how to use it, you account for the charge-up time and shoot it from a safe distance.

So, quit whining and learn2play.

Im so hurt, Im really am *cry*cry*
 "previous damage hardly did anything" And im the one that sucks. 

Let me teach you proper reading comprehension.

"The revert back to charge up and previous damage hardly did anything."

This is saying the Acolyte revert from yesterday hardly affected its effectiveness. Thus, it is still good.

Good lord, the idiocy here.

Edit: I did read the edit, and you would do better to not make your OP so vitriolic. Maybe you should ask us how to use the Acolyte properly? A little decency goes a long way with myself and others on the forums here.

Modifié par redBadger14, 20 décembre 2012 - 04:35 .

[elamo73]

When playing an adept your concern should be about power use and not weapon. I will agree that when playing with friends the change is not so big, but for me it ruined solo gold and platinum when playing with an adept.

And yes, I know you can still defeat the enemies just with your powers and other weapons, but it was nice not to be concerned with charging the gun and just strip the shields of a phantom at will and enjoy whatever combination of power I felt like at that moment.

[Ryan Torant]

redBadger14 wrote...

Ryan Torant wrote...

redBadger14 wrote...

OP you must suck at the game.

Acolyte was always meant to wipe out enemy shields/barriers. The revert back to charge up and previous damage hardly did anything. I used the Acolyte yesterday on Platinum, it still wipes out barriers and shields easily. And if you actually know how to use it, you account for the charge-up time and shoot it from a safe distance.

So, quit whining and learn2play.

Im so hurt, Im really am *cry*cry*
 "previous damage hardly did anything" And im the one that sucks. 

Let me teach you proper reading comprehension.

"The revert back to charge up and previous damage hardly did anything."

This is saying the Acolyte revert from yesterday hardly affected its effectiveness. Thus, it is still good.

Good lord, the idiocy here.

They increase the damage, so you can see my confusion. If you say that the rever to prev damage didnt do anything, while the damage was INCREASED, i asume something is wrong. If the damage was increased, of course it will wipe out shields, as it did before.

Modifié par Ryan Torant, 20 décembre 2012 - 04:38 .

[steverw1975]

born2beagator wrote...

Zhuinden wrote...

HolyAvenger wrote...

The original design was the way it was always meant to be used. They changed to try and curb missile glitching, saw it had no impact, so changed it back to the original design.

Wasn't a nerf.

It was still more user-friendly, and I still say this was a bad decision.

and theirn was the problem.  The moment they took the charge off everyone started using it.  They nerfed it once, and you saw Fagnan's post, he said that nerf wasn't going to be enough.  It was either this, or bioware continueing to nerf it.

I have yet to understand why exactly  this was a problem for bioware. God forbid the playerbase actually likes a weapon. It's not like it was an OP weapon that single-handedly wiped out enemies all over the map. It stripped shields and barriers, allowing players to then attack those enemies with powers or diferent weapons. The only enemy it was really good at taking on by itself was phantoms. So, while it was a widely used weapon, it was used as part of a tactic, and not a stand alone option. Furthermore, the change that was made had no real effect on what could be done with the weapon. It simply altered the mechanics to make it more frustrating for many players to use. Seriously, this is the first game I can ever remember where the devs blatantly altered a weapon with the sole intent of making it less popular. Not less powerful, mind you, simply more aggravating to use. The irony that this and other changes meant to weaken popular weapons and kits keeps happening in a cooperative game as opposed to a PVP game is both amusing and somewhat befuddling.

[Ryan Torant]

steverw1975 wrote...

born2beagator wrote...

Zhuinden wrote...

HolyAvenger wrote...

The original design was the way it was always meant to be used. They changed to try and curb missile glitching, saw it had no impact, so changed it back to the original design.

Wasn't a nerf.

It was still more user-friendly, and I still say this was a bad decision.

and theirn was the problem.  The moment they took the charge off everyone started using it.  They nerfed it once, and you saw Fagnan's post, he said that nerf wasn't going to be enough.  It was either this, or bioware continueing to nerf it.

I have yet to understand why exactly  this was a problem for bioware. God forbid the playerbase actually likes a weapon. It's not like it was an OP weapon that single-handedly wiped out enemies all over the map. It stripped shields and barriers, allowing players to then attack those enemies with powers or diferent weapons. The only enemy it was really good at taking on by itself was phantoms. So, while it was a widely used weapon, it was used as part of a tactic, and not a stand alone option. Furthermore, the change that was made had no real effect on what could be done with the weapon. It simply altered the mechanics to make it more frustrating for many players to use. Seriously, this is the first game I can ever remember where the devs blatantly altered a weapon with the sole intent of making it less popular. Not less powerful, mind you, simply more aggravating to use. The irony that this and other changes meant to weaken popular weapons and kits keeps happening in a cooperative game as opposed to a PVP game is both amusing and somewhat befuddling.

This. I totally agree.

[Eriseley]

steverw1975 wrote...

It's not like it was an OP weapon that single-handedly wiped out enemies all over the map.

Umm...no actually that's almost exactly what it does to Cerberus and Geth.

[redBadger14]

Ryan Torant wrote...

redBadger14 wrote...

Ryan Torant wrote...

redBadger14 wrote...

OP you must suck at the game.

Acolyte was always meant to wipe out enemy shields/barriers. The revert back to charge up and previous damage hardly did anything. I used the Acolyte yesterday on Platinum, it still wipes out barriers and shields easily. And if you actually know how to use it, you account for the charge-up time and shoot it from a safe distance.

So, quit whining and learn2play.

Im so hurt, Im really am *cry*cry*
 "previous damage hardly did anything" And im the one that sucks. 

Let me teach you proper reading comprehension.

"The revert back to charge up and previous damage hardly did anything."

This is saying the Acolyte revert from yesterday hardly affected its effectiveness. Thus, it is still good.

Good lord, the idiocy here.

I saw what you wrote before the edit turned south, so let me say this...

I realize that your OP was a sh*tstorm, but you should have just removed it completely. However, I apologize for being abrasive.

That being said, yes, the damage after all the buffs was great, but the Acolyte is still very effective after everything has been reverted. Not sure what level your Acolyte is, but I have an Acolyte X and I can strip Banshee barriers in two shots, Atlas shields about two-to-three shots, Primes about two-three shots, and Praetorians two-to-three shots. If you aim well and keep your distance, you can easily account for the charge-up time and travel speed/drop-off. Smaller enemies with shields and barriers usually just take one hit from the Acolyte to take them out. In fact, the damage loss from the revert is negligible. 

[N172]

Zhuinden wrote...

YOU have the ultra rare Scorpion for that...
you should also think of the players who haven't played for 700 hours straight.

So BW should add AoE-Stagger to the Predator? There are players who haven't unlocked any other pistol.
And of course add Hunter sight to Mantis, since the only one that has it is ultra-rare Javelin!

Guess what? Not having everything available from start is the reason why there is a "shop" at all.
Love it or hate it, but it is part of the game that you cannot have everything you want from start!
BW does not even allow you to simply buy the stuff you want.
You get packs HOPING that you get the stuff you want, that is the way BW wants it.
You do not NEED an Acolyte or a Scorpion to play.

And it does not matter at all since my point is that it is not what BW says it is (shield-stripper for adepts, especially asari).
It is petty compared to Paladin/Carnifex on Asari-Adept using biotics (no FEs and the like) without any other weapons.
Honestly I do not even care if it is possible to play a decent Acolyte-AA, it is meant to be a weapon designed to fit their needs, but as of now it is inferior to several other pistols on AA unless you modify the game to have only Atlas mechs and Geth Primes as enemies.