263 réponses à ce sujet

[AlanC9]

ld1449 wrote...
I believe he died, for a myriad of reasons. Not the least of which was the absolutely massive explosion that engulphed the Citadel/presidium. 

That's silly. Scenes exist for a reason. That scene has no reason to exist if Shepard is dead or dying. In any film or TV show you wouldn't interpret the scene as Shepard being dead or dying -- unless you're an idiot, and I don't believe you are.

[Iakus]

AlanC9 wrote...

ld1449 wrote...
I believe he died, for a myriad of reasons. Not the least of which was the absolutely massive explosion that engulphed the Citadel/presidium. 

That's silly. Scenes exist for a reason. That scene has no reason to exist if Shepard is dead or dying. In any film or TV show you wouldn't interpret the scene as Shepard being dead or dying -- unless you're an idiot, and I don't believe you are.

I'd interpret the scene as "sequel bait"

Which in the case of Mass Effect, would be wrong, since Shepard's not getting a sequel.

The conclusion to Sehpard's story needs to have a conclusion, not hint at a story that will never come

[Rifneno]

AlanC9 wrote...

ld1449 wrote...
I believe he died, for a myriad of reasons. Not the least of which was the absolutely massive explosion that engulphed the Citadel/presidium. 

That's silly. Scenes exist for a reason. That scene has no reason to exist if Shepard is dead or dying. In any film or TV show you wouldn't interpret the scene as Shepard being dead or dying -- unless you're an idiot, and I don't believe you are.

QFT.  High EMS destroy Shepard lives.  That's just all there is to it.

[Archonsg]

AlanC9 wrote...

Wait a  second....

Archonsg wrote...
Now take into account that Shepard was last seen on the Citadel which was in high orbit, take into account the breath scene has a body on *rubble* (concrete) ...

This whole argument would be of interest if we were analyzing a documentary, found footage, or something similar. But applied to a work of fiction it's irrelevant.

Surely a 7-year-old knows the difference?

AlanC I don't know if you are trolling but tell me, if you see a body on broken concrete, previously already shown on the verge of death way up in space, what would you think?
Would even a child not be able  to piece together that somthing falling from that height onto broken ground and then say "yeah, that isn't broken, nope, he's still alive."?

If you think that, then I am sorry but my daugther knew, and I could see it in her face that she knew.

Modifié par Archonsg, 24 décembre 2012 - 07:43 .

[AlanC9]

Archonsg wrote...


AlanC I don't know if you are trolling but tell me, if you see a body on broken concrete, previously already shown on the verge of death way up in space, what would you think?
Would even a child not be able  to piece together that somthing falling from that height onto broken ground and then say "yeah, that isn't broken, nope, he's still alive."?

If you think that, then I am sorry but my daugther knew, and I could see it in her face that she knew.

In a movie? I'd think it was a continuity error in the set design. Wouldn't change that the scene means the guy's alive.

She needs more media literacy. So do you.

If he really did fall from space the way you're saying he did he wouldn't be breathing. Your version, in addition to being just confused about what the scene is telling you, isn't even any more realistic. Hell, he wouldn't even fall -- the Citadel was in orbit, not being kept up with engines.

Modifié par AlanC9, 24 décembre 2012 - 07:49 .

[AlanC9]

iakus wrote...
I'd interpret the scene as "sequel bait"

Which in the case of Mass Effect, would be wrong, since Shepard's not getting a sequel.

The conclusion to Sehpard's story needs to have a conclusion, not hint at a story that will never come

If you like. But that's not an argument for Shepard being dead.

[Rifneno]

Archonsg wrote...

AlanC I don't know if you are trolling but tell me, if you see a body on broken concrete, previously already shown on the verge of death way up in space, what would you think?
Would even a child not be able  to piece together that somthing falling from that height onto broken ground and then say "yeah, that isn't broken, nope, he's still alive."?

If you think that, then I am sorry but my daugther knew, and I could see it in her face that she knew.

There's a reason why a lot of IT'ers call the breath scene their best piece of evidence.  Not that Shepard surviving all that wouldn't be as retarded as synthesis being real.  Anyway, let's look at Bioware's official guide.



"Shepard lives".  That's how it describes the contents of what the game files refer to as "End03_Shepard_Alive".

But yeah, he's totally dead.  Have fun with that headcanon.

[AlanC9]

Rifneno wrote...

QFT.  High EMS destroy Shepard lives.  That's just all there is to it.

Thanks. The insanity was getting to me a little.

[Archonsg]

AlanC9 wrote...

Archonsg wrote...


AlanC I don't know if you are trolling but tell me, if you see a body on broken concrete, previously already shown on the verge of death way up in space, what would you think?
Would even a child not be able  to piece together that somthing falling from that height onto broken ground and then say "yeah, that isn't broken, nope, he's still alive."?

If you think that, then I am sorry but my daugther knew, and I could see it in her face that she knew.

In a movie? I'd think it was a continuity error in the set design. Wouldn't change that the scene means the guy's alive.

She needs more media literacy. So do you.

If he really did fall from space the way you're saying he did he wouldn't be breathing. Your version, in addition to being just confused about what the scene is telling you, isn't even any more realistic. Hell, he wouldn't even fall -- the Citadel was in orbit, not being kept up with engines.

Okies.
You are trolling. 
Fine. 

[AlanC9]

Trolling? For saying why your bizarre interpretation is bizarre?

Do you really think a character in a film is dead when the film shows him alive, if  you don't think it probable that he lived through the previous scene? Seriously?

Modifié par AlanC9, 24 décembre 2012 - 07:53 .

[element eater]

sheps probably meant to be alive thats not the problem 

the problem is its S*** and completely unsatisfying to a whole bunch of people

although bio dont help matters by acting in the way they do when discussing the endings

Modifié par element eater, 24 décembre 2012 - 08:03 .

[Rifneno]

element eater wrote...

sheps probably meant to be alive thats not the problem 

the problem is its S*** and completely unsatisfying to a whole bunch of people

although bio dont help matters by acting in the way they do when discussing the endings

Pre-release: "You'll get answers to everything. That was one of the key things." (actual quote)
Post-release: Speculations 4 all!

And they wonder why we don't trust them.

[AlanC9]

Well, we got answers to most of the question we had going in to ME3. Like why the Reapers do the harvest.... even if lots of us hated the answers.

[ld1449]

AlanC9 wrote...

Wait a  second....

Archonsg wrote...
Now take into account that Shepard was last seen on the Citadel which was in high orbit, take into account the breath scene has a body on *rubble* (concrete) ...

This whole argument would be of interest if we were analyzing a documentary, found footage, or something similar. But applied to a work of fiction it's irrelevant.

Surely a 7-year-old knows the difference?

Edit: after reading this...

Given the scene we had, it would be logical to state that Shepard died on impact and that "breath"  was an inaccurate portrayal of what happened.

...I'm not 100% certain you do, either.

Or am I just missing the jokes here?

Its not irrelevant, its called exposition.

Its what fiction normally uses to tell their story.

Its like saying if I were playing the first Halo game, Master Chief escapes the Pillar, it cuts to black and when it fades back in we just see the ring world exploding and Master Chief is on the plane flying back home. "I think we're just getting started."

"But what the hell happened? We're missing elements here."

"If this were a doccumentary yeah. But since its a work of fiction the missing elements are irrelevant."

Do you see the missing pieces here???

[ld1449]

AlanC9 wrote...

ld1449 wrote...
I believe he died, for a myriad of reasons. Not the least of which was the absolutely massive explosion that engulphed the Citadel/presidium. 

That's silly. Scenes exist for a reason. That scene has no reason to exist if Shepard is dead or dying. In any film or TV show you wouldn't interpret the scene as Shepard being dead or dying -- unless you're an idiot, and I don't believe you are.

You aparently lack the means to listen so let me clarify again.

Author intent. Means Nothing. Without. Proper. Execution.

This is a concept you are aparently failing at grasping.

[ld1449]

paul165 wrote...


Hope is the first step on the road to disappointment (seems apt for this thread I feel).

An open mind is like a fortress. With its gates unbarred and unguarded.

[dorktainian]

When I die, I wanna go like my grandpa…peacefully…sleeping…not screaming, like the passengers in his car…

[ld1449]

dorktainian wrote...

When I die, I wanna go like my grandpa…peacefully…sleeping…not screaming, like the passengers in his car…

[Iakus]

AlanC9 wrote...

iakus wrote...
I'd interpret the scene as "sequel bait"

Which in the case of Mass Effect, would be wrong, since Shepard's not getting a sequel.

The conclusion to Sehpard's story needs to have a conclusion, not hint at a story that will never come

If you like. But that's not an argument for Shepard being dead.

Actually I don't like.  That's the problem.

It is an argument for Sheparc being alive not shown properly and p*ssing off a huge number of fans.

[JyrikGauldy]

for your won sake OP, keep your expectations low

[AlanC9]

ld1449 wrote...
You aparently lack the means to listen so let me clarify again.

Author intent. Means Nothing. Without. Proper. Execution.

This is a concept you are aparently failing at grasping.

I'm not failing to grasp it. I'm saying it's nonsense. Even if you don't like how unrealistic a scene was that doesn't mean that the scene went some more realistic way. It went the way you saw it go.

When you watched Indiana Jones survive an atomic bomb unscathed by hiding in a refrigerator, you may have thought the scene was badly written, but you didn't think he had actually been killed or badly injured in the blast. Right?

Seriously, what did you think had happened when you saw that scene? Beyond that you had just watched a badly-written scene, which we can take for granted.

I'm just trying to figure out what use your interpretive strategy is. Mostly it would seem to ensure that you get stuff wrong.

Modifié par AlanC9, 24 décembre 2012 - 10:19 .

[CptBomBom00]

Wut? Damn BW said like million times that they are finished with the endings, so I doubt they will alter ending with this DLC.

[ld1449]

AlanC9 wrote...

ld1449 wrote...
You aparently lack the means to listen so let me clarify again.

Author intent. Means Nothing. Without. Proper. Execution.

This is a concept you are aparently failing at grasping.

I'm not failing to grasp it. I'm saying it's nonsense. Even if you don't like how unrealistic a scene was that doesn't mean that the scene went some more realistic way. It went the way you saw it go.

When you watched Indiana Jones survive an atomic bomb unscathed by hiding in a refrigerator, you may have thought the scene was badly written, but you didn't think he had actually been killed or badly injured in the blast. Right?

Seriously, what did you think had happened when you saw that scene? Beyond that you had just watched a badly-written scene, which we can take for granted.

I'm just trying to figure out what use your interpretive strategy is. Mostly it would seem to ensure that you get stuff wrong.

You are looking at this through

"The end is what it is regardless of what happened while getting here."

I am looking as is Archsong with "The events leading up to this point one way while the end result is pointing somewhere else."

Bioware wants you me and the hole in the wall to believe 2+2 = 22

Shepard go hit by Reaper beam, shot in the abdomen, mostlikely has a concussion to boot, got blown up, fell god only knows where from how far a drop we don't know either, is at least hours away from rescue, FAR away from a proper, well stocked medical room along with a doctor. Is likely suffering from severe bloodloss if not internal injuries and you want me to just accept that the half rendered torso means he's alive?

I'd sooner believe 2+2 = potato.

[Andromidius]

AlanC9 wrote...

Wait a  second....

Archonsg wrote...
Now take into account that Shepard was last seen on the Citadel which was in high orbit, take into account the breath scene has a body on *rubble* (concrete) ...

This whole argument would be of interest if we were analyzing a documentary, found footage, or something similar. But applied to a work of fiction it's irrelevant.

Surely a 7-year-old knows the difference?

Actually, if its show in literature/film/art/games then it actually means something very deliberate.  Its called foreshadowing.

Shepard even being in rubble, let alone fit to breath, should be setting off alarm bells.

[Andromidius]

ld1449 wrote...
Shepard go hit by Reaper beam, shot in the abdomen, mostlikely has a concussion to boot, got blown up, fell god only knows where from how far a drop we don't know either, is at least hours away from rescue, FAR away from a proper, well stocked medical room along with a doctor. Is likely suffering from severe bloodloss if not internal injuries and you want me to just accept that the half rendered torso means he's alive?

Okay.  Take that information.  Now figure out how its possible.

Its pretty easy.  Think back to the last time Shepard was in a place where there was lots of rubble and his/her armour was badly damaged.