1009 réponses à ce sujet

[Xamufam]

Dr_Extrem wrote...

Troxa wrote...

Dr_Extrem wrote...

then, there was no new dna created.

there are several established methods, to alter the dna but all use retroviral treatment.


the binary helix salesman (rafael vargas) on noveria, tells us how genetic alteration works. the retrovirus you get, alters your cells, the alteration takes effect, after cell division happens. the old cell stays the was it was - only the stored dna is altered. the new cell will be something new - not the old. this process can take up to 10 years.

what we see is not a simple dna-alteration (like the starchild makes us want to believe). it is a complete transformation on the cellular level.

you mean alteration at sub atomic level
even the level of strings (string theory)

for a change who creeps in - like retroviral treatment, you only have to alter the dna.

for an immidiate change, you would have to alter the existing cell. the cell is made off proteins and sugars. to alter the cell, you would have to rearrange every atom in every molecule of every cell. subatomic parts, the charge and state would have to be altered as well. within a 4-dimensional system.

18g of water, contain roughly 6.022 x 10²³ oxygen atoms and 2 x 6.022 x 10²³ atoms of hydrogen. all of them would need to be treated equally and rearranged without any mistake.

good luck with that .. the friction caused by the molecular movement alone would vapourize the cell.

And immidiate change is what we see at the end

Modifié par Troxa, 06 janvier 2013 - 05:14 .

[ElSuperGecko]

Troxa wrote...
nope you the one showing ignorance, the catalyst should not even exist, he says is the citadel . Then why didn't he shut down the relays & bring in the reapers back in ME1 & why didn't the reapers take the citadel in me3 & shut down thge relays even an idiot would se that as an strategic advantage

the script of me 3 was leaked late in 2011 & it shows the real ending was acctully dark energy it was changed at the last minute

....all of which has nothing whatsoever to do with the points I've making, or the topic itself for that matter.  You're going off on a tangent because once again because you cannot deny or disprove my argument - namely, that Synthesis was foreshadowed within the game, and invariably in a bad way.

[Xamufam]

ElSuperGecko wrote...


....all of which has nothing whatsoever to do with the points I've making, or the topic itself for that matter.  You're going off on a tangent because once again because you cannot deny or disprove my argument - namely, that Synthesis was foreshadowed within the game, and invariably in a bad way.

your opinion is your opinion im just showing there is no forshadowing & i have aleady disproven that about the vision
& I can be a little obsessed with it
It also shows that you are the same if you didn't bother to answer i would not answer you

Modifié par Troxa, 06 janvier 2013 - 05:44 .

[ElSuperGecko]

Troxa wrote...
your opinion is your opinion im just showing there is no forshadowing & i have aleady disproven that about the vision

Yes, that's right.  You proved that the Prothean Beacon vision wasn't a warning by posting a video of Javik telling us it was a warning. 

You'll forgive my skepticism about the rest of your arguments, then.

[LinksOcarina]

I admit I didn't read 26 pages of this.

any word philosophically yet? Or no?

[Xamufam]

ElSuperGecko wrote...

Troxa wrote...
your opinion is your opinion im just showing there is no forshadowing & i have aleady disproven that about the vision

Yes, that's right.  You proved that the Prothean Beacon vision wasn't a warning by posting a video of Javik telling us it was a warning. 

You'll forgive my skepticism about the rest of your arguments, then.

if you don't believe me look at the video again & you will see that those things that is merging is actully clearing up to become pictures of collectors attacking
I can be a little obsessed with it I need to stop im agreing  there
It also shows that you are the same if you didn't bother to answer i would not answer you

Modifié par Troxa, 06 janvier 2013 - 06:12 .

[ziloe]

LinksOcarina wrote...

I admit I didn't read 26 pages of this.

any word philosophically yet? Or no?

To some extent, though, there appears to be a lot of arguing over this procedure being totally acceptable. Kinda makes me wish the writers would step in, and give us their take on the subject. 

Modifié par ziloe, 06 janvier 2013 - 05:59 .

[Ice Cold J]

I agree wholeheartedly... that's why I don't pick it.
It's basically playing God in almost every sense of the word.
Controlling the Reapers isn't b/c you're just there as a peacekeeper and destroy isn't b/c it's the cold calculus of war: destroy the enemy or get destroyed.

[Brug0r]

My first problem for me with synthesis, is how incredible unethical it is. If my genetic code got rewritten to that then I'll rather kill myself. I couldn't live with being a "good-looking husk" - for that is basically what it is. That leads to my second problem:


My second problem with synthesis is that it's an offering from the reapers. When the starbrat is giving you the synthesis-choice is precisely the same as when Darth Vader asks Luke to join the dark side, or when Sauron whispers in Aragorn's mind.

And when you choose the diarrhea-green endning you rewrite every origanic thing in the galaxy to a Organic/synthetic-hybrid. You're not only just part organic part synthetic... You're also part reaper (reaper = also synthetic). You didn't end the threat by choosing synthesis. You became a part of it. You basically gave up and gave the reapers everything.

By choosing synthesis you just loose. Is so morbid that there really are people who thinks it's the best outcome. I really don't get that.

:happy:

Modifié par Brug0r, 06 janvier 2013 - 06:12 .

[ElSuperGecko]

[quote]Troxa wrote...
You'll forgive my skepticism about the rest of your arguments, then.[/quote]
if you don't believe me look at the video again & you will see that those things that is merging is actully clearing up to become pictures of collectors attacking
I can be a little obsessed with it I need to stop im agreing  there
It also shows that you are the same if you didn't bother to answer i would not answer you[/quote]

Oh yeah, I'm obsessed with interpreting the scenes and events in ME3, I'm not even going to try and deny that one.

But...

"it's a warning. It clearly shows organic parts merging with synthetic, and depicts the fall of the Prothean race."

...isn't that almost word for word what you've written above?  Isn't that pretty much exactly what the Prothean Beacon vision shows?

[Dr_Extrem]

Troxa wrote...

Dr_Extrem wrote...

Troxa wrote...

Dr_Extrem wrote...

then, there was no new dna created.

there are several established methods, to alter the dna but all use retroviral treatment.


the binary helix salesman (rafael vargas) on noveria, tells us how genetic alteration works. the retrovirus you get, alters your cells, the alteration takes effect, after cell division happens. the old cell stays the was it was - only the stored dna is altered. the new cell will be something new - not the old. this process can take up to 10 years.

what we see is not a simple dna-alteration (like the starchild makes us want to believe). it is a complete transformation on the cellular level.

you mean alteration at sub atomic level
even the level of strings (string theory)

for a change who creeps in - like retroviral treatment, you only have to alter the dna.

for an immidiate change, you would have to alter the existing cell. the cell is made off proteins and sugars. to alter the cell, you would have to rearrange every atom in every molecule of every cell. subatomic parts, the charge and state would have to be altered as well. within a 4-dimensional system.

18g of water, contain roughly 6.022 x 10²³ oxygen atoms and 2 x 6.022 x 10²³ atoms of hydrogen. all of them would need to be treated equally and rearranged without any mistake.

good luck with that .. the friction caused by the molecular movement alone would vapourize the cell.

And immidiate change is what we see at the end

absolutely .. imo, this ending jumps the shark. there is no scientific principle in the meu, that supports this method. altering the mass of somehing is one thing - molecular and cellular rearrangement are alien to this universe.

[Trigunvts]

Even for fiction synthesis is a far fetched thing. Also I think the biggest reason its not a good choice is your forcing this change on the entire galaxy. I can't see how everyone in the galaxy would be willing to accept being altered in this manner.

[ziloe]

Dr_Extrem wrote...

Troxa wrote...

Dr_Extrem wrote...

Troxa wrote...

Dr_Extrem wrote...

then, there was no new dna created.

there are several established methods, to alter the dna but all use retroviral treatment.


the binary helix salesman (rafael vargas) on noveria, tells us how genetic alteration works. the retrovirus you get, alters your cells, the alteration takes effect, after cell division happens. the old cell stays the was it was - only the stored dna is altered. the new cell will be something new - not the old. this process can take up to 10 years.

what we see is not a simple dna-alteration (like the starchild makes us want to believe). it is a complete transformation on the cellular level.

you mean alteration at sub atomic level
even the level of strings (string theory)

for a change who creeps in - like retroviral treatment, you only have to alter the dna.

for an immidiate change, you would have to alter the existing cell. the cell is made off proteins and sugars. to alter the cell, you would have to rearrange every atom in every molecule of every cell. subatomic parts, the charge and state would have to be altered as well. within a 4-dimensional system.

18g of water, contain roughly 6.022 x 10²³ oxygen atoms and 2 x 6.022 x 10²³ atoms of hydrogen. all of them would need to be treated equally and rearranged without any mistake.

good luck with that .. the friction caused by the molecular movement alone would vapourize the cell.

And immidiate change is what we see at the end

absolutely .. imo, this ending jumps the shark. there is no scientific principle in the meu, that supports this method. altering the mass of somehing is one thing - molecular and cellular rearrangement are alien to this universe.

You're forgetting Overlord, but that was an awful, awful thing.

[Dr_Extrem]

ziloe wrote...

Dr_Extrem wrote...

Troxa wrote...

Dr_Extrem wrote...

Troxa wrote...

Dr_Extrem wrote...

then, there was no new dna created.

there are several established methods, to alter the dna but all use retroviral treatment.


the binary helix salesman (rafael vargas) on noveria, tells us how genetic alteration works. the retrovirus you get, alters your cells, the alteration takes effect, after cell division happens. the old cell stays the was it was - only the stored dna is altered. the new cell will be something new - not the old. this process can take up to 10 years.

what we see is not a simple dna-alteration (like the starchild makes us want to believe). it is a complete transformation on the cellular level.

you mean alteration at sub atomic level
even the level of strings (string theory)

for a change who creeps in - like retroviral treatment, you only have to alter the dna.

for an immidiate change, you would have to alter the existing cell. the cell is made off proteins and sugars. to alter the cell, you would have to rearrange every atom in every molecule of every cell. subatomic parts, the charge and state would have to be altered as well. within a 4-dimensional system.

18g of water, contain roughly 6.022 x 10²³ oxygen atoms and 2 x 6.022 x 10²³ atoms of hydrogen. all of them would need to be treated equally and rearranged without any mistake.

good luck with that .. the friction caused by the molecular movement alone would vapourize the cell.

And immidiate change is what we see at the end

absolutely .. imo, this ending jumps the shark. there is no scientific principle in the meu, that supports this method. altering the mass of somehing is one thing - molecular and cellular rearrangement are alien to this universe.

You're forgetting Overlord, but that was an awful, awful thing.

overlord had a completely different background - it was not a synthesis ... it was about controling geth.

the story is heavily inspired by steven kings story "the lawnmower man". dr. gavin archer uses his brother (an authistic math savant), to control the geth. the created ai wanted to upload itself onto every computer.

[Xamufam]

ElSuperGecko wrote...

Troxa wrote...
You'll forgive my skepticism about the rest of your arguments, then.

if you don't believe me look at the video again & you will see that those things that is merging is actully clearing up to become pictures of collectors attacking
I can be a little obsessed with it I need to stop im agreing  there
It also shows that you are the same if you didn't bother to answer i would not answer you

Oh yeah, I'm obsessed with interpreting the scenes and events in ME3, I'm not even going to try and deny that one.

But...

"it's a warning. It clearly shows organic parts merging with synthetic, and depicts the fall of the Prothean race."

...isn't that almost word for word what you've written above?  Isn't that pretty much exactly what the Prothean Beacon vision shows?

About the warning yes but not synthesis
srry for erlier can't focus didn't take my meds today can't take the catalyst or the crucible or synthesis seriously, no narrative legitimacy
The thing bioware tried to do was too ambitious if they had 2 games to explain it it would probably been better

Modifié par Troxa, 06 janvier 2013 - 07:02 .

[ElSuperGecko]

Troxa wrote...
srry for erlier can't focus didn't take my meds today can't take the catalyst or the crucible or synthesis seriously, no narrative legitimacy

Not a problem, and I agree with that particular sentiment entirely!

[EpicBoot2daFace]

At the very least, it made me question the sanity of Mac Walters and Casey Hudson.

[LinksOcarina]

ziloe wrote...

LinksOcarina wrote...

I admit I didn't read 26 pages of this.

any word philosophically yet? Or no?

To some extent, though, there appears to be a lot of arguing over this procedure being totally acceptable. Kinda makes me wish the writers would step in, and give us their take on the subject. 

admititngly though, would it matter much? 

[ziloe]

LinksOcarina wrote...

ziloe wrote...

LinksOcarina wrote...

I admit I didn't read 26 pages of this.

any word philosophically yet? Or no?

To some extent, though, there appears to be a lot of arguing over this procedure being totally acceptable. Kinda makes me wish the writers would step in, and give us their take on the subject. 

admititngly though, would it matter much? 

It would be nice. It's like looking at a piece of art, for instance. You make your own decision of what it really means to you. But then out of curiousity, you also ask the painter, what does this mean to you? Maybe something happened to inspire them, etc. And if so, what?

We can all form our own opinions, but I think the writer's response would add a lot more depth to the discussion.

[ziloe]

EpicBoot2daFace wrote...

At the very least, it made me question the sanity of Mac Walters and Casey Hudson.

I think we all felt that way when Bioware said they played it before release, and didn't think anything was wrong with the ending, at all, lol.

[DirtyPhoenix]

ziloe wrote...

EpicBoot2daFace wrote...

At the very least, it made me question the sanity of Mac Walters and Casey Hudson.

I think we all felt that way when Bioware said they played it before release, and didn't think anything was wrong with the ending, at all, lol.

I still can't wrap my head around that.

[ziloe]

pirate1802 wrote...

ziloe wrote...

EpicBoot2daFace wrote...

At the very least, it made me question the sanity of Mac Walters and Casey Hudson.

I think we all felt that way when Bioware said they played it before release, and didn't think anything was wrong with the ending, at all, lol.

I still can't wrap my head around that.

As a writer myself, neither can I.

[ElSuperGecko]

CATALYST:  "we have tried a... similar solution before".

CATALYST:  "we have tried a... similar solution before".

CATALYST:  "we have tried a... similar solution before".

[Ice Cold J]

ElSuperGecko wrote...

CATALYST:  "we have tried a... similar solution before".

CATALYST:  "we have tried a... similar solution before".

CATALYST:  "we have tried a... similar solution before".

So, what they're trying to say is that The Reapers can build a base surrounded by Black Holes and open Mass Effect fields at will, but cannot perform Project Lazarus?

Weak.

[IC-07]

Great feedback here, Bioware shouldn't ignore it. If they don't, then synthesis surely won't be the canon ending. Good work OP, good work.

Modifié par IC-07, 07 janvier 2013 - 05:32 .