482 réponses à ce sujet

[Fnork]

Easter egg they added when they thought that perhaps they made the endings a little too bleak.

[Dr_Extrem]

DeinonSlayer wrote...

Dr_Extrem wrote...

DeinonSlayer wrote...

Dr_Extrem wrote...

exactly ..

i was refering to shepards old helmet on the crash site ..

if the rescue team found sheps body - mostly intact, why remove the helmet, in an absolutly toxic and freezing environment. the ammonia alone would do horrible damage and dry out the head.

Shepard has more than one helmet, just saying... seems people want to make this as difficult as possible to justify being angry about it. What says he ever re-entered the atmosphere?

sure .. i was just asking a question. the game says, that it is sheps old helmet. ... the writer should rule stuff like this out, before it could backfire on day. especially, if you audience is made up of scifi nerds.

Occam's razor. Makes no sense for Shepard's body to make it through re-entry, hence no re-entry. Sort of like people arguing the presence of "rebar" means Shepard HAS to be on Earth in the breath scene, and thus HAD to reenter the atmosphere. People make it harder than is has to be, holding to scenarios they know to be illogical in the face of more likely explanations to justify being mad about it.

occams razor ... the writers should have sticked to this principle.

if they did, i would not ask unpleasent questions. to me, it is clear, that shepard lies on the citadel .. but on the other hand, the big ass explosion is as mortal, as reentry ..

[Iakus]

Fnork wrote...

Easter egg they added when they thought that perhaps they made the endings a little too bleak.

They were right.

And it wasn't enough.

[DeinonSlayer]

Dr_Extrem wrote...

DeinonSlayer wrote...

Occam's razor. Makes no sense for Shepard's body to make it through re-entry, hence no re-entry. Sort of like people arguing the presence of "rebar" means Shepard HAS to be on Earth in the breath scene, and thus HAD to reenter the atmosphere. People make it harder than is has to be, holding to scenarios they know to be illogical in the face of more likely explanations to justify being mad about it.

occams razor ... the writers should have sticked to this principle.

if they did, i would not ask unpleasent questions. to me, it is clear, that shepard lies on the citadel .. but on the other hand, the big ass explosion is as mortal, as reentry ..

Again, Presidium Tower (Shepard was at its base) is intact after the blast. People share the nastiest-looking screencaps they can find to make it look as bad as possible.

The funny thing is, at the end of ME1, Sovereign's arm came crashing through the roof of the Council Chamber, which should have vented them all into space. Guess we'll blame "mass effect fields" for their survival there.

[DeinonSlayer]

iakus wrote...

Fnork wrote...

Easter egg they added when they thought that perhaps they made the endings a little too bleak.

They were right.

And it wasn't enough.

For you maybe... but you've got MEHEM. Not to be rude, but it begs the question of why you're still complaining about the ending when you managed to sidestep the issue and they aren't going to change anything.

Modifié par DeinonSlayer, 26 décembre 2012 - 10:38 .

[cyrexwingblade]

Just a note -- the Normandy takes off after time is taken to repair and rebuild the ship's systems.

And Shep's re-entry is 'heavily implied' by the atmosphereic burn around his/her body while suffocating at the start of ME2.

Shep is alive, on the Citadel in the breath scene.

[Iakus]

DeinonSlayer wrote...

iakus wrote...

Fnork wrote...

Easter egg they added when they thought that perhaps they made the endings a little too bleak.

They were right.

And it wasn't enough.

For you maybe... but you've got MEHEM. Begs the question of why you're still complaining about the ending when you managed to sidestep the issue and they aren't going to change anything.

Eh, can't let Bioware think it was their brilliance that granted me closure. Bioware screwed up big time with a lot of their fans.  Maybe not you.  But with many many others. I'm not one to simply say "I'm happy so the rest of you can go frak yourselves". 

Plus I'm just waiting around for DA3 info.  Gotta keep busy somehow

[DeinonSlayer]

cyrexwingblade wrote...

Just a note -- the Normandy takes off after time is taken to repair and rebuild the ship's systems.

And Shep's re-entry is 'heavily implied' by the atmosphereic burn around his/her body while suffocating at the start of ME2.

Shep is alive, on the Citadel in the breath scene.

Not atmospheric burn - suit oxygen illuminated by sunlight as he passed out of Alchera's shadow (see Apollo 13). Re-entry would leave nothing for Lazarus to work with. Didn't happen.

[Dr_Extrem]

DeinonSlayer wrote...

Dr_Extrem wrote...

DeinonSlayer wrote...

Occam's razor. Makes no sense for Shepard's body to make it through re-entry, hence no re-entry. Sort of like people arguing the presence of "rebar" means Shepard HAS to be on Earth in the breath scene, and thus HAD to reenter the atmosphere. People make it harder than is has to be, holding to scenarios they know to be illogical in the face of more likely explanations to justify being mad about it.

occams razor ... the writers should have sticked to this principle.

if they did, i would not ask unpleasent questions. to me, it is clear, that shepard lies on the citadel .. but on the other hand, the big ass explosion is as mortal, as reentry ..

Again, Presidium Tower (Shepard was at its base) is intact after the blast. People share the nastiest-looking screencaps they can find to make it look as bad as possible.

The funny thing is, at the end of ME1, Sovereign's arm came crashing through the roof of the Council Chamber, which should have vented them all into space. Guess we'll blame "mass effect fields" for their survival there.

what i believe or think is not the question .. it is about the possibility to ask such question in the first place. if the writing would be good, no such questions would arise.

why we are still ****ing about the ending, despite having mehem? .. i am asking this myself .. the open hostility here, makes me sick sometimes. many people from all sides lost the ability to discuss, without resorting to stubbornness or insults.

maybe, because i still believe, that bioware cares .. i am a hopeless romantic.

[DeinonSlayer]

iakus wrote...

DeinonSlayer wrote...

iakus wrote...

They were right.

And it wasn't enough.

For you maybe... but you've got MEHEM. Begs the question of why you're still complaining about the ending when you managed to sidestep the issue and they aren't going to change anything.

Eh, can't let Bioware think it was their brilliance that granted me closure. Bioware screwed up big time with a lot of their fans.  Maybe not you.  But with many many others. I'm not one to simply say "I'm happy so the rest of you can go frak yourselves". 
Plus I'm just waiting around for DA3 info.  Gotta keep busy somehow

Not recommending anyone frak themselves. Just seems unhealthy at this point. I don't like the ending any better than you, but I made the best of it (without MEHEM - I'm sick of hearing about that mod) and moved on.

Modifié par DeinonSlayer, 26 décembre 2012 - 10:45 .

[Soratoma]

Sunnyhat1 wrote...

Brovikk Rasputin wrote...

It's pretty simple. Shepard wakes up in some rubble on the Citadel.

Yeah thats the first impression. But it makes even less sense. He just shouldn't have survived. Even if his body wasn't pulverized, his implants should be gone. He should be dead!?

And that's not even talking about air, etc.

A fewf times Shep. should have died in ME3:
1.) Vancouver prologue! The friggin' reaper beam blows a hole in the room kills all Admirals except Anderson, and a Table nearly crushes Her/him.
2.) Tuchanka, running toward a reaper possibly the smartest decision ever made, are you honestly telling me a reaper can blast through an entire ship of steel, but cant cut through concrete or rocks? hmmmmm
3.) Rannoch, that Reaper is inches away from Shep, literally inches away as it gets blasted to oblivion, the beam was so close to fireing, the ships inspace would imposibbly be able to target one exact spot without hitting Shep at that distance.
4.) London, the Reaper beam incinerates everyone and thing in its surounding but when it hits Shep, it only goes half speed, knowing it might not kill him but :"aaaah screw it, it probably will and then we can display the heroes body to intimidate our ene.... whoops now where'd he go!? Marauder Shields Stop him before he reaches the beacon! Well screw that, he'll never be able to activate the catalyst!"

Now tell me after all that sh*t a silly little explosion could kill Shep, MoFo survived a Reaper Beam, only person in history to have. Ocam's Razor: The rubble is Citadel Ruble, not everything on the citadel has to be made of Metal, it is a way to leave an open ending. Nuff Said

[Iakus]

DeinonSlayer wrote...

iakus wrote...

Eh, can't let Bioware think it was their brilliance that granted me closure. Bioware screwed up big time with a lot of their fans.  Maybe not you.  But with many many others. I'm not one to simply say "I'm happy so the rest of you can go frak yourselves". 
Plus I'm just waiting around for DA3 info.  Gotta keep busy somehow

Not recommending anyone frak themselves. Just seems unhealthy at this point. I don't like the ending any better than you, but I made the best of it (without MEHEM - I'm sick of hearing about that mod) and moved on.

Not you specifically.  But there are others here who think if you're not here to praise Bioware or the game you have no cause to be here at all.  I don't accept that.  I think Bioware was great once and can be again.  If I thought there was no hope I really would leave and not return.

And if you're sick of Mehem, well  I'm sick of being told the geth aren't really alive (or worse, EDI can be rebuilt), that Synthesis is beautiful, that Control is win-win for everyone, and Refusers are idiots for standing up to the Catalyst.  We all have our crosses to bear.

Edit:  also sick of phrases containing the following terms:  "unicorns" "rainbows" "Disney"

Modifié par iakus, 26 décembre 2012 - 10:54 .

[Dr_Extrem]

DeinonSlayer wrote...

iakus wrote...

DeinonSlayer wrote...

iakus wrote...

They were right.

And it wasn't enough.

For you maybe... but you've got MEHEM. Begs the question of why you're still complaining about the ending when you managed to sidestep the issue and they aren't going to change anything.

Eh, can't let Bioware think it was their brilliance that granted me closure. Bioware screwed up big time with a lot of their fans.  Maybe not you.  But with many many others. I'm not one to simply say "I'm happy so the rest of you can go frak yourselves". 
Plus I'm just waiting around for DA3 info.  Gotta keep busy somehow

Not recommending anyone frak themselves. Just seems unhealthy at this point. I don't like the ending any better than you, but I made the best of it (without MEHEM - I'm sick of hearing about that mod) and moved on.

i give my best not to mention it in my posts ... my signature is enough.

you started it though ..

[kal_reegar]

From the beam explosion to the big explosion around 150 seconds pass. A man can do a lot of things in 150 seconds, if his life is in danger.

For example
1. He quicly finds a way out of the catalyst room, Maybe an elevator. There are elevators everywhere on the citadel after all. Even invisible ones. Or maybe a tunnel. There a lot of tunnels too. Full of disgusting keepers probably.
2. He emerges somewhere in the Presidium
3 He finds a Kodiak or something like that nearby (we are in the presidium and everybody is probably dead,  so finding an abandoned vehicle shouldn't be so difficult).
4. Few seconds later, Shepard is flying over Zakera at 150 mph.
5. Explosion -> shock wave -> Kodiak crash somewhere far enough

Of course you have to accept that maybe there is concrete on the citadel after all... for example in the slums, or in the industrial district etc.

And of course you have to assume that Shepard's body is incredibly resistant, fireproof and unbreakable, but after Project Lazarus, well... why not?

[cyrexwingblade]

DeinonSlayer wrote...

cyrexwingblade wrote...

Just a note -- the Normandy takes off after time is taken to repair and rebuild the ship's systems.

And Shep's re-entry is 'heavily implied' by the atmosphereic burn around his/her body while suffocating at the start of ME2.

Shep is alive, on the Citadel in the breath scene.

Not atmospheric burn - suit oxygen illuminated by sunlight as he passed out of Alchera's shadow (see Apollo 13). Re-entry would leave nothing for Lazarus to work with. Didn't happen.

You did *read* that before you posted it right? You already put more work into the reality of it than BW did.

[DeinonSlayer]

iakus wrote...

DeinonSlayer wrote...

iakus wrote...

Eh, can't let Bioware think it was their brilliance that granted me closure. Bioware screwed up big time with a lot of their fans.  Maybe not you.  But with many many others. I'm not one to simply say "I'm happy so the rest of you can go frak yourselves". 
Plus I'm just waiting around for DA3 info.  Gotta keep busy somehow

Not recommending anyone frak themselves. Just seems unhealthy at this point. I don't like the ending any better than you, but I made the best of it (without MEHEM - I'm sick of hearing about that mod) and moved on.

Not you specifically.  But there are others here who think if you're not here to praise Bioware or the game you have no cause to be here at all.  I don't accept that.  I think Bioware was great once and can be again.  If I thought there was no hope I really would leave and not return.

And if you're sick of Mehem, well  I'm sick of being told the geth aren't really alive (or worse, EDI can be rebuilt), that Synthesis is beautiful, that Control is win-win for everyone, and Refusers are idiots for standing up to the Catalyst.  We all have our crosses to bear.

Edit:  also sick of phrases containing the following terms:  "unicorns" "rainbows" "Disney"

It's pretty much a battle of the headcanons at this point. The endings were left open to interpretation, and when people come across interpretations we dislike, we take umbrage.

I for one view the Geth as alive, but in light of their actions, I believe they deserve death. Peace is a mercy. Siding with them over their creators is unthinkable. That's just my stance - and I know it's not widely held. For better or worse, it makes Destroy easier for me to stomach - EDI is the only innocent casualty. I imagine it's harder for "pure paragons" who aren't primed for that kind of sacrifice.

Leaves me wondering just how much of the ending controversy stems from the lack of a clear "paragon" choice - the game isn't telling people what to think or do anymore.

Dr_Extrem wrote...

i give my best not to mention it in my posts ... my signature is enough.

you started it though ..

*reads up the pyramid*

*headdesk*

So I did. My apologies.

Modifié par DeinonSlayer, 26 décembre 2012 - 11:35 .

[DeinonSlayer]

cyrexwingblade wrote...

DeinonSlayer wrote...

cyrexwingblade wrote...

Just a note -- the Normandy takes off after time is taken to repair and rebuild the ship's systems.

And Shep's re-entry is 'heavily implied' by the atmosphereic burn around his/her body while suffocating at the start of ME2.

Shep is alive, on the Citadel in the breath scene.

Not atmospheric burn - suit oxygen illuminated by sunlight as he passed out of Alchera's shadow (see Apollo 13). Re-entry would leave nothing for Lazarus to work with. Didn't happen.

You did *read* that before you posted it right? You already put more work into the reality of it than BW did.

No, I'm simply calling it as I see it. Nothing complicated. It doesn't look like Shepard is de-orbiting to me, it's just sunlight hitting the cloud of oxygen that already spewed out of Shepard's suit. You're free to see it as re-entry if you wish, but it doesn't fit with the fact that there's still a body to recover.

Modifié par DeinonSlayer, 26 décembre 2012 - 11:34 .

[Iakus]

Dr_Extrem wrote...

i give my best not to mention it in my posts ... my signature is enough.

you started it though ..

I was gonna mention that, but decided not to 

[Iakus]

DeinonSlayer wrote...
It's pretty much a battle of the headcanons at this point. The endings were left open to interpretation, and when people come across interpretations we dislike, we take umbrage.

I for one view the Geth as alive, but in light of their actions, I believe they deserve death. Peace is a mercy. Siding with them over their creators is unthinkable. That's just my stance - and I know it's not widely held. For better or worse, it makes Destroy easier for me to stomach. I imagine it's harder for "pure paragons" who aren't primed for that kind of sacrifice.

Leaves me wondering just how much of the ending controversy stems from the lack of a clear "paragon" choice - the game isn't telling people what to think or do anymore.

The problem is the price tag is too high for all of them.  How much backlash did DAO cause?  Even if you take the DR out (since some peope insist that it's a "get out of jail free" card, though I think it' not so simple) you still have three choices, none of which are "clearly right" and each has its own variation based on how you played.

[Humakt83]

cyrexwingblade wrote...

And Shep's re-entry is 'heavily implied' by the atmosphereic burn around his/her body while suffocating at the start of ME2.

Miranda: "Test subject has been recoved but damage is much worse than we initially feared."
Miranda: "In addition to the expected burns and internal injuries from explosion, the subject has suffered significant cellular breakdown due to long-term exposure to vacuum and sub-zero temperatures."
Miranda: "Despite the extent of physical trauma, Wilson assures me subject is salvageable. The project proceeds as planned."

So much for the re-entry.

Modifié par Humakt83, 26 décembre 2012 - 11:41 .

[Dr_Extrem]

DeinonSlayer wrote...

iakus wrote...

DeinonSlayer wrote...

iakus wrote...

Eh, can't let Bioware think it was their brilliance that granted me closure. Bioware screwed up big time with a lot of their fans.  Maybe not you.  But with many many others. I'm not one to simply say "I'm happy so the rest of you can go frak yourselves". 
Plus I'm just waiting around for DA3 info.  Gotta keep busy somehow

Not recommending anyone frak themselves. Just seems unhealthy at this point. I don't like the ending any better than you, but I made the best of it (without MEHEM - I'm sick of hearing about that mod) and moved on.

Not you specifically.  But there are others here who think if you're not here to praise Bioware or the game you have no cause to be here at all.  I don't accept that.  I think Bioware was great once and can be again.  If I thought there was no hope I really would leave and not return.

And if you're sick of Mehem, well  I'm sick of being told the geth aren't really alive (or worse, EDI can be rebuilt), that Synthesis is beautiful, that Control is win-win for everyone, and Refusers are idiots for standing up to the Catalyst.  We all have our crosses to bear.

Edit:  also sick of phrases containing the following terms:  "unicorns" "rainbows" "Disney"

It's pretty much a battle of the headcanons at this point. The endings were left open to interpretation, and when people come across interpretations we dislike, we take umbrage.

I for one view the Geth as alive, but in light of their actions, I believe they deserve death. Peace is a mercy. Siding with them over their creators is unthinkable. That's just my stance - and I know it's not widely held. For better or worse, it makes Destroy easier for me to stomach - EDI is the only innocent casualty. I imagine it's harder for "pure paragons" who aren't primed for that kind of sacrifice.

Leaves me wondering just how much of the ending controversy stems from the lack of a clear "paragon" choice - the game isn't telling people what to think or do anymore.

Dr_Extrem wrote...

i give my best not to mention it in my posts ... my signature is enough.

you started it though ..

*reads up the pyramid*

*headdesk*

So I did. My apologies.

no harm done.

battle of the headcanons .. that hits it.

the problem is that some people here think, that their headcanon, is better then the ones of other users.

you have your headcanon - you are relatively happy ... i have mine ... no problem there ..


it still does not make the crappy writing and rookie errors bearable.

[DeinonSlayer]

iakus wrote...

DeinonSlayer wrote...
It's pretty much a battle of the headcanons at this point. The endings were left open to interpretation, and when people come across interpretations we dislike, we take umbrage.

I for one view the Geth as alive, but in light of their actions, I believe they deserve death. Peace is a mercy. Siding with them over their creators is unthinkable. That's just my stance - and I know it's not widely held. For better or worse, it makes Destroy easier for me to stomach. I imagine it's harder for "pure paragons" who aren't primed for that kind of sacrifice.

Leaves me wondering just how much of the ending controversy stems from the lack of a clear "paragon" choice - the game isn't telling people what to think or do anymore.

The problem is the price tag is too high for all of them.  How much backlash did DAO cause?  Even if you take the DR out (since some peope insist that it's a "get out of jail free" card, though I think it' not so simple) you still have three choices, none of which are "clearly right" and each has its own variation based on how you played.

Never played Dragon Age, wouldn't know. I just know that, realistically, this is the kind of decision one sometimes has to make in a war. You can't Paragon your way out of anything and everything. People who played as paragons got so used to everything automatically working out for them that they came to expect to be rewarded for it. Then this guy happened:



If people had paid more along the way (like the original script where the player loses one of the squadmates they brought to Thessia), maybe something like this would have been expected.

[Xilizhra]

Never played Dragon Age, wouldn't know. I just know that, realistically, this is the kind of decision one sometimes has to make in a war. You can't Paragon your way out of anything and everything. People who played as paragons got so used to everything automatically working out for them that they came to expect to be rewarded for it. Then this guy happened:

Well, everything worked out for me almost perfectly. The one tiny flaw was my own death, but that's a relatively small price.

[Dr_Extrem]

DeinonSlayer wrote...

iakus wrote...

DeinonSlayer wrote...
It's pretty much a battle of the headcanons at this point. The endings were left open to interpretation, and when people come across interpretations we dislike, we take umbrage.

I for one view the Geth as alive, but in light of their actions, I believe they deserve death. Peace is a mercy. Siding with them over their creators is unthinkable. That's just my stance - and I know it's not widely held. For better or worse, it makes Destroy easier for me to stomach. I imagine it's harder for "pure paragons" who aren't primed for that kind of sacrifice.

Leaves me wondering just how much of the ending controversy stems from the lack of a clear "paragon" choice - the game isn't telling people what to think or do anymore.

The problem is the price tag is too high for all of them.  How much backlash did DAO cause?  Even if you take the DR out (since some peope insist that it's a "get out of jail free" card, though I think it' not so simple) you still have three choices, none of which are "clearly right" and each has its own variation based on how you played.

Never played Dragon Age, wouldn't know. I just know that, realistically, this is the kind of decision one sometimes has to make in a war. You can't Paragon your way out of anything and everything. People who played as paragons got so used to everything automatically working out for them that they came to expect to be rewarded for it. Then this guy happened:



If people had paid more along the way (like the original script where the player loses one of the squadmates they brought to Thessia), maybe something like this would have been expected.

lol @ infinite ammo


mhmm .. even if i go almost full paragon ... well ... sorry javik ... but your pain would end on thessia.

for paragon players, the endings are a really big break in continuity .. i could even live with the geth and edi dying ... i had to make such decisions before (virmire) but the crappy writing and the lousy buildup are dealbreaker.

[DeinonSlayer]

Xilizhra wrote...

Never played Dragon Age, wouldn't know. I just know that, realistically, this is the kind of decision one sometimes has to make in a war. You can't Paragon your way out of anything and everything. People who played as paragons got so used to everything automatically working out for them that they came to expect to be rewarded for it. Then this guy happened:

Well, everything worked out for me almost perfectly. The one tiny flaw was my own death, but that's a relatively small price.

Congratulations. I feel the same way about Destroy, after putting a few rounds in the Geth VI's head on Rannoch (my "Peace" playthrough ended in Control).