325 réponses à ce sujet

[Maxster_]

Tomwew wrote...

how did the protheans get the plans to mars anyway? the relays were shut down in their cycle so they either had to take a very long ftl journey to our solar system, without being caught and then either construct the mars archives or decide to add, and hide the incomplete crucible designs to already existing archives.

or they had and were aware of the importance of the crucible plans before the invasion in their cycle, decided our species was a better candidate to entrust with the plans than the asari, then went to lengths to hide the information. and they couldn't build the crucible in time with a subjugated empire even, though we built it in a matter of months in the midst of a reaper invasion.

does feel a bit contrived.

More funny that they decided to hide information about reapers existence in archives, where they put plans for Crucible. So they knew about reapers in advance. And then sent warning about surprise attack of the reapers through beacons.

Makes no sense.

[txgoldrush]

Kabraxal wrote...



Except it's all meshed together and produces so many plot holes that have been discused time and time again... but no, you are only here to proclaim your grand intellect, call anyone that disagrees stupid, and parade around in your false sense of superiority.  

Here's a hint... you want to discuss the endings and the plot holes and contrivances like the Crucible?  Fine.  But you immediately start denegrating anyone that doesn't accept your opinion and proceed to troll.  You are the clear problem here.  YOu don't want a discussion... you just want to scream how intelligent you are without actually having to deal with competing theorires that hold just as much, if not more weight. So keep on talking about the stupid board and just proving yourself incapable of anything other than trolling.  

So a weapon designed to use the designs of enemy technology against them is contrived?

And what plot holes? Make believe ones so you can bash the game. Just because a character states something doesn't make it true. Just because what the character states is outright contradicted doesn't make it a plot hole either.

A competeing theory has absolutely no weight when backed up by falsehoods and lack of evidence....once again...what I pull, its ALL IN THE NARRATIVE.

Modifié par txgoldrush, 02 janvier 2013 - 03:03 .

[txgoldrush]

Maxster_ wrote...

Tomwew wrote...

how did the protheans get the plans to mars anyway? the relays were shut down in their cycle so they either had to take a very long ftl journey to our solar system, without being caught and then either construct the mars archives or decide to add, and hide the incomplete crucible designs to already existing archives.

or they had and were aware of the importance of the crucible plans before the invasion in their cycle, decided our species was a better candidate to entrust with the plans than the asari, then went to lengths to hide the information. and they couldn't build the crucible in time with a subjugated empire even, though we built it in a matter of months in the midst of a reaper invasion.

does feel a bit contrived.

More funny that they decided to hide information about reapers existence in archives, where they put plans for Crucible. So they knew about reapers in advance. And then sent warning about surprise attack of the reapers through beacons.

Makes no sense.

so where is your evidence that The Protheans knew the Reapers in advance before they were attacked?

It makes no sense to you because you don't get it.

Modifié par txgoldrush, 02 janvier 2013 - 03:24 .

[Maxster_]

txgoldrush wrote...

Maxster_ wrote...

Tomwew wrote...

how did the protheans get the plans to mars anyway? the relays were shut down in their cycle so they either had to take a very long ftl journey to our solar system, without being caught and then either construct the mars archives or decide to add, and hide the incomplete crucible designs to already existing archives.

or they had and were aware of the importance of the crucible plans before the invasion in their cycle, decided our species was a better candidate to entrust with the plans than the asari, then went to lengths to hide the information. and they couldn't build the crucible in time with a subjugated empire even, though we built it in a matter of months in the midst of a reaper invasion.

does feel a bit contrived.

More funny that they decided to hide information about reapers existence in archives, where they put plans for Crucible. So they knew about reapers in advance. And then sent warning about surprise attack of the reapers through beacons.

Makes no sense.

so where is your evidence that The Protheans knew the Reapers in advance before they were attacked?

It ames no sense to you because you don't get it.

Indulge me, how crucible plans ended up in mars research station exactly? Reapers suddenly forgot to turn off relays(which also completely contradicts ME1 and ME2), or protheans knew about reapers in advance?

Or you'll just spew more nonsense in attempt to shift theme again? 

[Kabraxal]

txgoldrush wrote...

Kabraxal wrote...



Except it's all meshed together and produces so many plot holes that have been discused time and time again... but no, you are only here to proclaim your grand intellect, call anyone that disagrees stupid, and parade around in your false sense of superiority.  

Here's a hint... you want to discuss the endings and the plot holes and contrivances like the Crucible?  Fine.  But you immediately start denegrating anyone that doesn't accept your opinion and proceed to troll.  You are the clear problem here.  YOu don't want a discussion... you just want to scream how intelligent you are without actually having to deal with competing theorires that hold just as much, if not more weight. So keep on talking about the stupid board and just proving yourself incapable of anything other than trolling.  

So a weapon designed to use the designs of enemy technology against them is contrived?

And what plot holes? Make believe ones so you can bash the game. Just because a character states something doesn't make it true. Just because what the character states is outright contradicted doesn't make it a plot hole either.

A competeing theory has absolutely no weight when backed up by falsehoods and lack of evidence....once again...what I pull, its ALL IN THE NARRATIVE.

How about the plot hole you conveniently avoided a few posts ago?  You know, the one based on the very same "evidence' with just as valid conclusion.  Don't bother looking for it again... we all know you'll just scream "You're wrong and too stupid!".  You actually have nothing to bring to the table... but then, if I remember correctly, you never really have.  You just search for ways to troll people that didn't blindly swallow the inane amount of plot holes and contrived moments that the ending and crucible ended up providinng.

[Kulbelbolka]

Next DLC will give us some answers about Crucible and authors of it's conception, I believe.

[Maxster_]

Kulbelbolka wrote...

Next DLC will give us some answers about Crucible and authors of it's conception, I believe.

Like leviathans. It will be glorius. 
I have faith in EAWare, they are capable of wonderous feats in a field of nonsense.

[Tomwew]

txgoldrush wrote...

Maxster_ wrote...

Tomwew wrote...

how did the protheans get the plans to mars anyway? the relays were shut down in their cycle so they either had to take a very long ftl journey to our solar system, without being caught and then either construct the mars archives or decide to add, and hide the incomplete crucible designs to already existing archives.

or they had and were aware of the importance of the crucible plans before the invasion in their cycle, decided our species was a better candidate to entrust with the plans than the asari, then went to lengths to hide the information. and they couldn't build the crucible in time with a subjugated empire even, though we built it in a matter of months in the midst of a reaper invasion.

does feel a bit contrived.

More funny that they decided to hide information about reapers existence in archives, where they put plans for Crucible. So they knew about reapers in advance. And then sent warning about surprise attack of the reapers through beacons.

Makes no sense.

so where is your evidence that The Protheans knew the Reapers in advance before they were attacked?

It ames no sense to you because you don't get it.

so they didn't know about the reapers before they attacked. that's consistent with the lore, but then raises the questions of how they got to mars with no relays and reapers on the hunt for stragglers and technology left behind?
and why would they make accessing  technology which leads to the reaper trap citadel, i.e mass effect technology and the relays easier than information on the reapers or how to defeat them?

they already know the reapers know about the crucible, indoctrinated agents sabotaged it according to the v.i on thessia, and if cerberus can hack prothean tech the reapers sure can so why make this information more difficult to access? if the reapers find the archives it's over anyway, so why make it more difficult for non-reapers to access it?

[txgoldrush]

Maxster_ wrote...

txgoldrush wrote...

Maxster_ wrote...

Tomwew wrote...

how did the protheans get the plans to mars anyway? the relays were shut down in their cycle so they either had to take a very long ftl journey to our solar system, without being caught and then either construct the mars archives or decide to add, and hide the incomplete crucible designs to already existing archives.

or they had and were aware of the importance of the crucible plans before the invasion in their cycle, decided our species was a better candidate to entrust with the plans than the asari, then went to lengths to hide the information. and they couldn't build the crucible in time with a subjugated empire even, though we built it in a matter of months in the midst of a reaper invasion.

does feel a bit contrived.

More funny that they decided to hide information about reapers existence in archives, where they put plans for Crucible. So they knew about reapers in advance. And then sent warning about surprise attack of the reapers through beacons.

Makes no sense.

so where is your evidence that The Protheans knew the Reapers in advance before they were attacked?

It ames no sense to you because you don't get it.

Indulge me, how crucible plans ended up in mars research station exactly? Reapers suddenly forgot to turn off relays(which also completely contradicts ME1 and ME2), or protheans knew about reapers in advance?

Or you'll just spew more nonsense in attempt to shift theme again? 

Because they can still travel without the relays, just nowhere near as fast.

Did you not see the shot on the Destry ending where ships are flying past the disabled relay?

[Maxster_]

txgoldrush wrote...

Maxster_ wrote...

txgoldrush wrote...

Maxster_ wrote...

Tomwew wrote...

how did the protheans get the plans to mars anyway? the relays were shut down in their cycle so they either had to take a very long ftl journey to our solar system, without being caught and then either construct the mars archives or decide to add, and hide the incomplete crucible designs to already existing archives.

or they had and were aware of the importance of the crucible plans before the invasion in their cycle, decided our species was a better candidate to entrust with the plans than the asari, then went to lengths to hide the information. and they couldn't build the crucible in time with a subjugated empire even, though we built it in a matter of months in the midst of a reaper invasion.

does feel a bit contrived.

More funny that they decided to hide information about reapers existence in archives, where they put plans for Crucible. So they knew about reapers in advance. And then sent warning about surprise attack of the reapers through beacons.

Makes no sense.

so where is your evidence that The Protheans knew the Reapers in advance before they were attacked?

It ames no sense to you because you don't get it.

Indulge me, how crucible plans ended up in mars research station exactly? Reapers suddenly forgot to turn off relays(which also completely contradicts ME1 and ME2), or protheans knew about reapers in advance?

Or you'll just spew more nonsense in attempt to shift theme again? 

Because they can still travel without the relays, just nowhere near as fast.

Did you not see the shot on the Destry ending where ships are flying past the disabled relay?

Yes yes, travelling through unknown systems for decades without refueling and discharging core. I'm not even saying about food or supplies.
And all that to deliver plans for crucible, which they suddenly conveniently discovered after reapers invasion(as you now stating), to a some backward planet to place those files in one place, and then encrypt those plans so no one could ever gain access to them and information about reapers existence, but information about me technology was left intact(because reasons).
I knew that you will just spew more nonsense. 

[Kabraxal]

txgoldrush wrote...

Maxster_ wrote...

txgoldrush wrote...

Maxster_ wrote...

Tomwew wrote...

how did the protheans get the plans to mars anyway? the relays were shut down in their cycle so they either had to take a very long ftl journey to our solar system, without being caught and then either construct the mars archives or decide to add, and hide the incomplete crucible designs to already existing archives.

or they had and were aware of the importance of the crucible plans before the invasion in their cycle, decided our species was a better candidate to entrust with the plans than the asari, then went to lengths to hide the information. and they couldn't build the crucible in time with a subjugated empire even, though we built it in a matter of months in the midst of a reaper invasion.

does feel a bit contrived.

More funny that they decided to hide information about reapers existence in archives, where they put plans for Crucible. So they knew about reapers in advance. And then sent warning about surprise attack of the reapers through beacons.

Makes no sense.

so where is your evidence that The Protheans knew the Reapers in advance before they were attacked?

It ames no sense to you because you don't get it.

Indulge me, how crucible plans ended up in mars research station exactly? Reapers suddenly forgot to turn off relays(which also completely contradicts ME1 and ME2), or protheans knew about reapers in advance?

Or you'll just spew more nonsense in attempt to shift theme again? 

Because they can still travel without the relays, just nowhere near as fast.

Did you not see the shot on the Destry ending where ships are flying past the disabled relay?

Really... they are going to fly with normal FTL all the way to mars during a Reaper invasion.  They'd totally survive that long trip with no reapers finding and eliminating them.  Yep.  Totally.

Let's not forget the logistical nightmare of that trip...

Modifié par Kabraxal, 02 janvier 2013 - 03:36 .

[txgoldrush]

Tomwew wrote...

txgoldrush wrote...

Maxster_ wrote...

Tomwew wrote...

how did the protheans get the plans to mars anyway? the relays were shut down in their cycle so they either had to take a very long ftl journey to our solar system, without being caught and then either construct the mars archives or decide to add, and hide the incomplete crucible designs to already existing archives.

or they had and were aware of the importance of the crucible plans before the invasion in their cycle, decided our species was a better candidate to entrust with the plans than the asari, then went to lengths to hide the information. and they couldn't build the crucible in time with a subjugated empire even, though we built it in a matter of months in the midst of a reaper invasion.

does feel a bit contrived.

More funny that they decided to hide information about reapers existence in archives, where they put plans for Crucible. So they knew about reapers in advance. And then sent warning about surprise attack of the reapers through beacons.

Makes no sense.

so where is your evidence that The Protheans knew the Reapers in advance before they were attacked?

It ames no sense to you because you don't get it.

so they didn't know about the reapers before they attacked. that's consistent with the lore, but then raises the questions of how they got to mars with no relays and reapers on the hunt for stragglers and technology left behind?
and why would they make accessing  technology which leads to the reaper trap citadel, i.e mass effect technology and the relays easier than information on the reapers or how to defeat them?

they already know the reapers know about the crucible, indoctrinated agents sabotaged it according to the v.i on thessia, and if cerberus can hack prothean tech the reapers sure can so why make this information more difficult to access? if the reapers find the archives it's over anyway, so why make it more difficult for non-reapers to access it?

Once again, they can travel without the relays, just no where near as well.

Just because an agent is indoctrinated doesn't mean it always will pass info back to the Reapers. We don't know how exactly they sabtoged the Crucible or that they passed info back to the Reapers, only that they did sabtoge it. There is no evidence that contradicts lore, just a specualtion, therefore no plot hole can be proven. Also how far are they indoctrinated? We don't know.  They could also be like most of Cerberus, who doesn't realize they were indoctrinated and still view Reapers as an enemy that should be controlled. The VI also states that it was a control faction, which supports this, as TIM still viewed the Reapers as the enemy.

Its all specualtion, no hard evidence.

If Vendetta would have said that the indoctrinated agents exposed the Crucible to the Reapers, then thats a plot hole.

[Maxster_]

Kabraxal wrote...

Really... they are going to fly with normal FTL all the way to mars during a Reaper invasion.  They'd totally survive that long trip with no reapers finding and eliminating them.  Yep.  Totally.

Let's not forget the logistical nightmare of that trip...

It's 
Unicorns and rainbows.

[txgoldrush]

Kabraxal wrote...

txgoldrush wrote...

Maxster_ wrote...

txgoldrush wrote...

Maxster_ wrote...

Tomwew wrote...

how did the protheans get the plans to mars anyway? the relays were shut down in their cycle so they either had to take a very long ftl journey to our solar system, without being caught and then either construct the mars archives or decide to add, and hide the incomplete crucible designs to already existing archives.

or they had and were aware of the importance of the crucible plans before the invasion in their cycle, decided our species was a better candidate to entrust with the plans than the asari, then went to lengths to hide the information. and they couldn't build the crucible in time with a subjugated empire even, though we built it in a matter of months in the midst of a reaper invasion.

does feel a bit contrived.

More funny that they decided to hide information about reapers existence in archives, where they put plans for Crucible. So they knew about reapers in advance. And then sent warning about surprise attack of the reapers through beacons.

Makes no sense.

so where is your evidence that The Protheans knew the Reapers in advance before they were attacked?

It ames no sense to you because you don't get it.

Indulge me, how crucible plans ended up in mars research station exactly? Reapers suddenly forgot to turn off relays(which also completely contradicts ME1 and ME2), or protheans knew about reapers in advance?

Or you'll just spew more nonsense in attempt to shift theme again? 

Because they can still travel without the relays, just nowhere near as fast.

Did you not see the shot on the Destry ending where ships are flying past the disabled relay?

Really... they are going to fly with normal FTL all the way to mars during a Reaper invasion.  They'd totally survive that long trip with no reapers finding and eliminating them.  Yep.  Totally.

Let's not forget the logistical nightmare of that trip...

 Once again, are you specualting a plot hole or do you have hard evidence?

Hell, what if they made the trip without Reaper interference because they were hitting systems one by one like Vigil said?

[Kabraxal]

txgoldrush wrote...

Tomwew wrote...

txgoldrush wrote...

Maxster_ wrote...

Tomwew wrote...

how did the protheans get the plans to mars anyway? the relays were shut down in their cycle so they either had to take a very long ftl journey to our solar system, without being caught and then either construct the mars archives or decide to add, and hide the incomplete crucible designs to already existing archives.

or they had and were aware of the importance of the crucible plans before the invasion in their cycle, decided our species was a better candidate to entrust with the plans than the asari, then went to lengths to hide the information. and they couldn't build the crucible in time with a subjugated empire even, though we built it in a matter of months in the midst of a reaper invasion.

does feel a bit contrived.

More funny that they decided to hide information about reapers existence in archives, where they put plans for Crucible. So they knew about reapers in advance. And then sent warning about surprise attack of the reapers through beacons.

Makes no sense.

so where is your evidence that The Protheans knew the Reapers in advance before they were attacked?

It ames no sense to you because you don't get it.

so they didn't know about the reapers before they attacked. that's consistent with the lore, but then raises the questions of how they got to mars with no relays and reapers on the hunt for stragglers and technology left behind?
and why would they make accessing  technology which leads to the reaper trap citadel, i.e mass effect technology and the relays easier than information on the reapers or how to defeat them?

they already know the reapers know about the crucible, indoctrinated agents sabotaged it according to the v.i on thessia, and if cerberus can hack prothean tech the reapers sure can so why make this information more difficult to access? if the reapers find the archives it's over anyway, so why make it more difficult for non-reapers to access it?

Once again, they can travel without the relays, just no where near as well.

Just because an agent is indoctrinated doesn't mean it always will pass info back to the Reapers. We don't know how exactly they sabtoged the Crucible or that they passed info back to the Reapers, only that they did sabtoge it. There is no evidence that contradicts lore, just a specualtion, therefore no plot hole can be proven. Also how far are they indoctrinated? We don't know.  They could also be like most of Cerberus, who doesn't realize they were indoctrinated and still view Reapers as an enemy that should be controlled. The VI also states that it was a control faction, which supports this, as TIM still viewed the Reapers as the enemy.

Its all specualtion, no hard evidence.

If Vendetta would have said that the indoctrinated agents exposed the Crucible to the Reapers, then thats a plot hole.

Obviously they did.. else the crucible would have been you know... succesful, if we are to believe it is actually what they say it is.

[Tomwew]

txgoldrush wrote...

Tomwew wrote...

txgoldrush wrote...

Maxster_ wrote...

Tomwew wrote...

how did the protheans get the plans to mars anyway? the relays were shut down in their cycle so they either had to take a very long ftl journey to our solar system, without being caught and then either construct the mars archives or decide to add, and hide the incomplete crucible designs to already existing archives.

or they had and were aware of the importance of the crucible plans before the invasion in their cycle, decided our species was a better candidate to entrust with the plans than the asari, then went to lengths to hide the information. and they couldn't build the crucible in time with a subjugated empire even, though we built it in a matter of months in the midst of a reaper invasion.

does feel a bit contrived.

More funny that they decided to hide information about reapers existence in archives, where they put plans for Crucible. So they knew about reapers in advance. And then sent warning about surprise attack of the reapers through beacons.

Makes no sense.

so where is your evidence that The Protheans knew the Reapers in advance before they were attacked?

It ames no sense to you because you don't get it.

so they didn't know about the reapers before they attacked. that's consistent with the lore, but then raises the questions of how they got to mars with no relays and reapers on the hunt for stragglers and technology left behind?
and why would they make accessing  technology which leads to the reaper trap citadel, i.e mass effect technology and the relays easier than information on the reapers or how to defeat them?

they already know the reapers know about the crucible, indoctrinated agents sabotaged it according to the v.i on thessia, and if cerberus can hack prothean tech the reapers sure can so why make this information more difficult to access? if the reapers find the archives it's over anyway, so why make it more difficult for non-reapers to access it?

Once again, they can travel without the relays, just no where near as well.

Just because an agent is indoctrinated doesn't mean it always will pass info back to the Reapers. We don't know how exactly they sabtoged the Crucible or that they passed info back to the Reapers, only that they did sabtoge it. There is no evidence that contradicts lore, just a specualtion, therefore no plot hole can be proven. Also how far are they indoctrinated? We don't know.  They could also be like most of Cerberus, who doesn't realize they were indoctrinated and still view Reapers as an enemy that should be controlled. The VI also states that it was a control faction, which supports this, as TIM still viewed the Reapers as the enemy.

Its all specualtion, no hard evidence.

If Vendetta would have said that the indoctrinated agents exposed the Crucible to the Reapers, then thats a plot hole.

and what about making info on the reapers and crucible more difficult to hide than information that would make us a target of the reapers (ME tech and info on the relays)?

TIM told the reapers about the catalyst, seren told them about the conduit, but the indoctrinated agents in the prothean cycle decided to go solo in destroying the crucible? and even if they did, the v.i knows they were indoctrinated so wouldn't anyone just assume the reapers know by association? and the reapers being unaware of the crucible when their indoctinated agents do is not contrived?

[Kabraxal]

txgoldrush wrote...

Kabraxal wrote...

txgoldrush wrote...

Maxster_ wrote...

txgoldrush wrote...

Maxster_ wrote...

Tomwew wrote...

how did the protheans get the plans to mars anyway? the relays were shut down in their cycle so they either had to take a very long ftl journey to our solar system, without being caught and then either construct the mars archives or decide to add, and hide the incomplete crucible designs to already existing archives.

or they had and were aware of the importance of the crucible plans before the invasion in their cycle, decided our species was a better candidate to entrust with the plans than the asari, then went to lengths to hide the information. and they couldn't build the crucible in time with a subjugated empire even, though we built it in a matter of months in the midst of a reaper invasion.

does feel a bit contrived.

More funny that they decided to hide information about reapers existence in archives, where they put plans for Crucible. So they knew about reapers in advance. And then sent warning about surprise attack of the reapers through beacons.

Makes no sense.

so where is your evidence that The Protheans knew the Reapers in advance before they were attacked?

It ames no sense to you because you don't get it.

Indulge me, how crucible plans ended up in mars research station exactly? Reapers suddenly forgot to turn off relays(which also completely contradicts ME1 and ME2), or protheans knew about reapers in advance?

Or you'll just spew more nonsense in attempt to shift theme again? 

Because they can still travel without the relays, just nowhere near as fast.

Did you not see the shot on the Destry ending where ships are flying past the disabled relay?

Really... they are going to fly with normal FTL all the way to mars during a Reaper invasion.  They'd totally survive that long trip with no reapers finding and eliminating them.  Yep.  Totally.

Let's not forget the logistical nightmare of that trip...

 Once again, are you specualting a plot hole or do you have hard evidence?

Hell, what if they made the trip without Reaper interference because they were hitting systems one by one like Vigil said?

You complain about me stating the simple deductive reasoning that: there is a reaper invasion, FTL travel would take decades, there are hundreds and hundreds of reapers around... thus it is most likely such a trip would be a failure since they'd get taken out.  Let's not add in the food supply and the aging and the drive cores and possible indoctrinated members of the crew....

That is far more probably than you're speculation that a ship managed to make such a long trip without being spotted and maintaining good food stores as the REapers destroy everything, manage to refuel or dump drive cores, and deal with no indoctrinated members of the crew despite such a mission most likely being know by enough people for someone to get it to the Reapers?  Really? 

You complain about us "wildly" speculating but all of our speculations are far more grounded in believability than the magical bus ride you just described.  And we know the Crucible was hit by indoctrinated forces... at least if Vendetta is to be believed.  So already we have shown one project wsa doomed by indoctrination.  You really think a decades long flight would fare any better?  Really?!

[txgoldrush]

Kabraxal wrote...

txgoldrush wrote...

Tomwew wrote...

txgoldrush wrote...

Maxster_ wrote...

Tomwew wrote...

how did the protheans get the plans to mars anyway? the relays were shut down in their cycle so they either had to take a very long ftl journey to our solar system, without being caught and then either construct the mars archives or decide to add, and hide the incomplete crucible designs to already existing archives.

or they had and were aware of the importance of the crucible plans before the invasion in their cycle, decided our species was a better candidate to entrust with the plans than the asari, then went to lengths to hide the information. and they couldn't build the crucible in time with a subjugated empire even, though we built it in a matter of months in the midst of a reaper invasion.

does feel a bit contrived.

More funny that they decided to hide information about reapers existence in archives, where they put plans for Crucible. So they knew about reapers in advance. And then sent warning about surprise attack of the reapers through beacons.

Makes no sense.

so where is your evidence that The Protheans knew the Reapers in advance before they were attacked?

It ames no sense to you because you don't get it.

so they didn't know about the reapers before they attacked. that's consistent with the lore, but then raises the questions of how they got to mars with no relays and reapers on the hunt for stragglers and technology left behind?
and why would they make accessing  technology which leads to the reaper trap citadel, i.e mass effect technology and the relays easier than information on the reapers or how to defeat them?

they already know the reapers know about the crucible, indoctrinated agents sabotaged it according to the v.i on thessia, and if cerberus can hack prothean tech the reapers sure can so why make this information more difficult to access? if the reapers find the archives it's over anyway, so why make it more difficult for non-reapers to access it?

Once again, they can travel without the relays, just no where near as well.

Just because an agent is indoctrinated doesn't mean it always will pass info back to the Reapers. We don't know how exactly they sabtoged the Crucible or that they passed info back to the Reapers, only that they did sabtoge it. There is no evidence that contradicts lore, just a specualtion, therefore no plot hole can be proven. Also how far are they indoctrinated? We don't know.  They could also be like most of Cerberus, who doesn't realize they were indoctrinated and still view Reapers as an enemy that should be controlled. The VI also states that it was a control faction, which supports this, as TIM still viewed the Reapers as the enemy.

Its all specualtion, no hard evidence.

If Vendetta would have said that the indoctrinated agents exposed the Crucible to the Reapers, then thats a plot hole.

Obviously they did.. else the crucible would have been you know... succesful, if we are to believe it is actually what they say it is.

Yet no hard evidence....what if while the indoctrinated agents were sabotaging the Crucible, were all killed and couldn't report back to the Reapers? What if, what if, what if......we do not know full details, we have no evidence to call this a plot hole.

You have to have evidence to call something a plot hole...for example, its clearly evident without a doubt, there are lore and plot holes in Paragon Lost, they can be proven, not just speculated.

[txgoldrush]

Kabraxal wrote...

txgoldrush wrote...

Kabraxal wrote...

txgoldrush wrote...

Maxster_ wrote...

txgoldrush wrote...

Maxster_ wrote...

Tomwew wrote...

how did the protheans get the plans to mars anyway? the relays were shut down in their cycle so they either had to take a very long ftl journey to our solar system, without being caught and then either construct the mars archives or decide to add, and hide the incomplete crucible designs to already existing archives.

or they had and were aware of the importance of the crucible plans before the invasion in their cycle, decided our species was a better candidate to entrust with the plans than the asari, then went to lengths to hide the information. and they couldn't build the crucible in time with a subjugated empire even, though we built it in a matter of months in the midst of a reaper invasion.

does feel a bit contrived.

More funny that they decided to hide information about reapers existence in archives, where they put plans for Crucible. So they knew about reapers in advance. And then sent warning about surprise attack of the reapers through beacons.

Makes no sense.

so where is your evidence that The Protheans knew the Reapers in advance before they were attacked?

It ames no sense to you because you don't get it.

Indulge me, how crucible plans ended up in mars research station exactly? Reapers suddenly forgot to turn off relays(which also completely contradicts ME1 and ME2), or protheans knew about reapers in advance?

Or you'll just spew more nonsense in attempt to shift theme again? 

Because they can still travel without the relays, just nowhere near as fast.

Did you not see the shot on the Destry ending where ships are flying past the disabled relay?

Really... they are going to fly with normal FTL all the way to mars during a Reaper invasion.  They'd totally survive that long trip with no reapers finding and eliminating them.  Yep.  Totally.

Let's not forget the logistical nightmare of that trip...

 Once again, are you specualting a plot hole or do you have hard evidence?

Hell, what if they made the trip without Reaper interference because they were hitting systems one by one like Vigil said?

You complain about me stating the simple deductive reasoning that: there is a reaper invasion, FTL travel would take decades, there are hundreds and hundreds of reapers around... thus it is most likely such a trip would be a failure since they'd get taken out.  Let's not add in the food supply and the aging and the drive cores and possible indoctrinated members of the crew....

That is far more probably than you're speculation that a ship managed to make such a long trip without being spotted and maintaining good food stores as the REapers destroy everything, manage to refuel or dump drive cores, and deal with no indoctrinated members of the crew despite such a mission most likely being know by enough people for someone to get it to the Reapers?  Really? 

You complain about us "wildly" speculating but all of our speculations are far more grounded in believability than the magical bus ride you just described.  And we know the Crucible was hit by indoctrinated forces... at least if Vendetta is to be believed.  So already we have shown one project wsa doomed by indoctrination.  You really think a decades long flight would fare any better?  Really?!

There is no magic bus ride I just described...you have to prove it in the narrative that its a plot hole. You can't why?....because you have to use specualtions.

Plot holes are proven by evidence, not speculations because someone can have a different speculation.

Hell, what if Mars was the main base of the Crucible and was hidden as much as Ilos was....see, I can speculate that its not a plot hole just like you can speculate plot holes.

[Maxster_]

Kabraxal wrote...

You complain about me stating the simple deductive reasoning that: there is a reaper invasion, FTL travel would take decades, there are hundreds and hundreds of reapers around... thus it is most likely such a trip would be a failure since they'd get taken out.  Let's not add in the food supply and the aging and the drive cores and possible indoctrinated members of the crew....

That is far more probably than you're speculation that a ship managed to make such a long trip without being spotted and maintaining good food stores as the REapers destroy everything, manage to refuel or dump drive cores, and deal with no indoctrinated members of the crew despite such a mission most likely being know by enough people for someone to get it to the Reapers?  Really? 

You complain about us "wildly" speculating but all of our speculations are far more grounded in believability than the magical bus ride you just described.  And we know the Crucible was hit by indoctrinated forces... at least if Vendetta is to be believed.  So already we have shown one project wsa doomed by indoctrination.  You really think a decades long flight would fare any better?  Really?!

Somehow that trip reminded me of the BSG first season.
Indoctrination is just contrived and bad plot device in ME1 sequels(especially ME3) anyway. TIM makes no sense - he is indoctrinated. Udina makes no sense - he is indoctrinated. Hackett makes no sense - he is indoctrinated. Crucible makes no sense - it is indoctrinat... oh wait 

[Kabraxal]

Man... you are a goldmine of pure unintentional comedy. "you need to prove a plot hole even though I have to speculate wildy and less believably than you to make the story fit the way I wish to see it!".

Come on... at least come up with something intelligent and reasonable just once. This is beyond pathetic and just hilarious you actually seem to think you're rebutting anything.

[Maxster_]

Kabraxal wrote...

Man... you are a goldmine of pure unintentional comedy. "you need to prove a plot hole even though I have to speculate wildy and less believably than you to make the story fit the way I wish to see it!".

Come on... at least come up with something intelligent and reasonable just once. This is beyond pathetic and just hilarious you actually seem to think you're rebutting anything.

You know dreman, perhaps?  

[Tomwew]

txgoldrush wrote...

Yet no hard evidence....what if while the indoctrinated agents were sabotaging the Crucible, were all killed and couldn't report back to the Reapers? What if, what if, what if......we do not know full details, we have no evidence to call this a plot hole.

so what you're saying is the crucible plot is under developed, conveniant and contrived? so you agree with the op? it only took 10 pages!

Modifié par Tomwew, 02 janvier 2013 - 03:59 .

[txgoldrush]

Kabraxal wrote...

Man... you are a goldmine of pure unintentional comedy. "you need to prove a plot hole even though I have to speculate wildy and less believably than you to make the story fit the way I wish to see it!".

Come on... at least come up with something intelligent and reasonable just once. This is beyond pathetic and just hilarious you actually seem to think you're rebutting anything.

And you are just another basher who ignores clear narrative points and resorts to speculation so you can "prove" plot holes. Whats funny is that most of the haters on this board (suprising that they stay on just to bash the game over and over with nothing better to do with their time) simply ignore the actually narrative and speculate it into an atrocity.

I payed attention to the story, I payed attention to the dialogue, I have evidence, you have speculations, so you are basically useless in a debate.

[Maxster_]

txgoldrush wrote...

Kabraxal wrote...

Man... you are a goldmine of pure unintentional comedy. "you need to prove a plot hole even though I have to speculate wildy and less believably than you to make the story fit the way I wish to see it!".

Come on... at least come up with something intelligent and reasonable just once. This is beyond pathetic and just hilarious you actually seem to think you're rebutting anything.

And you are just another basher who ignores clear narrative points and resorts to speculation so you can "prove" plot holes. Whats funny is that most of the haters on this board (suprising that they stay on just to bash the game over and over with nothing better to do with their time) simply ignore the actually narrative and speculate it into an atrocity.

I payed attention to the story, I payed attention to the dialogue, I have evidence, you have speculations, so you are basically useless in a debate.

Pathetic.