Hello, I am plannig on my DA:O save to DA2 including Awakening, witch Hunt and Golems.
Anyways I am creating my canon save and am wondering-should I save the city of Amaranthine or Vigils keep?
Now I know you can save them both, I have fully upgraded my keep. But the problem is even if you have a fully upgraded keep and save Amaranthine any companions you don't take with you will be flagged as dead for any future installments even though the epilouge says they survived. Also the codex says those companions who are not taken are dead.
So should I save the City or the Keep? I am trying to play more or less the morally good characatr, but I relly like all my companions.....
Also another sort of hard choice for me, should I kill the architect or not?
Save the City or the Vigil?
Débuté par
Azzanadra
, janv. 03 2013 06:14
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#2
Posté 03 janvier 2013 - 07:18
Blazomancer
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I assume you know about the only companion whose life or death has any consequence in DA2. So, you may want to keep that companion in your party for the final questline and then save whatever. Keeping that aside, while playing a morally good sort of character, I personally prefer to save the city, and spare the architect. But I suppose you'd know your warden better, and so you'd be better suited to decide what he/she thinks is the right thing to do.
#3
Posté 03 janvier 2013 - 07:37
Azzanadra
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Yeah but you never know, Bioware might make "finding Sigrun" or something like that in DA3..... and I actually kept that companian in my party, since I knew what would happen in DA2.
I have actually already played DAO and II on the PS3, I am now just playing it on PC so I am making it my "perfect" import. On the PS3 in awakening I burned Amaranthine and spared the architect, don't know if that was the right thing to do though.
I have actually already played DAO and II on the PS3, I am now just playing it on PC so I am making it my "perfect" import. On the PS3 in awakening I burned Amaranthine and spared the architect, don't know if that was the right thing to do though.
#4
Posté 03 janvier 2013 - 09:23
Foolsfolly
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Why not save both?
As for the Architect. My morally good PCs tend to kill him. That bit at the beginning with 'This all went just as the Architect fore-saw' or some-such tends to end that. The more 'ends justify the means' characters see the Architect as a hope of ending the Blight... who cares about what he's done in the past.
As for the Architect. My morally good PCs tend to kill him. That bit at the beginning with 'This all went just as the Architect fore-saw' or some-such tends to end that. The more 'ends justify the means' characters see the Architect as a hope of ending the Blight... who cares about what he's done in the past.
#5
Posté 03 janvier 2013 - 09:34
Face of Evil
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Azzanadra wrote...
Now I know you can save them both, I have fully upgraded my keep. But the problem is even if you have a fully upgraded keep and save Amaranthine any companions you don't take with you will be flagged as dead for any future installments even though the epilouge says they survived. Also the codex says those companions who are not taken are dead.
No, that is not the case. I left Anders behind at a fully-upgraded Vigil's Keep and saved Amaranthine. When I met Nathaniel in Act 3, he never once referred to Anders being dead.
There is a bug that prevents Nathaniel from appearing in Act 3 if he isn't in your party at the end of Awakening. This bug still applies even if you save the Vigil.
Also, the only two people who die defending the Vigil no matter what are Sigrun and Justice.
Modifié par Face of Evil, 03 janvier 2013 - 09:38 .
#6
Posté 03 janvier 2013 - 09:54
Azzanadra
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Face of Evil wrote...
Azzanadra wrote...
Now I know you can save them both, I have fully upgraded my keep. But the problem is even if you have a fully upgraded keep and save Amaranthine any companions you don't take with you will be flagged as dead for any future installments even though the epilouge says they survived. Also the codex says those companions who are not taken are dead.
No, that is not the case. I left Anders behind at a fully-upgraded Vigil's Keep and saved Amaranthine. When I met Nathaniel in Act 3, he never once referred to Anders being dead.
There is a bug that prevents Nathaniel from appearing in Act 3 if he isn't in your party at the end of Awakening. This bug still applies even if you save the Vigil.
Also, the only two people who die defending the Vigil no matter what are Sigrun and Justice.
Yes but in that case it doesn't matter. Justice and Anders survive no matter what, I am talkingh about the other companions, Valanna, Oghren, Sigrun etc that don't appear as major charactars in DA:O. Also the wiki states otherwise....
http://dragonage.wik..._on_Amaranthine
#7
Posté 03 janvier 2013 - 11:29
Shadow of Light Dragon
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Face of Evil wrote...
No, that is not the case. I left Anders behind at a fully-upgraded Vigil's Keep and saved Amaranthine. When I met Nathaniel in Act 3, he never once referred to Anders being dead.
Yet when I did the same thing, Nathaniel was surprised at seeing Anders alive and Anders said something like, "Good, that's what I wanted people to think," making it look like he staged his own demise. Perhaps you encountered a dialogue bug or something?
OP: if you're only concerned about keeping your NPCs alive, save the Keep. You get a less favourable epilogue with people thinking you sacrificed the city for your own profit etc, but apparently all the epilogues are unreliable now so who cares.
FWIW I've saved the city both times. My human noble believed the upgraded keep had more than enough to protect it, and saw it as her duty to try and save the common folk -- especially after the riot outside the Vigil. :/ My City Elf grew up amongst common folk and hated the idea of protecting a shiny castle while people like her own were forsaken, so she went to save the city as well.
#8
Posté 04 janvier 2013 - 02:54
Azzanadra
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Shadow of Light Dragon wrote...
Face of Evil wrote...
No, that is not the case. I left Anders behind at a fully-upgraded Vigil's Keep and saved Amaranthine. When I met Nathaniel in Act 3, he never once referred to Anders being dead.
Yet when I did the same thing, Nathaniel was surprised at seeing Anders alive and Anders said something like, "Good, that's what I wanted people to think," making it look like he staged his own demise. Perhaps you encountered a dialogue bug or something?
OP: if you're only concerned about keeping your NPCs alive, save the Keep. You get a less favourable epilogue with people thinking you sacrificed the city for your own profit etc, but apparently all the epilogues are unreliable now so who cares.
FWIW I've saved the city both times. My human noble believed the upgraded keep had more than enough to protect it, and saw it as her duty to try and save the common folk -- especially after the riot outside the Vigil. :/ My City Elf grew up amongst common folk and hated the idea of protecting a shiny castle while people like her own were forsaken, so she went to save the city as well.
How about the Architect? Did you kill or help him?
For the record, I spare pretty much all charactars, even Loghain (and I Loved Alistair). But the thing with the Architect is.... he might be dangerous to every race, Loghain was just a danger to me, if he backstabbed me the others would put him down quick. The architect has broodmothers cabale of producing thousabds of Darkspawn each.
#9
Guest_Faerunner_*
Posté 04 janvier 2013 - 03:20
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It really depends on the characters. I'll admit I've only played Awakening once with my City Elven Warden (kept meaning to get around to the others, but didn't), and her background as an abused minority influenced a lot of her decisions.
While I (the player) felt very pressured to burn the city, my City Elven Warden had too much experience with nobles locking gates and burning elves inside to even think of doing it to the citizens of Amaranthine. She also figured the Vigil's job was to defend people from darkspawn, so what kind of military outpost would they be if they literally butchered the people to save themselves? She wondered what kind of noble would she be if she took their tax money but threw away their lives when the time came to defend them, and how could she partake in the corrupt behavior she condemned in other nobles? (She figured Loghain did that ****, not her.)
My CE Warden also spared the Arctitect because a) she felt he made a compelling argument for his people's potential moral goodness,
she could not in good conscience condemn an entire race after a lifetime of being condemned for hers, c) she hoped he would help her against The Mother and d) thought she would have time to talk to him more about it after.
EDIT: Honestly, you might think your character will react one way and then get there and find they react differently. Don't worry too much about it now, I would just role-play as you naturally do and see how your character wants to react once they get to a certain situation. "Don't cross the bridge until you come to it," and all. =)
While I (the player) felt very pressured to burn the city, my City Elven Warden had too much experience with nobles locking gates and burning elves inside to even think of doing it to the citizens of Amaranthine. She also figured the Vigil's job was to defend people from darkspawn, so what kind of military outpost would they be if they literally butchered the people to save themselves? She wondered what kind of noble would she be if she took their tax money but threw away their lives when the time came to defend them, and how could she partake in the corrupt behavior she condemned in other nobles? (She figured Loghain did that ****, not her.)
My CE Warden also spared the Arctitect because a) she felt he made a compelling argument for his people's potential moral goodness,
she could not in good conscience condemn an entire race after a lifetime of being condemned for hers, c) she hoped he would help her against The Mother and d) thought she would have time to talk to him more about it after.EDIT: Honestly, you might think your character will react one way and then get there and find they react differently. Don't worry too much about it now, I would just role-play as you naturally do and see how your character wants to react once they get to a certain situation. "Don't cross the bridge until you come to it," and all. =)
Modifié par Faerunner, 05 janvier 2013 - 07:49 .
#10
Posté 05 janvier 2013 - 03:51
sylvanaerie
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My Surana and Queen Cousland both saved the city. On my King Cousland, I wanted to see something different (and get the achievement) and left the city to burn when Capt Garavel said it was lost. I hadn't planned on keeping it, but once it was done, it kind of felt right to me. Gawain was a 'whatever it takes' kind of warden, and a bit of a hardass anyway.
Very different epilogue for the two different outcomes, and I found the one where you help the city much more positive than the one for saving Vigil. And the effect of saving the keep instead of the city creates a new quest in DA2 in act 1.
And all my wardens kill the Architect. ****** started the fifth blight, I wasn't leaving him alive to wreak more havoc intentionally or not.
Very different epilogue for the two different outcomes, and I found the one where you help the city much more positive than the one for saving Vigil. And the effect of saving the keep instead of the city creates a new quest in DA2 in act 1.
And all my wardens kill the Architect. ****** started the fifth blight, I wasn't leaving him alive to wreak more havoc intentionally or not.
Modifié par sylvanaerie, 05 janvier 2013 - 03:52 .
#11
Posté 05 janvier 2013 - 04:31
Riverdaleswhiteflash
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So, I'm not the only one who named my King Cousland "Gawain?"
At any rate, I think I've already figured out some of what my Wardens would do if I ever got Awakenings. Most of them would save Amaranthine, with the exceptions of my crazy elf mage and my elf supremacist DE rogue.
As for the other big one, My non-king Cousland would spare the Architect because trusting Loghain, Jowan and Avernus worked out for him, and my elf mage would spare him for precisely the reason sylvanaerie described. My DC is metagamed for best outcomes, and I think DA2 implies that means Archie has to die. My DN just doesn't trust darkspawn. I can't think what my CE or my reasonable DE would do, since I don't really roleplay them consistently. Nor my evil DE, since there's a Dalish elf on Archie's side.
Gawain... well, no roleplaying decision I've previously made has any bearing on this one, with Loghain as a possible exception. (Avernus, yeah, but I haven't played Warden's Keep with him yet.) On the other hand, my headcanon has him possess "the Cousland family kekkei genkai" which lets him sniff out other people's motivations and personalities, and which would let him sense Archie's limitations in controlling darkspawn. (It's not even that farfetched by Dragon Age standards. He's bred from purely noble stock, and apparently selective breeding can result in babies born with the capacity to march in formation. Not to mention that this one isn't even that hard to see coming, what with it being the entire plot of Awakenings.) That, in addition to the fact that he never bothered trusting Loghain or Jowan... bye-bye Archie. My Amell... would probably give him benefit of the doubt, with so much to gain. She rationalized Isolde's death, her own use of blood magic, and in a fanmade adventure the deaths of several humans and two templars, for less gain each time. And then there's my Arcane Warrior, who I'm playing as hopelessly naive. I think she'd jump right on Archie's bandwagon.
At any rate, I think I've already figured out some of what my Wardens would do if I ever got Awakenings. Most of them would save Amaranthine, with the exceptions of my crazy elf mage and my elf supremacist DE rogue.
As for the other big one, My non-king Cousland would spare the Architect because trusting Loghain, Jowan and Avernus worked out for him, and my elf mage would spare him for precisely the reason sylvanaerie described. My DC is metagamed for best outcomes, and I think DA2 implies that means Archie has to die. My DN just doesn't trust darkspawn. I can't think what my CE or my reasonable DE would do, since I don't really roleplay them consistently. Nor my evil DE, since there's a Dalish elf on Archie's side.
Gawain... well, no roleplaying decision I've previously made has any bearing on this one, with Loghain as a possible exception. (Avernus, yeah, but I haven't played Warden's Keep with him yet.) On the other hand, my headcanon has him possess "the Cousland family kekkei genkai" which lets him sniff out other people's motivations and personalities, and which would let him sense Archie's limitations in controlling darkspawn. (It's not even that farfetched by Dragon Age standards. He's bred from purely noble stock, and apparently selective breeding can result in babies born with the capacity to march in formation. Not to mention that this one isn't even that hard to see coming, what with it being the entire plot of Awakenings.) That, in addition to the fact that he never bothered trusting Loghain or Jowan... bye-bye Archie. My Amell... would probably give him benefit of the doubt, with so much to gain. She rationalized Isolde's death, her own use of blood magic, and in a fanmade adventure the deaths of several humans and two templars, for less gain each time. And then there's my Arcane Warrior, who I'm playing as hopelessly naive. I think she'd jump right on Archie's bandwagon.
Modifié par Riverdaleswhiteflash, 05 janvier 2013 - 04:47 .
#12
Posté 05 janvier 2013 - 01:06
Corker
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I don't ever spare the Architect.
Darkspawn are parasites; they require members of other, already sapient races to complete their breeding cycle. As it is, they're mindless, and the moral burden of killing them is somewhere near killing smallpox viruses. If they achieve sapience, I have to trust that a thinking species will choose death for itself, rather than continue to kidnap, torture and rape women of other species to ensure their survival. Seems like a bad bet to make.
I'd rather murder the Architect now than have to genocide a race of intelligent darkspawn later.
Darkspawn are parasites; they require members of other, already sapient races to complete their breeding cycle. As it is, they're mindless, and the moral burden of killing them is somewhere near killing smallpox viruses. If they achieve sapience, I have to trust that a thinking species will choose death for itself, rather than continue to kidnap, torture and rape women of other species to ensure their survival. Seems like a bad bet to make.
I'd rather murder the Architect now than have to genocide a race of intelligent darkspawn later.
#13
Posté 05 janvier 2013 - 05:06
Bad King
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If you want to save Amaranthine, I would recommend leaving Anders and Justice behind (both survive anyway even if flagged as dead). If you kill the architect, I would recommend leaving Nathaniel to die - otherwise he will appear in DA2 claiming that the architect was spared (the flag is read incorrectly) which can break your immersion slightly. So take Oghren, Sigrun, and Velanna with you.
