204 réponses à ce sujet

[Javo2357]

It's a good power. Wouldn't mind seeing a buff but it doesn't really need one imo.

[Cyonan]

lightswitch wrote...

All the comparisons to Tac Scan and Recon Mine are a little strange. Sure, they're all debuffs, but Cryo Blast has a lot more versatility. I take "fire one power while active" for Tac Cloak and just spam Cry Blast all the time. I use it on mooks to force them to dodge for an easy headshot, make Phantoms bubble up for an easy headshot, freeze Abominations and either leave them to thaw or shoot them in the head, and so forth. Recon Mine and Tac Scan are both great debuffs but they don't do any of these things. Of course I also use Cryo Blast to debuff bosses. It's one of the more unique and versatile powers in the game.

I wouldn't complain if it could prime armored targets, though. That would make it awesome.

What about Warp, which also does all of those things and can prime any target for BEs or detonate them?

[lightswitch]

Cyonan wrote...

lightswitch wrote...

All the comparisons to Tac Scan and Recon Mine are a little strange. Sure, they're all debuffs, but Cryo Blast has a lot more versatility. I take "fire one power while active" for Tac Cloak and just spam Cry Blast all the time. I use it on mooks to force them to dodge for an easy headshot, make Phantoms bubble up for an easy headshot, freeze Abominations and either leave them to thaw or shoot them in the head, and so forth. Recon Mine and Tac Scan are both great debuffs but they don't do any of these things. Of course I also use Cryo Blast to debuff bosses. It's one of the more unique and versatile powers in the game.

I wouldn't complain if it could prime armored targets, though. That would make it awesome.

What about Warp, which also does all of those things and can prime any target for BEs or detonate them?

If I'm understanding correctly, your argument is that Cryo Blast is underpowered in comparison to Warp?

Hmm. It's a fair point. I feel qualified to comment because the HI and the HSent are both amongst my top three most played characters of late.

The difference is that Cryo Blast has a much quicker cooldown. I don't use Warp for any of the purposes listed above (except at short range when dealing with isolated targets) other than debuffing because Throw fills that role better. Also, my perception may be skewed because the HSent requires Warp+Warp Ammo and BEs just to get his damage output up to an acceptable level. The HI doesn't need any help because Tac Cloak.

A potential problem with allowing Cryo Blast to prime armored targets is that it will benefit the HI a lot more than it will the THS or FQE. It would probably make the HI the best boss killer in the game because Sticky Grenades can detonate cryo explosions. It would work something like Cryo, Cloak, Sticky, Shoot, Cryo Explosion. Sticky grenades on an HI specced for power damage already do 2475 base damage (not including the 50% extra damage versus armor in iteration 5), when thrown out of cloak AND setting off a cryo explosion the damage would be just insane (edit: plus the damage from the weapon w/ Tac Cloak damage boost. Me I'd probably be using a Wraith). I doubt even the Batslasher could keep up.

Modifié par lightswitch, 05 janvier 2013 - 12:37 .

[enealDC]

here's a question to the expert.. what does that 25% debuff do on top of Armor piercing ammo, mods and etc?

[lightswitch]

 Here's the build everyone would use if Cryo Blast primed armored targets.

[5857.5 damage from a sticky thrown from cloak. Doesn't include the damage boost from the Cryo debuff]+[2689.12 Wraith shot from cloak. Also doesn't include boost from Cryo]+[However much damage a Cryo Explosion does, I have no idea].

I'm not really sure how the damage boost from debuffs is actually applied but if someone who knows wanted to run the numbers it would be sweet just so we could all drool.

It would be awesome, it would be mad amounts of fun, but it would do nothing to help the "Tac Cloak isn't overpowered" crowd.

Modifié par lightswitch, 05 janvier 2013 - 12:59 .

[UnknownMercenary]

lightswitch wrote...

 Here's the build everyone would use if Cryo Blast primed armored targets.

[5857.5 damage from a sticky thrown from cloak. Doesn't include the damage boost from the Cryo debuff]+[2689.12 Wraith shot from cloak. Also doesn't include boost from Cryo]+[However much damage a Cryo Explosion does, I have no idea].

I'm not really sure how the damage boost from debuffs is actually applied but if someone who knows wanted to run the numbers it would be sweet just so we could all drool.

It would be awesome, it would be mad amounts of fun, but it would do nothing to help the "Tac Cloak isn't overpowered" crowd.

At least it will get people to play the human infiltrator... maybe

[Julian Skies]

lightswitch wrote...

 Here's the build everyone would use if Cryo Blast primed armored targets.

[5857.5 damage from a sticky thrown from cloak. Doesn't include the damage boost from the Cryo debuff]+[2689.12 Wraith shot from cloak. Also doesn't include boost from Cryo]+[However much damage a Cryo Explosion does, I have no idea].

I'm not really sure how the damage boost from debuffs is actually applied but if someone who knows wanted to run the numbers it would be sweet just so we could all drool.

It would be awesome, it would be mad amounts of fun, but it would do nothing to help the "Tac Cloak isn't overpowered" crowd.

Actually, Tac Cloak gives only a 25% boost to the final damage of the stickies >_>

[lightswitch]

Julian Skies wrote...

lightswitch wrote...

 Here's the build everyone would use if Cryo Blast primed armored targets.

[5857.5 damage from a sticky thrown from cloak. Doesn't include the damage boost from the Cryo debuff]+[2689.12 Wraith shot from cloak. Also doesn't include boost from Cryo]+[However much damage a Cryo Explosion does, I have no idea].

I'm not really sure how the damage boost from debuffs is actually applied but if someone who knows wanted to run the numbers it would be sweet just so we could all drool.

It would be awesome, it would be mad amounts of fun, but it would do nothing to help the "Tac Cloak isn't overpowered" crowd.

Actually, Tac Cloak gives only a 25% boost to the final damage of the stickies >_>

Good information to know. Edit: Is this true for all grenades thrown from cloak?

I just played a game with this build, and it's very good against Brutes and the like, but I take back what I said about it outpacing the Batslasher. It would be about the same I think, maybe a little better but not by a large margin, not to mention it would be balanced out a bit by the small exposion radius and delayed explosion of Sticky Grenades which makes them very difficult to use against groups of mooks. Besides, if Adepts get to combo Warp debuff+Warp ammo damge boost+Cluster Grenade damage+Biotic Explosions all at the same time, why shouldn't Cryo lovers get to do the same thing? I'm all in for Cryo Blast priming armored targets.

Modifié par lightswitch, 05 janvier 2013 - 01:43 .

[Dream-Maker]

People should stop saying it sucks with the reason that snap freeze primes everything for CEs. Snap Freeze is bugged to the bone. When they released the latest big patch before retaliation, they buffed CE damage and stated that they could only be detonated on frozen targets. A bit later they even buffed their damage again.

With this info in hand it's pretty obvious that snap freeze isn't behaving as intended. It's actually more likely that for the next patch, snap freeze looses its ability to prime on everything, what would be cool though is for them to finally fix the detonation centered on the paladin bug.

So cryo blast priming everything probably isn't going to happen unless they nerf CEs back somehow and apply the same treatment to cryo ammo.

What they should do to cryo blast though IMO is give it some small damage value that is not boostable by anything else than the passives and the ability to detonate tech combos, even if that means increasing the cooldown a little bit. That would make the power a lot more flexible and diversify it's uses in the kits that have it.

Modifié par Dream-Maker, 05 janvier 2013 - 01:54 .

[TheBMT]

Im under the impression that not all powers must be amazing. It does a good job, especially paired with incinerate.

[GordianKnot42]

I love it on my QFE.

On Silver.

On Gold, I can't even whittle down their defenses fast enough to prep a decent Cryosplosion. Buff would be nice.

[Xiaolruc]

Cryo Blast needs to be allowed to prime cryo explosions on protective layers in order to 'keep up' with Snap Freeze.
It would also be a nice change to have it inflict a slight amount of damage so I can kill Swarmers with it. The damage doesn't have to be like Snap Freeze; it just needs a slight 'oomph' boost.
Hell, I'd settle for 1 point of damage.

[Happy Shepard]

Give it a DoT evo. It would make sense, would make it easily possible to prime CEs on all enemies and it would do some damage.

[Zjarcal]

GordianKnot42 wrote...

I love it on my QFE.

On Silver.

On Gold, I can't even whittle down their defenses fast enough to prep a decent Cryosplosion. Buff would be nice.

Or, instead of waiting to setup a cryo explosion you could've cryo blasted them firsthand and increase your damage by 25% percent against their defenses.

[Valiantheart99]

The ability to cause tech explosions with it would be very nice. Right now its a little underwhelming.

[megabeast37215]

I'm with the OP on this one.

I think it sucks bigtime, especially when compared to other debuff powers. When you put it next to proxy mine, recon mine, tac scan, snap freeze, and warp... Cryo Blast ends up dead last. All those other powers have similar debuffs, they all do damage except tac scan... but tac scan can be cast from behind cover. When you factor in that it can be dodged AND does no damage... you're talking about a rather subpar power.

The only debuff I feel Cryo Blast is superior to is Biotic Orbs.

[Mahrac]

megabeast37215 wrote...

I'm with the OP on this one.

I think it sucks bigtime, especially when compared to other debuff powers. When you put it next to proxy mine, recon mine, tac scan, snap freeze, and warp... Cryo Blast ends up dead last. All those other powers have similar debuffs, they all do damage except tac scan... but tac scan can be cast from behind cover. When you factor in that it can be dodged AND does no damage... you're talking about a rather subpar power.

The only debuff I feel Cryo Blast is superior to is Biotic Orbs.

Until you figure theat the orbs can hit three (or four) targets in relatively quick succession and offer a buff to the user before that.

[Kyerea]

I run a 6/6/6/6/0 H.I. because Health and Shield's kind of not needed on her, and yeah, it becomes very apparent that Cryo Blast is effing terrible. Snap Freeze's introduction into the MP has not made it any better, it's made it EVEN MORE apparent how bad it is.

There needs to be a major overhaul of Cryo Blast similar to Singularity's overhaul.

[megabeast37215]

Mahrac wrote...

megabeast37215 wrote...

I'm with the OP on this one.

I think it sucks bigtime, especially when compared to other debuff powers. When you put it next to proxy mine, recon mine, tac scan, snap freeze, and warp... Cryo Blast ends up dead last. All those other powers have similar debuffs, they all do damage except tac scan... but tac scan can be cast from behind cover. When you factor in that it can be dodged AND does no damage... you're talking about a rather subpar power.

The only debuff I feel Cryo Blast is superior to is Biotic Orbs.

Until you figure theat the orbs can hit three (or four) targets in relatively quick succession and offer a buff to the user before that.

The cooldown  for Orbs is prohibitive.

[Mahrac]

megabeast37215 wrote...

Mahrac wrote...

megabeast37215 wrote...

I'm with the OP on this one.

I think it sucks bigtime, especially when compared to other debuff powers. When you put it next to proxy mine, recon mine, tac scan, snap freeze, and warp... Cryo Blast ends up dead last. All those other powers have similar debuffs, they all do damage except tac scan... but tac scan can be cast from behind cover. When you factor in that it can be dodged AND does no damage... you're talking about a rather subpar power.

The only debuff I feel Cryo Blast is superior to is Biotic Orbs.

Until you figure theat the orbs can hit three (or four) targets in relatively quick succession and offer a buff to the user before that.

The cooldown  for Orbs is prohibitive.

True.

Does its debuff stack?

[MetalDeggial]

It just needs to act like Snap Freeze, and prime chilled shielded and armored characters for a cryo explosion without the need to freeze 'em. And raise the cooldown a bit to make it fair. Just a bit... a tiny bit.

Then everyone would fear the Havoc.

[metaempiricist]

Yukari Yakumo wrote...

If it worked like Snap Freeze and still effected stuff with shields/barriers it'd be good, but no.
Buff it.

+1

[Silvair]

Air Quotes wrote...

On a Human Infiltrator and Havoc Soldier and only a little better on a QFE

1. Even with Radius and fired from cloak gets dodged ALL THE TIME 
2. Deals NO DAMAGE up front, in fact it deals no damage at all. I think getting hit by a -200 degree ice blast would hurt a bit. No DOT either
3. Doesn't stagger. 
4. Does nothing to shields or barriers
5. The slow down evo is barely noticeble and you have to sacrifice a damage boost for it 
6. Has LONG travel time. 
7. Does't freeze Phantoms - A BIG ONE  
8. That 25% armor debuff is nothing special. There are plenty of much better ones around. 

Buff? Please? 


 

1)  No more than any other cast spell/power.
2)  Its not FOR damage.  So this point is irrelevant.  Its a supporting debuff power, not a damage power.  Its like complaining that Sabotage doesn't damage the opponent.
3)  Doesn't need to stagger, they freeze up and fall over, or slow down.   (I try to freeze them in funny poses lol)
4)  Again, its not FOR shields or barriers.  So, irrelevant point there.
5)  I notice it quite a bit, its saved my life.
6)  Again, no worse travel time than anything else, really.
7)  I'm pretty sure you can freeze a phantom once its barrier is down.
8)  Such as?  Its an armor debuff+tech burst setup+makes any damage taken after do more.  Thats 3 layers of setup, there.

The issue seems to be that you just want it to be another offensive power like Incinerate, but it is meant for another purpose.

It freezes regular enemies without shields or barriers, it slows down enemies with it, and it weakens enemies with armor.  Much as a I hate the way its deployed, I do oh so love how effective it is.  And how I can rapid fire it for constant assists lol.

[Grumpy Old Wizard]

Mahrac wrote...

megabeast37215 wrote...

Mahrac wrote...

megabeast37215 wrote...

I'm with the OP on this one.

I think it sucks bigtime, especially when compared to other debuff powers. When you put it next to proxy mine, recon mine, tac scan, snap freeze, and warp... Cryo Blast ends up dead last. All those other powers have similar debuffs, they all do damage except tac scan... but tac scan can be cast from behind cover. When you factor in that it can be dodged AND does no damage... you're talking about a rather subpar power.

The only debuff I feel Cryo Blast is superior to is Biotic Orbs.

Until you figure theat the orbs can hit three (or four) targets in relatively quick succession and offer a buff to the user before that.

The cooldown  for Orbs is prohibitive.

True.

Does its debuff stack?

The debuff lasts 6 seconds.  Yeah, it stacks, but the timer does not stack which leaves you will a grand total of maybe 1.5 seconds at the max debuff.  Orbs is the most sucktacular power in the game and the Volus adept is the most sucktacular adept/character in the game.  His only redeeming quality is that he is a Volus. 

Modifié par Grumpy Old Wizard, 05 janvier 2013 - 08:51 .

[Zero132132]

Uh Cold wrote...

I love it.

But yes buff please.

Human Infiltrator will probably be a bit OP if they buff it too much... but yeah, I agree.