235 réponses à ce sujet

[Bhatair]

MP-Ryan wrote...

Air Quotes wrote...

I'm sorry, but NovaGuard eats this guy for breakfast.

So does every other vanguard.  Smashguard is, unfortunately, the worst of them.

Truth. As much as I love the adept I've found the vanguard to be pretty lacking.

He was pretty good while smash was 1.5 cooldown though. A shame they had to revert the cooldown.

[Carbuncle]

would be nice if it was when it was buffed in terms of range

[Arctican]

Air Quotes wrote...

Arctican wrote...

Air Quotes wrote...

Arctican wrote...

Air Quotes wrote...

Ledgend1221 wrote...

Air Quotes wrote...

Ledgend1221 wrote...

Air Quotes wrote...

Great comments. Strong arguments.

It goes through walls.
It goes with BC and singularity nicely.
It does massive damage.

 

Biotic Slash does all that. With 20 meters range minimum. 

Then play the SV then and leave the smashing to the smashers.

 

Laughable argument. Biotic Slash does more damage with a greater range. What's hard to understand? 

Where do you get the idea that Biotic Slash does more damage?

 

narida.pytalhost.com/me3/classes/#Vanguard/NSlayer/BAKIA////// - Slayer 
narida.pytalhost.com/me3/classes/#Vanguard/ExCerberus/BLAIA////// - Smashguard

You're hardly speccing into Smash's max potential. But even with your setup on Smashguard, they doing pretty much the same damage with Smash doing more the shields. 

 

Refer to previous post of 2 targets. Same damage, but Biotic Slash hits unlimited targets and has 20 meter range minimum. That's more than TWICE the range.

Smash can't even hit trough a container on Rio.

Biotic Slash does not have unlimited targets. It hits only 3, according to Cyonan. I need to do some digging, but it's in his thread about powers' hidden attribute. 

And Smash is a boss killer. You spec into Electric DoT and Barrier/Armor evolutions, and you'll kill bosses in a few Smash. Yes, Slash has range, but it can't kill bosses within a reasonable amount of time.

[heybigmoney]

Its not a bad ability, but the payoff isn't worth the risk.

[iOnlySignIn]

Phoenix classes are only good on small maps if you actually plan to frequently use Smash.

I doubt that will change even if you double the range of Smash.

[Canned Madness]

Biotic slash will only hit 3 targets, it can hit 2 targets with the mini slashes at the start of the animation at 60% damage though.
But Smash will do much more damage when spec'd for damage, which you didn't do in your comparison, with nearly 2000 damage to shields and 4000 to barriers and armour. Beating Biotic slash by a large margin in damage

But most of your argument is based of ease of use of which Biotic slash is the clear winner but it doesn't mean that it sucks, you just don't like it due the mind-numbingly ease of use of Biotic slash; which I don't like, and that Smash is a lot harder to use compared to it.

In the end it comes down to preference, ease of use or raw damage, but this prefence doesn't mean that one power is completely outclassed by the other.

[mybudgee]

Even its name is stupid

[TheKillerAngel]

Even if Smash is a boss killing ability, the Cerbguard is not a boss killer. Bosses all have some kind of stagger, dot, or massive damage, and the cerbguard is too squishy to absorb that sort of punishment. He's better at killing infantry.

[ToLazy4Name]

Air Quotes wrote...

Compared to Biotic Slash 

Smash: 

Only 8 meter range and cannot be extented compared to 20 meters that can be extended to 30 

Only 1.5 meters wide compared to 2 meters

Does LESS damage if you don't take the Barriers and Armor evo, but you have to forgo radius and more targets hit for it and the targets are limited to 3. It can't even one shot a bunch of swarmers.  

Phantoms block it all the time. So you risk going to that range and they freaking block it! 

The animation is absurdly long. You can roll in the mid-way of it, but still it's freaking long. No invicibility frames

Has the same CD as the Biotic Slash 

My suggestions - at LEAST 10-12 meter range, at LEAST 2 meters wide, unlimited number of targets hit, and it should stagger everyone who touches you in the beggining of the animation when you drop your whips to the ground. Dragoon whips do that. 

I agree with all of this, except the thing about Phantoms. You just need to understand the mechanics of power-blocking bubbles. You can hit them with powers, so long as the power isn't initiated while locked onto them. So, turn away from them so you don't lock on, THEN start Smash, and turn back to them before it finishes. This applies to all powers, and is especially effective with Grenades. 

[ThatGuyThatPlaysThisGame]

Bhatair wrote...

It's limited, yeah but I'd hardly say it sucks.

Don't use it on phantoms, for phantoms use singularity, they'll pop their bubble and stand in it allowing you to shoot them and strip their barrier, when their barrier is down they'll be lifted + lash to detonate = dead phantom. You can smash them but only through walls so they don't have LOS to use their bubble.

Though I'll agree that it does have drawbacks it far from sucks.

Against ravagers you have to plant a singularity first, that will kill the swarmers that drop out and let smash hit the ravager, plus it will prime for a BE anyway.

-takes note on how it requires a different power to handicap the enemies first- hmm quit not sucky .....

[ChatmanJay]

Both are spam powers... I don't like either.

[oO Stryfe Oo]

It doesn't need any buffs to range or area of effect. Just drop the 'limited targets' thing and this power will be much better.

[ThatGuyThatPlaysThisGame]

ToLazy4Name wrote...

Air Quotes wrote...

Compared to Biotic Slash 

Smash: 

Only 8 meter range and cannot be extented compared to 20 meters that can be extended to 30 

Only 1.5 meters wide compared to 2 meters

Does LESS damage if you don't take the Barriers and Armor evo, but you have to forgo radius and more targets hit for it and the targets are limited to 3. It can't even one shot a bunch of swarmers.  

Phantoms block it all the time. So you risk going to that range and they freaking block it! 

The animation is absurdly long. You can roll in the mid-way of it, but still it's freaking long. No invicibility frames

Has the same CD as the Biotic Slash 

My suggestions - at LEAST 10-12 meter range, at LEAST 2 meters wide, unlimited number of targets hit, and it should stagger everyone who touches you in the beggining of the animation when you drop your whips to the ground. Dragoon whips do that. 

I agree with all of this, except the thing about Phantoms. You just need to understand the mechanics of power-blocking bubbles. You can hit them with powers, so long as the power isn't initiated while locked onto them. So, turn away from them so you don't lock on, THEN start Smash, and turn back to them before it finishes. This applies to all powers, and is especially effective with Grenades. 

-throws grenade at a wall to hit different enemy-
-phantom walks around corner and activates bubble-

Uh nope doesn't work.

[ToLazy4Name]

ThatGuyThatPlaysThisGame wrote...

ToLazy4Name wrote...

Air Quotes wrote...

Compared to Biotic Slash 

Smash: 

Only 8 meter range and cannot be extented compared to 20 meters that can be extended to 30 

Only 1.5 meters wide compared to 2 meters

Does LESS damage if you don't take the Barriers and Armor evo, but you have to forgo radius and more targets hit for it and the targets are limited to 3. It can't even one shot a bunch of swarmers.  

Phantoms block it all the time. So you risk going to that range and they freaking block it! 

The animation is absurdly long. You can roll in the mid-way of it, but still it's freaking long. No invicibility frames

Has the same CD as the Biotic Slash 

My suggestions - at LEAST 10-12 meter range, at LEAST 2 meters wide, unlimited number of targets hit, and it should stagger everyone who touches you in the beggining of the animation when you drop your whips to the ground. Dragoon whips do that. 

I agree with all of this, except the thing about Phantoms. You just need to understand the mechanics of power-blocking bubbles. You can hit them with powers, so long as the power isn't initiated while locked onto them. So, turn away from them so you don't lock on, THEN start Smash, and turn back to them before it finishes. This applies to all powers, and is especially effective with Grenades. 

-throws grenade at a wall to hit different enemy-
-phantom walks around corner and activates bubble-

Uh nope doesn't work.

The Phantom put the bubble up because someone else targeted it, then. I'm not the only one who can attest to what I stated working. 

[Bhatair]

ThatGuyThatPlaysThisGame wrote...

Bhatair wrote...

It's limited, yeah but I'd hardly say it sucks.

Don't use it on phantoms, for phantoms use singularity, they'll pop their bubble and stand in it allowing you to shoot them and strip their barrier, when their barrier is down they'll be lifted + lash to detonate = dead phantom. You can smash them but only through walls so they don't have LOS to use their bubble.

Though I'll agree that it does have drawbacks it far from sucks.

Against ravagers you have to plant a singularity first, that will kill the swarmers that drop out and let smash hit the ravager, plus it will prime for a BE anyway.

-takes note on how it requires a different power to handicap the enemies first- hmm quit not sucky .....

Smash isn't ideal to use against phatoms. It's much easier and more effecitve to use singularity + lash or either one of them since phantoms can be ragdolled.
Against ravagers it has potential to be very damaging but closing distance can be tough and as stated swarmers can absorb smash if you aren't careful.
But you should be laying down a singularity before smashing a boss anyway for the bonus damage from BEs so it isn't that big of a deal.

This is all about the smashdept though, the smashguard is a bit SOL, that and I just don't have much experience playing him on gold.

[ToLazy4Name]

Air Quotes wrote...

ToLazy4Name wrote...

Air Quotes wrote...

Compared to Biotic Slash 

Smash: 

Only 8 meter range and cannot be extented compared to 20 meters that can be extended to 30 

Only 1.5 meters wide compared to 2 meters

Does LESS damage if you don't take the Barriers and Armor evo, but you have to forgo radius and more targets hit for it and the targets are limited to 3. It can't even one shot a bunch of swarmers.  

Phantoms block it all the time. So you risk going to that range and they freaking block it! 

The animation is absurdly long. You can roll in the mid-way of it, but still it's freaking long. No invicibility frames

Has the same CD as the Biotic Slash 

My suggestions - at LEAST 10-12 meter range, at LEAST 2 meters wide, unlimited number of targets hit, and it should stagger everyone who touches you in the beggining of the animation when you drop your whips to the ground. Dragoon whips do that. 

I agree with all of this, except the thing about Phantoms. You just need to understand the mechanics of power-blocking bubbles. You can hit them with powers, so long as the power isn't initiated while locked onto them. So, turn away from them so you don't lock on, THEN start Smash, and turn back to them before it finishes. This applies to all powers, and is especially effective with Grenades. 

 

You can spam Nova and she won't block it. You can spam Phase Disruptor and she won't block it. And the lock-on mechanism is finicky. Even when you try not to look at them it still targets them sometimes. And 0.1 seconds is all she needs to block it. 

It doesn't matter if you're locked onto her AFTER you start using Smash, as long as when you initiate it you aren't locked on. If you say you've tried it and it doesn't work, you're either doing it wrong or you are just imagining it. 

[Poison_Berrie]

It could use quite a bit of DR while casting and perhaps a base number of targets of 3 and evolution taking it to 5 (to compensate for how lackluster that choice is).

That said, it hardly sucks and, as seems to be the norm with a lot of threads on these subjects (and with threads by you on the subject, if I recall correctly), the title of the thread is more of a (flame?) bait than an actual reality.

[Zaxares]

I don't think Smash sucks; it does an incredible amount of damage, but I do agree that it's generally outclassed by Biotic Slash. (I say generally because Biotic Slash does have a longer cast time and because you're using it from range, you're more likely to annoy snipers and headshotters on your team if you're spamming it near where they're standing.)

[ToLazy4Name]

Air Quotes wrote...

ToLazy4Name wrote...

Air Quotes wrote...

ToLazy4Name wrote...

Air Quotes wrote...

Compared to Biotic Slash 

Smash: 

Only 8 meter range and cannot be extented compared to 20 meters that can be extended to 30 

Only 1.5 meters wide compared to 2 meters

Does LESS damage if you don't take the Barriers and Armor evo, but you have to forgo radius and more targets hit for it and the targets are limited to 3. It can't even one shot a bunch of swarmers.  

Phantoms block it all the time. So you risk going to that range and they freaking block it! 

The animation is absurdly long. You can roll in the mid-way of it, but still it's freaking long. No invicibility frames

Has the same CD as the Biotic Slash 

My suggestions - at LEAST 10-12 meter range, at LEAST 2 meters wide, unlimited number of targets hit, and it should stagger everyone who touches you in the beggining of the animation when you drop your whips to the ground. Dragoon whips do that. 

I agree with all of this, except the thing about Phantoms. You just need to understand the mechanics of power-blocking bubbles. You can hit them with powers, so long as the power isn't initiated while locked onto them. So, turn away from them so you don't lock on, THEN start Smash, and turn back to them before it finishes. This applies to all powers, and is especially effective with Grenades. 

 

You can spam Nova and she won't block it. You can spam Phase Disruptor and she won't block it. And the lock-on mechanism is finicky. Even when you try not to look at them it still targets them sometimes. And 0.1 seconds is all she needs to block it. 

It doesn't matter if you're locked onto her AFTER you start using Smash, as long as when you initiate it you aren't locked on. If you say you've tried it and it doesn't work, you're either doing it wrong or you are just imagining it. 

 

It works. But under fire and in the thick of things it doesn't always work as desired. NovaGuard has no such problem. Slayer has no such problem. They will stagger and kill the ****es. 

Oh, I completely agree with you about how bad Smash and the Phoenix characters are, I was simply pointing out how to get around Power Bubbles because it's one of the few things Smash is good at doing.

[TheThirdSpectre]

Ledgend1221 wrote...

Nope.
It's fine.

This.