293 réponses à ce sujet

[zRz Tyr]

Saltyballz81 wrote...

Oh for f**k sake.

Head, meet wall, wall, meet head.

You sir, just explained BSN perfectly.

[tictactucrac]

Our_Last_Scene wrote...

Apl_J wrote...

Our_Last_Scene wrote...

Apl_J wrote...

Our_Last_Scene wrote...

That's not an argument, you'd have to show what's unique about organic life controlling electrical impulses.

This is not fantasy. This is sci-fi. Organics are not magic.

That's not expressly stated anywhere, but one can assume that a biotic has to do or think something different in order to get a Warp field or perform a Biotic Charge. Also consider that the Mass Effect Universe is not complete; we've only just gotten female Turians after all. So either the answer to OP is no, on account of what info we have, or the answer is indefinite, on account of what BioWare could do with the lore.

Machines, like Geth and EDI, can control their electrical impulses. We see this in the game.

Arguing about whether or not they are thinking is a completely different argument that has nothing to do with whether or not they can control their electrical impulses.

Arguing about how they think IS relevant. Organics can use biotics; that's an indisputable fact. They can also do something to control how their Biotics work, a la different Powers like Throw, Lift, Warp, etc. There's something in the process that gives them that ability that isn't stated anywhere. Until we know what exactly that is and whether or not machines can replicate that, then the answer can't be determined at this time OR is no, because it would have happened already.

They control it through electrical impulses from the brain. Like moving their arms and legs, speaking, thinking and reasoning.

Geth can do the same.

Saying that there might be some sort of extra secret thing is headcanon, and also closer to fantasy than sci-fi, so therefore is not relevant to the argument.

In other words, theorising that there might be something that isn't mentioned anywhere in the canon that stops Geth Biotics is not an argument against Geth Biotics.

Exactly what you do to explain geth biotic.

[Boceto]

tictactucrac wrote...

Saltyballz81 wrote...

Pikachu?

I refuse to converse with a child that mentions pokeman as a reference. How old are you? 12?

You just refuse to admit that this pikachu idea is as stupid as this geth biotic idea. Maybe could you prove me that an ezo-augmented mouse couldn't exist ?


"look at this child playing pokemon, brrrr, i am SO MATURE, I PLAY MASS EFFECT"

Seriously ?

I'm pretty sure that the point is that you're using it as a reference which makes no sense at all.

And an "ezo-augmented mouse" would be useless in combat. A biotic geth would be useful so it's certainly not as stupid as a biotic mouse.

Edit: By the way, don't you know anything to say about my previous posts?

Modifié par Boceto, 07 janvier 2013 - 04:51 .

[Bendigoe]

Liaratards.

/thread

[ashtrails]

I don't know, but don't you have to defend a theory, rather than have others prove it wrong?
You want to convince us, since, you know, you WANT something that's not there.
Anyone opposed doesn't have to prove anything, in fact.

But anyway, as we see in Rannoch's final missions, geth develop something that's acutally comparable to a brain.

There's no problem with Geth mimicing biotic powers.
Where a problem _could_ be is in the fact that Eezo cores need Eezo to sustain their performance. A biotic only needs food, no additional Eezo, as far as we can deduct from things seen and happening.
Also, depending on the power levels of the cores needed to evoke biotic-like abilities in Geth, a Geth 'Biotic' taken out could be a rather big risk in regards of friendly fire, collaterla damage etc.

Modifié par ashtrails, 07 janvier 2013 - 04:50 .

[tictactucrac]

Boceto wrote...

tictactucrac wrote...

Saltyballz81 wrote...

Pikachu?

I refuse to converse with a child that mentions pokeman as a reference. How old are you? 12?

You just refuse to admit that this pikachu idea is as stupid as this geth biotic idea. Maybe could you prove me that an ezo-augmented mouse couldn't exist ?


"look at this child playing pokemon, brrrr, i am SO MATURE, I PLAY MASS EFFECT"

Seriously ?

I'm pretty sure that the point is that you're using it as a reference which makes no sense at all.

And an "ezo-augmented mouse" would be useless in combat. A biotic geth would be useful so it's certainly not as stupid as a biotic mouse.

No, i'm sorry, it's not mentionned anywhere that an ezo-augmented mouse would be useless, so it's totally possible that it would be usefull, hmm. ( <- this is your way to argument, not mine, don't forget)

Modifié par tictactucrac, 07 janvier 2013 - 04:52 .

[Clayless]

tictactucrac wrote...

Our_Last_Scene wrote...

They control it through electrical impulses from the brain. Like moving their arms and legs, speaking, thinking and reasoning.

Geth can do the same.

Saying that there might be some sort of extra secret thing is headcanon, and also closer to fantasy than sci-fi, so therefore is not relevant to the argument.

In other words, theorising that there might be something that isn't mentioned anywhere in the canon that stops Geth Biotics is not an argument against Geth Biotics.

Exactly what you do to explain geth biotic.

Incorrect, I'm in fact arguing the complete opposite using evidence from canon.

I'm not arguing against something using evidence that isn't supported by canon, I'm arguing for something using evidence supported by canon.

It's up to you to show what's lore breaking about Geth Biotics, using evidence supported by canon.

Modifié par Our_Last_Scene, 07 janvier 2013 - 04:54 .

[Saltyballz81]

tictactucrac wrote...


"look at this child playing pokemon, brrrr, i am SO MATURE, I PLAY MASS EFFECT"

Seriously?

Yes, seriously. Surprised you have not surrendered yet...... *whistles

[tictactucrac]

Saltyballz81 wrote...

tictactucrac wrote...


"look at this child playing pokemon, brrrr, i am SO MATURE, I PLAY MASS EFFECT"

Seriously?

Yes, seriously. Surprised you have not surrendered yet...... *whistles

Then YOU obviously are 12. Period.

[Boceto]

tictactucrac wrote...

No, i'm sorry, it's not mentionned anywhere that an ezo-augmented mouse would be useless, so it's totally possible that it would be usefull, hmm.

Did you ever see a mouse in combat? No.
Did you ever see a geth in combat? Yes.

Only referring to the codex/wiki isn't enough. You've got a brain. Use it.

Modifié par Boceto, 07 janvier 2013 - 04:57 .

[Someone With Mass]

Oh, I'd like our geth biotic to be a Hopper.

That'd be neat as hell.

[tictactucrac]

Our_Last_Scene wrote...

tictactucrac wrote...

Our_Last_Scene wrote...

They control it through electrical impulses from the brain. Like moving their arms and legs, speaking, thinking and reasoning.

Geth can do the same.

Saying that there might be some sort of extra secret thing is headcanon, and also closer to fantasy than sci-fi, so therefore is not relevant to the argument.

In other words, theorising that there might be something that isn't mentioned anywhere in the canon that stops Geth Biotics is not an argument against Geth Biotics.

Exactly what you do to explain geth biotic.

Incorrect, I'm in fact arguing the complete opposite using evidence from canon.

I'm not arguing against something using evidence that isn't supported by canon, I'm arguing for something using evidence supported by canon.

It's up to you to show the difference, using evidence supported by canon.

tl;dr : you're theorising something that isn't mentionned anywhere. (can you show me a quote from the codex/bioware saying that geth biotic IS (not could by some interpretation) possible ? You can't)

Modifié par tictactucrac, 07 janvier 2013 - 04:57 .

[Apl_Juice]

Our_Last_Scene wrote...

They control it through electrical impulses from the brain. Like moving their arms and legs, speaking, thinking and reasoning.

Geth can do the same.

Saying that there might be some sort of extra secret thing is headcanon, and also closer to fantasy than sci-fi, so therefore is not relevant to the argument.

In other words, theorising that there might be something that isn't mentioned anywhere in the canon that stops Geth Biotics is not an argument against Geth Biotics.

How could there possibly be a 'might' invlolved? Warp works by creating rapidly shifting mass effect fields that shread a target apart. You can't honestly think that sort of action is autonomous as moving your arms and legs. How would think that into happening? And why would Biotics meditate as a part of their training if its as simple as moving? That isn't headcannon, at worst its a solid theory based on evidence in the Codex, which is all anyone can do when disputing lore.

Also, look at it form a game perspective. We don't already have Geth Biotics and Biotic Weapons because one of the most important aspects of being a Biotic is rarity. You're either Asari, or your parents were involved in a freak accident. If Biotics could be mass produced, then they'd lose a LOT of what makes it special.

Modifié par Apl_J, 07 janvier 2013 - 04:58 .

[Bendigoe]

Saltyballz81 wrote...

tictactucrac wrote...


"look at this child playing pokemon, brrrr, i am SO MATURE, I PLAY MASS EFFECT"

Seriously?

Yes, seriously. Surprised you have not surrendered yet...... *whistles

Please don't use Pokemon as a measure of maturity. I'm 20 in a weeks time, plenty mature, and plan to play Pokemon for the rest of my adult life. 
In fact a persons game preference is a very poor example of maturity anyway.

Anyways, the point i'm trying to make is you're both using Liara as you're avatar on BSN and from what i've seen it does wonders for your Intelligence.

Modifié par Bendigoe, 07 janvier 2013 - 05:01 .

[tictactucrac]

Boceto wrote...

tictactucrac wrote...

No, i'm sorry, it's not mentionned anywhere that an ezo-augmented mouse would be useless, so it's totally possible that it would be usefull, hmm.

Did you ever see a mouse in combat? No.
Did you ever see a geth in combat? Yes.

Only referring to the codex/wiki isn't enough. You've got a brain. Use it.

Did you ever see a biotic geth in combat? No.

Codex > your brain. Sorry man.

The Codex says.
Your brain interprets.

The codex doesn't say anything about biotic geth. (while it explains for every other species)
You brain interpret that since it doesn't say anything, it's possible.

Modifié par tictactucrac, 07 janvier 2013 - 05:04 .

[Saltyballz81]

Then YOU obviously are 12. Period.

Nope, 32. And the fact you didn't get my tongue in cheek jibe confirms my previous point.

On an unrelated point, my young (8) daughter wants to know will you trade some cards with her?

[Boceto]

tictactucrac wrote...

Our_Last_Scene wrote...

tictactucrac wrote...

Our_Last_Scene wrote...

They control it through electrical impulses from the brain. Like moving their arms and legs, speaking, thinking and reasoning.

Geth can do the same.

Saying that there might be some sort of extra secret thing is headcanon, and also closer to fantasy than sci-fi, so therefore is not relevant to the argument.

In other words, theorising that there might be something that isn't mentioned anywhere in the canon that stops Geth Biotics is not an argument against Geth Biotics.

Exactly what you do to explain geth biotic.

Incorrect, I'm in fact arguing the complete opposite using evidence from canon.

I'm not arguing against something using evidence that isn't supported by canon, I'm arguing for something using evidence supported by canon.

It's up to you to show the difference, using evidence supported by canon.

tl;dr : you're theorising something that isn't mentionned anywhere. (can you show me a quote from the codex/bioware saying that geth biotic IS (not could by some interpretation) possible ? You can't)

Combine what is known. We know that humans can use biotics because they've got certain implants. Geth could use implants. They could use implants that make them able to use biotics.

[Someone With Mass]

tictactucrac wrote...

No, i'm sorry, it's not mentionned anywhere that an ezo-augmented mouse would be useless, so it's totally possible that it would be usefull, hmm. ( <- this is your way to argument, not mine, don't forget)

It's mentioned that the geth are known to be technologically adept, however.

[snarf001]

Geth don't use biotics because it's against their religion and they'll go to a place devoid of all metalic pleasures in the afterlife.

[Boceto]

tictactucrac wrote...

Boceto wrote...

tictactucrac wrote...

No, i'm sorry, it's not mentionned anywhere that an ezo-augmented mouse would be useless, so it's totally possible that it would be usefull, hmm.

Did you ever see a mouse in combat? No.
Did you ever see a geth in combat? Yes.

Only referring to the codex/wiki isn't enough. You've got a brain. Use it.

Did you ever see a biotic geth in combat? No.

Codex > your brain. Sorry man.

The Codex says.
Your brain interprets.

And yet a biotic geth would be possible, just like a biotic mouse. But as I said, a biotic mouse would be useless in combat (now don't tell me it could be useful, it just couldn't, it's brain isn't even advanced enough to use those biotics effectively).
And does this means you refuse to use your brain?

[Striker93175]

tictactucrac wrote...

Boceto wrote...

Striker93175 wrote...

Lets not also forget ME 1 and 2 and all of 3 had 0, zip, nada biotic geth. So we want to create something that never has existed, has nothing to do with the main game?

Lets just spawn giant yellow tech big bird characters and a biotic blue cookie monster throwing characters while we're pulling crap outta of our arses.

I personally want to play as pikachu killing some reapers. "It's not against lore?!"
I know! I want to play as Gundam Heavyarms. "It's not against lore?!"
BETTER YET! Let me play as a Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtle. Bam, theres 4 DLC characters right there... Leo, Donny, Raph, and Michelangelo

Biotic geth is just stupid I'm sorry. It makes as much sense as the suggestions mentioned above.

A biotic Geth is possible and still missing, that's why we want to create it. If Cerberus didn't have any snipers we would request them as well. A Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtle wouldn't make sense and be totally random (as you said), it's not like a biotic Geth.

I'm sorry, a turtle trained by ninjas and with ezo implants is lore friendly, it's possible. A yellow-painted mouse with omni-tool and overload power is lore-friendly, pikachu is lore friendly.

Seriously, please, stop being stupid, stop interpreting the lore.

[SKhalazza]

tictactucrac wrote...

"Biotic abilities are of varying rarity and status in other species:
Asari - All asari are naturally biotic to some degree, and though not all choose to develop their abilities, those who do pursue training usually display formidable ability. They do not require implants to use biotics effectively, nor do they need to undergo special training to acquire conscious neural control; their reproductive physiology grants them this ability from birth. Biotic ability is mandatory for asari who want to go into military service. The most powerful train as asari commandos.
Batarians - There are some known batarian biotics who are trained as shock troopers and sentinels.
Collectors - All Collectors have a latent biotic potential which is activated if the Collector General takes control of their body and mind, transforming them into powerful and dangerous opponents.
Drell - The drell assassin Thane Krios is a biotic. It is unknown how widespread drell biotics are.
Krogan - The few krogan biotics are extremely powerful and often train to become krogan battlemasters like Skarr or Wrex. Before the genophage, biotic krogan who enlisted in the military would rise quickly through the ranks; the other soldiers were in fear and awe of them, so their superiors recognized they would command great respect as officers and promoted them. The krogan developed a surgical procedure that was able to confer biotic ability, but the operation had a high mortality rate, so it was discontinued following the release of the genophage.
Protheans - Javik is a Prothean biotic. It is unknown how widespread Prothean biotics were before their extinction.
Quarians - According to Tali, quarian biotics are very rare. It is speculated that this is due to their life aboard the Migrant Fleet. Element zero is such a rare resource that it is probably too precious to be "spent" on encouraging biotic potential in quarians, and because the quarians live aboard ships, any engine accident severe enough to release dust-form element zero would also be fatal to the crew.
Rachni - Rachni Brood Warriors appear to have some biotic abilities.
Salarians - Salarian biotics are unusual and highly prized. The salarian military does not risk them in the front lines but instead uses them in intelligence services.
Turians - Turian biotics are also uncommon, and generally not much more powerful than a human L3. They are viewed with suspicion by the general turian infantry and tend to be relegated to special units called Cabals, which are employed for key missions.
To date, there has been no mention of the biotic abilities of the hanar, elcor, raloi, volus, vorcha, or yahg or what role (if any) biotics play in their respective societies."


Where is Geth ? Oh, nowhere.

End of a line.

Hum, where are volus ? 

[Enhanced]

Geth Bombers aren't officially part of the lore yet, but anyone else ever wonder how they hover and move in the air? Hmm...

Modifié par Enhanced, 07 janvier 2013 - 05:08 .

[Pyroninja42]

Oh my god.

I've created a monster.

[Clayless]

Apl_J wrote...

Our_Last_Scene wrote...

They control it through electrical impulses from the brain. Like moving their arms and legs, speaking, thinking and reasoning.

Geth can do the same.

Saying that there might be some sort of extra secret thing is headcanon, and also closer to fantasy than sci-fi, so therefore is not relevant to the argument.

In other words, theorising that there might be something that isn't mentioned anywhere in the canon that stops Geth Biotics is not an argument against Geth Biotics.

How could there possibly be a 'might' invlolved? Warp works by creating rapidly shifting mass effect fields that shread a target apart. You can't honestly think that sort of action is autonomous as moving your arms and legs. How would think that into happening? And why would Biotics meditate as a part of their training if its as simple as moving? That isn't headcannon, at worst its a solid theory based on evidence in the Codex, which is all anyone can do when disputing lore.

Also, look at it form a game perspective. We don't already have Geth Biotics and Biotic Weapons because one of the most important aspects of being a Biotic is rarity. You're either Asari, or your parents were involved in a freak accident. If Biotics could be mass produced, then they'd lose a LOT of what makes it special.

How would you think a Warp? With electrical impulses to manipulate dark energy, controlled by the brain. Why do Biotics meditate? To gain a greater control of their biotics (see: Someone who can move and someone who spends time training to gain greater control over their movements, like a gymnast).

You have to show whats difference in electrical impulses controlled by an organic and one controlled by a synthetic. That is what we are arguing.

Saying that they might control it differently, that there is something different about electrical impulses based on how it's controlled, isn't an argument against Geth Biotics, as there's nothing in the entire universe to suggest that.

Saying that they're rare in organics, and that makes them special, is just perception and opinion, not an argument against Geth Biotics.

Modifié par Our_Last_Scene, 07 janvier 2013 - 05:10 .