122 réponses à ce sujet

[Chaia]

Fnork wrote...

I don't see why you'd need to kill off Shep to end that story. I'm all for different endings, different strokes for different folks but I do think his finest hour should consist of a little more than limping towards Tim's hissy fit before croaking himself.

Ha yeah, my thoughts exactly. I, personally, didn't find Shep's last few moments particularly heroic. 

Its the last game in Shep's trilogy. This is it. End of the line. If they want him to live or die, so what? Its not going to effect a player anymore then anther player chooseing a difference LI etc. 

[garrusfan1]

Actually I think they should have choices. I think I you work your a** off you should be able to get Shepard to live but they should make it hard so it feels like it mattered. But if I had to choose one I would choose shep living everytime I mean come on Shepard already died once let shep enjoy life after he beats the reapers.

[in it for the lolz]

It should be up to the player if Shepard dies or not.

[a load of stanton]

yes but i wish he fired the crucible more epicly

[ElectronicPostingInterface]

Should Shepard die or not?

I don't know, should Shepard be able to pick synthesis or control?

Should depend on your choices, like everything else in this supposedly non-linear game with individual canons.

[Constipator369]

Yes, he should and he did in almost all cases. ME, ME2 and ME3 was the trilogy about Shepard. It's finished (not counting the upcoming DLCs). Let Shep rest in peace.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

majinstrings wrote...
Shepard died on the SR1...just came back to do one last thing...

Just like Gandalf.

[3DandBeyond]

john_sheparrd wrote...

What choice is better? A heroic death is also nice but settling down with LI after the war also..
I can't decide.. What do you think?

My preference is as it has always been-both should have existed and there should have been ways to get both.  I do think that there should never have been a choice, but rather an outcome at the end.  I think certain decisions and actions should have led to things that ultimately should just have happened.

And within the endings I believe there should have been multiple variations.  Very simply on the big question, reapers destroyed or not destroyed.  And then, various shades of all the rest.  Shepard could die, having to sacrifice self to destroy them, or die as the reapers win.  Or, Shepard could live (and kind of like refuse, but one that plays out), but only ends up seeing that everything is lost and the reapers will win.  Imagine how emotional that could have been to have Shepard be the last of those we know that is known to be left alive, giving a final speech-"we did everything we could to try and defeat them, but in the end it was not enough and the reapers are unstoppable now."  Then, cutscenes of fighting until the last bit of life is snuffed out.  I also saw it as something where Shepard might have to make decisions that were like on Virmire, where someone might die, even maybe someone close to Shepard (or in the Shepard dies, scenario), to win the fight. 

Along with that I thought that the fate of the galaxy could have also been up for grabs-a lot of ruin and death due to different factors, or even totally destroyed worlds, such as Earth, even in a reapers-lose scenario.

So, for me it wasn't only ever about a Shepard always lives ending, it was about different endings that showed different reasons for Shepard having to die or getting to live as the consequence of all that had been done in the games.  Forced suicide isn't great, but something like the Tuchanka bomb mission that was done really well where Victus (jr) did what he had to do because of his mistakes and the mistakes of other Turians.

And then I hoped for a true aftermath, where we see either the reapers leaving after winning, with worlds burning in the background, or people crying over the loss of Shepard, of worlds, or others, and beginning to pick up the pieces-say instead of that reaper variant scene at the end, the husk that gets shot by the Marine who starts helping others stand up, what if there was a scene of a Krogan reaching a hand to help up a Salarian? 

And if you got to the most difficult, full on win ending, why not a scene of Shepard grabbing a handful of dirt on Rannoch or of a small blue hand reaching up to grasp Shepard's hand, along with scenes of Shepard spurring people on to work together and rebuild what was lost?

Modifié par 3DandBeyond, 09 janvier 2013 - 05:33 .

[mopotter]

In some of my games I expected Shepard to die. In other of my games I expected Shepard to survive with his crew and LI. In other games I expected Shepard to live and some crew die. I expected something like ME2 where I could make choices that reflected in the ending. I expected too much.

[3DandBeyond]

mopotter wrote...

In some of my games I expected Shepard to die. In other of my games I expected Shepard to survive with his crew and LI. In other games I expected Shepard to live and some crew die. I expected something like ME2 where I could make choices that reflected in the ending. I expected too much.

Yes, this.  If I had one good, hard to get ending that did exist-a full on win and survival, I'd find sacrificial ones and even a full on lose to the reapers ending to be a lot more fun.

[DeinonSlayer]

in it for the lolz wrote...

It should be up to the player if Shepard dies or not.

It is. The presentation is just wonky.

[Ajensis]

I would've been okay with Shepard either surviving or dying, if only it had been done right. Preferably, though, the option to get both outcomes, like others have suggested.

Ultimately, it's BioWare's story. Sure, it would be great if they'd created something along the lines of the first Dragon Age or Mass Effect 2, where previous actions made a difference and lead to different endings, but they chose not to. That's their decision. I just at least expected it to be executed properly. *sigh*

[AlanC9]

DeinonSlayer wrote...

in it for the lolz wrote...

It should be up to the player if Shepard dies or not.

It is. The presentation is just wonky.

Yep.

[Steelcan]

No

[in it for the lolz]

DeinonSlayer wrote...

in it for the lolz wrote...

It should be up to the player if Shepard dies or not.

It is. The presentation is just wonky.

And stupid, dont forget stupid.

[mopotter]

3DandBeyond wrote...

mopotter wrote...

In some of my games I expected Shepard to die. In other of my games I expected Shepard to survive with his crew and LI. In other games I expected Shepard to live and some crew die. I expected something like ME2 where I could make choices that reflected in the ending. I expected too much.

Yes, this.  If I had one good, hard to get ending that did exist-a full on win and survival, I'd find sacrificial ones and even a full on lose to the reapers ending to be a lot more fun.

Would have made it more fun for me and also a lot more re-playable.  It's the first BioWare game I only replayed a couple of times.

[Robhuzz]

No I don't think he should. Other people like the story better when Shepard kicks the bucket in the end. I do not. That's why I'm all for choice. There should have been at least one ending in which Shepard visibly survives, and one in which he is most definitely a goner. And lots of stuff in between depending on earlier choices. As in...what was promised when they advertised ME3.

Modifié par Robhuzz, 09 janvier 2013 - 06:03 .

[movieguyabw]

It should be the player's choice. Similar to how it was with Dragon Age Origins (damn, I love that game) we should have been presented with the choice to live or die, as opposed to a "Oh, you die in every ending." sort of thing. Yeah, we can survive in the Destroy ending, and (depending on how you interpret it) the Control ending, but we're still told flat out that both options will kill us, so we really can't choose to live, without metagaming.

Of course, the life/death choice would've come at a cost (again, as Dragon Age Origins had it), but nothing so steep as genocide.

[VintageUtti]

LDS Darth Revan wrote...

majinstrings wrote...
Shepard died on the SR1...just came back to do one last thing...

Just like Gandalf.

Yeah but Gandalf got to sail off into the sunset.

[knightnblu]

Frankly, I never expected Shepard to survive the Reapers. He was just one guy and they were virtual Gods. The fact that he managed to beat them again and again was a miracle and had Cerberus not brought him back for ME2 his story would have ended early.

I expected some dire situation where he had two choices, sacrifice himself or let the Reapers win. Turns out I was wrong and the Reapers just gave up because Shep was such a nice guy. Guess you could say that he killed them with kindness. While that is a gross oversimplification of what transpired, it is never the less accurate.

I suppose that one could say that Shepard giving up his energy (whatever that means) in control and synthesis would constitute a personal sacrifice, but it feels...strange if you do it. The sacrifice in destroy is more to what I was thinking, but he just walks up, shoots the power transfer thingy, and boom! Game over.

Regardless of the OE or the EC you don't actually have to do anything, but show up and presto! You win. Thanks for playing, now go and kill yourself. That is what has been sticking in my craw ever since March when I was presented with that "artistic" ending cooked up by Hudson and Waters. Did they have a right to do it? Absolutely, but I am under no obligation to like it. The EC corrected many of my beefs with the ending, but not all of them. However, I just have to live with what we have now.

That anti-climactic ending is what grates. I fought all over the galaxy, killed I don't know how many bad guys, lost friends that I cared about, and fought my guts out on Earth just to show up and be handed a win by the big bad guy who had been trying desperately to kill me since ME1, succeeded in ME2 only to have to try to kill me again in ME3 because Cerberus found a way to reverse biological death. So in my view, the ending where Shep just offs himself for the greater good after making nice with the villain is a tease and not a good tease either.

It is that tease and unnatural comfort that Shepard apparently feels with the Catalyst that makes me feel greasy about the ending. Almost as if I needed a shower after the game congratulated me for completing ME3 and then exhorting me to purchase DLC to "continue the legend." But I digress and am getting off topic.

I doubt that anyone here really expected Shepard to pull off another win like when he emerged from the rubble at the end of ME1 with that smile on his face. Sooner or later your luck runs out. The breath scene at the end of destroy is nice, but I think that we are in reality witnessing Shepard's final breath as his soul is re-claimed by the angel of death. I think that letting Shepard survive ME3 is a cop out.

That's my .02.

[Dr_Extrem]

we should have the opportunity to decide this.

dragon age showed, that it is possible without being sappy. the hero who sacrifices him/herself fot the good of the galaxy and the survivin hero, who lives on happy, are different sides of the same clishé-medal. 


personal note:
imo, the surviving, beaten destroy-shepard is the most tragic in mass effect 3. he/she will have to live in the universe that was altered by his/her decision.

nobody questiones a dead hero - but the survivor will get the broadside, if shepard tells the world(s) what happened on the citadel. the surviving aliens will have questions, why the relays are gone and they will not see their homeworlds within their lifetimes again. this is bitter - especially for the quarians who just regained their home.

if shepard remains silent, one question will bug him/her for all time - "did i made the right decision?"


my shepard would survive everytime. to me. the interesting part is, how she will live with the consequences of her actions. will she seek help and therapy? will she ever be able to go on? is a return to active duty possible? how will her friends react? some of my shepards will get over it (barely), some will break under the pressure (and end up in the gutter) and some will return to duty (with the li at her side). this is fertile soil for fan fiction.

[Enhanced]

movieguyabw wrote...

It should be the player's choice. Similar to how it was with Dragon Age Origins (damn, I love that game) we should have been presented with the choice to live or die, as opposed to a "Oh, you die in every ending." sort of thing. Yeah, we can survive in the Destroy ending, and (depending on how you interpret it) the Control ending, but we're still told flat out that both options will kill us, so we really can't choose to live, without metagaming.

Of course, the life/death choice would've come at a cost (again, as Dragon Age Origins had it), but nothing so steep as genocide.

Actually, the Catalyst didn't  flat out say that Shepard would die if he chooses Destroy. He implies that Shepard could die when he says:

"The crucible will not discriminate. All synthetics will be targeted. Even you are partly synthetic"

then he says this when you ask for more details:
 
"Technology you rely on will be affected, but those who survive should have little difficulty repairing the damage." 

Modifié par Enhanced, 09 janvier 2013 - 06:34 .

[Dr_Extrem]

Enhanced wrote...

"Technology you rely on will be affected, but those who survive should have little difficulty repairing the damage." 

the catalyst does not talk about how long it will take though.


we will master the technology - but it will take time.

even if we can understand the relay technology, it will take years to reverse engineer and repair the relays. the protheans managed it, but they were pouring unlimited resources into the project. ilos' only purpose was scientific research and development. we only have whats left on the homeworlds and many bright minds have died. 

after we rebuild the first relay, we will have to travel to ne next one. relays only work as a pair. this will take a long time and planning. we would need to stop every x lightyears to discharge and refuel. this can only be done in systems, with helium-3 and planets with a sufficent magnetophere.


we will make it - but it will take centuries or millennia.

[AlanC9]

movieguyabw wrote...

It should be the player's choice. Similar to how it was with Dragon Age Origins (damn, I love that game) we should have been presented with the choice to live or die, as opposed to a "Oh, you die in every ending." sort of thing. Yeah, we can survive in the Destroy ending, and (depending on how you interpret it) the Control ending, but we're still told flat out that both options will kill us, so we really can't choose to live, without metagaming.

I agree that Shepard doesn't have any reason to think he'll live whatever he chooses, regardless of what happens later.. But I don't see the problem with that. Can you elaborate?

[3DandBeyond]

Dr_Extrem wrote...

we should have the opportunity to decide this.

dragon age showed, that it is possible without being sappy. the hero who sacrifices him/herself fot the good of the galaxy and the survivin hero, who lives on happy, are different sides of the same clishé-medal. 


personal note:
imo, the surviving, beaten destroy-shepard is the most tragic in mass effect 3. he/she will have to live in the universe that was altered by his/her decision.

nobody questiones a dead hero - but the survivor will get the broadside, if shepard tells the world(s) what happened on the citadel. the surviving aliens will have questions, why the relays are gone and they will not see their homeworlds within their lifetimes again. this is bitter - especially for the quarians who just regained their home.

if shepard remains silent, one question will bug him/her for all time - "did i made the right decision?"


my shepard would survive everytime. to me. the interesting part is, how she will live with the consequences of her actions. will she seek help and therapy? will she ever be able to go on? is a return to active duty possible? how will her friends react? some of my shepards will get over it (barely), some will break under the pressure (and end up in the gutter) and some will return to duty (with the li at her side). this is fertile soil for fan fiction.

This so much.  I always think that the after effects of the actions are really under-played by people and Destroy is the same.  Shepard must live after doing something s/he hated (my Shepard would hate it) and after altering everything, not just the state of the galaxy, tech-wise, but the relationships between synthetics and organics.  Wanna build trust, then don't totally destroy one or the other.  It solves for a time the problem as the kid sees it, but it sets up that problem as totally inevitable. 

Organics will know they survived and that synthetics did not-that will forever be a part of their shared history.  And organics will have a form of survivor's guilt (that kind of thing exists today).  Some people get this and become hostile towards those who suffered loss-so organics who survived might fear synthetics that will be created even more, thinking they will look for revenge.  And synthetics may find out that organics are not all broken up that synthetics died so they could live.  I think it truly is a tragic ending in many ways.  And I have problems with the others as well that make them equally disturbing to me.