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[That one guy with the face]

Whatever Fallout 4 will be, don't include the Lone Wanderer.

[naughty99]

That one guy with the face wrote...

Whatever Fallout 4 will be, don't include the Lone Wanderer.

I don't see how it could be the same character from FO3. 

I think we will start out in a vault again, or maybe a robot factory?

[FlyingSquirrel]

It would be hard to "import" a Lone Wanderer from FO3 the way Mass Effect games do with Shepard. Depending on your choices, you could be anything from the selfless idealist who purified the Potomac, drove out the Enclave, disarmed Megaton's nuke, and helped write a life-saving Wasteland Survival Guide to the psychopath who poisoned the Wasteland, bombed the Brotherhood of Steel, and blew up Megaton for caps.

[naughty99]

FlyingSquirrel wrote...

It would be hard to "import" a Lone Wanderer from FO3 the way Mass Effect games do with Shepard. Depending on your choices, you could be anything from the selfless idealist who purified the Potomac, drove out the Enclave, disarmed Megaton's nuke, and helped write a life-saving Wasteland Survival Guide to the psychopath who poisoned the Wasteland, bombed the Brotherhood of Steel, and blew up Megaton for caps.

I also think the kind of "repeat leveling from zero" that you see with linear game sequels would be pretty bizarre in a sandbox game like this.

I suppose you could have the lone wanderer get shot in the head, etc., and recover from zero with no memory of previous skills, but it would seem really contrived. Considering we started from playing as a toddler in FO3, I'm guessing we will start at least as some sort of new vault refugee, or some similar non-veteran character.

Modifié par naughty99, 07 février 2013 - 07:46 .

[That one guy with the face]

naughty99 wrote...

I also think the kind of "repeat leveling from zero" that you see with linear game sequels would be pretty bizarre in a sandbox game like this.

I suppose you could have the lone wanderer get shot in the head, etc., and recover from zero with no memory of previous skills, but it would seem really contrived. Considering we started from playing as a toddler in FO3, I'm guessing we will start at least as some sort of new vault refugee, or some similar non-veteran character.

Have you played Fallout: New Vegas?

[rjshae]

I'm hoping the protagonish will be an escapee from an underground clone factory.

[chunkyman]

naughty99 wrote...

chunkyman wrote...

I hope hardcore mode is included and heavily expanded upon.

I hope so too, but wouldn't hold my breath. My guess is it will probably only be available with mods.

They probably have some kind of metric that says only X% of players used hardcore mode.

But.... But.... I can't go back to regular mode! 

I tried regular mode recently, and it feels ...wrong. Hardcore mode adds so much to the game. I'm a console player so I can't just mod it, either...

I pray to Todd that they don't water everything down just because something might not be super popular.

Modifié par chunkyman, 09 février 2013 - 04:35 .

[sympathy4sarenreturns]

I'm going to play my first run of Fallout 4 on hardcore mode, if they still have it. I hope its more challenging then in New Vegas.

I'm also refining what type of character I want to have. In the middle of New Vegas now, and getting some ideas.

I'm going to go with a Lockpicking, Small Weapons, Speech and Explosives focus. I'm not sure yet how I'll roleplay, but that'll be the stat focus. Gonna do a concentrated build.

Science needs revamped...and I want there to be a huge world with factions and unique "dungeons" and beast liars. Up the enemy HP a lot and give them unique, appropriate criticals...even one-hitter quitters. And realistic lighting tech with pitch black lairs so I can add flashlight attachments. Same awesome looting (isn't it a blast to loot in Bethesda games?) but fully upgradable and customizable weapons and flashlight attachment for all. Fallout would do well to continue to improve on the horror feeling of deep lairs.

Centaur lair. Highly deadly and with tenacle grab and digestion of face as instakill critical...or 400 DAM to player character. Other high potent attacks. Pitch black. Flashlight only.

Yes please. Of course, I'm not asking it become survival horror. Just a stronger blend of it would go nice and neat. I want a high level cap that is soft and impossible to max in 70 hours....and I hope we can get a more clear and decisive crafting system. KEEP ATTRIBUTES!!!! No removing S.P.E.C.I.A.L.. And yes...new creatures and creative quests.

[naughty99]

That one guy with the face wrote...

naughty99 wrote...

I also think the kind of "repeat leveling from zero" that you see with linear game sequels would be pretty bizarre in a sandbox game like this.

I suppose you could have the lone wanderer get shot in the head, etc., and recover from zero with no memory of previous skills, but it would seem really contrived. Considering we started from playing as a toddler in FO3, I'm guessing we will start at least as some sort of new vault refugee, or some similar non-veteran character.

Have you played Fallout: New Vegas?

Hehe, yes, that was my point. If they do it a second time, it would feel contrived.

I don't think the protagonist will be the Lone Wanderer or the Courier. Maybe he will be a prisoner this time ;-)

[That one guy with the face]

^Van Buren.

[Addai]

sympathy4sarenreturns wrote...

Science needs revamped...and I want there to be a huge world with factions and unique "dungeons" and beast liars. Up the enemy HP a lot and give them unique, appropriate criticals...even one-hitter quitters. And realistic lighting tech with pitch black lairs so I can add flashlight attachments. Same awesome looting (isn't it a blast to loot in Bethesda games?) but fully upgradable and customizable weapons and flashlight attachment for all. Fallout would do well to continue to improve on the horror feeling of deep lairs.

You should probably moderate your expectations.  Bethesda is unlikely to make Fallout more "hardcore," that is just not their design priority, for which I'm grateful.  Sorry, these things are just not a draw for me and would be a drawback.  Punish exploration too much and you take away half of what the game exists for.  These things can be added by mods for those who want them.

[naughty99]

Barbarossa2010 wrote...

The dramatic expansion of crafting/reloading from FONV.

Yes, would be great to see an expanded crafting system in the new game. Are there some really good crafting mods for NV you'd recommend? I tried a few that add new ammo schematics and let you break down clothing and armor into raw materials, but was looking for something huge.

By "reloading" did you mean changing the way ammo is reloaded?

[bussinrounds]

chunkyman wrote...



I pray to Todd that they don't water everything down just because something might not be super popular.

  You do know you're talking about the ppl who turned Fallout into a FPS, right ? 

[Barbarossa2010]

naughty99 wrote...

Barbarossa2010 wrote...

The dramatic expansion of crafting/reloading from FONV.

Yes, would be great to see an expanded crafting system in the new game. Are there some really good crafting mods for NV you'd recommend? I tried a few that add new ammo schematics and let you break down clothing and armor into raw materials, but was looking for something huge.

By "reloading" did you mean changing the way ammo is reloaded?

Anything that can be done at the reloading bench really. I liked being able to craft hand-loaded ammo (that usually provides a good DAM bonus) for my preferred weapons; and I really like becoming less dependent on merchants and drops/boxes for ammunition. It's just a cool mechanic that worked superbly in NV and was well thought out.  Recycling your casings and adding other components to the game (lead, powder and primer, [oh, and another use for scrap metal]), and being able to break down crap ammo into usable components to craft it into better ammo, was a great addition to FO imo. 

As far as recommending a crafting mod, I have Weapons Mods Expanded (WMX), which extends the mod slots on all weapons (including melee, energy, and percussion fired) to three, and dramatically expands the mods (many, which are actually useful) inventory for weapons.  There are more weapon mods added to merchant inventories and can be found in drops, or looted, with regularity across the course of the game.  

If I'm not mistaken (it has been awhile since I've been in NV), it also expands the weapons mods that can be crafted. For example, the machete gladius was my preferred melee weapon, as my backup insurance policy, and as I recall, WMX gave me the ability to do things like temper the blade, add a Gecko skin grip, and apply a universal sharpening kit, which gave a significant DAM bonus per swing, and reduced the rate of deterioration. Some of the components are hard to come by (whet stones?), so you have to be patient or work a bit for the bonuses.

Anyway, I would recommend it without hesitation.

Modifié par Barbarossa2010, 28 avril 2013 - 05:59 .

[AventuroLegendary]

Alright. Some people are going to hate me for this...

I think the new Fallout should take some directions from New Vegas in terms of writing. Fallout 3 was a great game but the writing and overall narrative didn't really move me. Heck, if you removed a good amount of the NPCs, it would still have the same amount of immersion. 

As for where the game should take place, I vote for something new from California/Nevada and the DC area. I heard the Boston area and think that would be okay.

Deciding the time of the game depends on what you want as a player. Do you want a dark, gritty, undeveloped world like Fallout 3 or a more "civilized" and advanced post-apocalyptic setting (Like an oppressive Dystopia). For the former, it should be set like 40 or 50 years after the war and for the latter, about 250 maybe, both with a few references to events in older games.

Fallout 3 being a barren and unexplored wasteland prior to the arrival of the Lone Wanderer made little sense in context of it being 200 years after the War.

EDIT: Wait, this is a necro. I should look before I post...

Modifié par LegendaryAvenger, 29 avril 2013 - 12:11 .

[Mendelevosa]

LegendaryAvenger wrote...

Alright. Some people are going to hate me for this...

I think the new Fallout should take some directions from New Vegas in terms of writing. Fallout 3 was a great game but the writing and overall narrative didn't really move me. Heck, if you removed a good amount of the NPCs, it would still have the same amount of immersion. 

As for where the game should take place, I vote for something new from California/Nevada and the DC area. I heard the Boston area and think that would be okay.

Deciding the time of the game depends on what you want as a player. Do you want a dark, gritty, undeveloped world like Fallout 3 or a more "civilized" and advanced post-apocalyptic setting (Like an oppressive Dystopia). For the former, it should be set like 40 or 50 years after the war and for the latter, about 250 maybe, both with a few references to events in older games.

Fallout 3 being a barren and unexplored wasteland prior to the arrival of the Lone Wanderer made little sense in context of it being 200 years after the War.

EDIT: Wait, this is a necro. I should look before I post...

Well Obsidian has expressed interest to develop New Vegas 2. If Fallout 4 does not borrow any elements from New Vegas, then expect NV2 to do so if it becomes a reality.

Modifié par Mendelevosa, 29 avril 2013 - 03:54 .

[FlyingSquirrel]

LegendaryAvenger wrote...
Fallout 3 being a barren and unexplored wasteland prior to the arrival of the Lone Wanderer made little sense in context of it being 200 years after the War.

It did sometimes feel like the war was more "recent" than that. On the other hand, I suppose it's likely that Washington, D.C. would have been hit by a *lot* of nukes in the war, and perhaps the population of survivors was so small that it took a long time for even small communities like Megaton, Rivet City, etc. to develop. In fact, I have to wonder whether many of the non-ghoul NPCs that we seen in FO3 are actually descended from "locals" or if most of their ancestors either came from inside the vaults or migrated to D.C. from other locations.

[Jaison1986]

Well, many rumors are saying that the next Fallout game might take place on the commonwealth, so you would expect a lot of androids and fancy scientists. I would like to see the game take notes from NV as I liked it more then FO3. perhaps with the Massachusetts wasteland being savage and brutal while the commonwealth head quarters is extremely advanced and preserved, similar to how New Vegas felt when compared to the Mojave wasteland.

[FlyingSquirrel]

Jaison1986 wrote...

Well, many rumors are saying that the next Fallout game might take place on the commonwealth, so you would expect a lot of androids and fancy scientists. I would like to see the game take notes from NV as I liked it more then FO3. perhaps with the Massachusetts wasteland being savage and brutal while the commonwealth head quarters is extremely advanced and preserved, similar to how New Vegas felt when compared to the Mojave wasteland.

I think both games had their good and bad points. FO3, for me, was more convincing in the way it put me into the role of a relatively "blank slate" character and let me shape his motivations and reactions the way I wanted. As a "Paragon" Lone Wanderer, I quickly found that the simple fact of the Wasteland's pervasive poverty and danger was more than enough reason for me to explore and get involved in situations that didn't directly relate to finding my father. I was kind of perplexed by the Courier, who is sort of a blank slate but presumably has been living and working in this area for a while and yet seems to have almost no prior knowledge of the NCR, the Legion, etc. The first time through, the character I was playing wasn't all that inclined to go chasing after Benny or the platinum chip and eventually went to New Vegas simply because the game clearly wasn't going to progress if I didn't.

On the other hand, the faction/reputation system and the writing of some of the NPCs added a greater sense of depth and consequence to many of the quests in NV. Something like making friends with the Boomers, or trying to help Veronica persuade the Brotherhood to get their heads out of the sand, can actually change who your allies are or how things work out for individual characters at the end. In FO3, you could probably skip over a lot more characters and locations without it making any real difference at the end. You can, for example, help the escaped slaves take over the Lincoln Memorial and bust the Little Lamplighters out of Paradise Falls, but you'll still run into random slavers and you don't get the sense that you've actually dealt a significant blow to the slave trade in general.

I'd like to see the faction/reputation system of NV mixed with FO3's approach to the player-character, at least if we are in fact going to be playing a blank slate character again.

[AventuroLegendary]

A courier making a living out in the Mojave can have many beginnings and experiences to mold their motivations and personality traits. Not much is known about them except that they were trying to make a living. They could have remained ignorant of the situation between the factions, being an on-the-go traveler whose only concerns are Radscorpions and raiders but that's up the gamer's interpretation. However, there is the Lonesome Road which kind of muddies up the background. Fallout 3, on the other hand, has the character grow up with an established background which completely knocks out any background story possibilities. 

I don't think the rantings about Fallout 3's "horrible" character development are really all that valid. People complain a lot about the LW deciding to be evil simply because the player wills it. The LW experienced their father, the leading example of a good human being in their life, decide to hightail it without even a minute's notice and, with a few exceptions, the other Vault dwellers decide to direct their irrational fear and anger towards the LW. Pretty compelling case for a cold, antagonistic Lone Wanderer.

Modifié par LegendaryAvenger, 30 avril 2013 - 12:40 .

[FlyingSquirrel]

LegendaryAvenger wrote...
A courier making a living out in the Mojave can have many beginnings and experiences to mold their motivations and personality traits. Not much is known about them except that they were trying to make a living. They could have remained ignorant of the situation between the factions, being an on-the-go traveler whose only concerns are Radscorpions and raiders but that's up the gamer's interpretation. However, there is the Lonesome Road which kind of muddies up the background. Fallout 3, on the other hand, has the character grow up with an established background which completely knocks out any background story possibilities. 

I guess I had the opposite reaction. While we see snippets of the LW's childhood, you're still free to shape the character's attitudes and motivations however you want, and you're discovering the ins and outs of the Wasteland at the same time as your character is. It didn't seem plausible that the Courier would know nothing at all about the NCR or the Legion, given that almost everyone you run into has an opinion about what's going on.

Also, I can attest from my own experience that I had trouble staying "in-character" for my first New Vegas playthrough - I was playing a "small-picture altruist" who was happy to help in whatever situations she came across, but distrustful of authority figures and not inclined to get involved in big political schemes. I kept waiting for some additional reason to go to New Vegas besides looking for Benny or the chip, both of which she'd have been inclined to avoid, but it never really happened. And while she didn't mind helping to fight off the Legion, she wouldn't have been willing to disconnect Mr. House if she'd known it would kill him. Again, I was forced to go "all in" with the NCR in a way that I felt didn't necessarily make sense, simply because the game required me to do so in order to get to the end.

FO3 allows you fewer choices in how the main plot plays out, but it does at least supply a reason for the railroading, i.e. the Enclave has fairly wide reach and is trying to kill you, regardless of your attitude towards the rest of the Wasteland. In NV, it seemed like both the NCR and the Legion would have just shrugged their shoulders if the Courier had simply decided to get out of Dodge.

[Barbarossa2010]

An amalgam of the best parts of FO3 and New Vegas in a different setting, with a few improvements and a nod toward some of the better mods, works well for me.

I've talked above about what I liked about NV, but one thing I would like to see re-invented in FO4 from FO3, is another environment as compelling and forbidding as the DC metro.

Modifié par Barbarossa2010, 30 avril 2013 - 11:37 .

[AventuroLegendary]

I'll concede to some of your points. I thought it was annoying how Legion players were actively discouraged, especially in Honest Hearts.

I think this is really just about personal experience more than anything. In Fallout 3, my character, an opportunistic engineer with a penchant for scavenging, was more or less pissed off by the fact that Dad decided to jump ship without so much as a "kkthnxbye" and that she had to hold her lunch in when dealing with the exemplar protectors of technology (She would have had an easier time working with their western cousins or even the outcasts, probably) to achieve a dream that was never hers.

:wizard:But meh. I'd prefer if the game had NV's style of storytelling with some adjustments that made all storyline paths just as fun and enjoyable, even if somewhat conflicting. 

Barbarossa2010 wrote...

An amalgam of the best parts of FO3 and New Vegas in a different setting, with a few improvements and a nod toward some of the better mods, works well for me.

I've talked above about what I liked about NV, but one thing I would like to see re-invented in FO4 from FO3, is another environment as compelling and forbidding as the DC metro.

For a game that had an interesting environment, the subways were kind of boring. First time around, they were fun to shoot up but then trotting them just became a chore. This isn't a Metro 2033 but I'd really like to see more effort being put to designing the different sections of the subway.

Modifié par LegendaryAvenger, 01 mai 2013 - 01:09 .

[Barbarossa2010]

The thing I remember most about the metro, was the difficulty of navigating it the first time through, constantly on edge because you just didn't know what to expect. Probably since FO3 was my first open world excursion that was perhaps a more magnified experienced for a noob than a seasoned vet.

On to another of your points, the thing about the Legion was that they were just not a compelling enough faction for me personally to even want to put the effort into joining and closing off (relatively speaking) so much of the game in doing so. After Nipton and your encounter with Vulpes, they were just too easy to hate, and little was experienced thereafter to give you pause to fined anything redeeming about them. They just seemed to become the default choice for an "evil" character. I don't think that was the intent, but that's the way it turned out for me.

So, yeah a little more work needs to be done to make all paths equally enjoyable. Something comparable to Stormcloak vs. Imperial works much better, where it's truly difficult to determine the rightness and wrongness of each group's actions. Even though I became a Stormcloak, I felt like a real $#!+ sometimes, like when taking down Whiterun (a community I adopted as my own) and deposing Queen's and Jarls across Skyrim, whom I truly had no beef with. Whereas in New Vegas, I felt the Legion existed only for me to annihilate. It was just too easy to despise them.

Having said that, I appreciated and enjoyed the factioning of New Vegas. Things like being able to stay loyal to the NCR, accomplish the mission, and still persuade the Great Khans to fight along side us was satisfying. Of course, it required a murder to do so, but that's the fun of it all. That's the kind of stuff that made New Vegas memorable for me.