142 réponses à ce sujet

[Celene II]

Some people respec because they made a mistake accidentally putting points into abilities they did not want to and wish to remove them.

Others repsec because their ideas did not pan out and now their character is broken

Both of those would seem to only need at most 2 potions oof respec. Because people would learn after 2. Allowing instant and unlimited respec just makes any thought about how you will build your character moot.


And a lot of people will abuse unlimited respec by creating a damage mage for this section then a healer for this cave, then a crowd control mage for this cave. Destroying any sort of replay.


So i implore you -  If you have a maker's sigh potion or anything like it either make only 2 of them or only have enough material to craft two of them. Anything more really takes all thought and skill in character building out of the game.

[addiction21]

How does what someone else does in their own singleplayer game effect you at all?

And why are you moaning about what other people could possibly do that would never affect you in any way?

[mr_afk]

No, please don't.

I'm not sure about you, but reaching your ideal setup takes a fair amount of respeccing and testing. Based on DA:O and DA2, the combat is mostly balanced so that different setups don't have a particular advantage from fight to fight.

There's no reason to prevent someone from switching from a damage mage if they want to. There's the re-playability of the different classes, specialisations, party-setup, and not to mention the story/choices - respecs won't destroy replay value.

The only thing that a limited number of respecs does is make it a lot harder to min-max, since abilities might not pan out as expected.


Anyhow, Maker's sighs cost money - which is enough disincentive to not respec needlessly. If you believe it takes out the thought/skill in character building, just limit yourself to 1-2.
That's what you had to do to maximise money anyway.

Modifié par mr_afk, 11 janvier 2013 - 06:13 .

[Shadow Fox]

addiction21 wrote...

How does what someone else does in their own singleplayer game effect you at all?

And why are you moaning about what other people could possibly do that would never affect you in any way?

[Urzon]

I'll have to disagree with you. Being able to respec, unlimitly, doesn't kill character character builds, and it doesn't stop people from putting just as much thought into them. It allows players to try different specs until they find one they are most comfortable with. If anything, it allows players to refine and and give even deeper thoughts into their character build.

I would also like to add, that it can give a character's story more depth as well. One of my Hawkes was a healer all throughout Act1, but after the Deep Roads disaster; he found his healing lacking compared to Ander's. Even more so after the battle with the Rock Wraith, where Carver almost lost his life the first time. So in Act2, he devoted alot of his time to the study of force magic. In Act3, after all the emotional turmoil of his mother's death, he turned to blood magic. He vowed to protect all those who were close to him, even at the cost of himself.

I wouldn't have been able to do that storyline without the ability to respec multiple times.

[nightscrawl]

addiction21 wrote...

How does what someone else does in their own singleplayer game effect you at all?

And why are you moaning about what other people could possibly do that would never affect you in any way?

This.

If you don't want to use a respec potion more than once or twice, or at all, that's fine for you. My using it 10 times in a row has no impact on your game whatsoever.

Urzon wrote...

I would also like to add, that it can give a character's story more depth as well. One of my Hawkes was a healer all throughout Act1, but after the Deep Roads disaster; he found his healing lacking compared to Ander's. Even more so after the battle with the Rock Wraith, where Carver almost lost his life the first time. So in Act2, he devoted alot of his time to the study of force magic. In Act3, after all the emotional turmoil of his mother's death, he turned to blood magic. He vowed to protect all those who were close to him, even at the cost of himself.

I wouldn't have been able to do that storyline without the ability to respec multiple times.

I like it! I've read of people using the mirror in the Black Emporium to change their looks throughout the game for similar RP reasons.

Modifié par nightscrawl, 11 janvier 2013 - 06:43 .

[Dhiro]

I'm not sure how changing your build to suit the situation is bad? It seems pretty close to what I'd call tactical gameplay.

Urzon wrote...

I would also like to add, that it can give a character's story more depth as well. One of my Hawkes was a healer all throughout Act1, but after the Deep Roads disaster; he found his healing lacking compared to Ander's. Even more so after the battle with the Rock Wraith, where Carver almost lost his life the first time. So in Act2, he devoted alot of his time to the study of force magic. In Act3, after all the emotional turmoil of his mother's death, he turned to blood magic. He vowed to protect all those who were close to him, even at the cost of himself.

I wouldn't have been able to do that storyline without the ability to respec multiple times.

Wow, I never thought of that! Sounds like something I'd like to try someday.

[Seuzie Weuzie]

I don't see what's wrong with the way it is right now. Maker's Sigh potions aren't free. People are still required to think about their builds. They may have a build that works right now but later down the road it might not be so effective and they may want to change it. You can't fault a player for not knowing after a few tries what the most efficient and effective set up is. Limiting the ability to respec would add needless strain and pressure to optimize your build by assuming you'll know what will work best.

[deuce985]

I disagree. Reasoning? The other posters covered it for me.

[Aldandil]

For my part, I don't like respeccs at all. Never use it. But it doesn't really matter to me what the limitations on them are, if it gives other people enjoyment. I do prefer if it's not something you come across all the time, hidden in the Black Emporium was pretty OK.

[esper]

Urzon wrote...

I'll have to disagree with you. Being able to respec, unlimitly, doesn't kill character character builds, and it doesn't stop people from putting just as much thought into them. It allows players to try different specs until they find one they are most comfortable with. If anything, it allows players to refine and and give even deeper thoughts into their character build.

I would also like to add, that it can give a character's story more depth as well. One of my Hawkes was a healer all throughout Act1, but after the Deep Roads disaster; he found his healing lacking compared to Ander's. Even more so after the battle with the Rock Wraith, where Carver almost lost his life the first time. So in Act2, he devoted alot of his time to the study of force magic. In Act3, after all the emotional turmoil of his mother's death, he turned to blood magic. He vowed to protect all those who were close to him, even at the cost of himself.

I wouldn't have been able to do that storyline without the ability to respec multiple times.

I generally don't respec, but let the sub-optimal be sub-optimal, but Wow, I never thought of using respec like that. That was brilliant, serah.

[Darth Krytie]

Urzon wrote...

I'll have to disagree with you. Being able to respec, unlimitly, doesn't kill character character builds, and it doesn't stop people from putting just as much thought into them. It allows players to try different specs until they find one they are most comfortable with. If anything, it allows players to refine and and give even deeper thoughts into their character build.

I would also like to add, that it can give a character's story more depth as well. One of my Hawkes was a healer all throughout Act1, but after the Deep Roads disaster; he found his healing lacking compared to Ander's. Even more so after the battle with the Rock Wraith, where Carver almost lost his life the first time. So in Act2, he devoted alot of his time to the study of force magic. In Act3, after all the emotional turmoil of his mother's death, he turned to blood magic. He vowed to protect all those who were close to him, even at the cost of himself.

I wouldn't have been able to do that storyline without the ability to respec multiple times.

I am getting an undeniable urge to play again because this is a really awesome thought. Is 12 playthroughs enough? I guess not.

[milena87]

I quite like the respec ability, as it can only add to the experience for a lot of people (also it's not mandatory, so you can totally skip it).

I always respec my character and the companions that I use the most as soon as possible. Having already a given set of abilities, skills or talents irks me, even if it make sense character wise.

[frustratemyself]

addiction21 wrote...

How does what someone else does in their own singleplayer game effect you at all?

And why are you moaning about what other people could possibly do that would never affect you in any way?

QFT

[Fisto The Sexbot]

addiction21 wrote...

How does what someone else does in their own singleplayer game effect you at all?

And why are you moaning about what other people could possibly do that would never affect you in any way?

Some people prefer challenges to be set by the game's rules rather than self-imposed.

[Femlob]

Celene II wrote...

Some people respec because they made a mistake accidentally putting points into abilities they did not want to and wish to remove them.

Others repsec because their ideas did not pan out and now their character is broken

Both of those would seem to only need at most 2 potions oof respec. Because people would learn after 2. Allowing instant and unlimited respec just makes any thought about how you will build your character moot.


And a lot of people will abuse unlimited respec by creating a damage mage for this section then a healer for this cave, then a crowd control mage for this cave. Destroying any sort of replay.


So i implore you -  If you have a maker's sigh potion or anything like it either make only 2 of them or only have enough material to craft two of them. Anything more really takes all thought and skill in character building out of the game.

These kinds of posts make me headdesk so hard that I'm surprised that I have a face left by this point.

There is absolutely no sensible reason to handicap players with arbitrary restrictions like these in a single player game. Not one. Under any circumstances. Ever. Nobody is holding a gun to your head and forcing you to respec your characters every five minutes; if you don't like it, don't use it.

If you lack the self-control nescessary to refrain from doing so - well, that's an entirely different problem best handled by the appropriate professionals.

Modifié par Femlob, 11 janvier 2013 - 10:46 .

[Fisto The Sexbot]

Femlob wrote...

Celene II wrote...

Some people respec because they made a mistake accidentally putting points into abilities they did not want to and wish to remove them.

Others repsec because their ideas did not pan out and now their character is broken

Both of those would seem to only need at most 2 potions oof respec. Because people would learn after 2. Allowing instant and unlimited respec just makes any thought about how you will build your character moot.


And a lot of people will abuse unlimited respec by creating a damage mage for this section then a healer for this cave, then a crowd control mage for this cave. Destroying any sort of replay.


So i implore you -  If you have a maker's sigh potion or anything like it either make only 2 of them or only have enough material to craft two of them. Anything more really takes all thought and skill in character building out of the game.

These kinds of posts make me headdesk so hard that I'm surprised that I have a face left by this point.

There is absolutely no sensible reason to handicap players with arbitrary restrictions like these in a single player game. Not one. Under any circumstances. Ever. Nobody is holding a gun to your head and forcing you to respec your characters every five minutes; if you don't like it, don't use it.

If you lack the self-control nescessary to refrain from doing so - well, that's an entirely different problem best handled by the appropriate professionals.

Creating a feature that rewards players and asking them not to use it if they don't want to is **** design. It's not that I'm so much against respeccing in Dragon Age 3 (I don't care), but if you were allowed to do so in games like the original Fallout series (where stats matter) it would be completely obtuse.

Modifié par Fisto The Sexbot, 11 janvier 2013 - 10:49 .

[AlexJK]

Fisto The Sexbot wrote...

Creating a feature that rewards players and asking them not to use it if they don't want to is **** design.

Difficulty levels.

[Femlob]

Fisto The Sexbot wrote...

Femlob wrote...

Celene II wrote...

Some people respec because they made a mistake accidentally putting points into abilities they did not want to and wish to remove them.

Others repsec because their ideas did not pan out and now their character is broken

Both of those would seem to only need at most 2 potions oof respec. Because people would learn after 2. Allowing instant and unlimited respec just makes any thought about how you will build your character moot.


And a lot of people will abuse unlimited respec by creating a damage mage for this section then a healer for this cave, then a crowd control mage for this cave. Destroying any sort of replay.


So i implore you -  If you have a maker's sigh potion or anything like it either make only 2 of them or only have enough material to craft two of them. Anything more really takes all thought and skill in character building out of the game.

These kinds of posts make me headdesk so hard that I'm surprised that I have a face left by this point.

There is absolutely no sensible reason to handicap players with arbitrary restrictions like these in a single player game. Not one. Under any circumstances. Ever. Nobody is holding a gun to your head and forcing you to respec your characters every five minutes; if you don't like it, don't use it.

If you lack the self-control nescessary to refrain from doing so - well, that's an entirely different problem best handled by the appropriate professionals.

Creating a feature that rewards players and asking them not to use it if they don't want to is **** design. It's not that I'm so much against respeccing in Dragon Age 3 (I don't care), but if you were allowed to do so in games like the original Fallout series (where stats matter) it would be completely obtuse.

Respec'ing, in whatever way, shape or form, is a feature that is simply there. Like weapons. And armor. And optional companions. It's up to the player to decide whether or not to make use of it. Asking the developers to remove a feature simply because you don't like it - or can't stop yourself from abusing it - is selfish and stupid.

[Fisto The Sexbot]

AlexJK wrote...

Fisto The Sexbot wrote...

Creating a feature that rewards players and asking them not to use it if they don't want to is **** design.

Difficulty levels.

Point being?

[AlexJK]

Difficulty levels are a feature which rewards players (by making the game easier). Yet there is an accepted challenge in not using the easy levels, and playing on harder ones.

Repecs are a feature which rewards players (by letting them change their skills). Yet there is an accepted challenge in not using them, and sticking with one spec.

If respec potions are bad feature because they offer an optional reward, then so are difficulty levels. I think most players would agree that difficulty levels are a good feature, allowing players of different skill levels and play styles to enjoy the game. Respecs allow players who want to respec to do so, and don't force players who don't want to respec to do anything other than play as they normally would.

How could this possibly be considered bad design?

Modifié par AlexJK, 11 janvier 2013 - 11:01 .

[Fisto The Sexbot]

Femlob wrote...

Fisto The Sexbot wrote...

Femlob wrote...

Celene II wrote...

Some people respec because they made a mistake accidentally putting points into abilities they did not want to and wish to remove them.

Others repsec because their ideas did not pan out and now their character is broken

Both of those would seem to only need at most 2 potions oof respec. Because people would learn after 2. Allowing instant and unlimited respec just makes any thought about how you will build your character moot.


And a lot of people will abuse unlimited respec by creating a damage mage for this section then a healer for this cave, then a crowd control mage for this cave. Destroying any sort of replay.


So i implore you -  If you have a maker's sigh potion or anything like it either make only 2 of them or only have enough material to craft two of them. Anything more really takes all thought and skill in character building out of the game.

These kinds of posts make me headdesk so hard that I'm surprised that I have a face left by this point.

There is absolutely no sensible reason to handicap players with arbitrary restrictions like these in a single player game. Not one. Under any circumstances. Ever. Nobody is holding a gun to your head and forcing you to respec your characters every five minutes; if you don't like it, don't use it.

If you lack the self-control nescessary to refrain from doing so - well, that's an entirely different problem best handled by the appropriate professionals.

Creating a feature that rewards players and asking them not to use it if they don't want to is **** design. It's not that I'm so much against respeccing in Dragon Age 3 (I don't care), but if you were allowed to do so in games like the original Fallout series (where stats matter) it would be completely obtuse.

Respec'ing, in whatever way, shape or form, is a feature that is simply there. Like weapons. And armor. And optional companions. It's up to the player to decide whether or not to make use of it. Asking the developers to remove a feature simply because you don't like it - or can't stop yourself from abusing it - is selfish and stupid.

Why do you assume 'I can't stop myself from abusing it'? I just prefer a balanced game difficulty that's set by the rules defining the game world. If there's an overpowered piece of armor in the game should I not complain about it because I'm not forced to use it? Should I say explosives in Arcanum were fair and balanced because you can wipe out entire towns with them?

[Sutekh]

Fisto The Sexbot wrote...

Creating a feature that rewards players and asking them not to use it if they don't want to is **** design.

That's a strange thought. How is giving people options a bad design?

There are lots of things in many games that "reward" players and one can use but choose not to for various reasons (consistent RPGing being one).

Plus, how is Maker's Sigh a "reward"? It's just an expensive potion hidden in an (optional / DLCish) store.

[Femlob]

Fisto The Sexbot wrote...

Why do you assume 'I can't stop myself from abusing it'?

Because you wouldn't be complaining about optional shit in a single player game if you could.

[daft inquisitor]

I was going to say something here, but between Alex and Femlob, I think they got it covered.