443 réponses à ce sujet

[EagleScoutDJB]

I don't know if I should admire or pity you guys for sticking with this so long. I'd love to see a real fix for the ending but I don't believe for a second it's ever going to happen, even if Bioware wants to do it EA has moved on and there is no money to make it happen.

Modifié par dbollendorf, 15 janvier 2013 - 05:28 .

[OfficerDjHooker]

MinatheBrat wrote...

iakus wrote...

Chris Priestly wrote...

We have said this many times, we are done with the ending of Mass Effect. While there is still DLC to come (I cannot go into details yet) we will not be making any "ending" DLC.

So many people asking for the same thing over many months.

You don't suppose ME3 might be missing something, do you?

Ha. Yes, well, they'll be missing me buying any SP DLC. I was hoping when I heard about this last mysterious dlc (last bit extinguished) that there would be something to it that would allow me to enjoy what had been my favorite series again and get excited over the previously released dlc, because I don't -and haven't since the EC- see the point playing any more of the SP as it stands. It's heartbreaking and depressing and the opposite of fun.
I'm sad. 

Me too  Can't believe it but may have to rely on mehem to get some type of good ending for shepard available

[Reth Shepherd]

dreamgazer wrote...

Reth Shepherd wrote...

Did you by chance make a copy of the listings at that point in time? If so, would you mind posting them, please? I'd love to run some comparisons! If not, oh well.

I don't, sorry.  All I remember is that it was a few weeks after Omega was released, and the ranking tiers were pretty much the same as they are now---either indicating that everything is performing with incredible consistency, or that there might be some issues with that method of evaluation. 

I don't doubt that the sales for Omega weren't stellar, and that it has something to do with the content's angle and price-point, but I also doubt that Leviathan didn't inch its way up higher on the rankings following holiday gifts and the 50% off sale. So, yeah. 

Ah well. Would have been interesting to see, but it's not like we can bookmark/screenshot everything. Thanks anyway.

Well, I can say for sure that there have been minor changes to the rankings, as evidenced by the differences between my and ABCoLD's posts about a month apart. (I can't remember if I linked his/hers, so here. Also, mine again.) Levi has indeed inched up the rankings in that month, though only by one, I think. There are also other minor changes, mostly ME3 MP DLC inching up a rank or two. Given that they haven't been completely static, I'm inclined to trust the numbers until such time as we have more evidence. Bear in mind that we only know Levi sold well during its first week or so. We don't know if the numbers dropped off after that, particularly as Omega proved the Puzzle Theory wrong.

[dreamgazer]

Reth Shepherd wrote...

Brovikk Rasputin wrote...

I can't believe some of you people are actually surprised by Priestly's post. How many times does he and Bioware have to say it?! Seriously.

If nothing else, because I'm surprised to see EA pass up a chance to get money out of customers. I would dearly love to know what's going on behind the scenes here. There has GOT to be something we're missing.

Production cost and return on investment, if I had to wager a guess, on top of not wanting to compromise their creative intent.  Hence why I think a post-ending expansion, which elaborates on the fate of the galaxy---and Shepard---while bridging the gap to the next ME game, would be a wise investment (see: Fallout 3's Broken Steel).

[Cutlass Jack]

Reth Shepherd wrote...

Ah, I see. Good point, and I suppose I can't really bring up solid numbers short of calling up Microsoft. (Which I might anyway, if only to see if I can wheedle Omega's numbers out of them.)

However, doesn't your own post support the idea that Ending DLC would sell well? Why purchase a DLC if it ultimately affects nothing? But since by definition an Ending DLC DOES change how things turn out, wouldn't that give people a reason to purchase it? Particularly if it was a new ending branch (yeah, I know, I'm dreaming here) instead of just 'press this button to avoid the Catalyst'? For example: Ilos. If this DLC started with a mission to Ilos, did stuff there, carried us through the mini-Relay onto the Citadel, and finally ends up at the Citadel Control Console (ME1, in the Council Chamber), where we either use the Crucible differently or skip it altogether, would that make enough of a difference in things to be worth your while?

Well my only real point I was making coming into this thread today was that if they made a 'Happy Ending' DLC, they couldn't put a price tag directly on it. It would just create more rage instead of create a New Era of Happiness and Light as some seem to suggest.

I dont doubt if they did a 'Broken Steel' and changed the ending enough that they could do DLCs or an expansion past the end point of the current game it would encourage all DLC sales for the product. But I couldnt with any authority if the sales difference would be enough to cover the costs of making it vs. using that time to move on to something entirely new with less baggage.

But in the Spirit of full disclosure:  I would not be at all unhappy about a Happy Ending DLC, free or paid. I'd gladly buy it and love it best. I did not enjoy the ending either. However I've played many games I've loved with terrible unsatisfying endings. It doesnt at all take away from all the care and love they put into every moment prior to that ending for me. And it didn't keep me from replaying the game or buying the DLC and enjoying that too.

[AlexMBrennan]

I can't believe some of you people are actually surprised by Priestly's post. How many times does he and Bioware have to say it?! Seriously.

Some people realise that companies have to make products that people want in order to stay in business.
Some people realise that that's exactly what Bioware is doing with DLC - the statement that future DLC depends on Leviathan sales is utterly hypocritical and makes no sense if Bioware really did want to make games for the art.
Some people realise that that's how it's always been, as far back as the original Baldur's Gate (Imoen? Fans didn't like using the evil-aligned thieves with a good character, so they added chaotic good thief Imoen. In BG2, fans didn't like her death in Spellhold, so that got changed too).

It's one thing for Bioware to say stuff in a PR release to save face, and quite another to actually shoot themselves in the foot.

[TheRealJayDee]

NightAntilli wrote...

If you want happy endings, go watch Disney movies. And oh, I'd advise you to stay very far away from The Walking Dead and Spec Ops: The Line.

I like Disney movies. TWD and Spec Ops: The Line are among my favourite games of 2012, TWD even being my favourite. Horray!

I would also very much like a more positive ending for ME3, cause the existing options are in no way doing the diversity of Mass Effect justice.

Chris Priestly wrote...

We have said this many times, we are done with the ending of Mass Effect. While there is still DLC to come (I cannot go into details yet) we will not be making any "ending" DLC.

So, "ending DLC" is basically confirmed then?!

[Reth Shepherd]

Brovikk Rasputin wrote...

Reth Shepherd wrote...

Brovikk Rasputin wrote...

I can't believe some of you people are actually surprised by Priestly's post. How many times does he and Bioware have to say it?! Seriously.

If nothing else, because I'm surprised to see EA pass up a chance to get money out of customers. I would dearly love to know what's going on behind the scenes here. There has GOT to be something we're missing.

You know absolutely nothing bout how much I'd cost to develop that kind of thing and how many people who would actually buy it.

Nor can you prove that it WOULDN'T provide a return on investment. Given that I've given comparative sales rankings that suggest ME3's current DLC isn't doing that well, it would make sense for EA to be looking at options that might improve sales. Even something as minor as MEHEM proved popular (and inspired some people to purchase ME3 DLC because they now wanted to play the game again). Something along those lines would be a mimumum investment of time, resources, and money, and would have to bomb pretty spectacularly in order to not provide a profit.

Question. Do you have any reason why Bioware shouldn't make Alternate Ending DLC aside from 'it would somehow invalidate my preferred ending'?

[3DandBeyond]

Brovikk Rasputin wrote...

I can't believe some of you people are actually surprised by Priestly's post. How many times does he and Bioware have to say it?! Seriously.

Apparently you have forgotten the huge amount of pre-release hype that surely exceeds the amount of times they've said no ending DLC.  You know the hype that included nothing that came to be and that catagorically said that some things that wouldn't happen that then did happen.  Interview after interview, video and written, announcements and the like.  So, now when they say something we are supposed to just believe it.  For the record, I have no illusions they will do anything we want.  They are in business and have shown a complete lack of willingness to even discuss it or to try to actually make right all that hype, so why would I think at this late date that they'd get a conscience and do anything "nice"?  I don't believe in them, don't have faith in them, they are a business, and as such it always is about this new and improved attitude, "I'll believe it when I see it". 

I think they have done much to create such an atmosphere and hype should be truth or should be explained at the very least.  I also think they tried to use fans' feelings and pump up Leviathan sales with how that was handled-somehow IGN got the idea it would change the ending (did IGN just make this up) and sure a day later, BW said it would not, but then BW tried to be cute and said it would change the context of the ending.  They knew darn well that people would jump on anything that even seemed to minutely affect the ending.  I have the distinct impression it was an attempt to play on fans' emotions on this issue.  And that is because they often don't seem to say things that are truthful. 

But the thing I do think is true in all of this is that BW also has a very fluid idea of what constitutes the ending and they've gotten some fans to believe this as well-actually, it is the other way around.  Fans started to say that the ending isn't the ending of the game.  They said that the endings are really Curing the Genophage, Solving the Geth/Quarian divide, and so on.  So the endings were different.  And after months of not really saying much about it, BW started to say those were the endings-Genophage Cure, and such, and that's what they meant in the pre-release hype.  Nice try, since that doesn't even fit half of what they said.

No one is surprised by anything they say-and I have no belief that Chris is not being truthful here.  I just think some words apparently get lost in translation here.  Ending doesn't mean the end except that it does.  Hype is not a promise, except it is.  And so on.  And lots of other things.  It's like I returned from some trip to the past where I'd stepped on a butterfly and changed all the things I knew to be real in my time period.  So words I thought I knew have alternate meanings now.

[Reth Shepherd]

Cutlass Jack wrote...

Reth Shepherd wrote...

Ah, I see. Good point, and I suppose I can't really bring up solid numbers short of calling up Microsoft. (Which I might anyway, if only to see if I can wheedle Omega's numbers out of them.)

However, doesn't your own post support the idea that Ending DLC would sell well? Why purchase a DLC if it ultimately affects nothing? But since by definition an Ending DLC DOES change how things turn out, wouldn't that give people a reason to purchase it? Particularly if it was a new ending branch (yeah, I know, I'm dreaming here) instead of just 'press this button to avoid the Catalyst'? For example: Ilos. If this DLC started with a mission to Ilos, did stuff there, carried us through the mini-Relay onto the Citadel, and finally ends up at the Citadel Control Console (ME1, in the Council Chamber), where we either use the Crucible differently or skip it altogether, would that make enough of a difference in things to be worth your while?

Well my only real point I was making coming into this thread today was that if they made a 'Happy Ending' DLC, they couldn't put a price tag directly on it. It would just create more rage instead of create a New Era of Happiness and Light as some seem to suggest.

I dont doubt if they did a 'Broken Steel' and changed the ending enough that they could do DLCs or an expansion past the end point of the current game it would encourage all DLC sales for the product. But I couldnt with any authority if the sales difference would be enough to cover the costs of making it vs. using that time to move on to something entirely new with less baggage.

But in the Spirit of full disclosure:  I would not be at all unhappy about a Happy Ending DLC, free or paid. I'd gladly buy it and love it best. I did not enjoy the ending either. However I've played many games I've loved with terrible unsatisfying endings. It doesnt at all take away from all the care and love they put into every moment prior to that ending for me. And it didn't keep me from replaying the game or buying the DLC and enjoying that too.

An expansion-type DLC would be AMAZING, though yeah, Bioware's unlikely to make.

I've played some lousy endings, too. This is the first game I've ever played where the ending utterly destroyed any interest I had in replaying the game; much less the previous two installments, which I really loved. I can't touch them. Wish I could. The thought of clicking ME3's icon makes me literally sick to my stomach. I didn't know it was possible to have this physical a reaction to a frelling GAME! Every time I look at ME1 or ME2, the only thought that goes through my head is "what's the point"? If I'm going to have to headcanon the ending anyway, why not headcanon the entirety of the game?

[Jadebaby]

Chris Priestly wrote...

We have said this many times, we are done with the ending of Mass Effect. While there is still DLC to come (I cannot go into details yet) we will not be making any "ending" DLC.

That would be very unfortunate.

[Mr.BlazenGlazen]

Chris Priestly wrote...

We have said this many times, we are done with the ending of Mass Effect. While there is still DLC to come (I cannot go into details yet) we will not be making any "ending" DLC.

We know you have.

But you guys should take into consideration and ask yourselves why so many people (not just BSN) continue to want some kind of addition or change to the endings despite being told otherwise. Maybe you guys will go forth with your promise and not make anymore ending DLC, fine. But if you read what people are saying everywhere and write down some notes, then you know that there are clearly several issues with these current endings and you would know what to avoid and what not to avoid in future projects.

Modifié par Mr.BlazenGlazen, 15 janvier 2013 - 05:45 .

[Xellith]

Chris Priestly wrote...

We have said this many times, we are done with the ending of Mass Effect. While there is still DLC to come (I cannot go into details yet) we will not be making any "ending" DLC.

I think you would have more impact if you actually posted this on http://blog.bioware.com/ as an official statement.  A lot of people think you are actually out of the loop of what is actually going on in the development team.

So once again.  Post it on the blog as a long/short statement. 

Something like:

"There have been numerous threads on the Bioware Social Network, and the Internet, asking for alternate ending DLC/Expansion content.  There will NOT now nor EVER be such content produced by Bioware for Mass Effect 3.  There are no plans and NEVER will be plans to create such content.  This means NO DLC set AFTER the catalyst segment on the citadel where you pick your Red Green or Blue choice".

or

"There have been numerous threads on the Bioware Social Network, and the Internet, asking for alternate ending DLC/Expansion content.  There will NOT now nor EVER be ANY content created set AFTER the cerberus station segment outside of slight dialogue chances."  (or something to that extent)

Otherwise most people just arnt gonna believe you.  This will not go away for years.  So get ready to have to repeat yourself.  You may even want to set it as your signature.  But even then people are just gonna say "plans can change" or the like. 

Make an official statement.

Modifié par Xellith, 15 janvier 2013 - 07:17 .

[3DandBeyond]

Reth Shepherd wrote...


Nor can you prove that it WOULDN'T provide a return on investment. Given that I've given comparative sales rankings that suggest ME3's current DLC isn't doing that well, it would make sense for EA to be looking at options that might improve sales. Even something as minor as MEHEM proved popular (and inspired some people to purchase ME3 DLC because they now wanted to play the game again). Something along those lines would be a mimumum investment of time, resources, and money, and would have to bomb pretty spectacularly in order to not provide a profit.

Question. Do you have any reason why Bioware shouldn't make Alternate Ending DLC aside from 'it would somehow invalidate my preferred ending'?

Given the MEHEM support and the countless videos I've seen on youtube, as well as the begging for ending DLC, it seems there is a huge audience out there for it.  There are also ways that such a thing could be achieved with slight investment, and BW knows how to do this.  The re-use of certain scenes and even dialogue (done and done in many places).  Subtle changes to certain content that already exists.  Sure, there'd be an investment, but what you have now is a divide amongst fans and there are those that would see other DLC as way more fun if they had a conclusion to all of this that they do like.  They have the data on how the game is played, but I fear they will misunderstand it.  

For instance, they might conclude that MP is enough, enough to get people to buy and play ME games.  And that's because a lot of people played it (in part because it was fun for some, but also because they often used it as a time waster in waiting for the EC or DLC, or because they wanted to get some entertainment back for their money).  This could be misunderstood so that maybe a new game might feature a five hour SP game with MP-and MP being the main focus.  But, a heck of a lot of people are not going to buy that game.

It's just like the misuse of feedback and misunderstanding that has long existed between them and fans.  People said they didn't like how Harbinger was in ME2 and maybe compared him to Sovereign.  So instead of looking for ways to make Harbinger better (really reading what people wrote), they just decided to really get rid of him altogether (well until the end where he just looks on lovingly).

[Epique Phael767]

After all of the DLCs Priestly has denied and then later came out, who here seriously believes him anymore?

[Belisarius25]

It's not just Priestly saying that they aren't revisiting the endings, though.

It's certainly possibly they're lying/covering it up, but I prefer being cautious with my expectations.

Modifié par Belisarius25, 15 janvier 2013 - 06:03 .

[archangel1996]

We weill see this last DLC, it makes things good again(in ME3 there are plenty of bad things but fixing the ending is a start) i will buy it, and i will probably buy Omega/Leviathan too
It will not, farewell ME3, Hello dragonborn

[Epique Phael767]

Belisarius25 wrote...

It's not just Priestly saying that they aren't revisiting the endings, though.

It's certainly possibly they're lying/covering it up, but I prefer being cautious with my expectations.

Until they make an official statement (and by they, I mean the writers), all of the forum posts denying it mean nothing. The way I see it, we were lied to before the game came out, we were lied to on several  occassions after the game came out, so why would they not continue the practice?

[Dr_Extrem]

priestly is just "his masters voice" ... so to say. (its sad about the company - a tradition died)

he tells us, what he has to.

[Postman778]

Lenimph wrote...

Zjarcal wrote...

Dr_Extrem wrote...

the player should have had a say on shepards fate - dragon age style.

you expected your shepard to die - totally ok ... my shepard wanted to return in one piece.

We already do. 

I still laugh at people not being able to accept Shepard surviving high ems destroy.

Diddo, and in DA:O there was consequences to keeping your Warden alive, either the death of an ally, or the creation of OGB just like in ME3 there are consequences to keeping Shep alive. 

In Destroy Ending, the cruicible makes no difference between reapers, geth or other synthetics. In the Control Ending it is able to devide between reapers and geth and other synthetics. There must be consequences, but the consequences must be somehow logical...

[MinatheBrat]

OfficerDjHooker wrote...

MinatheBrat wrote...

Ha. Yes, well, they'll be missing me buying any SP DLC. I was hoping when I heard about this last mysterious dlc (last bit extinguished) that there would be something to it that would allow me to enjoy what had been my favorite series again and get excited over the previously released dlc, because I don't -and haven't since the EC- see the point playing any more of the SP as it stands. It's heartbreaking and depressing and the opposite of fun.
I'm sad. 

Me too  Can't believe it but may have to rely on mehem to get some type of good ending for shepard available

Alas...no such balm for me since I'm on xbox. 

I really don't see what the big deal is. Why can't they offer a product to a customer base that wants said product? I mean..usually salesmen are trying to figure out how to get people to buy something...I feel slightly ridiculous begging a company to make me a product to spend my money on...I mean, companies fill special orders  all the time. There's clearly a demand. And for those who are happy with things as they are..they don't have to buy it.

Dear Bioware, Can you special order me a happy triumphant ending like in ME1 and ME2 where my Shepard kicks major booty and comes out at the end like a boss? That was my expectation for ME3 based on the precedent you set in the first two games. Thank you.

[3DandBeyond]

iakus wrote...

Chris Priestly wrote...

We have said this many times, we are done with the ending of Mass Effect. While there is still DLC to come (I cannot go into details yet) we will not be making any "ending" DLC.

So many people asking for the same thing over many months.

You don't suppose ME3 might be missing something, do you?

Well, yeah, I know they're a business but the component that seemed to exist before that and is now absent is a heart.

Modifié par 3DandBeyond, 15 janvier 2013 - 06:24 .

[Jealous Beauty]

I'm fully convinced that I'm going to have that same smile of relief that Morgan Freeman wore at the end of The Dark Knight. Bioware will reward us for our faith.

Or not.

[3DandBeyond]

MinatheBrat wrote...

OfficerDjHooker wrote...

MinatheBrat wrote...

Ha. Yes, well, they'll be missing me buying any SP DLC. I was hoping when I heard about this last mysterious dlc (last bit extinguished) that there would be something to it that would allow me to enjoy what had been my favorite series again and get excited over the previously released dlc, because I don't -and haven't since the EC- see the point playing any more of the SP as it stands. It's heartbreaking and depressing and the opposite of fun.
I'm sad. 

Me too  Can't believe it but may have to rely on mehem to get some type of good ending for shepard available

Alas...no such balm for me since I'm on xbox. 

I really don't see what the big deal is. Why can't they offer a product to a customer base that wants said product? I mean..usually salesmen are trying to figure out how to get people to buy something...I feel slightly ridiculous begging a company to make me a product to spend my money on...I mean, companies fill special orders  all the time. There's clearly a demand. And for those who are happy with things as they are..they don't have to buy it.

Dear Bioware, Can you special order me a happy triumphant ending like in ME1 and ME2 where my Shepard kicks major booty and comes out at the end like a boss? That was my expectation for ME3 based on the precedent you set in the first two games. Thank you.

It's less than funny isn't it.  Companies beg for feedback in order to gauge the interests of their customers.  They also wish they could have an active fanbase because a silent customer tells them nothing about their product-they may only know they've failed when sales drop but then have to use psychic means to figure out what went wrong.

BW has fans that actually explain at length what went wrong and how it might be fixed, and that have offered to pay for the fix. 

As someone who has been in management in the private and public sector and has taken many management courses (expensive), BW is getting for free the knowledge that other companies have to pay to teach their employees to try to get out of customers.  "How are we doing and how can we do better?"  It's also one of the main rules of customer service.  You ask an unhappy customer what it would take to make them happy and then decide if you can fulfill that wish or not and you create a dialogue with those customers.  Above all is the desire to keep that customer even if you lose money on one deal.

[Giga Drill BREAKER]

I can't believe this thread is still going, how many times do people need to be told its not going to happen.